COMMENTS SAID HERE

[Surfer]

I've been quietly reading the postings about radio in this market. After carefully thinking about it, I have my own posting. While I'm sure most will disagree with me, please understand that this is just my EXPERIENCE talking.
I've been in broadcasting since 1980. During that time I've managed to hold almost every position one can in radio. I've seen good times and bad. I'm not a fan of what is happening today in the business but, I'd like to think I'm smart enough to realize one thing. If I want to remain employed in this business (and I do), I must change with the trends. I must be flexible. My opinions as to what works or doesn't work in radio are just that...opinions. The fact is, what I would "like" to see may not make money. Radio must make money. To do so it must, in some way, promote other folk's stuff thru advertising. Even on public, or non-commercial radio. Pledge drives are just another way to "advertise" products for sale. In that case, the product IS the station and its programming.
A lot of people bash what is happening in the business today. We need more "local" hosts. We need less "syndicated" programming. Less commercials, more music. More research...less research. I've seen it all on this board. It is nice to see everyone has some kind of opinion. What I don't like is how most everyone tries to badmouth large broadcasting companies. Sure, a lot of what they do and how they treat people isn't right. I absolutely agree with you there but I wonder how many people have had to be the person on the firing end of things? I have and it absolutely sucks. In a nutshell, I can keep my job and fire somebody, who is absolutely doing the right things or, I can say "no" and we both lose our jobs. It sucks but I DO NOT OWN THE BUSINESS. It is a business. These CEO's, VP's and the like are doing exactly what they have to do to keep their jobs. NOBODY WANTS TO BE UNEMPLOYED BUT IT DOES HAPPEN! We can argue this point forever but let's move on.
As a business, radio can, and should do, whatever it takes to remain in business. Sometimes that does mean changing a format or a jock because they want better ratings or TSL or more presence at a remote. Maybe the AE hasn't made enough sales or the Sales Manager didn't hit their budget. Maybe the Chief Engieer has to fix a transmitter hit by lightening but the station doesn't have the money in the budget for parts. Whatever the case, it seems to me we've all become way too emotional about the whole thing. Do I want to lose my job? Hell, no! Nor do I want anyone else to either. Unfortunately, stuff happens we can't control. I've been cut enough times in my career to say that I hate every part of it. But, radio IS a business and, for whatever reason, I was let go. Whether I agree or not has no bearing on the situation. My time was done.
Because tomorrow is Thanksgiving, I'd like to say a big thank you to all the people I've had the pleasure, or annoyance, to have worked with. All of them, some probably reading this now, have contributed to who I am and what I've been able to do with my career. I am thankful for radio, even if it is corporately owned by Clear Channel, Cumulus, Salem, Entercom, Emmis or some other big company. Why? Because all of them have, at the very least, found some way to fund a radio station that I either wanted to work for, or have worked for. We all know nobody is perfect. Corporations will mess up. It happens. Corporations are run, ultimately by people. People like you and I. Everyone making a decision they feel they must make in order to keep their business running. Radio is no longer about the listener. I wish it was but it is not. Most listeners have migrated to other forms of entertainment. Radio is not about the format or the personalities. In the age of PPM, listeners do not matter. Formats do not matter. What really matters are the people who have to try and work with what they are given because of technology, advertisers and owners. For all of you currently out of work, I truly wish I had the ability to hire you because I'm certain you'd do your job well. For those already employed in some way, may you always make the owners, managers, advertisers and listeners, however few, happy. In the end, I think, that is all you really can do.
Radio can be great again but let's not blame bad formats or bad owners. Most of the time (and you can all list exceptions, I'm sure), we as radio people fail to adapt. Principles or not, life forces us to adapt. I hope those who truly love radio, will find a way to adapt and not lose their principles. I did and it wasn't easy. If I can, I'm sure you can to.
I expect lots of negative comments about this. That would only prove my point. The world has changed. The business model has changed. For radio to be what it once was, we MUST CHANGE...SOMEHOW.
Oh, and one last thing. Can SOMEBODY...ANYBODY...WHO HAS ANY INFLUENCE WITH A BIG COMPANY TRY TO PROGRAM JUST ONE STATION IN ATLANT WITH AN OLDIES FORMAT?!? Maybe an adult standards format? How about hiring Gary McKee again, or maybe the Kimmer? And doesn't (insert big company name here) really know how to kill a decent format? I've tried my best but nobody will listen! Oh wait...I forgot...it's about the money. Never mind.

 

[Wildstyle K]

One thing nobody has ever been able to answer - and I've even given up on answering these questions - are the following questions:

How do you explain when a certain radio station / radio company decides to do something that people consider stupid and a bunch of people on these boards provide a solution to the problem caused by the "stupid decision," AND THEN the station that's doing the stupid thing fails and continues to fail - UP UNTIL the point it coincidentally decides to do what has been suggested on the board all along?

Or

What about when a bunch of people on this board start complaining about a particular station talking about how it "needs improvement" or "needs to get with the times" then after the station finally does that, it ends up getting some of the best ratings?

And

What about those who suggest a certain format for many months and then when a station finally flips to that format, it then begins to get better ratings than it ever had before?

Does everyone remember back when people were saying B98.5 needs an upgrade and there were always people to say "who says? look at the ratings."? And has anyone noticed the difference in ratings ever since they upgraded? How about back when I was saying that a CHR or even WiLD format could easily work in Atlanta - IF done correctly - and should be tried?

Anyon

Sorry, way too sleepy to think or post more at the moment. I'll fall asleep before finishing if I don't hit "Post" now. I actually drifted off to sleep and started the dream process TWICE while typing this...

 

[AlsoRan]

I dozed off at "quietly reading"... ;D

 

[Wildstyle K]

I dozed off at "quietly reading"... ;D

I actually read the original poster's comment earlier and couldn't resist the temptation to reply but procrastinated on replying. Not sure why I waited until I was tired to do so.

 

[trusty]

How do you explain when a certain radio station / radio company decides to do something that people consider stupid and a bunch of people on these boards provide a solution to the problem caused by the "stupid decision," AND THEN the station that's doing the stupid thing fails and continues to fail - UP UNTIL the point it coincidentally decides to do what has been suggested on the board all along?

I heard somewhere that radio stations/companies actually PAY people for the free service we provide (Imagine that!).

But, we'll continue to do it because our passion drives us. Happy Thanksgiving.

 

[Surfer]

To answer your "unanswered" questions, let me try this.

You said: "How do you explain when a certain radio station / radio company decides to do something that people consider stupid and a bunch of people on these boards provide a solution to the problem caused by the "stupid decision," AND THEN the station that's doing the stupid thing fails and continues to fail - UP UNTIL the point it coincidentally decides to do what has been suggested on the board all along?"
I answer: Somebody got the message but still thinks this board is a waste of time. I disagree.

You said: "What about when a bunch of people on this board start complaining about a particular station talking about how it "needs improvement" or "needs to get with the times" then after the station finally does that, it ends up getting some of the best ratings?"
I answer: Somebody got the message but still thinks this board is a waste of time. I disagree.

You said: "What about those who suggest a certain format for many months and then when a station finally flips to that format, it then begins to get better ratings than it ever had before?
Does everyone remember back when people were saying B98.5 needs an upgrade and there were always people to say "who says? look at the ratings."? And has anyone noticed the difference in ratings ever since they upgraded? How about back when I was saying that a CHR or even WiLD format could easily work in Atlanta - IF done correctly - and should be tried?"

I answer: Maybe somebody read this board and realized the posters my know something. Unfortunately, we do NOT live or work in a business where common sense would count for something.

 

[amlover]

I hate reading long and rambling post's.

 

[trusty]

Yeah. We need to get to the punctuation error in just a few words.

 

[Wildstyle K]

To answer your "unanswered" questions, let me try this.

You said: "How do you explain when a certain radio station / radio company decides to do something that people consider stupid and a bunch of people on these boards provide a solution to the problem caused by the "stupid decision," AND THEN the station that's doing the stupid thing fails and continues to fail - UP UNTIL the point it coincidentally decides to do what has been suggested on the board all along?"
I answer: Somebody got the message but still thinks this board is a waste of time. I disagree.

You said: "What about when a bunch of people on this board start complaining about a particular station talking about how it "needs improvement" or "needs to get with the times" then after the station finally does that, it ends up getting some of the best ratings?"
I answer: Somebody got the message but still thinks this board is a waste of time. I disagree.

You said: "What about those who suggest a certain format for many months and then when a station finally flips to that format, it then begins to get better ratings than it ever had before?
Does everyone remember back when people were saying B98.5 needs an upgrade and there were always people to say "who says? look at the ratings."? And has anyone noticed the difference in ratings ever since they upgraded? How about back when I was saying that a CHR or even WiLD format could easily work in Atlanta - IF done correctly - and should be tried?"

I answer: Maybe somebody read this board and realized the posters my know something. Unfortunately, we do NOT live or work in a business where common sense would count for something.

I've got to admit that this is good. I wasn't looking for some spectacular mind blowing answers. Just answers in general and these do seem to be right on.

In other words, board posters can be right a few times and maybe someone may see things from here and "think about / act on it" to some degree. However, just like Wikipedia, despite the fact that some things posted here may be right from time to time, it's still not known to be a "credible source."

 

[jokerman]

Well, I have never been "in" the radio business. I am merely a listener. But I can tell you one thing. In all the time I've been alive, I've never seen Atlanta radio in a worse state. I am to the point of giving it up altogether. Many times, I simply can't find anything to listen to. There are other options now like satellite, podcasts, or music off my own mp3. You can't get used to anything on radio anymore. It seems like every 6 months your favorite station has changed formats and/or hosts. THAT is not a good business model. It is ultimately going to drive customers away. There is no reason that an oldies station in a metro of millions can't survive. There is no reason that entertaining and local talk shows can't survive in a metro of millions. I'll never believe otherwise.

 

[secondchoice]

Well, I have never been "in" the radio business. I am merely a listener. But I can tell you one thing. In all the time I've been alive, I've never seen Atlanta radio in a worse state.

Unless you like CHR! When I was a child we had at the most 2 "real" Top 40's. Kids today have more choices in radio not counting other forms of delievery.

 

[trig]

From your Sarcasm, I can tell you understand Radio, except the ability to adapt to its current state. Here's my observation or experience as you call it.

It's so much easier to evolve, when you're part of the family running your corporation. How do you really accept the current state of radio corporations, and just let it go like it's the new norm without any confusion from those that witnessed it, and still do so on a daily business? Not that you stated it, but radio's sorry state is far from something that just evolved naturally because of competing technology. It is a result of going public, paying way too much for way too many properties by family members that could afford good lawyers, and the drastic corporate results that followed. But most of us already know that.

I am not against corporations and capitalism by any means, but in the radio business, it's who and how they are run that's truly a crime. If you're anyone of those people who watched it happen around you, or even didn't get a promotion due to one of the companies family members getting it, you're hopefully working somewhere else by now with your fine experience. It's not that simple to watch money go from employing thousands of devoted low-middle income employees and providing their families food and educations, to now paying off bankers/loans, lawyers to the top corporate executives their bonuses. That family member running your radio station, or rising through the ranks asap other ranking family to get to the top, most likely did not earn that position because he/she was the most qualified and best choice for the position. When they take that position, how can they really be making great decisions that are best for their stockholders and not just protecting their family interests at hand? Think of how much more profitable some corporations or even other non-radio companies would be if the most qualified person actually got the position available? Just look at the Mays and CCU, just one of many prime examples. Even if they are not going down the tubes, who's really getting all the money? That would be the Dickey's. I have yet to see any justification for any of these outrages bonuses handed out, when so may other people have lost. That money came from someone's lively hood after years of dedication, so think about how many, or just think about it, and that's were we are today to answer your question "Why can't we adapt?" Because there are too many still in the business, unhappy at the results of all the greed. Corporate Radio gives Corporate America and Corporations a bad name, period. I doubt any of these other posters have ever had enough public radio stock to vote for an officer they wanted running the company, and that person actually won. Steve Jobs was not allowed to be a write in candidate, I assure you.

Accept in and move on? Yeah, some can with lure of promises that usually don't happen. People's jobs were so more rewarding when you weren't having to do the job of the three co-workers (usually friends, not family) next to you, who's positions no longer exist. That $2 an hour raise only goes so far when you start to realize they saved $40 an hour to give it to you, and you don't have the support staff or support available to even do your job correctly. The result is complacency from the product, to the client, to the listener and then back again. I am sure Gary and the Kimmer feel the same way after all their dedication to the business. They have to make that same morality check you wrote about, but probably chose not to go with either, along with so many other past employees in or out of the business today.

For those of you that like paid consultants to tell you what works and what doesn't, this one's on me. Am I resentful, eh, a little, but not really too much, I got out. I am just saddened by the current complacency and "Family Greed", that it is still allowed to continue like everyone else. That's all that it is. To emphasize the first sentence 2nd paragraph. If you are not part of their family, they could at least try to make their employees feel like one. People like to fell "Vested" in the people they work hard for. It's not their obligation, but the employees might adapt a bit better and quicker. Kudos to the company that gave their employees back a bonus previously that stuck around after taking a 5% pay cut. More corporate leaders should follow that lead, it might make them more of a leader worth respecting.

 

[amlover]

Another long rambling post!

 

[jfrancispastirchak]

Surfer & Trig both offer valid points. I especially appreciate the observations of Surfer, who seems to have his finger well-placed on the pulse of both sides of the debate. At the same time, Trig laments the futility of working side-by-side with corporate "family" members in a trade that I believe no longer rewards individual talent and creativity. He's right.

It is my prayer that the corporate execs and the rank and file of today's radio industry will both speak out, and listen as well, as you two are so admirably doing here. Let's keep this chat going...

 

[trig]

Well, I have never been "in" the radio business. I am merely a listener. But I can tell you one thing. In all the time I've been alive, I've never seen Atlanta radio in a worse state. I am to the point of giving it up altogether. Many times, I simply can't find anything to listen to. There are other options now like satellite, podcasts, or music off my own mp3. You can't get used to anything on radio anymore. It seems like every 6 months your favorite station has changed formats and/or hosts. THAT is not a good business model. It is ultimately going to drive customers away. There is no reason that an oldies station in a metro of millions can't survive. There is no reason that entertaining and local talk shows can't survive in a metro of millions. I'll never believe otherwise.

It could survive, but it would take a very dedicated OLDer sales staff to build that relationship sale over a longer time than six months like you said. Just like they do for Sports stations that don't rank well in all the Adult demos between 25 and 64. Though outside of the Sports and maybe some Talk/News formats, those exclusive long term growth environments don't exist much anymore. The fact of the matter is, people from the 60's that were in their 20's in 65, are now 70+. You have to have the younger office listening to make it work, to at least get on the 35-64 buys.

As much as I hate to say it, its about the money. If they decide on radio sales, aggressive young sales people aren't going to sell Oldies as a first choice. If they are smart, they aren't going to try to build new relationships with more people older than their grand parents.

At least Sports formats have a lot of tickets and the "Sports Fan" lifestyle to help drive profits from sponsorships. Sales people there can make decent money for both themselves and the company, as long as they like who their working for. Key phrase "as long as". I wish the best to 92.9 and their efforts, they should make a lot more money than Dave in 1-2 years.

 

[Surfer]

Trig, I quite agree with you. Unfortunately, I think the "greed" previously mentioned in this thread comes not so much from the radio owners as the listeners! They want stuff for free...PERIOD! They want what they want when they want it and they want it now. How do you give them that? See if this makes sense.

The hot demo is 18-49 (for the most part). If you're like me...NOT in that group, advertisers don't want you. It's all about youth. Why? Because they spend money...(wait for it)...IMPULSIVELY! Of course, not all of them do, but a vast majority do and that causes advertisers to target that age group. Radio stations need to survive and they do so on ad dollars so, they program stations to go after this age group. It has worked this way for years. From my "inside" vantage point, I can tell you that the advertisers (and agencies) are NOT getting what they pay for. The age group has other interests OUTSIDE of traditional radio. So, folks like Brent and I, who desperately long to have an oldies format in Atlanta, are SOL. How do you change this? Not with government regulation or radio re-inventing itself.

Radio IS a solid medium. What isn't is the people who listen in that coveted 18-49 demo. They don't care about radio BECAUSE (at least according to my kids who ARE part of that demo) I CARE ABOUT RADIO! If you're old and you like something, the general rule of thumb seems to be that the younger crowd hates it. How do you fight that? Radio needs to create somthing that, when the youngsters discover it, they tell their friends and everybody returns to the medium. Someone should find a way to create a demand for the kids to listen to the radio again because it will give them what they want...or think they want, anyway. Until that happens, there will be a continuing slide into lousy formats, too much advertising clutter, lower ratings and eventually, no business. Give the kids what they want...and lots of it...FREE MUSIC! Hide your ads in half-hour and hour sponsorships and DITCH THE COMMERCIALS. You may just get them back and, after that you can show them what they've been missing. Maybe even get a few commercials back on the air and make some money.

The other choice is to program just to the older, more appreciative crowd and forget the ratings. I know many a station that does just this and they make money...LOTS OF IT! I bet that, if done shrewdly, an oldies format with no ratings can far outbill V103

 

[mythreecents]

I hate reading long and rambling post's.

You just have a short attention span.

 

[TheBigA]

Hide your ads in half-hour and hour sponsorships and DITCH THE COMMERCIALS.

That might work for programmers and audiences, but the sponsors, by and large, don't like it. Their research tells them that such sponsorships become lost in the background noise. They don't want to be hidden. Advertisers WANT to interrupt the flow. They WANT to stop the music and get your attention. They don't care if it annoys as long as you pay attention. Too much music programming just becomes mush, and that doesn't sell.

The other problem would be the cost. Half hour sponsorships would take the place of 8 minutes of spots. Do the math for how much it would cost, and it would be prohibitive for most local sponsors.

Advertisers don't understand programming. They understand sales. When you speak their language, you can get to a yes. But if you tell them their spots are a tune out, that's not what they want to hear. They want access to your audience, and that means they want their message their way. They pay a premium, and the customer gets what he wants.

 

[Wildstyle K]

I hate reading long and rambling post's. 

This is a place for radio discussion. Anyone who cannot handle the posts or comments said here for whatever reasons should discontinue logging in.

 

[Wildstyle K]

They don't care if it annoys as long as you pay attention.

The same could be said about the music played on certain stations these days according to many radio listeners.