Conway Jr.---Foot in mouth again

[henry]

Yikes. While I consider myself a "fan" of the show, I had no idea other listeners had such detailed, intricate hatred of the show. Credit where it's due, I certainly can't argue that you don't have good reasoning behind your distaste for the show.

I just tune in because it's non-cliche and makes me laugh. If it doesn't make you laugh, why not just flip to KPCC or KABC and be done with it?

 

[board_manager]

Some content has been relocated to Take It Outside

http://boards.radio-info.com/smf/index.php?topic=213577.msg1916500#msg1916500

 

[Ultimajock]

Re: Appreciate all responses !

As far as jr. goes, let's get the latest blunder out of the way, so we can turn to what seems to be tolerated on air behavior from the KFI programming dept. See: good for the goose, not good for the gander.

Monday night within the 1st half hour, jr. mentioned in some semi coherent attempt at knowledge that the late TV news anchor Tom Snyder, was probably not even in Los Angeles in the mid 60's. Wrong again, jr! Mr. Snyder was with KTLA and their news dept. in 1963. Nice research, again. Mr. Snyder was reporting on a Saturday afternoon about the Baldwin Hills Dam disaster. That would've been in mid-December, I believe.

Yeah, we know. You were just a "country bumpkin from the flats in the Valley." We know. We hear it all the time. Doesn't make any sense, but we hear it all the time. That A-D-D of his should really be checked professionally. Yeah, you were still in diapers in '63, so no one would've expected you to know about the dam breaking, Mr. Snyder reporting on it, or the first use of a news helicopter showing actual rescues.

There's this thing called the internet, maybe you've caught wind of it? And if not, maybe a bio somewhere in a BOOK or another place re: Mr. Snyder's career would've helped out. Just a thought. I could keep you from making a fool out of yourself on a daily basis, but listening to you drone on about what YOU THINK you know, without so much as a fact-check is really more amusing!

...I have an aircheck of Tim Conway's appearance on Tom Snyder's ABC radio show circa '89 or '90. Throughout it, Conway keeps making references to his kids' not working. Nothing has changed, has it? ;D ...

 

[von nupkins]

Henry: To reply simply (but not thoroughly) to your last post, BECAUSE jr is that proverbial car accident that we'd like to ignore or look away from, but just can't. His show gets worse as the days/nights go on, and watching and hearing someone's self destruction is rather interesting..



Especially when the EGO is sooooo large, and the "talent" so fleeting.. Lacking is probably a more exact word for what's missing in his life. Shhhhhhh! Don't tell him.. He 'thinks' he's really smarter and more accurate in his musings than the rest of us.. He really does.

Now, for this morning's post....

I know and have known people in that building on Olive in Burbank.. What he thinks he knows and what people talk about behind his back, let alone what his co-horts are REALLY thinking could fill more than just one chapter in someone's book.. Most assuredly!

So, on to Monday night's blunder. I only heard ONE, since the Dodger game and the Kings victory on Channel 4 was really more worthwhile.

It's called multi-tasking, these days. Ever listen to jr. try and attempt TWO things at once on the air? It's a walking horror show! Listen closely if ya don't believe me.. He can barely get a sentence out without stumbling over himself, or re-arranging a word in mid-sentence because his mind shuts down at the start of his 'on air' thought. It's really very unimpressive!

Anyway, back to Monday night's attempt at sounding intelligent.. So, it was between 8:35 and the :45 break. He was "interviewing" Matt Money Smith from KLAC about the Kings championship win earlier in the evening.. I put quotes around "interviewing" because jr. doesn't really know HOW to interview people. He can't ask a question, without cutting the person off in mid-sentence, and going in a different direction.. Never letting the interviewee answer the question completely.

It's called bad form.. You would've learned some interviewing techniques in the small and medium markets and towns, when you were working your way up in radio. Oh, I forgot.

jr. never did work his way UP in radio. He started out in the big time, because of his last name. So, there are A LOT of things he never learned about being good or at least "acceptable" on the radio, because he really didn't work hard or even make an attempt at the actual "learning process."

But that's evident.. Every weeknight, from 7-10 pm on KFI. Longer contract or not. He will be his own undoing, just like John Zeigler. Remember, it took Robin a few years to realize what a mental case Zeigler was/is, so we can expect that she'll be too long at the fair with jr.'s antics.. Then, she'll have to make her move. Years too late, but I'll guarantee you, it WILL happen!

Back to Monday night's "I'm really smarter than everyone" line of questioning. He was asking Matt Money Smith if the new Kings coach was signed "to a long term career?"

Really, jr? Really? A long term career? I'm sure he'd love a long term career, but at last check, they weren't handing those long term careers out just willy nilly.. Ya gotta EARN them, ya know?

Hey, anyone can make a mistake, right? Nightly.. In almost every segment after a commercial break. Several mistakes. Mistakes that you'd learn NOT to make with actual experience while working your way up in your chosen field. Whatever that would've been for jr. I'd heard that there were many attempts at 'this or that' career-wise, and he was a dismal failure at everything he tried. Unlike his father.. Funny how that works. Apple way too far from the tree? Out on the highway perhaps. About a mile away from the orchard? Probably! For sure!

So, I can hear it now from the jr. sniffers and apologists on this board. It was just a small mistake. It was just a misplaced word. Anyone would've done it.. Perhaps. But what the "jr. sniffers" and apologists don't hear or see, is.... that this type of faux pas happens nightly. More than once.. Many times. Many times within a 10:00 segment.

So when does a small mistake become the main part of someone's act, and not the subject matter? When does he finally admit that his A-D-D is affecting his work, the ears of whatever audience happens to be listening for 5 minutes, and the credibility of the place he works?

Yeah, but it's only a word.

I urge anyone who doubts me, to listen carefully and fully to jr's time slot. Try and keep track of the number of blunders in context of the subject matter. Not just words misused here or there.. I mean a whole segment. I dare you to come back here and tell me that he didn't lose track of what he was saying. He didn't lose his place on his page. He didn't know what he was going to say next. He asked a question of someone and didn't quite wait for the answer, because he couldn't wait to hear himself talk on the radio. AGAIN!

And you'll be able to know with these tell-tale signs of an unprepared broadcaster:

Listen for the "errrrs" and the "uhhhhs" not to mention the subtle "ummmmmms" that happen with ALMOST every subject matter or paragraph he's in the middle of.. It's not good form and not acceptable to a real program director. But we are talking about someone who hired Lisa Montgomery for extreme fill-in, J. Zeigler, and Jillian Michaels. How did that work out longevity-wise?

This is what it comes down to. "signed to a long term career" or "signed to a long trem contract."
When it comes to jr's errors, and there are MANY, both words start with a "C", and that's just good enough for his audience.

Who he KNOWS is not EVER going to be as smart as he is.

How did that "stand up comedy" career work out for ya, jr?

 

[henry]

Reading your comments reminds me of two radio guys I worked with in Salt Lake City.

One was a classic "broadcaster." He'd gone to broadcast school in the late 60s. He had the old FCC "operator's licence" to talk on air. He never said an "um" or "well" on the air. Everything he said sounded like a perfect performance of a well-written script. But that was the problem. In the 2000s, that kind of "announcing" is dreadfully boring. As talented as this guy was, he was basically a human text-to-speech personality. It's predictable. It's boring.

Another talent I worked with at the same station was not a "from the small market up" talent. He just kind of worked into a gig in the 90s and stuck with it. He was not a traditional radio pro and he made plenty of "announcing mistakes" in a technical sense. But his mind went all over the place and he connected crazy ideas together into opinions that were hilarious, infuriating, and occasionally insightful.

Guess who got more emails and phone calls (for good or bad)?

Perhaps TCJS has gone downhill since Insalako and Randy left. I think that team had fantastic chemistry on air and the unpredictable barrage of sound effects and catchphrases made the show absolutely hilarious. Conway really seems out of his groove the past month or so. You may be right that he's been "coasting" (which we all do in our jobs as we get better at doing them) and perhaps it's time to step things up and work a bit harder like he was 2 years ago, when he was getting used to the old team.

But I'd much rather have Conway break the technical aspects of "good announcing" and keep churning out crazy opinions, than vice-verse. Most talent between the 118 freeway and the 10 are genuinely nuts. It takes a lot of coaching, agents, and re-takes to make them look "normal" on the TV and silver screen. I'd say Handel, Kobylt, and Conway are all completely nuts. But that's what makes their shows funny.

I'd say your critiques are fairly valid in a post-Insalko show. Let's give it a summer to see if they get into a groove and fix things. Beyond that, without trying to sound like a personal attack, may I propose that many of your criticisms are just your era of radio? This isn't the 1980s anymore. KFI has to get away from the unbiased interviewer with the deep voice saying "let's go to the phones. Hello you're on KFI." I dare say they will need to get away from the heavy, heavy political talk to distinguish themselves in the decades to come. Wacky shows like TCJS certainly are different and prove there are angles you can take to get away from 90s political talk and win with 18-34s.

It can be hard for middle and older demos to accept evolutionary change. (Remember the outrage when all the AM Music of Your Life stations flipped to sports ten years ago?) My former colleague I mention above (example #1) hates the "shaky, sloppy" camera work on "The Office." Yet, it was among NBC's most popular shows. It's change. It's how you win younger audiences --- which KFI desperately needs.

 

[DJBigOne]

But I'd much rather have Conway break the technical aspects of "good announcing" and keep churning out crazy opinions, than vice-verse. Most talent between the 118 freeway and the 10 are genuinely nuts. It takes a lot of coaching, agents, and re-takes to make them look "normal" on the TV and silver screen. I'd say Handel, Kobylt, and Conway are all completely nuts. But that's what makes their shows funny. <

>It can be hard for middle and older demos to accept evolutionary change. (Remember the outrage when all the AM Music of Your Life stations flipped to sports ten years ago?) My former colleague I mention above (example #1) hates the "shaky, sloppy" camera work on "The Office." Yet, it was among NBC's most popular shows. It's change. It's how you win younger audiences --- which KFI desperately needs.

IMO, radio must be entertaining to attract listeners. Who cares if it's technically perfect? I once apologized on-air for the occasional stutter. A listener called in to say they loved me because I'm REAL, not some pre-programmed, monotone robot...like your example #1.

 

[calguy]

But I'd much rather have Conway break the technical aspects of "good announcing" and keep churning out crazy opinions, than vice-verse. Most talent between the 118 freeway and the 10 are genuinely nuts. It takes a lot of coaching, agents, and re-takes to make them look "normal" on the TV and silver screen. I'd say Handel, Kobylt, and Conway are all completely nuts. But that's what makes their shows funny. <

>It can be hard for middle and older demos to accept evolutionary change. (Remember the outrage when all the AM Music of Your Life stations flipped to sports ten years ago?) My former colleague I mention above (example #1) hates the "shaky, sloppy" camera work on "The Office." Yet, it was among NBC's most popular shows. It's change. It's how you win younger audiences --- which KFI desperately needs.

IMO, radio must be entertaining to attract listeners. Who cares if it's technically perfect? I once apologized on-air for the occasional stutter. A listener called in to say they loved me because I'm REAL, not some pre-programmed, monotone robot...like your example #1.

I can see what you're saying, but one can be entertaining without sounding like a stooge. I personally have a hard time following Jr a lot of the time, but it has more to do with the nature of his storytelling more than anything else. Yes, radio is different now. A highly rated top forty station in 1975 would most likely have a relatively smooth personalty with a nice voice, preferably mid-range to on the deep side. Now a top forty has a fast talking guy who rambles at times and has a lightweight voice, a LOT like Seacrest, and they sound interchangeable, almost hard to tell apart . Talk hosts today rarely sound like say Michael Jackson, though many do sound like they have their act together(See Bill Carroll). Then there's a guy with an act like Jr who really sounds like he wasn't even sure what he would talk about until about 2 minutes to air time. He rarely knows of what he speaks, and that can be annoying at times. I don't think one needs to be technically perfect, but it could help to sound like you know how to walk & chew gum at the same time.

Steven Roy, you're assuming that von nupkins is of a certain age because of his gripes, but I would submit that it's not age but education and intelligence that motivates his postings about Jr and less or even not at all about how old he is. There have always been exceptions to what was considered the "norm" throughout history. Not everyone sounded like Charlie Tuna back in the 70's(See Ken Levine) and Conway is unique, as well as outside of the "norm". But being unique only goes so far, it helps to have your act together and to know what you're talking about once in a while. Jr is all about his opinion, and while nice, opinion can't carry the whole show, you have to show a little knowledge once in a while too. As for change, I don't recall ANY outrage when the Music of Your Life stations starting falling off the grid. But then again, I'm not nor will I ever be THAT audience, so I wasn't exposed to any perceived outrage. Formats are eventually updated or they go away and when they do, people move on as well, or they buy an ipod and load it up with what they really want to hear. Oh, and being a "classic" broadcaster can mean many things. I agree that your #2 example can be entertaining, but many don't last long because they don't try to understand their business and to learn how to make their act grow and evolve. Ad for example #1, I know "classic" broadcasters who fit the uptight mold you described, I also know "classic" broadcasters that are as cool as they come. To borrow an old line, they were and still are "hip", up on everything that any 25 year old is. They just happen to have a broadcasting education. And on the topic of having an FCC license, it's too bad they abolished that system. I've seen many people come into a station without knowing diddly-squat about how to maintain a program log or know any of the basics in order to not get their station fined by the feds. They know NOTHING about their own business and it shows. And that's just sad, especially at the major market level...

 

[henry]

I wonder if this is a case of "you get what you pay for."

I wouldn't be surprised if Conway barely breaks 6-figures, if that. In a Clear Channel world, he may only be pulling 50k. That could explain a lack of motivation to do show prep?

I know Randy Wang (the board op) made something like $12.50/hour. We pay more in Salt Lake City (market 30)!

 

[ChannelFlipper]

But I'd much rather have Conway break the technical aspects of "good announcing" and keep churning out crazy opinions, than vice-verse. Most talent between the 118 freeway and the 10 are genuinely nuts. It takes a lot of coaching, agents, and re-takes to make them look "normal" on the TV and silver screen. I'd say Handel, Kobylt, and Conway are all completely nuts. But that's what makes their shows funny. <

>It can be hard for middle and older demos to accept evolutionary change. (Remember the outrage when all the AM Music of Your Life stations flipped to sports ten years ago?) My former colleague I mention above (example #1) hates the "shaky, sloppy" camera work on "The Office." Yet, it was among NBC's most popular shows. It's change. It's how you win younger audiences --- which KFI desperately needs.

IMO, radio must be entertaining to attract listeners. Who cares if it's technically perfect? I once apologized on-air for the occasional stutter. A listener called in to say they loved me because I'm REAL, not some pre-programmed, monotone robot...like your example #1.

I can see what you're saying, but one can be entertaining without sounding like a stooge. I personally have a hard time following Jr a lot of the time, but it has more to do with the nature of his storytelling more than anything else. Yes, radio is different now. A highly rated top forty station in 1975 would most likely have a relatively smooth personalty with a nice voice, preferably mid-range to on the deep side. Now a top forty has a fast talking guy who rambles at times and has a lightweight voice, a LOT like Seacrest, and they sound interchangeable, almost hard to tell apart . Talk hosts today rarely sound like say Michael Jackson, though many do sound like they have their act together(See Bill Carroll). Then there's a guy with an act like Jr who really sounds like he wasn't even sure what he would talk about until about 2 minutes to air time. He rarely knows of what he speaks, and that can be annoying at times. I don't think one needs to be technically perfect, but it could help to sound like you know how to walk & chew gum at the same time.

Steven Roy, you're assuming that von nupkins is of a certain age because of his gripes, but I would submit that it's not age but education and intelligence that motivates his postings about Jr and less or even not at all about how old he is. There have always been exceptions to what was considered the "norm" throughout history. Not everyone sounded like Charlie Tuna back in the 70's(See Ken Levine) and Conway is unique, as well as outside of the "norm". But being unique only goes so far, it helps to have your act together and to know what you're talking about once in a while. Jr is all about his opinion, and while nice, opinion can't carry the whole show, you have to show a little knowledge once in a while too. As for change, I don't recall ANY outrage when the Music of Your Life stations starting falling off the grid. But then again, I'm not nor will I ever be THAT audience, so I wasn't exposed to any perceived outrage. Formats are eventually updated or they go away and when they do, people move on as well, or they buy an ipod and load it up with what they really want to hear. Oh, and being a "classic" broadcaster can mean many things. I agree that your #2 example can be entertaining, but many don't last long because they don't try to understand their business and to learn how to make their act grow and evolve. Ad for example #1, I know "classic" broadcasters who fit the uptight mold you described, I also know "classic" broadcasters that are as cool as they come. To borrow an old line, they were and still are "hip", up on everything that any 25 year old is. They just happen to have a broadcasting education. And on the topic of having an FCC license, it's too bad they abolished that system. I've seen many people come into a station without knowing diddly-squat about how to maintain a program log or know any of the basics in order to not get their station fined by the feds. They know NOTHING about their own business and it shows. And that's just sad, especially at the major market level...

Seacrest is the personification of this society's elevation of the beta male.

 

[von nupkins]

Henry: I get what you're saying and you have ligitimate concerns. But the guy on the Dodgers, making the lowest amount a "try out" or rookie can make in the league, STILL tries his hardest and tries to improve on and off the field if he wants to be "one of the guys." Or at least stay for more than just a 'cup of coffee' in MLB..

I don't see/hear jr. doing any of that. I think that recent 're-sign' to a new contract in Jan. was part of the 'barely into the 6 figures push,' that after taxes, is probably between 50-75-K a year. Just supposition, but we're pretty well grounded with what we write.

That whole "I just bought a new/old house that needs a lot of work that I'll whore myself out with endorsements for" came right after the re-sign. Just think the two may be related.. Don't get me started with that whole "jr. in every stopset" routine.. I'd be here all night sighting ethics arguments.

Calguy made several good points and I accept the previous post re: technically perfect and what WAS and now IS.

Let me make a couple of points here. We're speaking LESS (that's ME as WE) of technical problems on the air (we've all made them/have them/been responsible, etc.) and more of just good English and proper grammer. Which for anyone's perusal, NEVER goes out of style, or goes unappreciated. Ask Mr. Scully when you get the chance.

The problem(s) with jr. stem from probably childhood. And please don't give me the "his mom was emotionally dead, so he gets a pass" routine. We've all been teenagers. We've all been youngsters and everything else in between. There were times we got along with our parents and times where every day there might've been some disagreement or battle to choose.
It's all a part of growing up.

The way it seems to this journalist, jr. is still looking for approval from his folks and still wanting attention, more so than your average adult. It's in his speech. It's in his choice of subject matter. It's in almost everything he does on the air. And maybe, it's so obvious to this observer, that it taints my radio listening experience when he's on the air. It's just that I've been listening to the radio (like most of us, I think) for more years than I've been on the air. We've NEVER heard a broadcaster (with music or a talk show) try soooo hard to get attention from other adults. He's like a little kid, trying to get Dad's or Mom's attention by being on teh obnoxious side, in order to get his way. We can't be the only person to have noticed this tact.

We'll get into his needing to "act out" like a kid in another post. Other duties call us to the almighty paycheck at the moment.

We'll put this out on the table for consideration and further discussion.

We have a background in psychology. Have been in broadcasting for years, but am probably younger than other posts suggest.

We don't sit around and psycho-analyze everyone on the air in order to keep sharp. But those who stick out like the proverbial sore thumb, get my attention.. Some of his on air stuff/schtick/whatever he's calling it these days, is obviosly based in his childhood and bad experiences with people in and out of his life, and he uses the airwaves like a cheap therapy session.

Except his plan isn't working. And instead of getting better with the "work" in the session, he's getting worse. And this has been going on from BEFORE his two associates left within a 2 week period. Which is telling, unto itself about the work situation jr. provided.

 

[henry]

Can't speak for Insalako, but I've chatted with Wang (Ryan Wong) now and again. His departure was simply dollars and cents (CC pays less in LA than they do in smaller markets). He loved working on the TCJS.