No one artist butters my bread. I get paid the same amount regardless of who gets played. Facts are facts. I have been known to play Emmylou, Cash, Dolly or Taylor Swift. There's a time and place for everything and every one. I go to lots of concerts by a broad range of people. One week it could be Carrie Underwood, the next it might be Emmylou or Alison Krauss. Nobody buys my loyalty.
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"Country Music"
- Thread starter K6JHU
- Start date
No one artist butters my bread. I get paid the same amount regardless of who gets played. Facts are facts. I have been known to play Emmylou, Cash, Dolly or Taylor Swift. There's a time and place for everything and every one. I go to lots of concerts by a broad range of people. One week it could be Carrie Underwood, the next it might be Emmylou or Alison Krauss. Nobody buys my loyalty.
The people who earn the "big" bucks for those of us in radio are the listeners.
By providing them with what they want, we can often prosper. They tell us what they want via research we do ourselves, music sales and downloads and on-demand streams and other less specific data like concert grosses, trending, social media image, etc.
More often than not we are at odds with the record peeps. "Play my record" usually finds us saying "no" nine times out of ten. Then they want us to play a new cut when the old one is in power. Or they want big $ to allow us to use a song or an image in our TV spot. Or they charge us normal rate to appear in a station event, even though we give them a fortune in additional promotion.
The music industry does not butter our bread. Advertisers do, and that is because we play the music their customers like.
P.S. At one station I kept at #1 for 22 years I put a sign in the PD's office. Record promoters could see it. It said, "The record promoter is not your friend. The record promoter can hurt you."
You misunderstood me. I was describing your relationship, via your career, with the industry and not any one artist or genre.
In my civilian mind the "music biz" includes the writers, performers, broadcasters and music/publicity media. Any person whose career is a part of one of these industries could reasonably be expected to promote/defend/explain the rest of it. I am NOT suggesting anyone was a paid shill or anything of that type. Merely the natural tendency of any person to be loyal to their career choice.
Based on what you're saying, I don't think you have an understanding of my relationship with the industry.
I have never heard the radio business considered part of the music business. That is a misconception on your part.
We use music as part of programming just as we use transmitters to broadcast; we are not in the transmitter business either.
Radio is in the advertising business.
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Wait, there are still 'Record Peeps"?? (Or 'Record Creeps', depending on how one views it..) I thought they went away with the traditional music industry and CD's. Do they actually visit stations, or just E-mail you a demo MP3 file?
As you can tell, I've been doing TV for a while.
Depends on the format. If your station plays a lot of currents, and is a trade reporter (such as Billboard), you see and hear from a lot of record peeps.
If you play "classic" anything, you don't.
I was speaking generally and did not mean to address any one individual.
The only thing that sticks out (to me) is that (a) you are not retired and (b) you spend an awful lot of time on this forum. That is not a criticism, just an observation and it may be wholly or partially incorrect.
To someone inside radio that is a logical deduction. To those of us on the outside it is not a distinction. Just as most people outside the newspaper business don't refer to the various sections of the paper we don't think of the various genre's of radio as anything other than "radio".
I understand what you mean by "advertising" but I don't think that is how the general population sees it. They will say TV is in the entertainment business yet TV advertises more than radio. TV also produces news and other features but they are best known for entertainment (whether sports, specials, movies or whatever). My perception is that more people listen to radio to hear music than any other single use. Therefore it makes sense that those people associate radio with music (even though "free" radio is "selling" music for listening time rather than direct revenue).
And although radio is very different today than in years past there once was a time when radio was about the only portal into recorded music of all types, especially new music. Many of us today are old enough to remember those days and still refer to it that way. Perhaps it is a generational thing.
Which has nothing to do with anything
Let's get this thread back on the subject of the Ken Burns documentary on Country music.
It's been about two months since the 8 part series debuted on PBS. I haven't seen any audience numbers yet. At some point, they usually put out a press release that covers the various PBS viewing platforms. I'm assuming it will be before the end of the year.
In the meantime, there has been quite a bit of news coverage that has measured something they call "The Ken Burns Effect:"
https://gazette.com/pikespeakcourie...cle_3898c590-ef8a-11e9-8321-4f8534278cd9.html
It's been about two months since the 8 part series debuted on PBS. I haven't seen any audience numbers yet. At some point, they usually put out a press release that covers the various PBS viewing platforms. I'm assuming it will be before the end of the year.
In the meantime, there has been quite a bit of news coverage that has measured something they call "The Ken Burns Effect:"
https://gazette.com/pikespeakcourie...cle_3898c590-ef8a-11e9-8321-4f8534278cd9.html
Anecdote about "years past": In 1964 I put my first radio station on the air. It was the first pure Top 40 in the city, the country and the continent.
The station was radically different, dismissed by advertisers and denigrated by other stations. I sold less than $50 in ads per month for 6 months. I was "seconds" away from closing the station.
But an advertising agency did a survey. The station was #1 and they sent orders for every client they had. Every other advertising agency followed suit. We suddenly were the top biller in a market of over 30 radio stations.
We created a great station, with good music, a strict format, good jocks, great jingles and fun contests. That got audience, and it was the audience that the advertisers bought. The only business we were in 55 years ago was the advertising business, because in that country in 1964 there was no music business.
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That is an interesting story. Care to share which country?
Unfortunately I cannot relate much to it because I have only listened to radio in a select few countries and most of those were in a language I could not understand.
When you read my comments you should bear in mind that I speak from my personal experience which is 99.9% within the USA (and within the Southwestern USA primarily). I do not have your international experience.
The country was Ecuador, and the year was 1964. My original station was HCRM1, 570 AM. I ended up with a group of 12 stations when the dictatorship "asked" me to leave... with rifles.
I've worked with stations as far ranging as Buenos Aires to Islamabad, and in the US from Cleveland to Miami, from Birmingham to Las Vegas and even in towns as small as Lake City, FL, and Tallahassee.
Wow! That opens up another whole interest. At the risk of taking this thread way off course, why would a government boot you out? Did they consider rock and roll to be a capitalist subversion? Don't laugh, I've heard that from official sources before.
My 9th station in Quito, after building 5 FMs and 3 other AMs was a higher power AM on 660 which did radio drama (soaps) news, sports and talk.
We were associated with the El Tiempo newspaper. And my partner on that station (all the others were mine alone) was the son of former mayor of Guayaquil and later, member of the senate and twice candidate for President and for 20 years mayor of Guayaquil and soon to be presidential candidate again.
Our alliance made us outspoken critics of the Velasco Ibarra presidency-turned-dictatorship, and we called for the promised free elections. That annoyed the government. The editor of the newspaper "disappeared" and I was given, at gunpoint, 24 hours to leave the country.
What happened to the radio stations?
Ex wife got two of them, the others went in an employee cooperative I set up as I was leaving.
And back on topic. I saw the final episode last night.
One major omission: George Jones singing "Who's Gonna Fill Their Shoes?" I thought surely that's how they would transition from the "Urban Cowboy" era to the neo-traditionalists. And the movie wasn't even mentioned, though they showed a scene from what I believe was that movie. The term was used in a newspaper article they showed.
And once again The Eagles were mentioned, but they were never included in the list of artists who weren't quite country.
At the end of his life Bill Monroe wondered about the future of bluegrass. I would say there are as many varieties of that music as there are types of country, since so many are trying to update the sound or mix it with other styles. I prefer the pure sound but I like what Ricky Skaggs did with it. I remember Monroe appearing in that video dancing but I didn't see where he was speaking.
Ironically, I thought George Strait was "too" country when he started. I had gotten so used to the Nashville sound. He sounds great to me now.
Randy Travis is from near where I live but they never mentioned Marshville, which has the big sign saying he's from there. I thought he was the best of the group.
I was surprised to hear Reba say she couldn't do crossover. I thought a lot of her songs were pop-sounding and I didn't like her that much. I liked her more traditional songs.
The Judds were great but Wynonna on her own didn't appeal to me.
Dwight Yoakam was real country, it turned out. I liked some of his music, but some of it seemed too rock-sounding at the time. I like it all now. And of course his duet with Buck Owens was great because I always liked him. They mentioned the Mexican influence on the duet.
Alan Jackson is, of course, one of the greats. I liked Clint Black too.
I was surprised to hear "Friends in Low Places" described as more of a rock song. That's the one Garth song I liked and the only one I thought sounded country. He did two more country sounding songs I liked later but they weren't mentioned.
Vince Gill did "When I Call Your Name" during a week when a Charlotte FM station tried eight formats in eight days to get listeners to vote on what they would do. I've never been sure there was a real vote. They chose "none of the above". But that was the first time I ever heard SMN Real Country and I liked it. Waylon was on there too. And then of course "Go Rest High on That Mountain" was Vince's greatest song.
I liked Rosanne Cash when she did her father's music but not the other hits. By that time I was getting tired of that crossover sound.
Meaningful lyrics were seen as important when they had Kathy Mattea's story. I'm not interested in songs like "Where've You Been", but my interest is songs that have a sound I like. A lot of country music today is meaningful lyrics that don't interest me, with a sound that I don't like either.
I liked Keith Whitley. It was not mentioned one of his last songs was "I've Done Everything Hank Did But Die".
k.d. lang has a great voice if she does country. I liked the comparison to Patsy Cline. I never cared for her pop hits, though she did a great duet with Tony Bennett that America's Best Music plays.
The people who weren't exactly country who were listed didn't really interest me.
Even if it didn't happen in the time period they intended to cover, it was great how they went ahead and covered the rest of Johnny Cash's career. The TV series "Smallville" played "Hurt" and that showed he was a big deal.
Taylor and more of today's artists at least got shown at the end.
One major omission: George Jones singing "Who's Gonna Fill Their Shoes?" I thought surely that's how they would transition from the "Urban Cowboy" era to the neo-traditionalists. And the movie wasn't even mentioned, though they showed a scene from what I believe was that movie. The term was used in a newspaper article they showed.
And once again The Eagles were mentioned, but they were never included in the list of artists who weren't quite country.
At the end of his life Bill Monroe wondered about the future of bluegrass. I would say there are as many varieties of that music as there are types of country, since so many are trying to update the sound or mix it with other styles. I prefer the pure sound but I like what Ricky Skaggs did with it. I remember Monroe appearing in that video dancing but I didn't see where he was speaking.
Ironically, I thought George Strait was "too" country when he started. I had gotten so used to the Nashville sound. He sounds great to me now.
Randy Travis is from near where I live but they never mentioned Marshville, which has the big sign saying he's from there. I thought he was the best of the group.
I was surprised to hear Reba say she couldn't do crossover. I thought a lot of her songs were pop-sounding and I didn't like her that much. I liked her more traditional songs.
The Judds were great but Wynonna on her own didn't appeal to me.
Dwight Yoakam was real country, it turned out. I liked some of his music, but some of it seemed too rock-sounding at the time. I like it all now. And of course his duet with Buck Owens was great because I always liked him. They mentioned the Mexican influence on the duet.
Alan Jackson is, of course, one of the greats. I liked Clint Black too.
I was surprised to hear "Friends in Low Places" described as more of a rock song. That's the one Garth song I liked and the only one I thought sounded country. He did two more country sounding songs I liked later but they weren't mentioned.
Vince Gill did "When I Call Your Name" during a week when a Charlotte FM station tried eight formats in eight days to get listeners to vote on what they would do. I've never been sure there was a real vote. They chose "none of the above". But that was the first time I ever heard SMN Real Country and I liked it. Waylon was on there too. And then of course "Go Rest High on That Mountain" was Vince's greatest song.
I liked Rosanne Cash when she did her father's music but not the other hits. By that time I was getting tired of that crossover sound.
Meaningful lyrics were seen as important when they had Kathy Mattea's story. I'm not interested in songs like "Where've You Been", but my interest is songs that have a sound I like. A lot of country music today is meaningful lyrics that don't interest me, with a sound that I don't like either.
I liked Keith Whitley. It was not mentioned one of his last songs was "I've Done Everything Hank Did But Die".
k.d. lang has a great voice if she does country. I liked the comparison to Patsy Cline. I never cared for her pop hits, though she did a great duet with Tony Bennett that America's Best Music plays.
The people who weren't exactly country who were listed didn't really interest me.
Even if it didn't happen in the time period they intended to cover, it was great how they went ahead and covered the rest of Johnny Cash's career. The TV series "Smallville" played "Hurt" and that showed he was a big deal.
Taylor and more of today's artists at least got shown at the end.
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