Country

[Clayton Douglas]

with country doing OK in Philly and Houston under people meter---- maybe WYNY will return to NYC? the call letters seem to be available.

 

[Clayton Douglas]

there were many "experts" who said cbs-fm would "never" return as oldies/greatest hits. so maybe country is possible. not that I like country music. personally ----- I miss standards but will likely have to hear them on HD-FM, internet, satellite or on other audio sources.

 

[DToTheJ]

As everyone knows, country has been a hard sell in New York due to sales adversity.

Now comparing the return of WYNY to the return of CBS-FM would be like comparing bowling balls to fruitcakes (Merry Christmas).

A better analogy would be to note the return of country in markets like L.A. and San Francisco that have been without them for a long period of time. It's even moderately successful in the liberal market of Boston. With all those signs, as well as the re-evolution of the country format including the popularity of "American Idol" Carrie Underwood, it should be only a matter of time before country returns to the city. ([urlhttp://www.radio-info.com/smf/index.php/topic,69591.0.html]Click here for a more detailed explanation in a previous post.[/url])

Now one could make the argument that it would be best to put it on a suburban (Long Island, Westchester) station with limited reach to the city, as has been done with the "Y-107" simulcast until it was sold (the Briarcliff Manor/Westchester station of the group last employed those WYNY calls). Again, time will tell.

 

[davideduardo]

there were many "experts" who said cbs-fm would "never" return as oldies/greatest hits.

And oldies never returned to CBS FM. It is so successful now by doing classic hits, not oldies.

 

[Danfm]

CBS FM is not true Classic Hits CBS FM is kind on a Oldies Classic Hits hybread. A true Classic it station is a AOR Hits format like Q104.3 Minus Black Sabbath, AC/DC Plus Seals & Crofts add more America, Rod Stewart, Chicago,Doobie Brothers and Eagles. Basicly AOR driven Classic Rock without the Hard Stuff.

 

[Jay F]

Country is back in Los Angeles and San Francisco. The country shares are very low. The LA and SF shares would discourage any company thinking of going country in NYC.

PPM doesn't look like it's going to be good for country radio. It seems to age the country audience. The last time I saw Houston demos, no country stations were in the top 10 25-54. Under the diary system, KILT and/or KKBQ always hit the top 10 25-54.

 

[cawasinnj]

The WYNY calls are not available. They are ironically on a country station, 1240AM on the west coast of Florida.

 

[Clayton Douglas]

but----- WYNY-FM calls are available.

 

[DavidKaye]

As everyone knows, country has been a hard sell in New York due to sales adversity.

Now comparing the return of WYNY to the return of CBS-FM would be like comparing bowling balls to fruitcakes (Merry Christmas).

A better analogy would be to note the return of country in markets like L.A. and San Francisco that have been without them for a long period of time.

As somewhat of an expert on "country" music I have to say that to refer to a music format as "country" is as lame as referring to a music format as "rock". There are at least 12 different kinds of "country" music. Here in the San Francisco area where I live, "Nashville Sound" has never gone over. But "Western" music (such as Western swing) has been very successful in the past.

For those people who are unfamiliar, the broad classifications of "country" music are: Bluegrass, honky-tonk, Nashville sound, Bakersfield sound, rockabilly, newgrass, zydeco, Cajun, oldtime, gospel, Western swing, and jug band.

Unfortunately, most people have been exposed to Nashville sound, which is little more than dreary pop music with a twang. That kind of stuff doesn't fly in most metros.

 

[DavidKaye]

For those people who are unfamiliar, the broad classifications of "country" music are: Bluegrass, -------tonk,

Ohhhh...this is funny. The "-----tonk" was automatically censored, I guess due to the fact that the first part of the word is considered derogatory in some parts of the country. Perhaps if I misspell it as "honkeeetonk" the genre name will pass uncensored. Jeezzz....next thing you know, we won't be able to talk about ------s, ----s, or --------s.

 

[surfdude]

David K said...

"Unfortunately, most people have been exposed to Nashville sound, which is little more than dreary pop music with a twang. That kind of stuff doesn't fly in most metros."

CD sales (Carrie Underwood), concert ticket sales (Kenny Chesney), and the CMA ratings (36 million viewers) proves that statement so wrong. "Country", the country coming out of mainly Nashville, is the New AC in many markets for many listeners.

 

[no1uno]

As everyone knows, country has been a hard sell in New York due to sales adversity.

Now comparing the return of WYNY to the return of CBS-FM would be like comparing bowling balls to fruitcakes (Merry Christmas).

A better analogy would be to note the return of country in markets like L.A. and San Francisco that have been without them for a long period of time.

As somewhat of an expert on "country" music I have to say that to refer to a music format as "country" is as lame as referring to a music format as "rock". There are at least 12 different kinds of "country" music. Here in the San Francisco area where I live, "Nashville Sound" has never gone over. But "Western" music (such as Western swing) has been very successful in the past.

For those people who are unfamiliar, the broad classifications of "country" music are: Bluegrass, -------tonk, Nashville sound, Bakersfield sound, rockabilly, newgrass, zydeco, Cajun, oldtime, gospel, Western swing, and jug band.

Unfortunately, most people have been exposed to Nashville sound, which is little more than dreary pop music with a twang. That kind of stuff doesn't fly in most metros.

This begs for a response. Sorry, all these are very niche forms of country product, but are far from what country is today. Philadelphia, Chicago, Detroit, Houston, Atlanta, Washington, Baltimore, san Diego, Tampa and everywhere but maybe San Francisco would disagree that Nashville Country, which by the way is the hub of the country universe, doesn't "fly" in their very big metros.

Even San Francisco is making a decent number with country today, and these sounds represent COUNTRY, not the niches. You ought to bone up on your knowledge of the product if you want to retain your "expert" status! But the diversity of the product today is not all dreary pop with a twang. The format simply has evolved, like it has evolved from Roy Rogers and Dale Evans, to the Highwaymen era, to the Urban Cowboy days, the heyday late 80s and 90s to today. Just like every other format.

 

[Element9]

So we're back on this topic again, eh? Well, nothing polarizes the posters here like "why isn't there a Country station in New York."

Today's Country might just as well be Adult Top 40. The music is exceptionally produced, the acts are slick (some might argue too slick) and photogenic and the musicianship is top notch. The writers and producers know how to make hits. The format has progressed so far beyond the "Urban Cowboy" days that even mentioning WYNY doesn't really apply.

Maybe New York is "beyond hope" for a Country format on a big signal FM. There's a lot of money at stake and radio-communications companies are getting hammered these days on Wall Street, so it's doubtful that a company would roll the dice on the format.

BUT, I'm of the mind that a company with balls, brains and marketing savvy could make it work. It takes a guy with a truckload of chutzpa and street smarts like Randy Michaels to make it work.

-9-

 

[no1uno]

It is a financial decision, just like in any other business. If you think you can make more money with an Italian restaurant, vs. steak house...Italian it is. Its arguably 18+M in expenses for a New York stick if run average. Your listenership will come outside of Manhattan. You cant make money on car dealers and outside Manhattan clients because you would have to compete with rates from their local stations. Impossible to do. You need New York rates and clients to satisfy the expenses. Its just bad math, or somebody wold be there by now. Doesn't fit the flank model either. To me, all the brains and balls in the world cant overcome the dynamic of where your listeners would essentially come from, and what you will need in ad rates to reach them.

 

[Jay F]

I'm also going to disagree with DavidKaye. While the Nashville country hits would have a rough time in NYC, I think it could still pull around a 2 share. If he thinks that "wouldn't fly" the type of obscure music he is thinking of would not show up at all. It would be fine for a specialty show on a public radio station but would be a disaster as a commercial format.

 

[AlvaJr]

How many times that I want to say? No Country Music station in NYC.

And second, why Univision Radio brings Regional Mex in NYC?

Is beacuse Regional Mex station does not belong in NYC and not even in Miami, because Country (Nashville) and Regional Mex (Noteño, Banda, Corridos and Tejano, Latin Country) works in AZ, CA, CO. IL, NM, NV and TX.

And also, why Spanish Classic Hits (formerly Spanish Oldies) doesn't have in NYC?

Is because since WPAT was launched Spanish love songs in Feburary 1996 until it was stopped playing Spanish Classics of the '50s, '60s, '70s and '80s since January 2002 and I want Spanish Classic Hits of the '70s, '80s and '90s in NYC to replace 92.7FM and letters call rename WQBU (La Que Buena) to WXTV (Pasion) (like Univision 41) since CBS-FM Classic Hits (formerly Oldies) is back in NYC since July 12, 2007 by playing the '60s, '70s and '80s hits of the decade.

 

[davideduardo]

And second, why Univision Radio brings Regional Mex in NYC?

Is beacuse Regional Mex station does not belong in NYC and not even in Miami, because Country (Nashville) and Regional Mex (Noteño, Banda, Corridos and Tejano, Latin Country) works in AZ, CA, CO. IL, NM, NV and TX.

And it works in Des Moines, Raleigh, Atlanta, Tampa, New Orleans, Birmingham, Nashville, NW Arkansas, Tulsa, Wichita, Milwaukee, Grand Rapids, and where there are large groups of Mexican immigrants. there are more Mexican heritage persons in NY than in Austin or Bakersfield or Fresno. 600,000 of them cume WQBU

And also, why Spanish Classic Hits (formerly Spanish Oldies) doesn't have in NYC?

Except for Miami, this is not a format in areas that are predominantly Caribbean in origin. WCMQ in Miami is "Cuban Oldies" yet there is not, even in Puerto Rico, an equivalent for Boricuas.

Is because since WPAT was launched Spanish love songs in Feburary 1996 until it was stopped playing Spanish Classics of the '50s, '60s, '70s and '80s since January 2002 and I want Spanish Classic Hits of the '70s, '80s and '90s in NYC to replace 92.7FM and letters call rename WQBU (La Que Buena) to WXTV (Pasion) (like Univision 41) since CBS-FM Classic Hits (formerly Oldies) is back in NYC since July 12, 2007 by playing the '60s, '70s and '80s hits of the decade.

Huh? Remember, the classic hits stations of the Southwest (Recuerdo, José, Preciosa) are really cousins of regional Mexican, and the music is 75% ranchera and grupera; WCMQ is totally Cuban and Miami. There is no such format as you envision... and that is because in Puerto Rico, the Dominican Republic, etc., it does not work.

 

[MoldaMania182]

Today's Country might just as well be Adult Top 40. The music is exceptionally produced, the acts are slick (some might argue too slick) and photogenic and the musicianship is top notch. The writers and producers know how to make hits. The format has progressed so far beyond the "Urban Cowboy" days that even mentioning WYNY doesn't really apply.

I completely agree. I'm not going to get into the mess of what "real country" is or not, but the only way country could work in NYC is something worked around Today's Country as you put it. Say, Rascal Flatts, Carrie Underwood, Phil Vassar, Kenny Chesney etc. I'm sure the diehard out of market country fans would complain it sounds like an AC station and that it distorts the genre, but NY would call it country, and it may just work enough to get a tiny share, but it wont happen, so... C'est la Vie.

 

[KFodor]

Today's Country might just as well be Adult Top 40. The music is exceptionally produced, the acts are slick (some might argue too slick) and photogenic and the musicianship is top notch. The writers and producers know how to make hits. The format has progressed so far beyond the "Urban Cowboy" days that even mentioning WYNY doesn't really apply.

I completely agree. I'm not going to get into the mess of what "real country" is or not, but the only way country could work in NYC is something worked around Today's Country as you put it. Say, Rascal Flatts, Carrie Underwood, Phil Vassar, Kenny Chesney etc. I'm sure the diehard out of market country fans would complain it sounds like an AC station and that it distorts the genre, but NY would call it country, and it may just work enough to get a tiny share, but it wont happen, so... C'est la Vie.

Most of those artists you mentioned get airplay on A/C stations all over the country. So, New York is being exposed to "today's country"...just in smaller amounts.

I know some country "pureists" hate today's country...but, country has been headed that way since the early 1980's.