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Cox Should Jack Its Four Florida Stations

P

PassDutch

Guest
This will be on the Miami, Orlando, Tampa & North Florida boards. Cox should flip its Jacksonville & Tampa stations to "Jack" clones, modeled after Cox's 98-9 WMMO in Orlando.

Here it is!

Miami: WFLC (Dropping the "Coast" AC Format)
Orlando: WMMO (Has been Floida's first adult hits station)
Tampa: WPOI (Dropping "Point" 80's Format)
Jacksonville: WMXQ (Also Dropping 80's)
 
Re: Cox - Jack

Silly notion- all of these stations usually perform well 25-54, WMMO being
ranked #1 recently. WMXQ has rebounded after The Eagle signed-on and
Tampa also does consistently well 25-54.

Flipping for the sake of flipping (ESPECIALLY successful stations) is no
way for radio to operate (recent Jack-ing notwithstanding).

> Here it is!
>
> Miami: WFLC (Dropping the "Coast" AC Format)
> Orlando: WMMO (Has been Floida's first adult hits station)
> Tampa: WPOI (Dropping "Point" 80's Format)
> Jacksonville: WMXQ (Also Dropping 80's)
>
 
Re: Cox - Jack

> Silly notion- all of these stations usually perform well
> 25-54, WMMO being
> ranked #1 recently. WMXQ has rebounded after The Eagle
> signed-on and
> Tampa also does consistently well 25-54.
>
> Flipping for the sake of flipping (ESPECIALLY successful
> stations) is no
> way for radio to operate (recent Jack-ing notwithstanding).
>
> > Here it is!
> >
> > Miami: WFLC (Dropping the "Coast" AC Format)
> > Orlando: WMMO (Has been Floida's first adult hits station)
>
> > Tampa: WPOI (Dropping "Point" 80's Format)
> > Jacksonville: WMXQ (Also Dropping 80's)
> >
>
Also, I wouldn't consider WMMO Orlando a real "Jack" (variety hits) station anyway. They are a Rock AC (a term they kind of coined when they debuted in the early 90s) and haven't seemed to change to me. Their laid back easy listening style of announcing and lack of pop or any 80's rhythmic titles would also count them out as being a Variety hits-Jack station in my opinion.
 
Cox - Jack

but they take up enough room in Jack's general market position that it would make it a bigger challenge for Jack to carve out enough real estate to prosper.
Format labels are just that- labels.

> >
> Also, I wouldn't consider WMMO Orlando a real "Jack"
> (variety hits) station anyway. They are a Rock AC (a term
> they kind of coined when they debuted in the early 90s) and
> haven't seemed to change to me. Their laid back easy
> listening style of announcing and lack of pop or any 80's
> rhythmic titles would also count them out as being a Variety
> hits-Jack station in my opinion.
>
 
> This will be on the Miami, Orlando, Tampa & North Florida
> boards. Cox should flip its Jacksonville & Tampa stations to
> "Jack" clones, modeled after Cox's 98-9 WMMO in Orlando.
>
> Here it is!
>
> Miami: WFLC (Dropping the "Coast" AC Format)
> Orlando: WMMO (Has been Floida's first adult hits station)
> Tampa: WPOI (Dropping "Point" 80's Format)
> Jacksonville: WMXQ (Also Dropping 80's)



If the stations are making money why change? Just to say that you are going with the latest trendy thing? That is just not the way Cox operates, from what I have seen, and I'm sure that they are not going to change just because someone on a radio board has been lobbying for it. If the stations change, they change. Cox would have done their homework first before doing it.

Here's a thought for you. If Cox does change those stations to the "Jack" format, you can post everywhere you need to saying that you single handedly brought about the change by posting in every radio board in Florida.

>
 
Re: Cox - Jack

Lack of Pop? what about Rob Thomas? Maroon 5? Green Day? Lifehouse? 5 for Fighting? When WMMO first hit the airwaves in the late 80's (not sure which year) they were a real Triple A thanks to Cary Pall, but Orlando just wasn't ready for such a sophisticated approach. Still don't know if it is. Seems Triple A works (or worked) much better out West. Only Triple A I'm aware of that has garnered any modicum of succes in the South is "The River" 100.3 in Knoxville, TN. Not sure if that format is still there, last I was up there was a year ago. No doubt WMMO is unique, but more of a hybrid of AC, oldies and the milder AOR hits.

> Also, I wouldn't consider WMMO Orlando a real "Jack"
> (variety hits) station anyway. They are a Rock AC (a term
> they kind of coined when they debuted in the early 90s) and
> haven't seemed to change to me. Their laid back easy
> listening style of announcing and lack of pop or any 80's
> rhythmic titles would also count them out as being a Variety
> hits-Jack station in my opinion.
>
 
Re: Cox - Jack

Orlando not ready for WMMO? Do your homework- for years they were #1 25-54
and have returned to ranking of late. SOMEBODY down there is listening
and gets it.

And, they're not (and never were) an AAA station. More classic hits than anything.

> When WMMO first hit the airwaves
> in the late 80's (not sure which year) they were a real
> Triple A thanks to Cary Pall, but Orlando just wasn't ready
> for such a sophisticated approach. Still don't know if it
> is. Seems Triple A works (or worked) much better out West.
> Only Triple A I'm aware of that has garnered any modicum of
> succes in the South is "The River" 100.3 in Knoxville, TN.
> Not sure if that format is still there, last I was up there
> was a year ago. No doubt WMMO is unique, but more of a
> hybrid of AC, oldies and the milder AOR hits.
>
> > Also, I wouldn't consider WMMO Orlando a real "Jack"
> > (variety hits) station anyway. They are a Rock AC (a term
>
> > they kind of coined when they debuted in the early 90s)
> and
> > haven't seemed to change to me. Their laid back easy
> > listening style of announcing and lack of pop or any 80's
> > rhythmic titles would also count them out as being a
> Variety
> > hits-Jack station in my opinion.
> >
>
 
Re: Cox - Jack

> And, they're not (and never were) an AAA station. More
> classic hits than anything.

I like what it was called in a previous post... a male AC.... or Rock AC will do too.
 
Re: Cox - Jack

Oldies Cat, you've reacted to several posts on this board as of late as though they were personal attacks on you. Take a deep breath. This is just a discussion. I lived in Orlando then, actually, since 1984, and I live here now. I was born here many years before that (lets not go there!) and even though i left for a couple decades, i spent every summer here since birth.

When WMMO debuted circa 1990 it was under the programming direction of Cary Pall in 1990, who was also the engineer. Those who lived in Orlando during that time heard a distinctly unique playlist, much different than today. I'm not talking about positioning statements or formatics... but the songs themselves. It was most definitely Triple A at that time, as Mr. Pall was a pioneer of that format. I recall hearing bands such as Traffic and the cut Hidden Treasure. That is not a song you will hear on WMMO today, and is what would be considered of a sound that is typical of a Triple A station. I also had several conversations with Cary, who referred to the initial format as Triple A, and also bemoaned the reality that it doesn't work in Orlando. (the music format, not the station) Other songs no longer heard since the station morphed into its current state: Little Feat's All that you Dream, Bonnie Raitt's Whiskey, Kenny Rankin's version of Manic Depression, I could go on, the play list was long. I think the meaning of what I wrote is fairly clear. When i said that Orlando wasn't ready, i meant the Triple A music format the station played, not WMMO in its current state today. When they programmed as a Triple A, with something in the neighborhood of 3000 titles, they tanked in the ratings.



> Orlando not ready for WMMO? Do your homework- for years
> they were #1 25-54
> and have returned to ranking of late. SOMEBODY down there
> is listening
> and gets it.
>
> And, they're not (and never were) an AAA station. More
> classic hits than anything.
>
> > When WMMO first hit the airwaves
> > in the late 80's (not sure which year) they were a real
> > Triple A thanks to Cary Pall, but Orlando just wasn't
> ready
> > for such a sophisticated approach. Still don't know if it
> > is. Seems Triple A works (or worked) much better out West.
>
> > Only Triple A I'm aware of that has garnered any modicum
> of
> > succes in the South is "The River" 100.3 in Knoxville, TN.
>
> > Not sure if that format is still there, last I was up
> there
> > was a year ago. No doubt WMMO is unique, but more of a
> > hybrid of AC, oldies and the milder AOR hits.
> >
> > > Also, I wouldn't consider WMMO Orlando a real "Jack"
> > > (variety hits) station anyway. They are a Rock AC (a
> term
> >
> > > they kind of coined when they debuted in the early 90s)
> > and
> > > haven't seemed to change to me. Their laid back easy
> > > listening style of announcing and lack of pop or any
> 80's
> > > rhythmic titles would also count them out as being a
> > Variety
> > > hits-Jack station in my opinion.
> > >
> >
>
 
Re: Cox - Jack

I gotta agree about the WMMO - I thought the station sounded much better when Cary Pall was around and it was closer to a AAA format. Now, WMMO is more of a mish-mash it's a little bit classic hits, a little bit AC, plus every single freakin' Sting and Phil Collins song out there. It's becoming much less of a male focussed station and sounding much female.
 
WMMO

Just stating fact- if you believe I take ANY of this personally, you are reading between lines that don't exist and overthinking what you see. It really is OK to call somebody out if you believe their misinformed or incorrect (that's why it's called a "discussion board", so we can volley things back & forth).

That being said, so what if some of the titles on the station aren't anymore- that doesn't matter because on any library-based stations titles come and go. And, during their history a lot of music has been recorded that wasn't available then. If you actually ask Cary Pall (whom people at Cox today still credit with the station's concept), he'll tell you it isn't and never was AAA. The "Rock AC" descriptor seems to be used the most (or some brand of Classic Hits) and today he's still putting on WMMO-type stations (latest in Tulsa).

> Oldies Cat, you've reacted to several posts on this board as
> of late as though they were personal attacks on you. Take a
> deep breath. This is just a discussion. I lived in Orlando
> then, actually, since 1984, and I live here now. I was born
> here many years before that (lets not go there!) and even
> though i left for a couple decades, i spent every summer
> here since birth.
>
> When WMMO debuted circa 1990 it was under the programming
> direction of Cary Pall in 1990, who was also the engineer.
> Those who lived in Orlando during that time heard a
> distinctly unique playlist, much different than today. I'm
> not talking about positioning statements or formatics... but
> the songs themselves. It was most definitely Triple A at
> that time, as Mr. Pall was a pioneer of that format. I
> recall hearing bands such as Traffic and the cut Hidden
> Treasure. That is not a song you will hear on WMMO today,
> and is what would be considered of a sound that is typical
> of a Triple A station. I also had several conversations with
> Cary, who referred to the initial format as Triple A, and
> also bemoaned the reality that it doesn't work in Orlando.
> (the music format, not the station) Other songs no longer
> heard since the station morphed into its current state:
> Little Feat's All that you Dream, Bonnie Raitt's Whiskey,
> Kenny Rankin's version of Manic Depression, I could go on,
> the play list was long. I think the meaning of what I wrote
> is fairly clear. When i said that Orlando wasn't ready, i
> meant the Triple A music format the station played, not WMMO
> in its current state today. When they programmed as a
> Triple A, with something in the neighborhood of 3000 titles,
> they tanked in the ratings.
>
>
>
> > Orlando not ready for WMMO? Do your homework- for years
> > they were #1 25-54
> > and have returned to ranking of late. SOMEBODY down there
>
> > is listening
> > and gets it.
> >
> > And, they're not (and never were) an AAA station. More
> > classic hits than anything.
> >
> > > When WMMO first hit the airwaves
> > > in the late 80's (not sure which year) they were a real
> > > Triple A thanks to Cary Pall, but Orlando just wasn't
> > ready
> > > for such a sophisticated approach. Still don't know if
> it
> > > is. Seems Triple A works (or worked) much better out
> West.
> >
> > > Only Triple A I'm aware of that has garnered any modicum
>
> > of
> > > succes in the South is "The River" 100.3 in Knoxville,
> TN.
> >
> > > Not sure if that format is still there, last I was up
> > there
> > > was a year ago. No doubt WMMO is unique, but more of a
> > > hybrid of AC, oldies and the milder AOR hits.
> > >
> > > > Also, I wouldn't consider WMMO Orlando a real "Jack"
>
> > > > (variety hits) station anyway. They are a Rock AC (a
> > term
> > >
> > > > they kind of coined when they debuted in the early
> 90s)
> > > and
> > > > haven't seemed to change to me. Their laid back easy
>
> > > > listening style of announcing and lack of pop or any
> > 80's
> > > > rhythmic titles would also count them out as being a
> > > Variety
> > > > hits-Jack station in my opinion.
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
 
Re: WMMO

wow... i think it was the strong reactions you've had that led me to that conclusion. my comments are about what was, not what is. i lived here then and i live here now. i think that what you perceive are facts are actually opinions, and that's okay. we can split hairs over the meaning of Triple A just as easily as we can debate how appropriate it is for a classic rock station to play a new release by Aerosmith. it just ain't that big of a deal.

i don't doubt that the folks at COX give credit to Cary for the station, they should. i don't thnk anything i've written suggests otherwise. as i said earlier, i have spoken with Cary a number of times. In fact, he offered me a fulltime position at WMMO, however, i had two other offers on the table that were more attractive, and opted to take one of them. Later on, Paul Warren called me to offer me a position there again, but I turned him down because i was very happy with the position i was in.

no hard feelings. peace, Bro

> Just stating fact- if you believe I take ANY of this
> personally, you are reading between lines that don't exist
> and overthinking what you see. It really is OK to call
> somebody out if you believe their misinformed or incorrect
> (that's why it's called a "discussion board", so we can
> volley things back & forth).
>
> That being said, so what if some of the titles on the
> station aren't anymore- that doesn't matter because on any
> library-based stations titles come and go. And, during
> their history a lot of music has been recorded that wasn't
> available then. If you actually ask Cary Pall (whom people
> at Cox today still credit with the station's concept), he'll
> tell you it isn't and never was AAA. The "Rock AC"
> descriptor seems to be used the most (or some brand of
> Classic Hits) and today he's still putting on WMMO-type
> stations (latest in Tulsa).
>
> > Oldies Cat, you've reacted to several posts on this board
> as
> > of late as though they were personal attacks on you. Take
> a
> > deep breath. This is just a discussion. I lived in Orlando
>
> > then, actually, since 1984, and I live here now. I was
> born
> > here many years before that (lets not go there!) and even
> > though i left for a couple decades, i spent every summer
> > here since birth.
> >
> > When WMMO debuted circa 1990 it was under the programming
> > direction of Cary Pall in 1990, who was also the engineer.
>
> > Those who lived in Orlando during that time heard a
> > distinctly unique playlist, much different than today. I'm
>
> > not talking about positioning statements or formatics...
> but
> > the songs themselves. It was most definitely Triple A at
> > that time, as Mr. Pall was a pioneer of that format. I
> > recall hearing bands such as Traffic and the cut Hidden
> > Treasure. That is not a song you will hear on WMMO today,
> > and is what would be considered of a sound that is typical
>
> > of a Triple A station. I also had several conversations
> with
> > Cary, who referred to the initial format as Triple A, and
> > also bemoaned the reality that it doesn't work in Orlando.
>
> > (the music format, not the station) Other songs no longer
> > heard since the station morphed into its current state:
> > Little Feat's All that you Dream, Bonnie Raitt's Whiskey,
> > Kenny Rankin's version of Manic Depression, I could go on,
>
> > the play list was long. I think the meaning of what I
> wrote
> > is fairly clear. When i said that Orlando wasn't ready, i
> > meant the Triple A music format the station played, not
> WMMO
> > in its current state today. When they programmed as a
> > Triple A, with something in the neighborhood of 3000
> titles,
> > they tanked in the ratings.
> >
> >
> >
> > > Orlando not ready for WMMO? Do your homework- for years
>
> > > they were #1 25-54
> > > and have returned to ranking of late. SOMEBODY down
> there
> >
> > > is listening
> > > and gets it.
> > >
> > > And, they're not (and never were) an AAA station. More
> > > classic hits than anything.
> > >
> > > > When WMMO first hit the airwaves
> > > > in the late 80's (not sure which year) they were a
> real
> > > > Triple A thanks to Cary Pall, but Orlando just wasn't
> > > ready
> > > > for such a sophisticated approach. Still don't know if
>
> > it
> > > > is. Seems Triple A works (or worked) much better out
> > West.
> > >
> > > > Only Triple A I'm aware of that has garnered any
> modicum
> >
> > > of
> > > > succes in the South is "The River" 100.3 in Knoxville,
>
> > TN.
> > >
> > > > Not sure if that format is still there, last I was up
> > > there
> > > > was a year ago. No doubt WMMO is unique, but more of a
>
> > > > hybrid of AC, oldies and the milder AOR hits.
> > > >
> > > > > Also, I wouldn't consider WMMO Orlando a real
> "Jack"
> >
> > > > > (variety hits) station anyway. They are a Rock AC
> (a
> > > term
> > > >
> > > > > they kind of coined when they debuted in the early
> > 90s)
> > > > and
> > > > > haven't seemed to change to me. Their laid back
> easy
> >
> > > > > listening style of announcing and lack of pop or any
>
> > > 80's
> > > > > rhythmic titles would also count them out as being a
>
> > > > Variety
> > > > > hits-Jack station in my opinion.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
 
One thing is CERTAIN!

One thing is Certain, the station DID sound much better when Cary Pall was around than it does now with its emphasis on Female Soft Rock.

I do believe that this Board would really perk up when SOMEBODY flips to jack, If mix or O rock flip, i believe it will start the eroding process at the boring, post Cary Pall WMMO. I am a Central FL resident who listens on occasion to WMMO
 
Re: WMMO

In general, WMMO sounds like an interesting and creative station. Last year when I was down in Florida for a few weeks, I was listening to WMMO as I drove through Orlando. It was a good station and I guess it would be appropiate to call it "Rock AC". I only listened once, but that is the opinion and observation I can form.
<P ID="signature">______________
Kevin</P>
 
Mix, O Rock, and Jack

It would be interesting if one of those stations flipped to Jack. Who doesn't do as well, WOMX or O Rock? For the station not doing well, it may be a smart decision. Mix would seem more likely to switch to Jack though. I guess will see, but the main question is: Will Jack come to Florida to get some sun?<P ID="signature">______________
Kevin</P>
 
well,

they take up a lot of real estate, especially since you lost your Oldies station WMMO is on a roll. top of the market 25-54 must mean many souls are listening more than you.

> One thing is Certain, the station DID sound much better when
> Cary Pall was around than it does now with its emphasis on
> Female Soft Rock.
>
> I do believe that this Board would really perk up when
> SOMEBODY flips to jack, If mix or O rock flip, i believe it
> will start the eroding process at the boring, post Cary Pall
> WMMO. I am a Central FL resident who listens on occasion to
> WMMO
>
 
Re: Cox - Jack

> Lack of Pop? what about Rob Thomas? Maroon 5? Green Day?
> Lifehouse? 5 for Fighting? When WMMO first hit the airwaves
> in the late 80's (not sure which year) they were a real
> Triple A thanks to Cary Pall, but Orlando just wasn't ready
> for such a sophisticated approach. Still don't know if it
> is. Seems Triple A works (or worked) much better out West.
> Only Triple A I'm aware of that has garnered any modicum of
> succes in the South is "The River" 100.3 in Knoxville, TN.
> Not sure if that format is still there, last I was up there
> was a year ago. No doubt WMMO is unique, but more of a
> hybrid of AC, oldies and the milder AOR hits.

I used to describe WMMO as either the hippest AC in America or the most conservative Triple A station in America.
 
Re: Cox - Jack

> Oldies Cat, you've reacted to several posts on this board as
> of late as though they were personal attacks on you. Take a
> deep breath. This is just a discussion. I lived in Orlando
> then, actually, since 1984, and I live here now. I was born
> here many years before that (lets not go there!) and even
> though i left for a couple decades, i spent every summer
> here since birth.
>
> When WMMO debuted circa 1990 it was under the programming
> direction of Cary Pall in 1990, who was also the engineer.
> Those who lived in Orlando during that time heard a
> distinctly unique playlist, much different than today. I'm
> not talking about positioning statements or formatics... but
> the songs themselves. It was most definitely Triple A at
> that time, as Mr. Pall was a pioneer of that format. I
> recall hearing bands such as Traffic and the cut Hidden
> Treasure. That is not a song you will hear on WMMO today,
> and is what would be considered of a sound that is typical
> of a Triple A station. I also had several conversations with
> Cary, who referred to the initial format as Triple A, and
> also bemoaned the reality that it doesn't work in Orlando.
> (the music format, not the station) Other songs no longer
> heard since the station morphed into its current state:
> Little Feat's All that you Dream, Bonnie Raitt's Whiskey,
> Kenny Rankin's version of Manic Depression, I could go on,
> the play list was long. I think the meaning of what I wrote
> is fairly clear. When i said that Orlando wasn't ready, i
> meant the Triple A music format the station played, not WMMO
> in its current state today. When they programmed as a
> Triple A, with something in the neighborhood of 3000 titles,
> they tanked in the ratings.
>

Not that I don't appreciate the sentiment, but Bonnie Raiit "Whiskey" and nothing by Kenny Rankin ever played on WMMO while I was programming it unless someone snuck them in while I was sleeping or out of town, just to set the record straight. I still have the Selector database, and they ain't in it. Little Feat was there occasionally, however, and we did play some deeper Traffic cuts. We certainly were packaged in a very similar way to Triple A stations like KBCO and KINK but our music list was decidedly more conservative and pop leaning (but not pop by any stretch...the name Rock AC implies just that; we played rock songs that could have played on AC, and vice versa), hence the comparisons to Jack. Orlando wasn't ready for a full blown Triple A, and Denver wouldn't have been either, if KBCO hadn't been there exposing the music over time since 1976. If we had tried to unload that much unfamiliar music on Orlando, we would have been dead before we started.
 
THANK YOU!!!

Your kind comments about WMMO are appreciated more than you will ever know. WMMO was a lot more than a job to us. Until the "barbarians at the gate" showed up, anyway.
 
Re: Cox - Jack

thanks, Cary.

>
> Not that I don't appreciate the sentiment, but Bonnie Raiit
> "Whiskey" and nothing by Kenny Rankin ever played on WMMO
> while I was programming it unless someone snuck them in
> while I was sleeping or out of town, just to set the record
> straight. I still have the Selector database, and they
> ain't in it. Little Feat was there occasionally, however,
> and we did play some deeper Traffic cuts. We certainly were
> packaged in a very similar way to Triple A stations like
> KBCO and KINK but our music list was decidedly more
> conservative and pop leaning (but not pop by any
> stretch...the name Rock AC implies just that; we played rock
> songs that could have played on AC, and vice versa), hence
> the comparisons to Jack. Orlando wasn't ready for a full
> blown Triple A, and Denver wouldn't have been either, if
> KBCO hadn't been there exposing the music over time since
> 1976. If we had tried to unload that much unfamiliar music
> on Orlando, we would have been dead before we started.
>
 
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