Word from an ad firm today is that Cox reps are hinting heavily that a format flip to an fm newstalk is coming by the end of the year, and one would have to guess that would be on 102.3. Would they simulcast KRMG?
JT
JT
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Cox spinning format wheel again
- Thread starter journaltulsa
- Start date
Wow with KRAV's latest book.... Is it totally stupid to think they would be a candidate?
B
BehindTheLines
Guest
Remember the rumor mill last time Cox spun that format wheel? They were saying 102.3 was going to be an FM talker THEN too. Next thing you know, BAM...there's Spirit. Sure it's not just another diversion?
It's not stupid to think Mix would be a candidate. But it IS unlikely. Cox doesn't knee jerk like that based on one book.
Here's my analysis. It would appear that Spirit is cannibalizing Mix's women numbers. I'm not sure Cox knows what to do. A station they put on as a spoiler is actually spoiling another of their own stations. It was clear from the beginning that Spirit was designed to stop KXOJ from dominating Mix. But now that Spirit is out-pacing the station is was put on to protect, there are problems. Could it be that the GRAND EXPERIMENT has backfired?
Prediction: With Cox's recently successful track record of putting on FM talkers (Jacksonville and Dayton), Cox turns Spirit into "KRMG-FM" to bolster their news/talk numbers. "KRMG AM/FM" simulcast becomes the NUMBER ONE station in Tulsa. Mix recovers to their previous status by no longer having an AC sister to steal it's thunder. Cox gets out of the Christian music business.
Heck, it was worth a try right?
Across town, KXOJ returns to it's twelve plus upper 4 and 5 shares.
It's not stupid to think Mix would be a candidate. But it IS unlikely. Cox doesn't knee jerk like that based on one book.
Here's my analysis. It would appear that Spirit is cannibalizing Mix's women numbers. I'm not sure Cox knows what to do. A station they put on as a spoiler is actually spoiling another of their own stations. It was clear from the beginning that Spirit was designed to stop KXOJ from dominating Mix. But now that Spirit is out-pacing the station is was put on to protect, there are problems. Could it be that the GRAND EXPERIMENT has backfired?
Prediction: With Cox's recently successful track record of putting on FM talkers (Jacksonville and Dayton), Cox turns Spirit into "KRMG-FM" to bolster their news/talk numbers. "KRMG AM/FM" simulcast becomes the NUMBER ONE station in Tulsa. Mix recovers to their previous status by no longer having an AC sister to steal it's thunder. Cox gets out of the Christian music business.
Heck, it was worth a try right?
Across town, KXOJ returns to it's twelve plus upper 4 and 5 shares.
J
JournalGuy
Guest
I talked with a good friend at Cox and I got the scoop.
No format change. They made a management budget cut but they are adding a morning man to Spirit next week.
The PD is moving to middays. Doesn't sound like they are giving up the format, so sorry KXOJDJ and KXOJBOB. They aren't going away.
From what I have seen in the trends, KKCM is beating KXOJ 25-54, so again, they will probably stay in the format. KRAV looks like they are coming out of the slump too. The last two trends have been better.
Why would they put KRMG on FM? They have a killer signal. In the two Cox markets where they simulcast, the AM signals are not 50,000 watts. I bet KRMG has a better coverage than KKCM. Just like 1170 has a bettter coverage than most Tulsa FM's. Otherwise, we would have put KFAQ on 99.5 years ago. (We talked about it.)
The real prediction is a format change on 106.1. Any ideas?
No format change. They made a management budget cut but they are adding a morning man to Spirit next week.
The PD is moving to middays. Doesn't sound like they are giving up the format, so sorry KXOJDJ and KXOJBOB. They aren't going away.
From what I have seen in the trends, KKCM is beating KXOJ 25-54, so again, they will probably stay in the format. KRAV looks like they are coming out of the slump too. The last two trends have been better.
Why would they put KRMG on FM? They have a killer signal. In the two Cox markets where they simulcast, the AM signals are not 50,000 watts. I bet KRMG has a better coverage than KKCM. Just like 1170 has a bettter coverage than most Tulsa FM's. Otherwise, we would have put KFAQ on 99.5 years ago. (We talked about it.)
The real prediction is a format change on 106.1. Any ideas?
B
BehindTheLines
Guest
So who got the ax in management at Cox?
And who's the new morning guy on 102.3?
And who's the new morning guy on 102.3?
A
AndyBarber
Guest
:
I have not been here for awhile.. you people crack me up about all these RUMORS!!! I've been in The Radio Biz "40" now in 28 cities...All those rumors are fake, I'm here I don't see any of this happening..!!! Cox Radio and our people running this know what's up!!
Andy Barber/KJSR Star-103.3 (in my 14 year of tulsa radio)
I have not been here for awhile.. you people crack me up about all these RUMORS!!! I've been in The Radio Biz "40" now in 28 cities...All those rumors are fake, I'm here I don't see any of this happening..!!! Cox Radio and our people running this know what's up!!
Andy Barber/KJSR Star-103.3 (in my 14 year of tulsa radio)
J
JournalGuy
Guest
Guys. Andy is right. It cracks me up with some of the stuff that is posted here. Try to get the facts right before posting.
I think the Cox manager was on the sales side. The 102-3 morning guy is coming from Arkansas. Not sure when he is moving to Tulsa, but I understand that he has been around the station. He is starting after Labor Day Weekend.
Somebody joked that DelGiorno was coming back to Cox to host mornings on 102-3. Now that would be FUNNY! He could give gambling tips between Christian songs. A totally new concept.
I think the Cox manager was on the sales side. The 102-3 morning guy is coming from Arkansas. Not sure when he is moving to Tulsa, but I understand that he has been around the station. He is starting after Labor Day Weekend.
Somebody joked that DelGiorno was coming back to Cox to host mornings on 102-3. Now that would be FUNNY! He could give gambling tips between Christian songs. A totally new concept.
Re: Cox spinning format wheel again in Tulsa
Well, I got the ax a few weeks back, and last time I got the ax at Cox, "Rock 102.3" became "Spirit 102.3"... Conspiracy-hunters, discuss!
Seriously, I think Andy's right... I know these things can happen suddenly but when I was there the talk wasn't about anything mentioned above.
Spirit, as far as I know, is a cash cow for Cox. I think it's giving KRMG a run for their money for making easy cash. K95 of course is on top, Star is trending upwards... Mix is the only one I see hurting, and some on the board are reporting they are trending up as well.
To my eyes, Cox Tulsa is in a bad way. Mix is being programmed exactly the way Atlanta wants it programmed (whatever we may think of it here). If books continue to be bad, then I expect it will be (unfairly) be blamed on personnel, not the formatics.
If you go light AC with Mix, you cut into Spirit's audience and put yourself up again 'BZ who has held that title for decades.
Corporate won't see the logic of all-80s because where all-80s has been done across the nation it has failed (never mind that I don't think it's been done right yet).
If you simulcast with KRMG you #1 reveal how bad-sounding a lot of these talk show feeds are, and #2 divide the audience between AM & FM. Why take an 8 and make it two 4s? (SEE: "Mel & Dave watch 14K nosedive when simulcast on 92K back in the 80s.")
Is the time right for a JACK-FM in Tulsa? You blow out the (admittedly very talented and seasoned) airstaff to save costs, then you either program it on hard drive from Atlanta or you run ABC's satellite version. That would carry you short-term... I'm not convinced of JACK-FM's long-term capabilities.
If Mix trends back up, especially if it continues to be something Account Executives can sell, look for absolutely no changes at all. I think that's about as good as they can hope for.
Well, I got the ax a few weeks back, and last time I got the ax at Cox, "Rock 102.3" became "Spirit 102.3"... Conspiracy-hunters, discuss!
Seriously, I think Andy's right... I know these things can happen suddenly but when I was there the talk wasn't about anything mentioned above.
Spirit, as far as I know, is a cash cow for Cox. I think it's giving KRMG a run for their money for making easy cash. K95 of course is on top, Star is trending upwards... Mix is the only one I see hurting, and some on the board are reporting they are trending up as well.
To my eyes, Cox Tulsa is in a bad way. Mix is being programmed exactly the way Atlanta wants it programmed (whatever we may think of it here). If books continue to be bad, then I expect it will be (unfairly) be blamed on personnel, not the formatics.
If you go light AC with Mix, you cut into Spirit's audience and put yourself up again 'BZ who has held that title for decades.
Corporate won't see the logic of all-80s because where all-80s has been done across the nation it has failed (never mind that I don't think it's been done right yet).
If you simulcast with KRMG you #1 reveal how bad-sounding a lot of these talk show feeds are, and #2 divide the audience between AM & FM. Why take an 8 and make it two 4s? (SEE: "Mel & Dave watch 14K nosedive when simulcast on 92K back in the 80s.")
Is the time right for a JACK-FM in Tulsa? You blow out the (admittedly very talented and seasoned) airstaff to save costs, then you either program it on hard drive from Atlanta or you run ABC's satellite version. That would carry you short-term... I'm not convinced of JACK-FM's long-term capabilities.
If Mix trends back up, especially if it continues to be something Account Executives can sell, look for absolutely no changes at all. I think that's about as good as they can hope for.
From what I've heard, Mix signficantly outbills its ratings share. So, I wouldn't look for any changes in the near future.
I really don't see KRMG-FM as likely in the near future. It may have some signal issues before long because of the explosive growth of the Owasso and Collinsville areas, but it should still cover the Tulsa area just fine for the foreseeable future. It certainly doesn't parallel WOKV in Jacksonville, which has one of the tightest nighttime directional patterns I've seen outside of 1190 in Dallas. WOKV needed that FM at 106.5 and often borrowed 96.9 during nighttime severe weather coverage because the areas around Jacksonville couldn't hear it after dark.
I'm not sure why Cox is simulcasting WHIO in Dayton on 95.7 as 1290 has few to no signal issues. However, I do know there's a proposal to move 95.7 into Cincinnati. Given the Point wasn't doing well at 95.7, maybe Cox was just trying to do something to keep the carrier warm knowing that 95.7 wouldn't be around much longer. That's just speculation on my part, but I can't see Cox doing FM talk in Dayton after moving 95.7 into Cincinnati, and I don't see them moving any stations out of Tulsa.
I really don't see KRMG-FM as likely in the near future. It may have some signal issues before long because of the explosive growth of the Owasso and Collinsville areas, but it should still cover the Tulsa area just fine for the foreseeable future. It certainly doesn't parallel WOKV in Jacksonville, which has one of the tightest nighttime directional patterns I've seen outside of 1190 in Dallas. WOKV needed that FM at 106.5 and often borrowed 96.9 during nighttime severe weather coverage because the areas around Jacksonville couldn't hear it after dark.
I'm not sure why Cox is simulcasting WHIO in Dayton on 95.7 as 1290 has few to no signal issues. However, I do know there's a proposal to move 95.7 into Cincinnati. Given the Point wasn't doing well at 95.7, maybe Cox was just trying to do something to keep the carrier warm knowing that 95.7 wouldn't be around much longer. That's just speculation on my part, but I can't see Cox doing FM talk in Dayton after moving 95.7 into Cincinnati, and I don't see them moving any stations out of Tulsa.
Kent,
You bring up a good point on KRMG's coverage north of Tulsa, especially nighttime.
I often wished when I was there that they would get 101.5 from CC and simulcast... maybe nighttime only? That starts getting complicated... and of course to get 101.5 they'd have to dump an FM... why give up 100kw to buy 6?
You bring up a good point on KRMG's coverage north of Tulsa, especially nighttime.
I often wished when I was there that they would get 101.5 from CC and simulcast... maybe nighttime only? That starts getting complicated... and of course to get 101.5 they'd have to dump an FM... why give up 100kw to buy 6?
B
BehindTheLines
Guest
JournalGuy said:Guys. Andy is right. It cracks me up with some of the stuff that is posted here. Try to get the facts right before posting.
I think the Cox manager was on the sales side. The 102-3 morning guy is coming from Arkansas. Not sure when he is moving to Tulsa, but I understand that he has been around the station. He is starting after Labor Day Weekend.
Somebody joked that DelGiorno was coming back to Cox to host mornings on 102-3. Now that would be FUNNY! He could give gambling tips between Christian songs. A totally new concept.
I knew a guy who hosted a morning show at Clear Channel down the hall from Del Giorno's morning show. He said he had to make sure his studio door was closed because of all the F-Words coming from DG's studio between on air banter. Funny.
And why bother getting the facts (that may or may not be available) before posting when all we were doing was speculating and making predictions for fun anyway?
B
BehindTheLines
Guest
106.1
You're right. Something has got to happen over there. Kudos to Kevan for taking a chance on freshening the flavor. He took a step. But unfortunately, I think he stepped IN something instead.
It's time to change something up. On another note, don't they have some jobs open there?
JournalGuy said:
You're right. Something has got to happen over there. Kudos to Kevan for taking a chance on freshening the flavor. He took a step. But unfortunately, I think he stepped IN something instead.
It's time to change something up. On another note, don't they have some jobs open there?
I'm concerned about 106_1 too, and unless they move backwards (giving themselves an older demo) or move more rock (putting them up against established Star) I'm not sure where this ends. I've been surprised how unlistenable the station has been to my ears... and I was a kid during that era, I like a lot of 70s... but not THOSE 70s. It's an awkward mix, too, I think, from the mid-60s to the late 70s. Heck, I've heard some early 80s... but it's just not a fun or appealing format... at least when I tune in.
(Does anybody remember the 70s & 80s format Jim Zippo put together some years ago? I was sorry but not surprised to see that not fly...)
One thing they DO air that I LOVE are the old American Top-40 countdowns from the 70s on Sunday morning. Holy cow, how cool is that? I'd love to see numbers for just those hours!
If I were over there right now... I'd be begging management for more time... and going over that playlist with a fine-toothed comb to make sure every single song was a guaranteed winner. I'm not a fan of short playlists... but to increase cume for a little while it might not be a bad idea.
None of this is to talk bad about Kevan... I've never met the man, but he's got a "voice of the gods" and has always impressed me on air. I just hope he's able to tweak this up and then promote the snot out of it to get the new listeners in he's going to have to have.
(Does anybody remember the 70s & 80s format Jim Zippo put together some years ago? I was sorry but not surprised to see that not fly...)
One thing they DO air that I LOVE are the old American Top-40 countdowns from the 70s on Sunday morning. Holy cow, how cool is that? I'd love to see numbers for just those hours!
If I were over there right now... I'd be begging management for more time... and going over that playlist with a fine-toothed comb to make sure every single song was a guaranteed winner. I'm not a fan of short playlists... but to increase cume for a little while it might not be a bad idea.
None of this is to talk bad about Kevan... I've never met the man, but he's got a "voice of the gods" and has always impressed me on air. I just hope he's able to tweak this up and then promote the snot out of it to get the new listeners in he's going to have to have.
B
BehindTheLines
Guest
Sgeirk said:
Hmmm...sounds like someone who's had a run in with Mr. Seal. I'm sure there are no shortages of Kevan Seal stories to tell. Like him or not, he IS a fascinating individual.
I don't really know Kevan as a person either. I've heard stories of his colorful exits from stations and eccentric behavior while employed different places across town. But I must agree that the man has an amazing set of pipes and sounds really good on the air.
I only know what I've heard of his character. But in short, I'd have to agree with Gene and admit that I'm impressed with a measure of his talent. Give the man his due where he's earned it.
J
JournalGuy
Guest
Gene-when you did you leave Cox? Why? I thought you sounded good on their stations.
Kent-You seems to have a good read on the situation. I don't see any changes with the Cox stations anytime soon. I just wish they would put on their HD channels. Can't wait to see what they offer. Hopefully it is fun radio and less researched. They have good programmers in the building that should have some creative ideas.
Speaking of HD2 - KQLL should switch their HD1 and HD2 channels. The HD2 is a much better mix of music. The main channel is fun to listen to for a few minutes, but it is a format that belongs on HD2. Too novelty. Kevin has a nice voice, but I question his programming skills.
I don't think a Jack format would work in Tulsa. It would be a quick novelty that would wear down quickly. Kind of like KQLL's Classic Top-40. Noble try.
I also noticed that KMYZ is playing more Active Rock. FINALLY, the station is sounding better. I'm sure KMOD is not happy about that. That will hurt their younger end demo. Smart programming by the Shamrock folks.
The one thing that can be said is that the Tulsa stations still sound better than the OKC stations.
Kent-You seems to have a good read on the situation. I don't see any changes with the Cox stations anytime soon. I just wish they would put on their HD channels. Can't wait to see what they offer. Hopefully it is fun radio and less researched. They have good programmers in the building that should have some creative ideas.
Speaking of HD2 - KQLL should switch their HD1 and HD2 channels. The HD2 is a much better mix of music. The main channel is fun to listen to for a few minutes, but it is a format that belongs on HD2. Too novelty. Kevin has a nice voice, but I question his programming skills.
I don't think a Jack format would work in Tulsa. It would be a quick novelty that would wear down quickly. Kind of like KQLL's Classic Top-40. Noble try.
I also noticed that KMYZ is playing more Active Rock. FINALLY, the station is sounding better. I'm sure KMOD is not happy about that. That will hurt their younger end demo. Smart programming by the Shamrock folks.
The one thing that can be said is that the Tulsa stations still sound better than the OKC stations.
If JournalGuy is correct about KKCM it's most likely Josh Bentley, who has been doing fill-in work for KKCM the last couple of weeks.
JournalGuy - I didn't leave Cox as much I was informed I was leaving Cox. It happened the afternoon of August 9th. I don't know how much of this is supposed to be private, but I figure as long as I don't slander them here I don't see that they could or would do much:
I was told it just wasn't working out, and that they were going to have to let me go. I was told my work was inconsistent, that I hadn't stepped up to the plate like I was supposed to, that I wasn't providing the updates on the website they required. (Amusingly, I had been upstairs working on an update when I was told to come downstairs.) I think that generally covers what I was told; obviously, I can't quote them.
In MY opinion, I believe I was let go because I got cross-wise with my supervisor. As long as I was underneath Rob, there were no problems with my performance. I suspect others either update the website minimally or not at all, and to my knowledge are not having their jobs threatened. That led me to conclude it was a personality conflict... well, and I never let the website updates get in the way of my on-air performance, and I wasn't going to work on the web off-the-clock. (These last items, however, were never indicated to me to be the reasons.)
To my knowledge, the FM PDs never had a problem with me... if they did, it was never voiced. However, I was informed by the OM that since I was gone from the AM, I was gone from the FMs and there was nothing anybody could do about it. I had also just started doing remote engineering (to rave reviews) which I was told was ended because of this as well. The production department had insisted if their normal guy was gone, I was to be the one to fill in for him... it meant working nights which didn't thrill my wife, but I was flattered that my work was that highly considered by them.
I was extremely disappointed to leave Cox, #1 because I loved the people I worked with (well, MOST of them...) and #2 I loved my work there.
Being on a legend like KRMG, even if it was just drop-ins between syndicated programming, was something I am truly proud of. Getting to work weekends for Karla on K95, the station battling with KMOD for the top position, was a true honor and a real joy. (Karla, btw, is a THRILL to work for, my time under her was absolutely effortless.) I worked around people like Mel Myers, Dave Michaels, Andy Barber, Chuck Stevens, Matt Bradley... what was not to like? I felt like I was becoming a better jock just being around all that talent, rubbing off on me hopefully.
..Oh... and THANKS for the kind words. I TRIED to sound good...
P.S. - JournalTulsa, I also suspect Josh Bentley. He did part-time / fill-in work at KRMG too, and was a great sounding guy on the air and all-around great guy... sharp as a tack on the board, too. I really liked him and enjoyed our time working together. He's done CCM for years in Arkansas and is smooth and warm. He'll be a great addition to Spirit!
_________________________________________________
This post is strictly the words and opinions of myself and is not designed to necessarily reflect the views and opinions of anyone mentioned or implied, nor should it be considered an accurate representation of actions, events or words. None of the content has been cleared or verified for accuracy by any of the parties alleged to have been involved in alleged conversations or activities, and should for all intents and purposes be considered entertainment / fiction not intended to harm, demean or in any way damage the reputations of any mentioned or implied companies, stations or people, all of whom should be considered to be fine, upstanding people and / or organizations by anyone reading this post. This post should not be used to determine or influence future activities, positive or negative, with said or implied people and / or organizations, and all perspectives presented or suggested herein should be discarded as unreliable. And yes, I wrote this disclaimer by myself.
I was told it just wasn't working out, and that they were going to have to let me go. I was told my work was inconsistent, that I hadn't stepped up to the plate like I was supposed to, that I wasn't providing the updates on the website they required. (Amusingly, I had been upstairs working on an update when I was told to come downstairs.) I think that generally covers what I was told; obviously, I can't quote them.
In MY opinion, I believe I was let go because I got cross-wise with my supervisor. As long as I was underneath Rob, there were no problems with my performance. I suspect others either update the website minimally or not at all, and to my knowledge are not having their jobs threatened. That led me to conclude it was a personality conflict... well, and I never let the website updates get in the way of my on-air performance, and I wasn't going to work on the web off-the-clock. (These last items, however, were never indicated to me to be the reasons.)
To my knowledge, the FM PDs never had a problem with me... if they did, it was never voiced. However, I was informed by the OM that since I was gone from the AM, I was gone from the FMs and there was nothing anybody could do about it. I had also just started doing remote engineering (to rave reviews) which I was told was ended because of this as well. The production department had insisted if their normal guy was gone, I was to be the one to fill in for him... it meant working nights which didn't thrill my wife, but I was flattered that my work was that highly considered by them.
I was extremely disappointed to leave Cox, #1 because I loved the people I worked with (well, MOST of them...) and #2 I loved my work there.
Being on a legend like KRMG, even if it was just drop-ins between syndicated programming, was something I am truly proud of. Getting to work weekends for Karla on K95, the station battling with KMOD for the top position, was a true honor and a real joy. (Karla, btw, is a THRILL to work for, my time under her was absolutely effortless.) I worked around people like Mel Myers, Dave Michaels, Andy Barber, Chuck Stevens, Matt Bradley... what was not to like? I felt like I was becoming a better jock just being around all that talent, rubbing off on me hopefully.
..Oh... and THANKS for the kind words. I TRIED to sound good...
P.S. - JournalTulsa, I also suspect Josh Bentley. He did part-time / fill-in work at KRMG too, and was a great sounding guy on the air and all-around great guy... sharp as a tack on the board, too. I really liked him and enjoyed our time working together. He's done CCM for years in Arkansas and is smooth and warm. He'll be a great addition to Spirit!
_________________________________________________
This post is strictly the words and opinions of myself and is not designed to necessarily reflect the views and opinions of anyone mentioned or implied, nor should it be considered an accurate representation of actions, events or words. None of the content has been cleared or verified for accuracy by any of the parties alleged to have been involved in alleged conversations or activities, and should for all intents and purposes be considered entertainment / fiction not intended to harm, demean or in any way damage the reputations of any mentioned or implied companies, stations or people, all of whom should be considered to be fine, upstanding people and / or organizations by anyone reading this post. This post should not be used to determine or influence future activities, positive or negative, with said or implied people and / or organizations, and all perspectives presented or suggested herein should be discarded as unreliable. And yes, I wrote this disclaimer by myself.
J
JournalGuy
Guest
Thanks Gene. I wish you the best of luck as you move on to your next adventure. I know the turnover at Cox is very low. That is why I wanted to ask. I know a few of the FM crew and they are decent folks. I also know the promotions guy on KWEN from his days at KVOO. 'Ol McDonald is a cool guy.
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