Creating New Markets

[arnoldevns]

Every time I see the market rankings from Nielsen, I'm always baffled at some of the hyphenated markets. I think sometimes markets are held together by Nielsen because the stations there demand it.

For example: in Texas, I don't understand why Bryan-College Station isn't it's own market. The cities are about 100 miles from Waco, yet the stations are in the same market. I'm well aware that all of the Waco-Temple-Killeen stations have sister stations in the BCS area, but I don't see why cities that are so far apart from each other are considered to be in the same DMA. It makes no sense.

The BCS market would be small (like 150 in rank) and Waco-Temple-Killeen would drop out of the top 100, but so what? It wouldn't change anything about how many people live in those two areas. It seems to me the combined sales from the two areas for all the stations would be the same.

The same could be said of the Sherman-Ada market in Southern Oklahoma/ North Texas. It's almost 3 markets. Ada-Ardmore is where the stations used to be based. They both also served the Sherman-Denison area of North Texas and had repeater stations in Paris, Texas. For a while, one of the stations even used to produce a seperate newscast for Paris. Now both stations are based in the Sherman-Denison area with bureaus in Ardmore and Ada. Paris is still served by repeaters of both. The sparse population in much of this market is probably the reason why it is cobbled together the way it is. However, anyone who's worked there knows that there's little commonality between the Sherman-Denison area and Ada-Ardmore. The folks on the Texas side of the border are probably more interested in the DFW area than anything to the north of the border. The population growth on the Texas side of the border will make that divide even worse over the next few years. I just wonder if perhaps it would be better to see the Ada area added to the OKC market and Ardmore/ Sherman-Denison moved into a market with Paris and a few other Texas border counties. This probably won't happen because it would hurt the ranking of the DFW market. But it still would make some sense.

 

[KML0224]

National/Re: Creating New Markets

I'm in New England and hope that southern New Hampshire can separate from Boston/Worcester. You've got an ABC affiliate in Manchester, a MY affiliate in Derry, NH, a Telemundo affiliate in Merrimack and an I/PAX station in Concord, which was a CBS affiliate from 1987 to 1989. It's easily the fastest growing part of New England and will likely have its own area code soon enough. Heck, based on viewing habits, even Windham County, VT (includes Brattleboro) is still a portion of the Boston/Worcester market.

 

[chuckydoll]

I don't understand why Bryan-College Station isn't it's own market.The cities are about 100 miles from Waco, yet the stations are in the same market.

Let's look at the Big 4 in those 2 DMAs . . .

ABC: Full-power in Waco, an LPTV in Bryan.

CBS: Full-power in Waco and Bryan, each with its own news department.

Fox: Full-power in Waco and Bryan.

NBC: Full-power in Temple, a simulcast LPTV in Bryan.

I just wonder if perhaps it would be better to see the Ada area added to the OKC market and Ardmore/ Sherman-Denison moved into a market with Paris and a few other Texas border counties. This probably won't happen because it would hurt the ranking of the DFW market. But it still would make some sense.

Sherman is about 75 miles north of Dallas. Ardmore is about 90 miles from Oklahoma City. People in the Red River Valley don't identify with the Metroplex or OKC.

Paris is within the Dallas/Fort Worth DMA. If you live in Paris and have DirecTV or Dish Network, you'll get Dallas/Fort Worth locals but not KTEN-10 or KXII-12.

 

[arnoldevns]

Sherman is about 75 miles north of Dallas. Ardmore is about 90 miles from Oklahoma City. People in the Red River Valley don't identify with the Metroplex or OKC.

Paris is within the Dallas/Fort Worth DMA. If you live in Paris and have DirecTV or Dish Network, you'll get Dallas/Fort Worth locals but not KTEN-10 or KXII-12.

Agreed. I understand both markets very well.

Paris is so far away from the DFW area that I'm not sure why it's part of the DFW DMA. I doubt they identify with the DFW area more than the Red River Valley. I think if it were part of a newly constituted Sherman-Ardmore DMA they would be better served. Ada going to OKC wouldn't do much to folks there since many of them watch OKC stations anyway. You could take Cooke, Grasyon and Lamar counties and add them to the DMA that currently makes up the Sherman-Ada DMA and move Pontotoc County (Ada's county) to OKC (along with maybe one or two others) and it would make more sense.

The folks in BCS don't identify with Waco-Temple-Killeen either. KBTX and KRHD-LP both have local reporters doing stories in the BCS area - even though the news for KRHD is produced out of KXXV in Waco. I just think BCS should be it's own DMA - even if the stations from Waco continue to keep supporting the stations down there. You could take Brazos county and a few others and make a decent little DMA. It would perhaps remove a county or two from Houston and maybe the Tyler markets, but it would be more logical as a DMA.

 

[Markxxx]

A lot of the markets are simply because the East and Midwest contained the largest number of "big" cities when TV came into being.

Some of it is political. Washington and Baltimore could easily be one market, and most likely so could Providence and Boston. Topeka and Kansas City are still another possible area. But there are political reasons to seperate them.

On the flip side you had markets like Akron-Canton, or Atlantic City, or St Joseph, Mo that never made it to full market status.

In 1950 San Jose had 95,000 today it has about 950,000. San Jose would most likely NOT be in with San Francisco if the markets were defined today.

Same goes for Texas. Houston was around 600,000 in 1950. The west being larger the VHF are spaced further apart to accoomodate this. As Texas grew, it got a lot of intermediate cities, as opposed to Arizona or Nevada, which also had skyrocketing population shifts, but AZ population continued to cluser around it's main cities in 1950. (Phoenix and Tuscon) as well as in Nevada, Reno and Las Vegas were the main cities in 1950 and remain so today.

One other thing is no one knew for sure how many networks there would be, 2? 3? or 4? Did every market have enough stations? No? Some areas are so underpopulated that they have to cover enough distance to have 3 decent sized citites in the them.

 

[bhayes1016]

For example: in Texas, I don't understand why Bryan-College Station isn't it's own market. The cities are about 100 miles from Waco, yet the stations are in the same market. I'm well aware that all of the Waco-Temple-Killeen stations have sister stations in the BCS area, but I don't see why cities that are so far apart from each other are considered to be in the same DMA. It makes no sense.

The BCS market would be small (like 150 in rank) and Waco-Temple-Killeen would drop out of the top 100, but so what? It wouldn't change anything about how many people live in those two areas. It seems to me the combined sales from the two areas for all the stations would be the same.

The same could be said of the Sherman-Ada market in Southern Oklahoma/ North Texas. It's almost 3 markets. Ada-Ardmore is where the stations used to be based. They both also served the Sherman-Denison area of North Texas and had repeater stations in Paris, Texas. For a while, one of the stations even used to produce a seperate newscast for Paris. Now both stations are based in the Sherman-Denison area with bureaus in Ardmore and Ada. Paris is still served by repeaters of both. The sparse population in much of this market is probably the reason why it is cobbled together the way it is. However, anyone who's worked there knows that there's little commonality between the Sherman-Denison area and Ada-Ardmore. The folks on the Texas side of the border are probably more interested in the DFW area than anything to the north of the border. The population growth on the Texas side of the border will make that divide even worse over the next few years. I just wonder if perhaps it would be better to see the Ada area added to the OKC market and Ardmore/ Sherman-Denison moved into a market with Paris and a few other Texas border counties. This probably won't happen because it would hurt the ranking of the DFW market. But it still would make some sense.

To futher complicate matters, the cable system in Bryan also carries KTRK (ABC) from Houston, and College Station's cable system (which services TAMU) carries Houston's KHCW (WB/CW).

I have family members who live in far northern Colin County. They have DirecTV and the DFW locals, though if you drive 10 miles from their house, you're in the Sherman/Ada market.

 

[KeithE4]

A lot of the markets are simply because the East and Midwest contained the largest number of "big" cities when TV came into being.

Some of it is political. Washington and Baltimore could easily be one market, and most likely so could Providence and Boston. Topeka and Kansas City are still another possible area. But there are political reasons to seperate them.

The census bureau considers DC & Baltimore to be one metro area, but it's logical that they're separate TV markets even though they're as far apart as Dallas & Ft. Worth. One TV market covering two states on a co-equal basis isn't generally a good idea, although there are a few (such as Yuma-El Centro).

On the flip side you had markets like Akron-Canton, or Atlantic City, or St Joseph, Mo that never made it to full market status.

Akron was absorbed into Cleveland years ago. I'm surprised that KQTV St. Joseph didn't snag NBC in 1994 and target KC.

In 1950 San Jose had 95,000 today it has about 950,000. San Jose would most likely NOT be in with San Francisco if the markets were defined today.

San Jose was, for all intents a purposes, part of the Monterrey-Salinas market until KNTV got (and was later purchased by) NBC.

Same goes for Texas. Houston was around 600,000 in 1950. The west being larger the VHF are spaced further apart to accoomodate this. As Texas grew, it got a lot of intermediate cities, as opposed to Arizona or Nevada, which also had skyrocketing population shifts, but AZ population continued to cluser around it's main cities in 1950. (Phoenix and Tuscon) as well as in Nevada, Reno and Las Vegas were the main cities in 1950 and remain so today.

Add to that Utah & Hawaii, states with only one major city. The entire state is its own TV market in both cases.

One other thing is no one knew for sure how many networks there would be, 2? 3? or 4? Did every market have enough stations? No? Some areas are so underpopulated that they have to cover enough distance to have 3 decent sized citites in the them.

Before 1953, there were only two major networks: CBS and NBC. ABC and Dumont were the equivalent of UPN & WB as far as affiliates, ad dollars, and audience was concerned. That's one reason why smaller cities only got 2 VHF channels. Nobody (including themselves) knew for certain if ABC or Dumont would survive.

 

[JeeperOne]

Hi everyone:

On the flip side you had markets like Akron-Canton, or Atlantic City, or St Joseph, Mo that never made it to full market status.

Akron was absorbed into Cleveland years ago. I'm surprised that KQTV St. Joseph didn't snag NBC in 1994 and target KC.

I'm not. KQTV 2 is too far away OTA. They'd have to rely on cable & satellite penetration, which is probably something that NBC didn't want to gamble on. Hence the affiliation with KSHB 41 instead.

In 1950 San Jose had 95,000 today it has about 950,000. San Jose would most likely NOT be in with San Francisco if the markets were defined today.

San Jose was, for all intents a purposes, part of the Monterrey-Salinas market until KNTV got (and was later purchased by) NBC.

Same goes for Texas. Houston was around 600,000 in 1950. The west being larger the VHF are spaced further apart to accoomodate this. As Texas grew, it got a lot of intermediate cities, as opposed to Arizona or Nevada, which also had skyrocketing population shifts, but AZ population continued to cluser around it's main cities in 1950. (Phoenix and Tuscon) as well as in Nevada, Reno and Las Vegas were the main cities in 1950 and remain so today.

Add to that Utah & Hawaii, states with only one major city. The entire state is its own TV market in both cases.

Add to that the island of Guam where one city (Agana - sp?) covers the entire island. Heck, I'd be willing to bet that CBS affiliate KUAM-LP 11 could probably do it without boosters.

One other thing is no one knew for sure how many networks there would be, 2? 3? or 4?

[snip...]

Before 1953, there were only two major networks: CBS and NBC. ABC and Dumont were the equivalent of UPN & WB as far as affiliates, ad dollars, and audience was concerned. That's one reason why smaller cities only got 2 VHF channels. Nobody (including themselves) knew for certain if ABC or Dumont would survive.

And history is repeating itself over 50 years later with UPN & The WB. Only this time around, both networks will be around in one form or another in the main form of The CW. The next go 'round will no doubt involve i/PAX and MY.

Cheers