DANCE MUSIC....OKAY PHILLY, YOU ARE NEXT!

[TonySantiago]

For those of you that happen to peek at the New York forum, a new rhythmic station playing current dance has been launched...Pulse 87. It took quite a while to fill a void up this way but it happened! And now, we want to keep pushing for more radio stations to consider a current based rhythmic format throughout the country. We are now targeting Philadelphia and Boston for our campaign.

Now, even though I don't live in the Philadelphia Metro area, I do know some history....mainly with Q-102 back in the 90's and Boss 97 out in Atlantic City. I also know that there are two stations just outside the metro area covering dance (Z88.9 - WBZO (hi Brett!) and Super 91.7 - WMPH (hi Clint!) although they can't get into Philadelphia directly. There was also a guy that ran a coalition a couple of years back for Philly (I think his name was Kevin). There is NO doubt that there is an audience for current based dance music in the region. And by all means continue to support 'BZO and 'MPH. But if a station can cover everywhere in the Reading/Allentown/Atlantic City/Central Delaware perimeter, then bring it!

Just need some feedback on this.

 

[Kyle D]

Here's some feedback.

If "Dance" was a viable format, someone would be doing it.

 

[Bill_W]

How is pulse 87 even a radio station? What do you see when you turn on your TV in NYC to analog channel 6? Is it in stereo on a radio? Is it softer than all the other radio stations? I guess we have an 87.7 here in Philly for another year, 6ABC but, it is much softer and in mono.

 

[DToTheJ]

Here's some feedback.

If "Dance" was a viable format, someone would be doing it.

Agreed! Despite the popular opinion, Philly does not need a "danz stashun".

 

[BRUSSTAR]

"Targeting Philadelphia and Boston" for your "campaign"?

Are you a PAC? Do you file with the FEC?

I don't doubt there is a handful of, perhaps even a few thousand people out there who would enjoy a "dance" station ("Dance" isn't a "format", of course). There are even more who would like Standards, Actual Oldies(SM), Classical, the Big Bands, Traditional Jazz, Country (in the case of New York), Classic Country, Beautiful Music, '80s-Hair-Metal, Celtic-Hits-of-the-'60s, etc. Being a "mass medium" at least for the time being, terrestrial radio I don't think has a reason to take programming advice from your "coalition". I'm not trying to be rude or a smartass, but you said you "needed feedback".

I think two lesser-powered non-comms on the outskirts of Philly (and in Wilmington's case, a high school station outside the market altogether)-- and for a small part of NY, misuse of low-power TV audio that isn't even part of the FM broadcast band-- pretty much accurately represent the "need" for "Dance Radio" relative to other formatic desires.

But what I really don't understand is why "radio"? With the Internet there is now an infinite amount of potential to do just about anything, provided the issue of performance royalties gets resolved in the near future. If "dance" is the future, then why bother with terrestrial radio?

 

[TonySantiago]

Feedback is what I wanted and feedback is what I am getting! So...let's break it down!

Here's some feedback.

If "Dance" was a viable format, someone would be doing it.

If no one had done it in the past, then you would probably have a valid point here. But you DID have WIQO (Q102) as a rhythmic station back in the 90's and was very popular at that. The other fact that you have two non-comm stations in the region doing current based rhythmic dance formats show that there is a following. In those areas the audience is there. I'm sure if they had bigger signals they could even attract MORE listeners (we had a similar problem in NYC with WDRE - Party 105 in Long Island..excellent station, class "A" signal.) There is also a question of awareness and that is something we're working on and hopefully someone locally can take it that step further.

How is pulse 87 even a radio station? What do you see when you turn on your TV in NYC to analog channel 6? Is it in stereo on a radio? Is it softer than all the other radio stations? I guess we have an 87.7 here in Philly for another year, 6ABC but, it is much softer and in mono.

Yes, we know Pulse 87 is on channel 6 here. And it has been argued many times on the NYRMB (New York Radio Message Board) by radio enthusiasts regarding how one can't really classify Pulse as a radio station since by FCC standards, it is licensed as a TV station. There is a REASON why I bring up radio enthusiasts versus fans of the music who could give two boots on whether or not a radio station is a TV station. As far as they are concerned, they are hearing music on the radio and like what they are getting. Plus if Mega Media (the company that owns Pulse) turns up a profit..perhaps in time should radio corporations decide to bail and sell off their frequencies, that they could get a better dial position above 92.

Agreed! Despite the popular opinion, Philly does not need a "danz stashun".

I'm kinda surprised you are saying this since you have been following the arguments regarding Pulse. Well, we're trying to test the waters to see whether or not the dance music fans in Philly would open up to a current based format. And if things are positive, then we're going to venture into making noise and doing something about it.

"Targeting Philadelphia and Boston" for your "campaign"?

Are you a PAC? Do you file with the FEC?

I don't doubt there is a handful of, perhaps even a few thousand people out there who would enjoy a "dance" station ("Dance" isn't a "format", of course). There are even more who would like Standards, Actual Oldies(SM), Classical, the Big Bands, Traditional Jazz, Country (in the case of New York), Classic Country, Beautiful Music, '80s-Hair-Metal, Celtic-Hits-of-the-'60s, etc. Being a "mass medium" at least for the time being, terrestrial radio I don't think has a reason to take programming advice from your "coalition". I'm not trying to be rude or a smartass, but you said you "needed feedback".

I think two lesser-powered non-comms on the outskirts of Philly (and in Wilmington's case, a high school station outside the market altogether)-- and for a small part of NY, misuse of low-power TV audio that isn't even part of the FM broadcast band-- pretty much accurately represent the "need" for "Dance Radio" relative to other formatic desires.

But what I really don't understand is why "radio"? With the Internet there is now an infinite amount of potential to do just about anything, provided the issue of performance royalties gets resolved in the near future. If "dance" is the future, then why bother with terrestrial radio?

No PAC, No FEC. Sorry, I'm not Obama.

Okay...let me stand corrected on the format term....."Rhythmic". But anyway you name it, it is still "Dance Music". And no, I DO want opinions so I'm not taking your comment or anyone else's as "smartass". And I am sure there are perhaps voids in the Philly market that need priority first over dance. That's what I am trying to find out. But whether or not you want to talk specific markets near your region...the fact of the matter is, the people that tune in to the dance stations on those outskirts ARE the same people that can easily tune in to the Philadelphia market stations.

Sure, the future WILL be Internet streaming stations. As long as long range Wi-Fi gets perfected, I can see Live 365 come out with their own car stereo whereas you can bring in the streams that you want. But until then, terrestrial radio STILL holds a purpose. It will ALWAYS be a part of mass media. And perhaps with a rhythmic station, (and I can say this because it is happening here), people will RETURN to radio whereas of late they have abandoned it since corporate ruined the soundscape as the majority of stations sound "cookie cutter" with "safe" formats.

That's why I am investigating Philadelphia for this. I WANT to also hear from fans of dance music in Philly with their response as well.

 

[rapking]

24 Hours of Will Smith ! The Prince of Philly ! Your Will Cheese Steak Station !

 

[SICKofIT]

hey tony, doubt it, never will work, bye...

 

[TonySantiago]

I'll see what the Philly dance fans have to say.

 

[Rockin Rob]

Look at the guy's signature line. Nuff said. Another poster with an agenda. FOX NEWS ALERT: DANCE WILL NOT WORK IN PHILLY. PERIOD. This market can barely sustain a gold-based rhythmic-leaning Hot AC. Just because its your format of choice (and, therefore, should be placed on all radio stations) does not show the suits that it would be a viable format. Again, it would have already been done. Your Q argument holds no weight as they were a rhythmic CHR. Actually, at the time I was there, it was referred to as "CHURBAN" or "Crossover". Remember, freestyle was big at the time, but they also fused in rhythmic tracks (as in the more popular Urban cuts) and an occasional smattering of "blue eyed soul rock".

 

[JerseyDude]

I lived in Philly back in the 90s. Dance would never work there.
Philadelphia is a large eastern city, but has the mentality of a small Kentucky town.

Boston would be more open to the idea.

 

[DToTheJ]

Feedback is what I wanted and feedback is what I am getting! So...let's break it down...

Agreed! Despite the popular opinion, Philly does not need a "danz stashun".

I'm kinda surprised you are saying this since you have been following the arguments regarding Pulse. Well, we're trying to test the waters to see whether or not the dance music fans in Philly would open up to a current based format. And if things are positive, then we're going to venture into making noise and doing something about it.

I think the posters above me said it best: New York is more likely to warm up to an all-dance radio format than Philadelphia would be, hence the whole "Philly needs a danz stashun" mentality/gag that has been going on for the better half of the last decade...

 

[Dancerev889]

"Targeting Philadelphia and Boston" for your "campaign"?

Are you a PAC? Do you file with the FEC?

I don't doubt there is a handful of, perhaps even a few thousand people out there who would enjoy a "dance" station ("Dance" isn't a "format", of course). There are even more who would like Standards, Actual Oldies(SM), Classical, the Big Bands, Traditional Jazz, Country (in the case of New York), Classic Country, Beautiful Music, '80s-Hair-Metal, Celtic-Hits-of-the-'60s, etc. Being a "mass medium" at least for the time being, terrestrial radio I don't think has a reason to take programming advice from your "coalition". I'm not trying to be rude or a smartass, but you said you "needed feedback".

I think two lesser-powered non-comms on the outskirts of Philly (and in Wilmington's case, a high school station outside the market altogether)-- and for a small part of NY, misuse of low-power TV audio that isn't even part of the FM broadcast band-- pretty much accurately represent the "need" for "Dance Radio" relative to other formatic desires.

But what I really don't understand is why "radio"? With the Internet there is now an infinite amount of potential to do just about anything, provided the issue of performance royalties gets resolved in the near future. If "dance" is the future, then why bother with terrestrial radio?

Ok first off I totally disagree with your statement about less a thousand people like dance music. Acoording to Aribitron WBZC is averaging between 25000 and 30000 listeners a week. They are mostly during the daytime when we are playing dance music. Feb 2007 we sold out Taylors night club with over 2000 people for a concert and there was ine still outside at 2:30 AM. We did the same thing at Kat Man Du in Trenton. Neither Q102 or PST have been able to do this.

Now do I think a full blown out dance format will work? Hell no, however what Q did in the 90's will work. Freestyle is dance music btw. Q was able to fuse dance, hip-hop and some alternative tracks together. It is the same formula that we are working at Z889.

You say that a dance format will work but a station that has standards will? If thats the case why hasnt anyone done it? Hell classical hasnt come back except on WRTI. What Pulse 87 in New York is doing is pretty much what we are doing down here.

Just looking at the current state of Top 40, the BPM's has gone up drastically. Enur's Calabria is a dance record and on a dance label. Miley Cyrus new single is a dance record. Timbaland's records are uptempo and were in power at most "dance" stations across the country. Kanye sampled Daft Punk. The new Janet Jackson single Rock with u is a dance record. A lot of people forget dance music was Pop music in the 90's Ace of Base, taylor Dayne, Stevie B, Rockell were all dance tracks. I could go on and on. I dont consider my station a dance station, I consider it a Rhythmic station. Philly has always been a rhythmic station. The 70's a lot of the disco artists came out of philly, hell American Band stand is Philly.

The biggest problem is that programmers are not allowed to program anymore. Philly lost its sound.

 

[XCountry285]

Feedback is what I wanted and feedback is what I am getting! So...let's break it down!

Here's some feedback.

If "Dance" was a viable format, someone would be doing it.

If no one had done it in the past, then you would probably have a valid point here. But you DID have WIQO (Q102) as a rhythmic station back in the 90's and was very popular at that. The other fact that you have two non-comm stations in the region doing current based rhythmic dance formats show that there is a following. In those areas the audience is there. I'm sure if they had bigger signals they could even attract MORE listeners (we had a similar problem in NYC with WDRE - Party 105 in Long Island..excellent station, class "A" signal.) There is also a question of awareness and that is something we're working on and hopefully someone locally can take it that step further.

How is pulse 87 even a radio station? What do you see when you turn on your TV in NYC to analog channel 6? Is it in stereo on a radio? Is it softer than all the other radio stations? I guess we have an 87.7 here in Philly for another year, 6ABC but, it is much softer and in mono.

Yes, we know Pulse 87 is on channel 6 here. And it has been argued many times on the NYRMB (New York Radio Message Board) by radio enthusiasts regarding how one can't really classify Pulse as a radio station since by FCC standards, it is licensed as a TV station. There is a REASON why I bring up radio enthusiasts versus fans of the music who could give two boots on whether or not a radio station is a TV station. As far as they are concerned, they are hearing music on the radio and like what they are getting. Plus if Mega Media (the company that owns Pulse) turns up a profit..perhaps in time should radio corporations decide to bail and sell off their frequencies, that they could get a better dial position above 92.

Agreed! Despite the popular opinion, Philly does not need a "danz stashun".

I'm kinda surprised you are saying this since you have been following the arguments regarding Pulse. Well, we're trying to test the waters to see whether or not the dance music fans in Philly would open up to a current based format. And if things are positive, then we're going to venture into making noise and doing something about it.

"Targeting Philadelphia and Boston" for your "campaign"?

Are you a PAC? Do you file with the FEC?

I don't doubt there is a handful of, perhaps even a few thousand people out there who would enjoy a "dance" station ("Dance" isn't a "format", of course). There are even more who would like Standards, Actual Oldies(SM), Classical, the Big Bands, Traditional Jazz, Country (in the case of New York), Classic Country, Beautiful Music, '80s-Hair-Metal, Celtic-Hits-of-the-'60s, etc. Being a "mass medium" at least for the time being, terrestrial radio I don't think has a reason to take programming advice from your "coalition". I'm not trying to be rude or a smartass, but you said you "needed feedback".

I think two lesser-powered non-comms on the outskirts of Philly (and in Wilmington's case, a high school station outside the market altogether)-- and for a small part of NY, misuse of low-power TV audio that isn't even part of the FM broadcast band-- pretty much accurately represent the "need" for "Dance Radio" relative to other formatic desires.

But what I really don't understand is why "radio"? With the Internet there is now an infinite amount of potential to do just about anything, provided the issue of performance royalties gets resolved in the near future. If "dance" is the future, then why bother with terrestrial radio?

No PAC, No FEC. Sorry, I'm not Obama.

Okay...let me stand corrected on the format term....."Rhythmic". But anyway you name it, it is still "Dance Music". And no, I DO want opinions so I'm not taking your comment or anyone else's as "smartass". And I am sure there are perhaps voids in the Philly market that need priority first over dance. That's what I am trying to find out. But whether or not you want to talk specific markets near your region...the fact of the matter is, the people that tune in to the dance stations on those outskirts ARE the same people that can easily tune in to the Philadelphia market stations.

Sure, the future WILL be Internet streaming stations. As long as long range Wi-Fi gets perfected, I can see Live 365 come out with their own car stereo whereas you can bring in the streams that you want. But until then, terrestrial radio STILL holds a purpose. It will ALWAYS be a part of mass media. And perhaps with a rhythmic station, (and I can say this because it is happening here), people will RETURN to radio whereas of late they have abandoned it since corporate ruined the soundscape as the majority of stations sound "cookie cutter" with "safe" formats.

That's why I am investigating Philadelphia for this. I WANT to also hear from fans of dance music in Philly with their response as well.

Q102's call sign is WIOQ, not WIQO. And I think Q102's doing just fine w/ their Top 40 Format.

 

[TonySantiago]

I lived in Philly back in the 90s. Dance would never work there.
Philadelphia is a large eastern city, but has the mentality of a small Kentucky town.

Boston would be more open to the idea.

That actually surprised the HELL out of me that Boston posters were more open and receptive when I posted a similar thread there! I thought Boston, traditionally being a rock oriented town, would ream the idea. Yet Philly, because of Q-102 and past history is the place that is hardcore AGAINST IT. And I do correct myself with what Dancerev said.....RHYTHMIC (which would include pop remixes, certain R&B and hip-hop tracks in there.)

And yeah....I DO have an agenda! I'll be the FIRST to admit to that! And "the suits" know it. Whatever can bring them MONEY (so we can eliminate the self-serving part since I'm not making a dime out of this).

Wow....amazing. Yet I will still "bring it" to the fans and let them do what they have to do.

 

[TonySantiago]

Q102's call sign is WIOQ, not WIQO. And I think Q102's doing just fine w/ their Top 40 Format.

My bad on that...typo. And I wouldn't think of wanting to change ANYTHING with Q102. It should be another station that Philly dance music fans should go for.

 

[TonySantiago]

One more thing.....

THANK YOU DANCEREV!

 

[ScorpioBoy]

Q102's call sign is WIOQ, not WIQO. And I think Q102's doing just fine w/ their Top 40 Format.

My bad on that...typo. And I wouldn't think of wanting to change ANYTHING with Q102. It should be another station that Philly dance music fans should go for.

I agree that if whoever decides to actually grant a dance station to Philly, there'd be a better reception if they didn't do a "dance" makeover of a station like Q102. Certainly I'd check it out at least.

 

[JerseyDude]

I am not suprised that people in Philadelphia wouldn't be down with a Dance-Leaning Rhythmic station.

I live in Northern New Jersey, but have friends down that way. When I speak with friends in that area, they say "you people up there in New York still listen to that dance stuff?".

My parents loved The Sound of Philadelphia back in the 70s. Teddy Pendergrass, Patti Labelle,Double Exposure,MFSB,Karen "Hot Shot" Young,The Trammps and First Choice were played in my home as a kid. They even rocked Frankie "Double Dutch Bus" Smith and Bryan Loren in the early 80s.

I can't believe that Philly is so backwards now.

 

[beefjerky]

Hey with only about 1 dance music hit per year, I just don't see how you can build a format out of it. Wish that wasn't the case, really loved the dance music days of yore, but, I don't see enough dance music making it. The clubs are not exactly on fire either. Which is a problem since most dance tunes start there.