Daytime only am

[ok walters]

I have always wondered about the impact on the business model of an AM station that is daytime only as opposed to 24/7? With most stations on reduced power or a directional signal at night, how much of an impact is the night signal anyway? What has been the recent history of daytimers going silent against the history of 24/7 stations?

Any thoughts?

 

[secondchoice]

I am assuming there is not FM translator or streaming. If (and this is a biggie) the station has good Pre sunrise and some Post sunrise hours, there is most likely not much difference. Unless you are targeting retirees IMHO you have to have the market covered for morning drive and evening drive. Some places morning drive starts at 6AM. In Atlanta, the traffic can be a bear at 6AM. Even in the late 1970's Gary McKee started at 5:30. Ideally your station is on the clock radio, but now with the extra interference (CFL's, Computers, etc.), a lot of clock radios are set to FM. Selling evenings (not counting sport events: footfall, basketball, and baseball) can be hard unless you are targeting under 21 (who most likely are listening to FM), so it should not be that big of an issue unless your area is severe weather prone, or a like formatted station has a night time signal. The short full power hours really can hurt in November and December if you have a good sales team. In the last half of January and February (usually the slow months) if does not matter that much. Of course all markets are different and your mileage may very. Another factor is the power bill on large transmitters but, I assume 1 KW or less with a solid state transmitter with good efficiency at night.

 

[Matt]

Having some level of nighttime power...even flea-power...can make money for a station in the right situation.

The biggest thing it opens up is the capability of doing high school football and basketball. For these, you don't need high listenership, just enough to reach parents and families of the school(s) you cover. It then helps to have streaming for your station, to reach those your signal doesn't.

In the spring and summer, churches hold revivals, camp meetings, jubilees and other things that can be sold. Anywhere that has a sound system and can be reached by a telephone can be set up for a remote broadcast, and if your signal can reach nursing or rest homes you can often arrange for a receiver in the dining hall for no cost, that will impress church leaders and get them ears where people will react well.

Outside of hours that stations broadcast such things, just pick a regular sign-off time that fits within your daytime hours, and shut down when you don't have something profitable at night.

At least, that's how WRNA in China Grove and WHIP in Mooresville NC do it. They have about 10 red-hot watts each at night, but wouldn't go back to daytime-only operation willingly.

 

[ok walters]

I have been involved in several AMs with marginal night signals. One was a graveyard (1240) frequency at 1KW and I barely got six to eight miles out of it at night, The other was a goof frequency but a directional 1KW. Neither station made much of anything at night except during high school football season. So even with a night signal there wasn't much income - and no income at all except for live football games which are fairly labor intensive.

I guess the real question is the importance of being on all of the time - is it worth the cost and does it help overall listenership? It doesn't appear to make much revenue in most places.

 

[PTBoardOp94]

Its difficult to draw comparisons. There's two daytimers in Indianapolis. One at 810, spanish WSYW. Only 250 watts ND, but it draws a 0.6 rating 12+. (26th place)
WSYW has a sister, also Spanish, which does have some night signal. 1590 WNTS gets a 0.7 rating 12+. Their day signals are similar, if you trust Radio-locator.

The programming costs will be higher for the 24/7 station unless you get all-barter programming.
WNTS will consume about 25 times more power per year for the transmitter than WSYW

Then a little extra engineering effort to maintain a directional antenna...

Its hard for me to say in this particular case that 24/7 operation is more profitable. I'd be interested to hear more.

 

[Chuck]

Its hard for me to say in this particular case that 24/7 operation is more profitable. I'd be interested to hear more.

Short term, I doubt it is more profitable, but in the long run, being there all the time builds confidence and trust. It is hard to put a price on that, but I think it is important to the success of the station.

 

[ok walters]

Its hard for me to say in this particular case that 24/7 operation is more profitable. I'd be interested to hear more.

Short term, I doubt it is more profitable, but in the long run, being there all the time builds confidence and trust. It is hard to put a price on that, but I think it is important to the success of the station.

I think the night signal has some value just being there all the time. As Chuck said there is some sort of a "confidence" factor there.

Now does the night signal make money? I think that is case by case but there are few big winners.

 

[jhguthlac]

I started in radio at a sunrise to sunset operation. Still did well, because in the 60's, people understood that some stations were not on all the time.

Next stop was a daytimer that came on at 500 watts every day at 6am. Increased to 1kw at sunrise. Again, no revenue problem. We could have done better at Christmas time if we had been on til 7pm, but thems the breaks.

In the early 90's, I was the OM at a daytimer. 500 watts 6am til sunrise, 1kw day, reduction preceeded after sunset down to 42 watts. Still covered most of the market. Baseball, NFL and high school football sold well. The owner fought me hard against 24/7 operation, but I finally prevailed. My arguement is this. These are certainly not the 1960's. Then, there were FM and TV stations even, that were not 24/7. Some FM stations, even in major markets, did not sign-on til noon (WSID-FM Baltimore a prime example). People understood this. Now, everything is 24/7. All FM and TV. Throw in 300+ cable channels. If you are an AMer, you are at a disadvantage to begin with. If you are here one hour and gone the next, no one takes you seriously. If one of your 50+ year old listeners does go out after 7pm, turns on the radio, and you are not there, they will punch up another station. The next morning, when they get in the car, its THAT station which will come up when they turn the radio on. Not yours!

Even back in the 60's, I knew of adertisors who would not place ads on daytime-only stations. They didn't want to advertise at night, they just thought it was a waste of money to place spots on a daytimer. 50 years later, few are going to take you seriously.

 

[amfmxm]

Something very few radio folks still understand is that it wasn't "the stereo effect" given to FM-only back in 1970 that killed AM, it was the lack of a consistent, clear, audible signal all the time--24/7. Look around today and the only exceptions to the AM Is Dead rule are the old 1A clears--the WLWs, WGNs, KDKAs, WCBSs of the world... or a handful of lower-power rigs with consistent, clear, audible signals covering their markets entirely, 24/7. Yeah, there are a handful of directionals--WBZ & WWL for instance--whose DAs merely keep half their signals from being wasted over water. And a handful of "graveyard/Class IV" teapots--like WDWS & WJBC in Central Illinois, where the great soil and spacing between co-channels minimize interference. But, basically, AM is dead. America is littered with 5-kw/1-kw DA-N stations at 1330 and 1470 (etc.) that can't compete because half their markets can't hear them at night.

The average listener expects to hear your damn station when they hit your button--without needing to consult their damn watch. If they don't hear it, they leave... and most often never come back. Get it?

So having a daytime-only AM in 2012 is just heaping misery on top of misery. Better to take the purchase price and just set a match to it....

 

[ok walters]

There are successful daytimers still in operation though. WRZN 720 in Hernando Florida is one that comes to mind. It is an interesting study to look at some of the daytimers that succeed, and those that have failed. Where are some successful operations now?

 

[Goat Rodeo Cowboy]

There are successful daytimers still in operation though. WRZN 720 in Hernando Florida is one that comes to mind. It is an interesting study to look at some of the daytimers that succeed, and those that have failed. Where are some successful operations now?

First of all, I segregate big-city daytimers out of the debate and conversation. Their only hope appears to be some kind of brokered-time, info-mercial or religion formats which so far from center-stage that they are anomalies. We can't build a business plan by studying them. They are aberrations in the big picture.

Not too long ago I got a few minutes with a man who is probably one of the best fly-over-country radio operation in the country. His advice: DO NOT BUY AN AM STATION (full-time or daytime) unless it is a long-term LEGACY operation in the community. If it was once a well respected legacy station but has been operated by one or more operators since them who have trashed the legacy, "I have tried my best and found you can not make a winner out of an AM station that has been denigrated." That was his advice. When I found I couldn't afford to buy those that fit his criteria, I decided sitting in the grandstands was more desireable than trying to make something out of "a pig wearing lipstick."

 

[cd637299]

There are successful daytimers still in operation though. WRZN 720 in Hernando Florida is one that comes to mind. It is an interesting study to look at some of the daytimers that succeed, and those that have failed. Where are some successful operations now?

WRZN does run 250w at night, so technically it's not a daytimer. True, it covers a wide area in the day and *barely* reaches Hernando, I suppose, at night. In Ocala I think WRZN *and* WGN can be neck-and-neck signal-wise at night.

cd

 

[ok walters]

My error on WRZN.

GRC - great post. The revival of many non-heritage AMs is not fiscally possible, and with the added issue of limited operation in daytime only situations you have even less of a chance. A non-typical format would appear to be one of the only options at all.

 

[Nostalgia]

WRZN does run 250w at night, so technically it's not a daytimer. True, it covers a wide area in the day and *barely* reaches Hernando, I suppose, at night. In Ocala I think WRZN *and* WGN can be neck-and-neck signal-wise at night.
cd

In addition to dropping from 10,000 watts daytime to 250 watts at night, they also go from omni-direction to a three tower pattern directly away from WGN, so I would be suprised if they were heard at all in Ocala. It is shooting into Hernando County but talking mostly to trees, not reaching Brooksville, Spring Hill, or any populated area. Anyone have any updates on the rumor mill that they were looking at one of the translators in Ocala to give them a nighttime presence?

 

[cd637299]

WRZN does run 250w at night, so technically it's not a daytimer. True, it covers a wide area in the day and *barely* reaches Hernando, I suppose, at night. In Ocala I think WRZN *and* WGN can be neck-and-neck signal-wise at night.
cd

In addition to dropping from 10,000 watts daytime to 250 watts at night, they also go from omni-direction to a three tower pattern directly away from WGN, so I would be suprised if they were heard at all in Ocala. It is shooting into Hernando County but talking mostly to trees, not reaching Brooksville, Spring Hill, or any populated area. Anyone have any updates on the rumor mill that they were looking at one of the translators in Ocala to give them a nighttime presence?

I thought the NRC book of 1996 had 'em non directional....I don't think that WGN is shaking in their boots.....

BTW can anybody tell me (not that I have the answer) some of the higher-rated daytime-only AM stations are in the good old U S of A?

cd

 

[davideduardo]

BTW can anybody tell me (not that I have the answer) some of the higher-rated daytime-only AM stations are in the good old U S of A?

cd

I found the following stations that are daytime or less than 100 watts at night with a 1.5 share or more in diary markets:

WUTQ Utica 1.8
WTSK Tuscaloosa 5.2
WSEN Syracuse 1.5
KRMP Oklahoma City 1.7
WNWN Kalamazoo 6.4
WIOO Harrisburg 1.6
WAXB Danbury 3.2
WPTL Asheville 1.6
WHOL Allentown 2.2

In PPM, one AM has a 1.5 and that is WAMO Pittsburgh. KQLL in Las Vegas has a 1.4...

I think a couple of these have FM translators, meaning most of the audience is on the FM, like KQLL.

If you want ratings, don't buy a daytime AM... they may have some value for non-rated alternatives like religion or brokered stuff, but there are few listeners.

 

[fybush]

The audiences for WUTQ, WIOO and WAXB are almost certainly on the FM translators, just like KQLL and WAMO. WNWN has an FM translator, too, and I wouldn't be surprised if some of what's being attributed to WNWN-A actually belongs to WNWN-FM (ditto for WSEN in Syracuse.)

WHOL is Spanish, the only Spanish in a market with a growing Hispanic population.

KRMP and WNWN both have a nice niche, too, programming to adult black listeners in communities without much urban radio to speak of.

 

[knoxbob]

WPTL is a 500 watter in Canton, NC just outside of Asheville with barely a signal into Asheville due to the ground conductivity of near zero in the W. NC mountains. And they are flea power at night. That shows that their local programming is doing it's job. I don'tthink that they have a translator but if they did the numbers would probably go up.

 

[davideduardo]

WPTL is a 500 watter in Canton, NC just outside of Asheville with barely a signal into Asheville due to the ground conductivity of near zero in the W. NC mountains. And they are flea power at night. That shows that their local programming is doing it's job. I don'tthink that they have a translator but if they did the numbers would probably go up.

The station cumes 6,200 persons in a market of about 300,000 persons.

 

[radiophiler]

WHOL does have a small signal FM, but it also has a simulcast AM at 1400 in Easton, PA, the eastern side of the Allentown market. 1400 is 1,000 watts day and night. Hard to tell which of the three frequencies is actually getting the listenership.