Despite so-called regulation, TV commercials are still louder than regular shows

[The Voice of Reason]

I thought that starting this new year there was a rule in place where commercials could not be louder than the shows carrying them?

Can't tell you how many times I had to turn the volume down or mute the TV because the commercials "blasted" my eardrums.

 

[crainbebo]

Some companies should be fined for this. I'd suppose $1,000-2,000 a commercial if it's higher than the program volume.

-crainbebo

 

[ROBGv1]

What they need to do is make all networks be at equal volume.

 

[quadraphonic]

There's too many variables to enforce this "helpful" law.

 

[willdav713]

Happens more on YouTube and Crackle vs. Cable TV. But it is the internet so I expect that.
Most of the channels I get are at equal volume, but I use a Digital Tuning Adapter on TV 1 and a Digital Converter Box on TV 2.

 

[SixtiesGuy]

Regardless of how indifferent or irresponsible broadcasters may be, or how inept the government may be in enforcing regulations or laws, all manufacturers should include volume leveling circuitry in their TV's. That is the only sure way to deal with the problem. Many TV's, as well as home theater receivers, already have this capability. It isn't rocket science, nor is it expensive circuitry. Audio compressors have been around for years.

 

[landtuna]

DVR = What commercials?

 

[FreddyE1977]

That should once and for all deliver the lesson that more often than not,
Government Regulation is an EPIC FAIL.

But somehow I suspect that it won't.

 

[landtuna]

That should once and for all deliver the lesson that more often than not,
Government Regulation is an EPIC FAIL.

How do you figure?

There are laws against speeding in every state but lots of people still speed. Some get caught. But how is that an EPIC FAIL? What do you think our roads would be like without speed laws?

Laws by themselves will not prevent some people from ignoring them. That is the role of enforcement. But enforcement costs money so how much enforcement do you want to pay for?

There are now hundreds of broadcasters out there and everybody already admits the FCC is inept and overloaded so how would this particular law be enforced?

If the gubmint has faults, and it does, it tends to pass laws without understanding whether or not the law can be enforced (and at what cost) and whether there are funds existing to pay for it.

Personally, I'd rather see a law regulating how commercials are presented. I really hate getting shouted at by car dealers or lied to by TV stations telling me how they won't waste my time during news programs. :

 

[DJKraze]

If I remember correctly, aren't modulation levels usually controlled at the transmitter end with some kind of compressor/expander/limiter? They have these things installed to keep modulation levels from over-modulating and to bring up the modulation when it's not high enough (there is a limit to how much gain to give something that drops to like 10% or something).

Commercials try to get your attention in order to sell you something, so it's possible that some of the production houses that make them have them spiked up to the limits as far as compression and levels goes, but even still, there is a limiter in place that brick walls the peaks and has been this way for a very long time. When commercials seem louder, it's very possible that the program you're watching might not have taken the same steps in production to create as loud a program and will seem softer, even with the audio chain at the transmitter doing what it can to bring it up, as it's easier to chop off peaks than it is to raise the mountain.

 

[kenglish]

Hmmmm....

Ten-thousand dollar box on each of your program channels, to try and regulate levels.
Thirty-thousand dollar box in the rack, to prove you are trying to regulate levels.
Engineer spending several hours a day monitoring the boxes and tweaking the levels.

People still bitching that stations "don't care".

Priceless.
:

 

[FightingIrish]

If I remember correctly, aren't modulation levels usually controlled at the transmitter end with some kind of compressor/expander/limiter? They have these things installed to keep modulation levels from over-modulating and to bring up the modulation when it's not high enough (there is a limit to how much gain to give something that drops to like 10% or something).

Commercials try to get your attention in order to sell you something, so it's possible that some of the production houses that make them have them spiked up to the limits as far as compression and levels goes, but even still, there is a limiter in place that brick walls the peaks and has been this way for a very long time. When commercials seem louder, it's very possible that the program you're watching might not have taken the same steps in production to create as loud a program and will seem softer, even with the audio chain at the transmitter doing what it can to bring it up, as it's easier to chop off peaks than it is to raise the mountain.

That's what I figured all along. The TV version of the "Loudness Wars".

It's used in music and in radio, to make everything sound "louder" than the others (or at the same level as other heavily limited media). Basically, it kills all the dynamic range and makes virtually every sound in the track at equal volume, meaning that instead of occasional parts of the track hitting the volume line, the entire thing does. Therefore, it's still at the same maximum level, only the entire file hits the wall as opposed to just parts of it (like in movies, shows, etc.).

Here's some more about the loudness wars as used in music (NOTE: they are heavily against excessive limiting in music):

http://turnmeup.org/

 

[quadraphonic]

If this "problem" is ever technologically solved, then it will only be a couple years of Pax Claritas before there are people (probably in the gubmint) who determine that there is too much contrast or too much red (pick your color) in programs.

 

[kenglish]

We already have what is called Gamut, or "Legal" video.
It's not an FCC thing, but a technical limitation. I have to explain to people, especially graphics designers, that "anything outside of the legal areas is not guaranteed to look like anything you ever expected it to".

 

[quadraphonic]

I feel ya. Even though it's technically impossible to make everyone happy, there are always those who will want some legislation to make people happy. "If we make one more person happy, then all this will have been worth it."

 

[SixtiesGuy]

Hmmmm....

Ten-thousand dollar box on each of your program channels, to try and regulate levels.
Thirty-thousand dollar box in the rack, to prove you are trying to regulate levels.
Engineer spending several hours a day monitoring the boxes and tweaking the levels.

People still bitching that stations "don't care".

Priceless.
:

Obviously you are annoyed by the conclusions viewers have drawn about the reasons for this situation. You mention supposedly expensive equipment that broadcasters allegedly use, as well as the expensive talent that you claim monitors "the boxes" and tweaks the levels, yet, despite all this, it is not working. Somehow, for decades now, radio stations have very successfully been able to maintain a consistent actual and perceived sound level with program material of very widely varying sound levels. Obviously it can be done. So, if it's not a matter of indifference, it must be either ineptitude, or the hundreds of thousands of us who notice this problem must be lying or hallucinating. Now you will probably get all righteously indignant and claim that I don't know what I'm talking about... but I'm not alone in this - it's not my perception, nor am I part of a tinfoil hat wearing group of whack jobs. If that were true, this would not have gotten to the point where legislation, however ineffective or unenforced, would have been passed by the US Congress. Well, guess what? While you're busy rolling your eyes, with technological developments such as on-demand, internet-based program delivery and devices such as The Hopper, the 20th Century model of program delivery will soon disappear, so the soon-to-be former broadcasters will no longer have to spend all that precious money on magic boxes and technicians to tweak them. I bid you good night and good luck.

 

[blizzard59]

For anyone still experiencing loud commercials, I would recommend going into your TV's settings menu and seeing if there's a function enabled called "auto volume" or something similar. If so, disable it and see if the problem still persists. It's generally been my experience that these kinds of functions can make loudness problems worse rather than fix them.