DFW Ratings July 2013

[Jay Walker]

Latest 6+ ratings (beauty contest) from Tom Taylor
http://us6.campaign-archive2.com/?u=78b390ff9f5b002e3f050238c&id=19c7617944&e=a1ef80cbbf

AQH Share for Persons 6+, Mon-Sun 6AM-Mid

The Ticket still leads sports down slightly from a 2.6 to a 2.4
ESPN down 2.1 to a 1.9
Fan's down from a 1.0 to a 0.8

KHKS still on top but down from a 7.8 to a 6.8
KDMX up 0.5 to a 4.9
Edge is up 0.5 to a 3.9
KVIL drifts up to a 4.1
KLIF-FM I-93 is chugging long with a steady 2.1

Seems to be a number of "down" wobbles, maybe Mr. Eduardo can explain the variables...

 

[davideduardo]

Seems to be a number of "down" wobbles, maybe Mr. Eduardo can explain the variables...

There is a reason why agencies give less credence to summer books or months... listening patterns are disrupted.

Add to that the fact that generally PPM panels turn over more at the beginning of summer than any other time except the Christmas season.

It all means that bigger wobbles will occur in the summer.

 

[pjc1961]

AllAccess PPM Ratings Analysis with demo breakouts for July 2013 (scroll down for Dallas):
http://www.allaccess.com/net-news/a...rch-director-inc-presents-exclusive-july-ppm-

 

[AlanB]

KLIF brought up the rear as the absolute last subscribing station in the market. When your .3 6+ is being defeated by every Spanish language station in the market, not to mention KNON, it's time to make a change. The question is, to what? Cumulus is not going to spend the capital it would take to make KLIF a true and credible all-news station.

Assuming that they will not move KTCK to 570, what will be done with 570?

 

[Jay Walker]

KLIF brought up the rear as the absolute last subscribing station in the market. When your .3 6+ is being defeated by every Spanish language station in the market, not to mention KNON, it's time to make a change. The question is, to what? Cumulus is not going to spend the capital it would take to make KLIF a true and credible all-news station.

Assuming that they will not move KTCK to 570, what will be done with 570?

Remember, while the ratings are fun for us "armchair quarterbacks" the true numbers that matter are the station bottom lines. IF 570 KLIF has a good bottom line, things will remain as they are. That's why when we look at the ratings and say "how/why do they do/don't change" we are at the disadvantage of not seeing the big picture, and for the management/owner(s) the only big picture that matters is the bottom line...

 

[Jay Walker]

Seems to be a number of "down" wobbles, maybe Mr. Eduardo can explain the variables...

There is a reason why agencies give less credence to summer books or months... listening patterns are disrupted.

Add to that the fact that generally PPM panels turn over more at the beginning of summer than any other time except the Christmas season.

It all means that bigger wobbles will occur in the summer.

Thank you Mr. Eduardo, when it comes to ratings explanations it's nice to be able to go to "The Source" of all things ratings...

 

[AlanB]

Remember, while the ratings are fun for us "armchair quarterbacks" the true numbers that matter are the station bottom lines. IF 570 KLIF has a good bottom line, things will remain as they are. That's why when we look at the ratings and say "how/why do they do/don't change" we are at the disadvantage of not seeing the big picture, and for the management/owner(s) the only big picture that matters is the bottom line...

Your wisdom is completely understood, but a .3 6+ cannot translate into a good demographic number of any kind. Of course, if Cumulus is running the station to lose money (tax write-off), then they are doing exactly what is expected and no change is needed.

I love Wheels on Saturday morning, but since that is surely a paid program, it will move to another station if KLIF were to flip. Other than a true all-news (which is expensive and labor intensive: two things Cumulus is not known for), what could be done with this failed frequency?

 

[Jay Walker]

Remember, while the ratings are fun for us "armchair quarterbacks" the true numbers that matter are the station bottom lines. IF 570 KLIF has a good bottom line, things will remain as they are. That's why when we look at the ratings and say "how/why do they do/don't change" we are at the disadvantage of not seeing the big picture, and for the management/owner(s) the only big picture that matters is the bottom line...

Your wisdom is completely understood, but a .3 6+ cannot translate into a good demographic number of any kind. Of course, if Cumulus is running the station to lose money (tax write-off), then they are doing exactly what is expected and no change is needed.

I love Wheels on Saturday morning, but since that is surely a paid program, it will move to another station if KLIF were to flip. Other than a true all-news (which is expensive and labor intensive: two things Cumulus is not known for), what could be done with this failed frequency?

AlanB sir, the bottom line does not care about demographics, it's only concern is $dollar signs$.. There are a number of stations in Dallas with pretty bad ratings in 6+ and not really much better in 25-54 that have really good bottom lines. It gets down to how much are ratings bragging rights really worth to a station.

As I had posted somewhere else on this forum, If you are #1 and billing let's say for the sake of a number to work with, 25 mil a year but are spending 25 mil to generate billing of 25 mil, you have a poor bottom line. But if you are sitting there with a 1.0 share billing let's say for a number, 6 mil and are spending 1 mil to do that, you have an EXCELLENT bottom line when compared to our previous example. Even though you have really poor ratings. KLIF 570 probably makes a lot more money than you might think. Price a half hour or a full hour on Saturday and you will see what I mean. Those times are not cheap on any station in DFW, including the rimshot AM total broker stations.

Also cluster operation is vastly different in mindset than a "stand alone". A station in a cluster is simply one more chess piece you use to block, deflect, or attack another station not in your cluster...all the while working to generate a good bottom line for the station AND the cluster.

IMHO the only reason top 40/CHR is on KLIF-FM, is the hope to pull a share or two off KISS. They know that signal will never beat KISS but it may pull a critical share or two out of the demo just enough to allow one of their country properties a chance to float up a rank or two...it's a part of the cluster strategy...Otherwise KLIF-FM would be a simulcast of The Ticket or 570. At least that scenario makes sense to me from a cluster stand point...

 

[davideduardo]

Thank you Mr. Eduardo, when it comes to ratings explanations it's nice to be able to go to "The Source" of all things ratings...

Actually, there are much better ratings gurus on this board, at least occasionally, than the humble servant.

And that line is my cue to recommend one of the most informative radio sites that exist... and it is all about the DFW market:

http://www.dfwradioarchives.info/

The best chronology of area radio, as well as fabulous ratings data... and lots of historical documents and data. Worth setting time aside for...

 

[Jay Walker]

Thank you Mr. Eduardo, when it comes to ratings explanations it's nice to be able to go to "The Source" of all things ratings...

Actually, there are much better ratings gurus on this board, at least occasionally, than the humble servant.

And that line is my cue to recommend one of the most informative radio sites that exist... and it is all about the DFW market:

http://www.dfwradioarchives.info/

The best chronology of area radio, as well as fabulous ratings data... and lots of historical documents and data. Worth setting time aside for...

http://www.dfwradioarchives.info/

That's where I go to re-live "Glory Days" ;D

As the Pink Floyd song goes:
"The memories of a man in his old age, are the deeds of a man in his prime"
Pink Floyd - Free Four from the LP Obscured By Clouds...

 

[salemjedi54]

Remember, while the ratings are fun for us "armchair quarterbacks" the true numbers that matter are the station bottom lines. IF 570 KLIF has a good bottom line, things will remain as they are. That's why when we look at the ratings and say "how/why do they do/don't change" we are at the disadvantage of not seeing the big picture, and for the management/owner(s) the only big picture that matters is the bottom line...

Your wisdom is completely understood, but a .3 6+ cannot translate into a good demographic number of any kind. Of course, if Cumulus is running the station to lose money (tax write-off), then they are doing exactly what is expected and no change is needed.

I love Wheels on Saturday morning, but since that is surely a paid program, it will move to another station if KLIF were to flip. Other than a true all-news (which is expensive and labor intensive: two things Cumulus is not known for), what could be done with this failed frequency?

AlanB sir, the bottom line does not care about demographics, it's only concern is $dollar signs$.. There are a number of stations in Dallas with pretty bad ratings in 6+ and not really much better in 25-54 that have really good bottom lines. It gets down to how much are ratings bragging rights really worth to a station.

As I had posted somewhere else on this forum, If you are #1 and billing let's say for the sake of a number to work with, 25 mil a year but are spending 25 mil to generate billing of 25 mil, you have a poor bottom line. But if you are sitting there with a 1.0 share billing let's say for a number, 6 mil and are spending 1 mil to do that, you have an EXCELLENT bottom line when compared to our previous example. Even though you have really poor ratings. KLIF 570 probably makes a lot more money than you might think. Price a half hour or a full hour on Saturday and you will see what I mean. Those times are not cheap on any station in DFW, including the rimshot AM total broker stations.

Also cluster operation is vastly different in mindset than a "stand alone". A station in a cluster is simply one more chess piece you use to block, deflect, or attack another station not in your cluster...all the while working to generate a good bottom line for the station AND the cluster.

IMHO the only reason top 40/CHR is on KLIF-FM, is the hope to pull a share or two off KISS. They know that signal will never beat KISS but it may pull a critical share or two out of the demo just enough to allow one of their country properties a chance to float up a rank or two...it's a part of the cluster strategy...Otherwise KLIF-FM would be a simulcast of The Ticket or 570. At least that scenario makes sense to me from a cluster stand point...

That is what I keep telling folk Mr. Walker, if they are making budget with a .3 share then things ARE NOT going to change. Everyone is fat and happy. If Cumulus thought they could make more money with moving KTCK to 570, 96.7 or 93.3 it would have been done ages ago. But as it stands they are making enough money at 1310 to pay the water bill, light bill, salaries and car notes so why change. That's why Service sold KKDA. It was not making the money they thought it could make, so instead throwing good money after bad, sell it and put some in the pocket, and the rest in KKDA-FM and KRNB.

 

[Jay Walker]

That is what I keep telling folk Mr. Walker, if they are making budget with a .3 share then things ARE NOT going to change. Everyone is fat and happy. If Cumulus thought they could make more money with moving KTCK to 570, 96.7 or 93.3 it would have been done ages ago. But as it stands they are making enough money at 1310 to pay the water bill, light bill, salaries and car notes so why change. That's why Service sold KKDA. It was not making the money they thought it could make, so instead throwing good money after bad, sell it and put some in the pocket, and the rest in KKDA-FM and KRNB.

As a former listener, as much as I hated to see "Soul 73" go away, even as it was just hitting it's stride with that great combination of R&B, Pop, and Gold Soul, I still get the mindset, and the reasons it was sold. It's ALWAYS about costs and if the station, even as an automated jukebox, is not generating a healthy bottom line, they really have no options other than cutting losses and selling out.

Still hated to see it go away...

 

[idiggraves]

KLIF brought up the rear as the absolute last subscribing station in the market. When your .3 6+ is being defeated by every Spanish language station in the market, not to mention KNON, it's time to make a change. The question is, to what? Cumulus is not going to spend the capital it would take to make KLIF a true and credible all-news station.

Assuming that they will not move KTCK to 570, what will be done with 570?

Cumulus has/will never spend the capital it would take to make KLIF anything credible. I'm convinced it's intentionally become the Dallas cluster "write off".

 

[davideduardo]

Cumulus has/will never spend the capital it would take to make KLIF anything credible. I'm convinced it's intentionally become the Dallas cluster "write off".

At the risk of dispelling a Hollywood myth about how business works, there is no "tax write off" if one station in a cluster does not make money.

In reality, where most business people are neither crooked bankers or tax cheats, all that truly happens is that the cluster, and thus the company, makes less money. As a result, there is less money for the owners and less money to pay in taxes. In other words, there is no silver lining in under performing.

 

[Jay Walker]

KLIF brought up the rear as the absolute last subscribing station in the market. When your .3 6+ is being defeated by every Spanish language station in the market, not to mention KNON, it's time to make a change. The question is, to what? Cumulus is not going to spend the capital it would take to make KLIF a true and credible all-news station.

Assuming that they will not move KTCK to 570, what will be done with 570?

KLIF has been on a long slow slide to obscurity which accelerated after the move from 1190 to 570. If the station ever had an opportunity it was when they moved to the vastly superior 570 signal. Over the many years since the moved there were bright moments to be sure but really never more than just moments with ratings success, the latest attempt as a hybrid news talk doesn't seem to be gaining any traction.
More than likely they will drift back into talk with the usual cast of third and fourth string syndicated talk shows...

 

[rbrucecarter5]

KLIF brought up the rear as the absolute last subscribing station in the market. When your .3 6+ is being defeated by every Spanish language station in the market, not to mention KNON, it's time to make a change. The question is, to what? Cumulus is not going to spend the capital it would take to make KLIF a true and credible all-news station.

Assuming that they will not move KTCK to 570, what will be done with 570?

KLIF has been on a long slow slide to obscurity which accelerated after the move from 1190 to 570. If the station ever had an opportunity it was when they moved to the vastly superior 570 signal. Over the many years since the moved there were bright moments to be sure but really never more than just moments with ratings success, the latest attempt as a hybrid news talk doesn't seem to be gaining any traction.
More than likely they will drift back into talk with the usual cast of third and fourth string syndicated talk shows...

KLIF's decline started when they switched from top-40. Ultimately, though - the move of music to FM would have doomed them. But the 570 frequency would have really helped if it had happened in the 60's during KLIF's golden era. Now - who cares?

 

[Jay Walker]

KLIF brought up the rear as the absolute last subscribing station in the market. When your .3 6+ is being defeated by every Spanish language station in the market, not to mention KNON, it's time to make a change. The question is, to what? Cumulus is not going to spend the capital it would take to make KLIF a true and credible all-news station.

Assuming that they will not move KTCK to 570, what will be done with 570?

KLIF has been on a long slow slide to obscurity which accelerated after the move from 1190 to 570. If the station ever had an opportunity it was when they moved to the vastly superior 570 signal. Over the many years since the moved there were bright moments to be sure but really never more than just moments with ratings success, the latest attempt as a hybrid news talk doesn't seem to be gaining any traction.
More than likely they will drift back into talk with the usual cast of third and fourth string syndicated talk shows...

KLIF's decline started when they switched from top-40. Ultimately, though - the move of music to FM would have doomed them. But the 570 frequency would have really helped if it had happened in the 60's during KLIF's golden era. Now - who cares?

Only us RF junkies and control room fleas care about this stuff, but posting on the forum provides the general public a service by keeping us off the streets in front of our keyboards and out of sight from the mall walkers, and Starbuck freaks ;D

 

[andydallas]

Am I the only one old enough to remember WFAA and WBAP swapped frequencies twice a day,,it seems like a big cow bell would ring when WBAP was going to the "next" frequency

 

[budman1]

How does KNON have the same ratings as KSKY ?
Or am I reading something wrong.

KNON is programmed like a college station circa 1975. Don't worry about what the listeners want, just play the records you like. And take the meter readings every 4 hours, sign the log and do the top of the hour ID. AND SHOW UP FOR YOUR SHIFT !!!

Is this an artifact of small sample size or is KNON really that much of a listened to product ?

--bud

 

[Jay Walker]

How does KNON have the same ratings as KSKY ?
Or am I reading something wrong.

KNON is programmed like a college station circa 1975. Don't worry about what the listeners want, just play the records you like. And take the meter readings every 4 hours, sign the log and do the top of the hour ID. AND SHOW UP FOR YOUR SHIFT !!!

Is this an artifact of small sample size or is KNON really that much of a listened to product ?

--bud

Bud,
Remember these are the 6+ ratings which are worth nothing to an advertiser. That's why they are free for public viewing.

KNON is a community station doing block programming, and there are probably a number of individuals that give them a listen. Heck recently I find myself listening to KNTU for the Jazz programming, and on Saturday the always eclectic North Texas Jukebox. I am a recent cume for KNTU all because one day everyone of my usual choices were in stopsets, KXT wasn't doing anything for me so I landed on KNTU and stayed a while. Now I make it a point to check them out a lot more than I would have use to...

I also listen to contemporary stations, classic hits/rock and even Funny 1700. As far as KSKY, they have their slice of listeners as well. While they may not look good in 6+, they might look better in the older demos. While KSKY and talk radio in general does nothing for me, there are a number of others who enjoy the format...