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Digital AM Radio

L

Len14043

I have been watching the development of IBOC with great interest. I heard that a person named Leonard Kahn has developed a system for AM. Does anyone know the technical aspects of this system? Is it truly digital, or just another version of AM stereo? Thanks.

NOTE: Please don't respond with a diatribe about how IBOC is inferior. I am very familiar with its atvantages and limitations.
 
Leonard is not forthcoming with any technical details. It seems to be a variant of his "Powerside" system. Have you seen his web site? http://www.wrathofkahn.org/ I think he does himself more harm than good.

If it actually works (and I hope it does), I'd love to hear it. But that seems to be the problem. Nobody has actually heard it that I know of.
 
Doesn't he have off air demos on his site? The issue I have with his system is that one, it relies on the analogue carrier and so it will never be turned off and two, there are no receivers available, that I know of and it's also only an AM system. Other than IBOC I don't know of any systems which work on both AM & FM and in which the analogue portion disappears eventually.
 
It looks like he is providing a demonstration of a lack of interference on various types of receivers but no indication of what the system actually sounds like when received digitally.
 
LEN14043 WROTE: "...Leonard Kahn has developed a system for AM. Does anyone know the technical aspects of this system?"

You can glean a lot with some patient reading. There's plenty of material. I suspect we won't learn the full story of how CAM-D actually works until Kahn receives a patent.

Here's a brief description from the owner of Kahn's first CAM-D radio station, KDYL-AM in Salt Lake City - on February 2, 2005.

From: http://www.wrathofkahn.org/wst_page5.html

1.) The Kahn Communications, Inc. CAM-D is up and doing what it promised on KDYL-AM 1060 in Salt Lake City. Tests on the spectrum analyzer show that it has a clean digital signal.

2.) We are delighted to be the first in the world to have this new digital modernization for AM Radio. Unlike the old IBOC System, CAM-D will not interfere with adjacent channels.

3.) CAM-D dramatically increases, and does not limit, sky wave coverage.

4.) CAM-D is fully compatible with the more than 800 million radios in America.

5.) CAM-D more than passes NRSC Standards with +/- 8 KHz bandwidth.

6.) CAM-D will utilize the several data channels that will alert the listening public about storms, road conditions, and national defense.

7.) The installation cost to broadcasters is minimal compared to Ibiquity. It does not require purchasing new transmitters, tower antennas, or processors.

8.) There is no time delay from mike to speaker in your car, home or business.

9.) Interference from high power electrical lines is eliminated almost completely. The signal remains strong when going through road underpasses.

10.) CAM-D will work to improve the AM band, not take it backwards to 5 KHz. More wide band digital radios are on the horizon that will make AM even better.

All I ask is that stations look before they leap and not install something that will take the AM Band backwards. Call me at 801 268-8181 or Leonard Kahn at (212) 983-6765 for more information.

Ralph J. Carlson President of Carlson Communications, Intl.
 
autopaint-1 said:
Doesn't he have off air demos on his site? The issue I have with his system is that one, it relies on the analogue carrier and so it will never be turned off and two, there are no receivers available, that I know of and it's also only an AM system. Other than IBOC I don't know of any systems which work on both AM & FM and in which the analogue portion disappears eventually.
Click to expand...
When the analog signal disappears all current broadcast radios including current HD Radio's will become obsolete, useless doorstops.
There will be expensive new "improved" versions for us to buy again. A real moneymaking racket.
Why not just use a truly compatible system and have the best of both worlds, and no need to replace all your radios if you don't want to?
Here are the links to truely compatible digital high definition radio without causing interference to current analog radio:
www.dreinc.com
http://www.wrathofkahn.org/wst_page5.html
IBOC AM and FM systems are different, but both use adjacent channels not used with these other systems.
 
"When the analog signal disappears all current broadcast radios including current HD Radio's will become obsolete, useless doorstops"

Where did you hear this? Sounds a bit suspect to me.
 
Uhh Super, are you familiar with the Boston Acoustic HD receptor? I thought not. It has a data port for firmwear upgrades in the back of the radio. B.A. has been very good about supplying upgrades free of charge. The Dipole being one example. I don't know, do you have a twin named Say no?
 
autopaint-1 said:
Uhh Super, are you familiar with the Boston Acoustic HD receptor? I thought not. It has a data port for firmwear upgrades in the back of the radio. B.A. has been very good about supplying upgrades free of charge. The Dipole being one example.I don't know, do you have a twin named Say no?
Click to expand...
YOU ARE RIGHT, YOU DON'T KNOW.
DO YOU HAVE iBiquity HD RADIO CLONES?

Does the Boston Acousitics data port allow upgrading to the new revision 2 of HD Radio such as allegedly being used by Radiosophy?
If not, then it is already obsolete.
 
Isn't HD 2 a new Chip design that makes for a more sensitive receiver and to draw less current? If it's a different system (which it isn't) or a different codec (which it isn't) than the Receptor can be upgraded.
 
Everyone should bring or send their Boston Acoustics Receptor to you for the free hardware chip upgrade?
Do you take care of the shipping also?
 
SUPERCASTER said:
Does the Boston Acousitics data port allow upgrading to the new revision 2 of HD Radio such as allegedly being used by Radiosophy?
If not, then it is already obsolete.
Click to expand...


2.0 is a receiver design spec, using a newer chipset. It is not a software or firmware update. It is manufacturing specs.
 
"2.0 is a receiver design spec, using a newer chipset. It is not a software or firmware update. It is manufacturing specs."

This is basically what I said. It's amazing how some people are so blinded by their own preconceptions that they refuse to see the truth.
 
autopaint-1 said:
Isn't HD 2 a new Chip design that makes for a more sensitive receiver and to draw less current? If it's a different system (which it isn't) or a different codec (which it isn't) than the Receptor can be upgraded.
Click to expand...
You said (above and before) the HD Receptor can be upgraded all the way to when hybrid digital goes to digital only. Below it implies that it can not even be upgraded to HD2. Both can't be true.
If upgrades are as simple as you say, why shouldn't recent owners of the premium priced Boston Acoustics HD Radio be entitled to, and get the free HD2 upgrade?
Earlier, you claimed:
Uhh Super, are you familiar with the Boston Acoustic HD receptor? I thought not. It has a data port for firmwear upgrades in the back of the radio. B.A. has been very good about supplying upgrades free of charge. The Dipole being one example.
Click to expand...
It would be a pleasant change to see some truth about HD Radio from supporters. Most of what has been posted here is just unscupulous HD Radio sales hype.

autopaint-1 said:
"2.0 is a receiver design spec, using a newer chipset. It is not a software or firmware update. It is manufacturing specs."

This is basically what I said. It's amazing how some people are so blinded by their own preconceptions that they refuse to see the truth.
Click to expand...
Some candid truth about HD Radio from your side, instead of marketing hype, and wild accusations would be a refreshing change.
"Where's the beef?'
 
I own a Boston Acoustics HD Receptor and it has a data port on the back of the radio whch allows it to be upgraded? What is the HD 2 you are refereing to? Is it different than the HD 2 & 3 it now receives? There is no different method of broadcasting it will not receive. I'd love to know where you get your information. BY the way (and HD radio is not changing for the nervous out there) what do you think of all those Windows 3.1, 95, 98 etc etc who can not run current XP programs without buy a new computer, any thoughts on that?
 
I own a Boston Acoustics HD Receptor and it has a data port on the back of the radio whch allows it to be upgraded? What is the HD 2 you are refereing to? Is it different than the HD 2 & 3 it now receives? There is no different method of broadcasting it will not receive. I'd love to know where you get your information. BY the way (and HD radio is not changing for the nervous out there) what do you think of all those Windows 3.1, 95, 98 etc etc who can not run current XP programs without buy a new computer, any thoughts on that?
Click to expand...

Revision 2 is the most recent revision to HD Radio standard implementation for improved reception. I would contact your HD radio's maker or iBiquity for what should be the free upgrade.
The new HD Radio recievers are promising to include the new, improved, revision 2 circuits in their new radios such as the Radiosophy, which is scheduled to be available soon.
No, it has nothing to do with Windows nor any of the other innuendos, abberations, or sales hype HD supporters enjoy including in their posts.
 
Please make an attempt to understand me. My current radio will be able to recieve HD radio exactly as it always has. The new radios might have newer chip versions but that has nothig at all to do with the content HD radio stations are transmitting. What is so hard about that to understand? Here's an analogy for you; I drive a 1995 automobile. Improvements have been made since that vehicle was built. That doesn't mean the my 1995 car won't work on todays roads.
 
SUPERCASTER said:
Revision 2 is the most recent revision to HD Radio standard implementation for improved reception. I would contact your HD radio's maker or iBiquity for what should be the free upgrade.
The new HD Radio recievers are promising to include the new, improved, revision 2 circuits in their new radios such as the Radiosophy, which is scheduled to be available soon.
No, it has nothing to do with Windows nor any of the other innuendos, abberations, or sales hype HD supporters enjoy including in their posts.
Click to expand...

No, 2.0 is a design spec, for manufacturers to construct receivers around a newer chipset. It gives the technical criteria on how to build a radio around a different "master" or core chip... everything from power supply needs to the pin-outs and such.

In other words, it is a raodmap for manufacturers to help them build receivers that work well.

There are no upgrades, any more than Intel is going to send you a new and free CPU every time they build a better chip.
 
DavidEduardo said:
SUPERCASTER said:
Revision 2 is the most recent revision to HD Radio standard implementation for improved reception. I would contact your HD radio's maker or iBiquity for what should be the free upgrade.
The new HD Radio recievers are promising to include the new, improved, revision 2 circuits in their new radios such as the Radiosophy, which is scheduled to be available soon.
No, it has nothing to do with Windows nor any of the other innuendos, abberations, or sales hype HD supporters enjoy including in their posts.
Click to expand...

No, 2.0 is a design spec, for manufacturers to construct receivers around a newer chipset. It gives the technical criteria on how to build a radio around a different "master" or core chip... everything from power supply needs to the pin-outs and such.

In other words, it is a raodmap for manufacturers to help them build receivers that work well.

There are no upgrades, any more than Intel is going to send you a new and free CPU every time they build a better chip.
Click to expand...
So you are saying there is no hope for those who listened to HD Radio promoters, and their promises of upgradeability, and recently purchased Boston Acoustics Receptor HD Radios?
Many BA HD Receptors are still deaf in spite of the new external antennas.
I guess the suckers that bought into the HD Radio hype can't get the upgrades/updates they were promised. It seems BA HD Receptor customers are now SOL, in spite of the fact that many of the HD receptors are deaf and only a few months old.
The CPU manufacturers never promised new CPU's. But if their new CPU's don't work properly they are obligated to fix or replace them.
 
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