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DO NIELSEN RATINGS INCLUDE LOCAL TV SUB-CHANNELS ?

gregg75

gregg75

I searched a bit online and could not find a real answer to this question.
My guess would be no......seeing some of the junk that many of the sub-
channels are full of (weather, sports, music, etc.). I think if stations were
aware of the small audience they were getting then they would go for an
Antenna TV, Me-TV or Retro TV which could bring in a larger audience.
 
Nielsen does not compile ratings for subchannels. They do collect information about viewership, though. My guess is that TV stations were not willing to double, triple, or even octuple what they were paying for ratings in 2005 to pay for ratings for subchannels.
 
I would be curious to know how they collect information on sub-channels that are major-network affiliates. A ton of smaller markets are airing another major network on their subchannel, rather than the mini-nets. Here in Great Falls, the station I work for carries FOX on our sub-channel (branded as Fox 5.2).

In Macon, GA the Fox station carries ABC on it's subchannel and in Bowling Green, KY the NBC station carries CBS on it's sub. Do these major nets receive their own ratings books, like some of the cable channels that are "shared" (Nickelodeon vs Nick at Nite, which was discussed on this board a few weeks ago).
 
That's a good question. From what I gather only one station per signal is rated (the main one). You would think in those unique cases they would do both. Something tells me this whole sub-channel thing will get ratings sooner or later. The stations need to know if anybody is watching.
 
The stations which offer major networks on subchannels have to be rated somehow, or why in the world would they do it?

Of course, not far from here, WKBN/27.2 "Fox Youngstown" still airs on its original analog LPTV home (62). But there are many other markets where the network only airs on a subchannel (i.e. Wheeling WV's WTRF/7.2 and 7.3, Fox and ABC respectively).
 
Yes, Nielsen does include subchannels. You are just not likely to find a lot of media reports about the numbers. If a station is running a major network like Fox or NBC on a .2or .3, the numbers can be substantial. RTV, weather, etc... not so much.
 
There must be some kind of ratings compiled for subchannel networks. See for instance http://www.tvweek.com/blogs/tvbizwire/2010/05/several-tribune-stations-pick.php

I don't understand how they can say that This TV nationally had 597k viewers that one particular night but they won't say anything about how many viewers WTTV 4.2/Bloomington-Indianapolis had on that same night. Might be a sample size concern.
 
Then I wonder how TV stations are able to evaluate their subchannels in terms of viewership and what to charge advertisers.

NBC in New York has a 24/7 subchannel that may be the most ambitious in the country. It's called New York Non-Stop and it's sort of like a continuous local magazine show. There are all sorts of features like Where to Find the Best Pizza or A New Club Opens in Chelsea. The news department (which suffered deep cuts to help fund this thing) also does a one-hour newscast at 7pm, not seen on the regular channel.

With all of NBC's investment in this subchannel (which is also carried on an upper tier on many area cable systems), you'd think NBC would like to know if their investment is paying off, in terms of ratings.

NBC also runs Universal Sports on many of its stations' subchannels around the country, ABC here in NYC runs Living Well and an Accu-Weather subchannel including local forecasts recorded by Channel 7 metorologists. There's This TV and Estrella on WPIX. I'm sure the stations and the advertisers wonder if anyone is watching these channels or even know they are there.


Gregg
[email protected]
 
I know The Sherman Denison area is unique to in the fact that
ABC, FOX, CW, and MY TV are all only Carried on Sub channels.
ABC on 10.2 KTEN
CW on 10.3 KTEN
Fox on 12.2 KXII
MY on 12.3 KXII

I don't know if they can rate those or not.
 
In Presque Isle, ME, FOX is available via WAGM-DT 8-2 (WAGM-DT 8-1 is CBS).

In Bangor, ME, FOX is available via WVII-DT 7-2 (WVII-DT 7-1 is ABC). That FOX station is also available over-the-air as analog low-power WFVX-LP channel 22.

To conclude Maine, Portland/Poland Spring has WPFO-TV channel 23 of Waterville for FOX. I don't know if that market has its own ION station, as I only saw it on cable when I visited Portland in November (WPFO-TV was once WMPX-TV, a PAX affiliate).

What I'd like to know is how the ratings are counted in a market which has the station locally in-market as another station's sub channel, yet might also be seen from an adjoining market in HD? Case in point: Springfield, MA. That market has FOX 6 ("6" referring to the analog cable channel number), which is actually WGGB-DT 40-2 (WGGB-DT 40-1 is ABC). Some cable systems in that market, possibly Comcast in Springfield itself carried WTIC-DT 61-1 (FOX) from Hartford/New Haven. That may have been done since FOX 6 wasn't available in HD when it started. It's also because until digital TV and subchannels started, Springfield, MA relied on Hartford/New Haven for both CBS and FOX. (Springfield on their own only had NBC 22, ABC 40 and PBS 57 for full-powered analog stations).
 
LibertyNT said:
I know The Sherman Denison area is unique to in the fact that
ABC, FOX, CW, and MY TV are all only Carried on Sub channels.
ABC on 10.2 KTEN
CW on 10.3 KTEN
Fox on 12.2 KXII
MY on 12.3 KXII

I don't know if they can rate those or not.
Click to expand...

Okay, maybe I didn't explain this the right wy. YES, THERE ARE RATINGS FOR SUBCHANNELS!!!!!!!! YES, YES, YES!!!!

If they could not rate them, they would not exist. No ratings = no revenue. That just isn't the case. Nielsen DOES RATE THEM.
 
OK, but let's get back to the original question. Do we see ratings for subchannels that are NOT part of a major network? Maybe in a market where Fox or CW are carried a subchannel, that outlet gets rated But how about the Accu-Weather subchannel for WABC-TV in NYC? Or New York Non-Stop, a subchannel for WNBC? Do they even rate the Ion (formerly Pax) subchannels of religion, Qubo and health/travel/infomercials? Do those channels have more viewers than just the guys in the control room?

Gregg
[email protected]
 
tested said:
LibertyNT said:
I know The Sherman Denison area is unique to in the fact that
ABC, FOX, CW, and MY TV are all only Carried on Sub channels.
ABC on 10.2 KTEN
CW on 10.3 KTEN
Fox on 12.2 KXII
MY on 12.3 KXII

I don't know if they can rate those or not.
Click to expand...

Okay, maybe I didn't explain this the right wy. YES, THERE ARE RATINGS FOR SUBCHANNELS!!!!!!!! YES, YES, YES!!!!

If they could not rate them, they would not exist. No ratings = no revenue. That just isn't the case. Nielsen DOES RATE THEM.
Click to expand...

Same deal in the Quincy, IL/Hannibal, MO market: ABC, Fox and the CW are carried on subchannels--and none of their affiliates have ever carried My (or UPN when it was around).

ABC on KHQA 7.2 (main KHQA 7.1 is a CBS affiliate)
CW on WGEM 10.2 (main WGEM 10.1 is NBC)
Fox on WGEM 10.3

Also something similar in Springfield, IL as CBS programming from WCIA-3 in Champaign (in the eastern half of the market) is carried on sister station WCFN 49.2 (main 49.1 is My). WCFN originally began as a translator for WCIA in 1967, then became a full-power station in 1985 with their current calls while maintaining their status as a Springfield repeater for WCIA. Then in April 2002 they became a standalone station as a UPN affiliate (and later My)--which made it difficult, if not impossible in some cases, for people in the immediate Springfield area relying on OTA reception in the last 7 years of analog to even receive a CBS signal from WCIA (or rely upon an alternative from other CBS affiliates as KMOV St. Louis, WMBD Peoria, or KHQA Quincy).

But on the eastern half of the Champaign/Decatur/Springfield market (Champaign/Danville areas), WCFN's My programming is aired on WCIA's subchannel (3.2).
 
Gregg said:
OK, but let's get back to the original question. Do we see ratings for subchannels that are NOT part of a major network? Maybe in a market where Fox or CW are carried a subchannel, that outlet gets rated But how about the Accu-Weather subchannel for WABC-TV in NYC? Or New York Non-Stop, a subchannel for WNBC? Do they even rate the Ion (formerly Pax) subchannels of religion, Qubo and health/travel/infomercials? Do those channels have more viewers than just the guys in the control room?

Gregg
[email protected]
Click to expand...

The simple answer is yes, but you likely won't see them reported anywhere. I have seen stories in trade magazines tht talk about numbers for individual events or shows. But I have yet to see any source for continual ratings on any of these channels.
 
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