Do You Really Care About Radio?

[oldies76]

No. Those are votes by oldies geeks, not radio listeners. Apples vs. oranges. Or apples vs. artichokes.

The test for radio play is not "like" but "how much do you want to hear... or not hear... that song on the radio today?"

If you test that kind of song, you will get 80% or more strong negatives. If you play it on the radio, you will see half your metered listeners disappear.

The point is that many, many people who enjoy oldies (geeks or not), still like these songs. Why would they "approve" of them? If they truly disliked, hated or despised those songs, the opposite would show. People who like oldies also listen to classic hits radio, to get a "sample" of what's out there (or I should say, what's left), in the meantime some cringing, on the other songs that never get aired anymore.

If there was a way (not in a blue moon I suppose), get the YouTube 70's oldies audience into a test hall, and see how many songs will test high in one of those auditoriums. The problem is, whenever you need the right people to test, they're never pre-selected. It just does not represent the full spectrum of the potential listening audience, it's too random I believe.

 

[davideduardo]

No. Those are votes by oldies geeks, not radio listeners. Apples vs. oranges. Or apples vs. artichokes.

The test for radio play is not "like" but "how much do you want to hear... or not hear... that song on the radio today?"

If you test that kind of song, you will get 80% or more strong negatives. If you play it on the radio, you will see half your metered listeners disappear.

The point is that many, many people who enjoy oldies (geeks or not), still like these songs. Why would they "approve" of them? If they truly disliked, hated or despised those songs, the opposite would show.

People go to hear / see "Honey" or "Ballad of the Green Berets" or "Snoopy..." because they like the song. 99% of classic hits listeners don't like the song.

If you hate those songs, you certainly don't tell Youtube to play them for you.

 

[Groove1670]

4439 Likes, Only 86 dislikes

If you wanna use youtube statistics. That isn't really that big. Some of the top song have millions of views.

Heck Leonard Nimoy's Ballad of Bilbo Baggins has over 2 million views. I don't think it will get airplay soon, and it won't test well.

Let get those numbers up to 2,187,500. ;D

Listen now, and sing along.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XC73PHdQX04

 

[TheBigA]

It just does not represent the full spectrum of the potential listening audience, it's too random I believe.

In the real world, on the air, they love what they're hearing. No need to fix what's not broken.

 

[Tom Wells]

It just does not represent the full spectrum of the potential listening audience, it's too random I believe.

In the real world, on the air, they love what they're hearing. No need to fix what's not broken.

I'm sure that explains why WLS FM seems to be playing American Pie once every night now between midnight and 6 AM.

I do not live in a "8-crayon" world. I'll continue to live in a "64 crayoon" world, and I'll always enjpy the odd colors.

There are two great "clear channel" sucessful examples of wider playlist music stations on AM, CFZM 740 and WSM 650.

There is a difference between "listeners" and "active listeners".
Active listeners would be those who actually notice if there's an audio problem or an alternate take of a song being played.

Any station should cultivate the active listeners, and let those with low expectations play their ipod with 200 songs.

For most of my adult life, I have heard people complain about limited playlists, and "the biz" continues to believe it's doing
what it must.

I'd agree there don't need to be a lot of different flavors of dog food, but music and oldies is quite different.

 

[oldies76]

There are two great "clear channel" sucessful examples of wider playlist music stations on AM, CFZM 740 and WSM 650.

I-25 radio , Colorado Springs.

http://i25radio.co/

KWRP 690

 

[michael hagerty]

I agree with you 110%.....it a sham that so-many, I mean 85% of all the past hits, that were hits back in the day, and that people miss and/or remember, do not get aired today. Every FM radio station does it, they just avoid playing all the big hits, only some! You might have some luck tuning into an AM that has larger playlists, but that is so far and few between these days.

If 85% or so of all the hits (top 20's) from the past (1960-1985) are never heard, what makes radio think that they are satisfying the average listener, when so many songs from the past are being intentionally left out? It's a joke.

Here's the problem: A chunk of what we thought were hits back in the day weren't. Buzz Bennett (PD at KCBQ) used to say there were only 7 real hits at any given moment. The rest were songs that were past their peak, songs that weren't hits yet and songs that never would be but sounded pretty good on the radio.

I tend toward depth and ecelcticism in my own listening, but I have no illusions about the mass audience. Case in point: About 7 years ago, someone took a rimshot FM here in Phoenix and went to a nostalgia format with it. Pre-rock stuff (Sinatra, Tony Bennett, Ella Fitzgerald)...and they played great stuff.

I went to a business lunch with four other people who were in the station's demographic (these folks were in their early 60s). I brought up the station, expecting to hear rabid praise. They were all familiar with it, all thought it was okay...but...

"Why do I have to hear the third-best track on a Tony Bennett album? Why not "I Left My Heart In San Francisco"?

Honest.

The fact about a mass audience is that they know what they like....they like what they know. And while I'd rather hear "Another Park, Another Sunday" by the Doobie Brothers instead of its original flip side ("Black Water"), I'm in a minority.

But it's worse than that. Because while "Take Me In Your Arms (Rock Me)" hit #11 for the Doobies and "China Grove" only hit #15, I guarantee you more people will stay tuned if you play "China Grove".

The formula is songs everyone can agree on.

What do we call everyone agreeing to the exclusion of their own particular taste? Compromise. And as Steve Jobs would tell you, compromise and excellence rarely get within the same time zone as each other.

 

[TheBigA]

The fact about a mass audience is that they know what they like....they like what they know. And while I'd rather hear "Another Park, Another Sunday" by the Doobie Brothers instead of its original flip side ("Black Water"), I'm in a minority.

This is going to get ugly to be on the SF board.

You're comparing Tom Johnston songs and Pat Simmons songs. Very different animals. To me, Tom has "the voice." I got in a lengthy argument with someone about Pat's songs. I just prefer hearing Tom sing. He sounds like San Francisco. And Michael McDonald is a completely different band. That's just my opinion.

 

[SFStatic]

Michael Hagerty is dead bang right. Oldies, Classic Hits, Standards, you play the hits, and they will come. Play deep cuts or stiffs, and they go away. YOU may not like it, but the masses for those audiences do, and that's what counts.

 

[nocomradio]

Since this thread popped up, I've been doing some informal listening of a number of my local stations. Of them about 3 do a "lunchtime request" or a "5 o'clock request" type show. These are stations that I sometimes listen to all day long for a week at a time or more so I am as familiar with their playlists as the DJ's and PD's are. Not kidding about that.

When folks call in for the request hour, they always, and I mean always request the same stuff that was played sometimes an hour before, or within the same day. Chicago's 25 or 6 to 4, Lynyrd Skynyrd of any variety as long as its Sweet Home Alabama or Free Bird, America's Sister Golden Hair or Horse With No Name, Looking Glass's Brandy, etc, ad nauseum.

What does this prove? Probably nothing as its just what I've heard this week, but either the people who call in just switched the radio on and called in their request not knowing this stuff was already played eight times this week just between 8AM and 6PM, or they all like the same played over stuff and can't get enough of it. Now, given the attention span of the average modern American at 2.2 seconds, I'd say they just turned on the radio, found the 800 number and called in their request. If they are hearing these songs half as much as I am, why on earth would they request them yet again? All the afore mentioned songs are staples, and all are good in their own right, and there are millions of different people out there, but for goodness sake I can't honestly believe they want this stuff constantly with little to no variation.

 

[JEREMIAH]

None of you remembered one of the greatest hits of all time.....every classic hits station should give it heavy roatation..

"THEY'RE COMING TO TAKE ME AWAY HA HA".

Jerry Gordon

 

[Tom Wells]

Compromise and excellence are always the great divide.

It makes a great deal of difference from what perspective such terms are applied.

 

[TheBigA]

I can't honestly believe they want this stuff constantly with little to no variation.

I've said this before, so forgive me. But most people are creatures of habit. They order the same beverage every night. The commute using the same route every day. They go to the same job. Come home to the same home and wife. The same stuff constantly with little to no variation. And by the way, if you ask them, they'll say they're very happy.

 

[nocomradio]

And by the way, if you ask them, they'll say they're very happy.

I'd say they are very happy with the fact that nothing is changing. Change is scary, bad, evil and can only lead to more of it.

 

[landtuna]

I've said this before, so forgive me. But most people are creatures of habit. They order the same beverage every night. The commute using the same route every day. They go to the same job. Come home to the same home and wife. The same stuff constantly with little to no variation. And by the way, if you ask them, they'll say they're very happy.

Oh, I don't know. Wifey and I tried a new restaurant tonight. We both hated it. I'll take my boring favorites any time.

 

[1069_KIFR]

And by the way, if you ask them, they'll say they're very happy.

I'd say they are very happy with the fact that nothing is changing. Change is scary, bad, evil and can only lead to more of it.

Obama ran his entire 2008 campaign on Change.

 

[DavidKaye]

Why does it have to be scientific?

Another name for "scientific method" is "trial and error". You try something, it doesn't work, you drop it and try something else. You try something else, it works, and you try something similar to see if it works. In the case of radio you don't subject your whole audience to your experiments; you use a small sample.

And as to the matter of playing music at parties and clubs and people not leaving, that's because people are there for other reasons: to meet someone for sex or companionship, to kill time, to get drunk, etc., with music being secondary to the experience. If I were in a club and I heard a song or two or three that I didn't like, I wouldn't leave because I already have too much invested: a parking space or maybe a parking charge, the walk out the door to my car, the decision on what else to do that night, the idea of leaving people I'm with. That's a lot of investment to ditch just because I didn't like a few songs.

But the investment in radio listening is nil. You don't like the song, you change the station.

 

[rricci]

The fact about a mass audience is that they know what they like....they like what they know. And while I'd rather hear "Another Park, Another Sunday" by the Doobie Brothers instead of its original flip side ("Black Water"), I'm in a minority.

Michael, I don't want to get off-topic here, but I had the 45 of Black Water, but my copy had Song To See You Through. Are you certain about "Another Park, Another Sunday"?

If you rather reply to me in private my email is rricci428 at mail2world dot com

 

[rricci]

None of you remembered one of the greatest hits of all time.....every classic hits station should give it heavy roatation..

"THEY'RE COMING TO TAKE ME AWAY HA HA".

Jerry Gordon

WHere's the LIKE button when you really need one????

 

[rricci]

And by the way, if you ask them, they'll say they're very happy.

I'd say they are very happy with the fact that nothing is changing. Change is scary, bad, evil and can only lead to more of it.

If that's the case, how did Obama get elected in 2008 on the platform of change??