Entry-level talent: Does a college degree matter?

[kenhawk1160]

Recently I gave a lecture at the local community college, and I've been shocked at what I've been hearing. Thus, I have to put this question out to managers and programmers to get your feedback. There's a lot of young on-air people coming out of colleges and trade schools expecting to make $30,000 a year off the bat.

At your stations, does a college degree have any bearing on a starting seller or on-air talent's salary? If so, by how much? Inquiring minds want to know! Thanks!

 

[hammondo]

Is the degree in Marketing (Sales?) Could make a difference. Not 30k t start, however. If he CAN sellm that coul be cheating the person.

 

[nino]

"...There's a lot of young on-air people coming out of colleges and trade schools expecting to make $30,000 a year off the bat.

"...does a college degree have any bearing on a starting seller or on-air talent's salary?..."

I've met a lot of college graduates lately shunning radio because of the pay...

There were times where I chose to not hire someone with a degree because they were not taught the skills needed on the job.

I was on-air before going to college, and more than once attempted to correct what was taught in my classes. For programming and production, I have never been able to recommend college as a path to radio...unless...maybe...the student would get a lot of practical experience in a studio and/or LIVE "on-air".

 

[SirRoxalot]

Degree of Difficulty

There is one thing that determines your value as an entry-level talent: What you bring to the table.

If we're talking air talent, the aircheck is the thing. If we're talking sales, what have you SUCCESSFULLY sold? Otherwise, your coming through the door as promotions fodder, and hoping to make an impression.

IF you were lucky enough to work at a college station that was run by under the tutelage of professionals and treated radio as a PROFESSION instead of an ego-trip, you'll have valuable experience that will translate to the "real world". IF you were lucky enough to polish your skills at creating and delivering ideas - meaning that you can both write and speak well - your education wasn't wasted. Bonus points for actually knowing who the FCC is, and having a basic knowledge of their rules & regs.

Your college degree indicates that you have the ability to read & follow directions, that you can actually complete a series of tasks, and that you've been exposed to a world wider than your high school. That should be a plus, but is not the only determining factor. It also doesn't mean you'll make 20 cents more an hour than the high school dropout who started as a promo mook but lives and breathes radio.

 

[Auralous Sublimate]

In my humble college drop-out opinion, most communications programs suck. The schools don't give them the tools to teach a monkey how to throw poop, let alone the real deal day-to-day changes that a "radio person" needs access to.

Read a :30 second news piece. Super.

How about a wether report? Great.

Here's the thing. Most REAL radio people would get kicked outta college. MOST! Especially the successful ones! I mean, I just mispelled WEATHER!

If you're looking to learn how to run a board, get an internship.

If you're going to college for radio, go to lots of parties, gather stories from them, and take interesting classes like philosophy and underwater basket weaving. At least then you'll have something to talk ABOUT when you get this alleged job.

Good luck to 'em all!

 

[kenhawk1160]

Thanks everyone for your replies.

Here in Western Pennsylvania, the only two places where I found communications programs worth a damn were at Point Park College in Pittsburgh and Westminster College in New Wilmington. As far as on-air, the kids that came out of the state-owned universities were, with very few exceptions, about as useful as a hubcap on a tractor.

 

[hammondo]

You young pups really need some background that "life" brings."

College helps in the LONG run. You may not see the value of college because you are FORCED to make it work for you and pay, NOW. I graduated with a BA in Communications in 1971 and pretty much felt as you do.

After a few radio jobs I wanted more than being a dj and found better money in sales and management. I got an MA in 76, bought a station in 77, and by '79 had 4.

Sold them all in '85 to a doctor, and I got an MA in Theology in 94, then bought a couple of funeral homes, and sold them in 2003.

Now I'm a very happy nursing home chaplain (not having to work anymore at age 57). I'm VERY HAPPY I was in - and now happier I'm OUT of radio.

I HAVE great holidays, no getting up at 3:30am (like I did for 17 years), no managing dweebs who wanna be the latest "fad" announcer (Lujack, Howard, etc.).

 

[Countrykev]

College degrees are certainly not required, but you're way better off with them.

I had been working at a group of radio stations for 3 years when I started college. I continued working for a couple of stations in my college town. Interned at a large market station an hour away. In some classes I knew they were teaching me outdated techniques, but I wasn't there to learn the radio aspect.

I got my degree and became an OM/PD right out of the gate.

Degrees will help you get to a management role a lot faster, and in your career gives you a lot more options. Radio, as we all know, is a very unstable business and having a backup plan is definitely a good thing.

 

[hammondo]

O one more thing about college. As a BOSS, if YOU were comparing several applicants and all was EQUAL except education WHY wouldn 't someone with better education not win?

 

[nino]

"...As far as on-air, the kids that came out of the state-owned universities were, with very few exceptions, about as useful as a hubcap on a tractor."

Overnight airshifts were a blessing to me: I honed/polished, screwed-up, tried different things and approaches...

IF the shifts exist, air talent isn't allowed to do that anymore...and damn sure don't get any feedback and support that will help them.

 

[nino]

O one more thing about college. As a BOSS, if YOU were comparing several applicants and all was EQUAL except education WHY wouldn 't someone with better education not win?

When having to compare "natural talent" against a certified education (degree), I needed/preferred/chose talent...because that's what my priority was at the time.

It may have also been somewhat prejudicial: that's where my interests have always been, and what my strength has been.

 

[hammondo]

I'm saying if all but education were EQUAL. Most of the time, "natural talent" has a cause. Maybe the college person would be easier to train (maybe not).

 

[kenhawk1160]

I got my degree and became an OM/PD right out of the gate.

That's more the exception than the norm. You were fortunate.

My experience tells me that the rare candidates coming fresh out of a reputable broadcasting school still tend to get entry-level jobs in small market, but they tend to quickly elevate elsewhere...usually to a bigger market.

 

[hammondo]

I know what I'm about to post is harsh, but it is the ABSOLUTE truth!

The 30 or so broadcasting school grads (from Chicago Detroit and St. Louis) that were candidates over our 17 or so years of ownership were (with only about 2 or 3 exceptions) drug-infested, lazy, sex maniac, inept, lying losers. These adjectives have been carefully chosen.

In one case, the announcer told me HIS MOM DIED. We wanted to send flowers until the florist 200 miles away said, "HEY...She's nOT dead...I just saw Mrs. Alexander in my shop this morning!" When this guy returned, he was fired on the spot.

In a few other cases if the local chief of police and I weren't buds, they would probably just be getting out of prison NOW (after 17 years since we sold the stations).

I DO have an open mind. Maybe the automation operators board ops today have found "their level."

 

[Al Johnson]

For what it's worth, I notice those who attend proprietary broadcasting schools (if they are lucky) get work in small markets and bounce around small markets until they get real jobs. Those who are broadcasting majors at colleges and universities often get medium market jobs. Most bounce around and get out. A few may move up (especially if they look good enough for TV news). But liberal arts grads from highly selective schools go right to the network level and they are the ones who run things in the big time.

 

[kenhawk1160]

The 30 or so broadcasting school grads (from Chicago Detroit and St. Louis) that were candidates over our 17 or so years of ownership were (with only about 2 or 3 exceptions) drug-infested, lazy, sex maniac, inept, lying losers. These adjectives have been carefully chosen.

Well, you're talking about much bigger cities. I've had pretty good luck with Specs Howard grads in Detroit. I had a couple of real gems come out of Westminster College here in Western PA. They got their feet wet in small market radio, but they turned out to be so good that there was no way on God's green earth that I was ever going to be able to hold them with the wages I could pay. They both went to TV and are still doing well.

 

[hammondo]

Thats funny kenhawk. EVERY SINGLE Spec's grad was the most immature, poorest excuse for a human I've ever met.

Midwest in Chicago and Bcst Center in St. Louis had some people with morals and a bit of starting talent. NONE ever from Specs.

 

[kenhawk1160]

Thats funny kenhawk. EVERY SINGLE Spec's grad was the most immature, poorest excuse for a human I've ever met.

Nice attitude. Maybe you needed to do a better job of screening your people.

 

[hammondo]

NO manager would put up with the crap they pulled. (see post below). The people from Detroit had an expectation that THEY (all but 2 guys who wanted to SELL and did a good job- see note below) should be treated like "Larry Lujack" (days off/payroll loans/coming late/criminal behavior like smoking marijuana and drinking in the studio) while only offering minimal work ethic and the morals of a rapist.

Yup - better screening. FIRED THEM ALL! After giving the broadcasting schools a chance, we abandoned that idea. Eventually, we told all the broadcasting schools to stuff it and hired college kids who worked out much better. They followed instructions(!). Not a strong point for the bc school people.

Specs needed to sort out the prima donnas from the people who wanted to work.

 

[kenhawk1160]

NO manager would put up with the crap they pulled. (see post below). The people from Detroit had an expectation that THEY (all but 2 guys who wanted to SELL and did a good job- see note below) should be treated like "Larry Lujack" (days off/payroll loans/coming late/criminal behavior like smoking marijuana and drinking in the studio) while only offering minimal work ethic and the morals of a rapist.

Yup - better screening. FIRED THEM ALL! After giving the broadcasting schools a chance, we abandoned that idea. Eventually, we told all the broadcasting schools to stuff it and hired college kids who worked out much better. They followed instructions(!). Not a strong point for the bc school people.

Specs needed to sort out the prima donnas from the people who wanted to work.

I haven't had that kind of bad luck with Specs. Their people have been good, though not perfect. But then again, I came up through the ranks of radio back in the late 80's and early 90's...when the future of jocks started dimming. The problems you speak of sound like back in the 70's when you had so-called "Boss Jocks" and others of that ilk.

I had only one problem with a Specs 'prima donna'. She was a "calorically challenged" weekend board op who demanded to the GM why an outsider (me) was hired as Operations Manager over her. She was an intern, not a paid employee, and had only been at the station for probably less than two months. The GM gently but firmly told her she had to learn to crawl before she walked.

But she was the exception, rather than the norm.

I stand by my earlier statement that the kids from colleges that have a highly developed radio and TV program do a far better job than college students who get their experience from their campus station that is little more than an ego-tripping outlet for programs that most people could care less about.