FCC RECORDS ON TWO RADIO STATIONS IS DEFINITELY WRONG

[towernews]

I still continue to say that some of the FCC Records on some radio stations may be wrong, because I want to point out two examples where this is occuring. The FCC records state that WGYM AM 1580 is supposed to be operating at 1000 watts during the day. Instead, they are only operating at only 10 watts during the day permanently all the time 24 hrs. a day. Another example is WVLT FM 92.1. The FCC records state that this station is operating at 6,000 watts 24 hrs. a day. This is definitely not true at all. WVLT is only operating at 4,000 watts 24hrs. a day. When I was at their studio their engineer told me this. So I don't know where some of you come off thinking that the FCC records are always right and accurate. Believe me they are not. The examples I just pointed out are true facts. The FCC will not look into these records because they simply don't care. I just wanted to get this off my chest. Whether you want to believe me or not it is the absolute truth!

 

[w9wi]

The FCC records reflect what's on the license.

WGYM holds Special Temporary Authority to operate at 25 watts during the day. (not 10) It is very common for these "STA"s to not appear in the database.

They're supposed to reduce to their ordinarily-licensed 6 watts at night. It's not in the least unusual for stations to ignore that requirement... but of course, stations don't tell the FCC when they operate at 400% of authorized power, and of course if the FCC doesn't know about it, it doesn't appear in the database!


I don't see any STA for WVLT. However, as I mentioned above, it's not unusual for a STA to not show up. And again, it's not at all unheardof for stations to operate at power levels different from what's on their license. (a lot rarer for FM stations, but not unheardof)

 

[Goat Rodeo Cowboy]

There are letters and telegrams that go back and forth between stations and the FCC that don't end up in the on-line records you and I can see. In the CDBS screens on the internet, there is a place to click if you want to see "correspondence". Seldom is anything listed there.

A lot of stations that show up on the FCC records (their license) as being daytime only, have a letter hanging on the wall at the transmitter where a number of years ago the FCC notified tons of them that they were authorized to operate at night with a (much) reduced power. But those letters do not show up in the "Official" online records.

I was told by someone that if you have such a letter, be sure a make a copy or two and store them somewhere. If your station were to have a fire or be blown away by a tornado, and your letter comes up missing, you are out of luck once you rebuild. The FCC apparently didn't keep a copy of many of these letters in their permanent files.

Why the "bee in your bonnet" over this issue anyway?

 

[DaveWilliams]

WVLT probably is running 4000 watts TPO and with their antenna height and number of bays, the ERP is 6000 watts. I've worked at many FM stations where the transmitter output was way way less then their licensed power. case in point was when I was involved with the rebuilding of 92.9 in Dillon SC. The transmitter output was 44000 watts but the power was listed as 100000 watts, using 7 bays at 1800 feet.
The National Radio Club publishes a listing weekly syhowing stations operating on STA's, usually giving a reason why their on it. Some STAs have been around for years.

 

[BarryATL]

99% of the time, the FCC records are right. Now they are right in the way they are organized. That does not mean they are user friendly. Every once in awhile the online records are wrong.

Example: WGUN in Atlanta (just changed to WTZA) was supposed to be operating at 50kw daytime and 10kw critical hours. For years and years the online database read that the station was 50kw daytime with no critical hours listed.

At the top of the search page there is an email address to write to if you find errors. There is a separate person for each database (AM, FM, TV). I have found other minor errors they have corrected. Just make sure you really understand the database before you start reporting errors.

Oh... Some AM daytime stations were issued PSA (pre-sunrise authourity) in the 1970s. This was before the flea power notices came out in the late 80s. Usually, that PSA was for 500 watts from 6AM to local sunrise. The FCC originals of those were lost in an FCC fire. Goat Rodeo Cowboy is right. If a station loses the piece of paper, they lose the PSA authority because the FCC has no record of it.

 

[w9wi]

WVLT probably is running 4000 watts TPO and with their antenna height and number of bays, the ERP is 6000 watts. I've worked at many FM stations where the transmitter output was way way less then their licensed power. case in point was when I was involved with the rebuilding of 92.9 in Dillon SC. The transmitter output was 44000 watts but the power was listed as 100000 watts, using 7 bays at 1800 feet.
The National Radio Club publishes a listing weekly syhowing stations operating on STA's, usually giving a reason why their on it. Some STAs have been around for years.

The last license application I see in CDBS lists the TPO as 5.35kw. However, don't I recall properly that non-directional stations are allowed to change their transmitter & antenna (and thus TPO) at will as long as the combination continues to achieve the same ERP? So you could well be right, that WVLT is running 4kw TPO. TPO is of course usually less than ERP.

Yes, the NRC STA listings are very informative! They are of course only applicable to AM stations.

(for the info of non-NRC-members... National Radio Club is an organization interested in the unusual long-distance reception of AM stations. The club keeps close track of FCC proceedings involving AM stations, as it's a lot easier to know what you're pulling out of the noise if you know what the FCC believes is authorized! The NRC is however an AM organization, it is not particularly interested in FM stations. There are other groups for that.)

 

[rtetro]

I know of a daytime station that was inspected by the FCC recently and told that their Post-sunset power was too high...according to the inspector's records. The station authorization/license, however, said they were running right where they should be. They were cited for overpower operation until.....
A few weeks later the "OOPS! letter" came.
The commission found that their own records were wrong and that the station authorization was indeed correct.

 

[BarryATL]

I know of a daytime station that was inspected by the FCC recently and told that their Post-sunset power was too high...according to the inspector's records. The station authorization/license, however, said they were running right where they should be. They were cited for overpower operation until.....
A few weeks later the "OOPS! letter" came.
The commission found that their own records were wrong and that the station authorization was indeed correct.

I am just proud that an FCC inspector is looking at more than just the public file. Not to be snippy, but lately, it seems all of the fines nowadays are paperwork related and have nothing to do with how the station operates the transmitter. It used to be the other way around... fines were about operations (tower lights, power levels, independent frequency checks, etc).

 

[JerseyShor]

It happens.

The directional pattern for WMGM-FM has the null in the wrong place (it protects WNNJ to the North-West; FCC website shows the null as being to the North-East)

 

[KyleSmith1988]

The directional pattern for WMGM-FM has the null in the wrong place (it protects WNNJ to the North-West; FCC website shows the null as being to the North-East)

Seem more like they're protecting 103.5 WKTU which makes more sense.
WMGM should be protecting WXCY, which is much closer (Class B), than WNNJ (Class B1).

 

[DaveWilliams]

WXCY protects WMGM, no protecting to WXCY from WMGM. I was there when they went up to 50kw and saw the antenna go in and how it had to be set to get the protecting.

 

[tom]

I put the WMGM tower and directional antenna up. It does indeed protect Newton, NJ -
they wouldn't sign a reciprocal agreement. Havre de Grace, MD on the other hand,
has a "mutual interference" agreement with WMGM which lets both go to 50 KW.
The reason WXCY had to pull back was probably because they moved closer to WMGM,
which wasn't allowed in the agreement.

 

[joshzz]

Stations often run with multi-bay antennas to reduce their electric bills. The effective ERP for WVLT is still 6,000 watts but because of their antenna arrangement they can run at reduced electricity yet still have the same coverage.

 

[Neal]

I have to laugh at this.. The FCC Records (database) is really messed up.
Several weeks ago I get a call from the Philly Office. That one of my stations was running too much power.
Impossible I told them, and set up to meet them at the site a few hours later. As I was in Northern NJ at the time.
I got there 30 Mins early and discovered a PA Module was out running at 75% power. I replaced the Module, back unto Full Power..
Needless to say They arrive. and say Im running too much power the base Current was at 12.8 amps….. They Pull out the copy of the license, and show Me..
Its supposed to be 11.6 amps ,I tell them they are wrong as I hand them the Current license which says 12.8 amps..
There was work done on the tower, and had been relicensed for the New Impedance , and base current..
After they did field measurments. They came back wondering why the Readings they Just took were higher than they were this morning?
I said.. Yes and they should be explaining that the transmitter had a PA module fault, and was running at reduced power by default , and that I Fixed it.
what was Odd was they could not Find the new Current License before arriving at the site. The Copy I gave them I actually downloaded from the FCC site so go figure..
I do not mind FCC inspections when I know Im running within Legal specs…
It upsets me that One hand Does not know what the other is doing within the organization that Regulates
waste of my time,fuel, and Theirs. But we actually made a nice day of It. and we all learned something From the experience .

99% of the time, the FCC records are right. Now they are right in the way they are organized. That does not mean they are user friendly. Every once in awhile the online records are wrong.

Example: WGUN in Atlanta (just changed to WTZA) was supposed to be operating at 50kw daytime and 10kw critical hours. For years and years the online database read that the station was 50kw daytime with no critical hours listed.

At the top of the search page there is an email address to write to if you find errors. There is a separate person for each database (AM, FM, TV). I have found other minor errors they have corrected. Just make sure you really understand the database before you start reporting errors.

Oh... Some AM daytime stations were issued PSA (pre-sunrise authourity) in the 1970s. This was before the flea power notices came out in the late 80s. Usually, that PSA was for 500 watts from 6AM to local sunrise. The FCC originals of those were lost in an FCC fire. Goat Rodeo Cowboy is right. If a station loses the piece of paper, they lose the PSA authority because the FCC has no record of it.