FM Talk: The Comin' Thing?

[jimwalsh2001]

Some folks in the industry, including Holland Cooke and Phil Boyce, believe we're on the brink of seeing an explosion of FM stations going all-talk, in response to the royalty fee flap and other factors.

Is FM Talk the comin' thing? I hope it is, but I do have some concerns:

* Does this bode well for "live 'n' local" hosts, or will it just be more syndication...

* Will this mean new and/or fresh varieties of spoken-word programming, or just more of the same ol' Angry-White-Republican stuff...

* Given the "quick turnaround" mentality of the biz these days, will the industry give it time to work (note how fast everyone bailed on "Free FM" - ill-conceived as it was)...


You now have my permission to discuss...

 

[cm454]

FM talk needs to be issue-oriented talk with a less predictable, more energetic approach. Not T&A talk. Not agenda driven.

FM is where the younger crowd is---and they like interesting conversation too. Most young people won't even give traditional talk a listen, as it's reputation precedes it.

 

[kinetic]

FM talk needs to be issue-oriented talk with a less predictable, more energetic approach.

What does that mean? Ninety percent of what's on talk radio is issued oriented, albeit through the prism of a partisan lean (or more likely, extreme). Do you mean that kind of issue-oriented, people who actually have dialogue with listeners, or something else? What operation will pay to stock the talent, and if they can simulcast their AMs and increase ratings, why should they?

 

[livingfruitvirus]

Do they mean FM talk as in traditional AM talk on FM? Like WPGB 104.7 FM in Pittsburgh? I could certainly see that. No company is brave enough right now to try out an edgier hot talk format.

 

[Rusty Muck]

I would think that they are talking about traditional talk... and not the FreeFM nuclear disaster.

However, another good example of an AM-style FM talker is WNIR/Kent-Akron. Holding a talk format since the early 80s', they are live and local all day long (5:30am-11pm) and most of the weekends (6am-10pm), with an airstaff that's been astoundingly stable. Local ownership with frugal settings that make them look good in this economy... oh... wait. Maybe WNIR is an anomoly.

 

[dinosaur]

FM talk is definitely coming because talk...one-to-one activating communication...is what radio does best. A lot better than playing the first of three-thousand in a row,

Talk can be viable financially for a company, provided their debt service isn't so far past Jupiter that they can't afford to do anything right.

Talk on FM will not necessarily be like anything you're hearing now. Most of us automatically think news-talk, sports talk or Opie and Anthony. (listen to 'em all.) It could be anything.

What will hinder its progress: Thirty years of basically doing the same things over and over again. Thirty years of programming to diaries, not to people. Lack of good talent development. And that's not just a knock on radio in particular, but society in general. Are we talking to each other now? No. We leave text messages. (A 20-something who worked for me a year or so ago said texting was the best way to dump a girl friend.) We don't really talk! It will take some work to overcome this. It kills me to seem to knock an industry I spent a lifetime in, but how many people today can actually open a mic and say something worth listening to?

How would I do FM talk? Depends on the market, but I'd try like crazy to make daytimes 100% local with talented communicators. (Not 100% with local talent. "local talent" is often a catch-phrase for board ops allowed to talk.) I'd get talk host wannabes to do podcasts on my website and use that as my farm team. Good wannabes may get evening or weekend try-outs. And of course I'd have to find a PD who knew what I wanted.

I don't think this model would appeal to a publicly-held company. Too much cost, not enough ROI...maybe. Not saying it can't make money, but for some companies, the cost would keep it from hitting cash flow targets. There's a difference between making money and making the money the company needs and the money the company wants. Still, maybe if I were a program syndicator, I might pick up a station or two and use them as farm teams.

 

[Parttimer]

Hot Talk on FM has almost never worked without Howard Stern in the morning, and obviously that's no longer an option. One of the few remaining viable outlets is WTKS/Orlando, but they are on shaky ground with issues including the recent arrest of their midday host.

For the most part I see companies just picking up their existing AM properties and moving them to an FM... I think KIRO in Seattle just did that, although it's a simulcast at the moment. Then the AMs spiral into the abyss of brokered radio.

 

[livingfruitvirus]

Hot Talk on FM has almost never worked without Howard Stern in the morning, and obviously that's no longer an option. One of the few remaining viable outlets is WTKS/Orlando, but they are on shaky ground with issues including the recent arrest of their midday host.

The thing with hot talk is I do believe it could work, but with consolidated radio the way it is today, hot talk is one of the least turn-key operations in radio, which is what some of these companies are trying to turn radio into. Hot talk requires taking risks with content, and treading on offending groups of people for laughs, which radio clearly has no interest in doing. It takes patience and work, and can result in a large payoff if you manage to reel in young dedicated listeners, but today's radio execs aren't willing to put in the work it takes to build a good hot talk station when they could easily put something like an AC format.

 

[smedge2006]

FM talk will be the same as AM talk -- right-wing and syndicated -- because it is all radio companies can afford to do, all they know how to do, and all they want to do.

 

[Signal_Faded]

While I am firm believer in FM Talk I am growing tired of hearing that it's about to 'explode.' I have been hearing that from talking heads on panels for years. Do you remember when the next big things was FM Talk targeted towards female listeners? Outside of Minneapolis and Charlotte there aren't too many stations that have succeeded in female geared talk.

I believe that FM Talk will be exactly what AM talk is with maybe a bit more lifestyle talk mixed in.

The recent launches in Fresno and Tyler Texas are examples of ownership seeing the value of talk programming on the FM side and leveraging an existing talk brand in the market to do so.

 

[DToTheJ]

For the most part I see companies just picking up their existing AM properties and moving them to an FM... I think KIRO in Seattle just did that, although it's a simulcast at the moment. Then the AMs spiral into the abyss of brokered radio.

FYI KIRO 710 in Seattle is now ESPN Radio.

 

[Parttimer]

I knew the old AM content was moving to FM, and I heard Colin Cowherd say he was now on in Seattle, so that all adds up....

 

[Leebo65]

How about Lectures from Universities/Colleges

Just record lectures, guest speakers from the Universities and Colleges on stuff like history, science, art...etc Then broadcast them on FM. That way people can get smarter listening to the radio.

 

[willcail]

FM Sports Talk have better chance in growth than issue-political talk FM stations. There are only two that are doing just fine WXXM 92.1 The Mic and KTLK 100.3 FM.

There are only two Talk FM stations in Columbus. WLZT HD2 93.3 FM, an simulcast of WTVN AM and WTDA 103.9 FM that went to a 1.7 share back down to 0.5 share. Guessing the near Talk Radio Network Lineup isn't doing that well for WTDA. Then having Mancow and Micheal "Weiner" Savage doesn't help.

 

[OhioMediaWatch]

The "cheap, immediate solution" for most large groups will be directly planting current AM "issues"/political stations onto FM, or creating new ones in that mold.

Clear Channel has had great success with WPGB down in Pittsburgh. It came out of nowhere, and is now a solid talker up against CBS powerhouse KDKA/1020...with younger demos.

How'd they do it?

Not necessarily Rush, really. (I seem to recall that WPGB actually got higher ratings - at first, at least - with its original 12-3 host, Cox/Dial Global/WSB's Neal Boortz! Rush's ratings did improve after he moved to WPGB.)

Basically? It was Jim Quinn, who moved his top-rated morning drive talk show ("Quinn and Rose") over from rocker WRRK. If you pull Quinn and Rush from WPGB, it falls apart, and doesn't provide the ratings support for Hannity in PMD, the sports talk show after Hannity or anything else. WPGB also added Pirates baseball.

It's probably the textbook example of how to mount a new FM (or any, really) talk station of a political bent.

CC has tried a similar move in Minneapolis (KTLK/100.3), but had no local, high-rated morning drive equivalent of Quinn.

No matter...with that company's push towards even more national/syndicated programming, with the questions about music formats and royalty costs, a hundred WPGB/KTLK clones will grow in the next year. And where they're not mounting an FM talk format out of scratch, they'll simulcast or move others.

Well, maybe not here, yet...it seems kind of silly to simulcast 50,000 watt flamethrower WTAM/1100 on FM. Maybe when John Lanigan finally calls it a career on the classic hits station.

CC's talker down in Akron simulcasts on HD2 of one of the local rock stations (WRQK/106.9 Canton). Does "Rock 106.9" go away if music royalty issues pop up, making 106.9 "WHLO-FM"? It was actually a sister to WHLO/640 at one point, long before Clear Channel took over, but it was beautiful music WHLQ before taking rock for the first time as WOOS...

And then there's the local FM-AM-style talk station Nathan mentioned...WNIR/100.1 "The Talk of Akron". Though it's really skewed older in recent years, it has been #1 dozens of times since 1981, and is pretty much always in the top 3 in its home market (and gets good ratings down in Canton, too).

I'm not sure how listeners outside Northeast Ohio (or really, specifically, Akron) would take it, but you can visit their website to listen to it...they've been streaming since January.

 

[OhioMediaWatch]

Oh, and I know I am not alone on this...

But somewhere, someone will crack the code of how to mount a "different" talk station that isn't one of those AM-clone political talkers (right or left-leaning), and that appeals to a broader audience without T&A talk or insulting intelligence of the listener (or assuming they're holding a beer while looking at pictures of scantily clad women while listening).

But that's all I'm gonna give up here.

 

[cm454]

FM talk needs to be issue-oriented talk with a less predictable, more energetic approach.

What does that mean? Ninety percent of what's on talk radio is issued oriented, albeit through the prism of a partisan lean (or more likely, extreme). Do you mean that kind of issue-oriented, people who actually have dialogue with listeners, or something else? What operation will pay to stock the talent, and if they can simulcast their AMs and increase ratings, why should they?

I wrote two short paragraphs. You highlighted the second, but apparently ignored the first, which partially addressed your question.

Yes, I am talking about issue-oriented talk that isn't based on some transparent partisan double standard. People talking to people about what's going on in the world---all for the purpose of entertainment.

Get your head out of radio for 2 seconds. THINK: Most people you know talk periodically about the hot issues of the day. My guess is MOST of them don't approach every situation with a Limbaughesque mentality. Most people I know aren't trying to pander to a niche---they just speak from the heart, and those opinions rarely all fit neatly into one specific political ideology.

That's life, and it's about time talkradio reflects it.

 

[gr8oldies]

There are a lot of talk show hosts, but not a lot of good talk show hosts. There's be no problem filling slots on additional talk stations...making them successful would be a big issue

 

[jimwalsh2001]

I understand both San Antonio and Louisville have FMs about to flip. Details, anyone?

 

[Speaker of Truth]

Sports Talk will work but only if you have major franchises on your air..WEEI in Boston is a prime example with the Red Sox and Celtics..you can fill daytime hours with Rome or Dan Patrick, but you MUST have a solid morning show with talent the audience knows and respects..and you must give them latitude to discuss things OTHER than sports..

As far as trying to build a franchise, no one has mentioned Dr Drew and Love Line, which I would run at night..you can run a psychic during the day..hell watch the phones light up on music stations when they come on..a lot of CHRs do this now..

You can find people who can do talk, but it takes a real passion to do it well..I've been thrown behind the mic where I am now and I can tell you it takes two hours of prep for every hour you are actually on the air..just trying to wing it can't be done..

You can find lawyers who can discuss legal issues, and have a show that can generate a ton of phones..you can Veternarian shows on weekends..or you can sit in your office and see what sticks when you throw it against the wall..