Ford Slams HD Radio Inclusion Proposal

[KB1OKL]

November 24, 2008 (10:37 am) Tyler Savery

In an interesting move, Ford Motor Company has come out against a proposed rule that would require all satellite receivers to include HD radio capabilities. The position Ford is taking is interesting because Ford was one of the first major auto makers to announce a deal with HD Radio for installations of HD technology their cars.

more at:

http://siriusbuzz.com/ford-slams-hd-radio-inclusion-proposal.php

 

[JH_Radio]

Did anyone read the letter written by Ford to the FCC regarding this?
I quote:
"Although HD
radio is becoming increasingly well-established in the audio entertainment marketplace, it
continues to be an evolving technology."
Woah, hold up a second here... Although HD
radio is becoming increasingly well-established in the audio entertainment marketplace... Come again? Dad didn't even know what HD radio even was, until I (The geeky one) pointed it out to him. No, HD Radio isn't well known, and my thinking is that ford missrepresented IBiquity by stateing this fact.
John
Bensalem, PA

 

[Carmine5]

And Ford Motor Company is still listed as an investor in iBiquity, in fact, they're the only car company on the list.

http://www.ibiquity.com/about_us/investor_information

Perhaps Ford has a sweeter deal with Sirius/XM going and has written off HD Radio and their investment with iBiquity.

C5

 

[KB1OKL]

And Ford Motor Company is still listed as an investor in iBiquity, in fact, they're the only car company on the list.

http://www.ibiquity.com/about_us/investor_information

Perhaps Ford has a sweeter deal with Sirius/XM going and has written off HD Radio and their investment with iBiquity.

C5

Yeah, maybe reality is starting to rear it's head at Ford. They own Volvo I believe who is making them standard and also have iBlock as an option in some select Fords.

 

[Savage]

"Increasingly well established....continues to be an evolving technology."

That's a little like, "increasingly Democrat, but showing pronounced Republican tendencies."

Talk about corporate double-speak! Obviously the press release writer had a previous career at a pretzel company.

If you read between the lines, "evolving technology" = "half-baked" in Ford's view.

 

[clouseau]

"Increasingly well established....continues to be an evolving technology."

If you read between the lines, "evolving technology" = "half-baked" in Ford's view.

Or if you looked at it in what some would say is a more objective light, it MIGHT mean HD is starting to become well established and the technology is evolving. As in "More radios out there very day" & "Power increase coming" and "chipset quality improving".

Since the hrydrogen fuel cell "continues to be an evolving technology" I guess we might as well put that in the "half-baked" column as well.

Clouseau

 

[Savage]

If a press release about hydrogen fuel-cell technology (currently being worked on very successfully by GM at its nearby Honeoye Falls research facility BTW) contained similar conflicting language and was presented in the same context, I'd have to agree with you.

It doesn't. So I don't.

Ahh, Inspector.....always The Sentinel Of Objectivity here on the opinion message boards. (Somehow I missed the references by Ford to "more radios out there (e)very day," "power increase (and more interference) coming," and "chipset quality improving" (IOW, you'll only need DOUBLE ought cables to your iPod instead of QUAD ought. And cooling requirements have been halved from 1000 BTU to 500!)

Just curious, Clouseau - when you're trying to parse the meaning of a Ford press release on HD, does "objectivity" generally include inserting nonexistent statements (see above) into the language? So that's the way to provide clarity, eh?

 

[clouseau]

If a press release about hydrogen fuel-cell technology (currently being worked on very successfully by GM at its nearby Honeoye Falls research facility BTW) contained similar conflicting language and was presented in the same context, I'd have to agree with you.

Ahh yes. Here in "Olby World", letters to the FCC & articles written in a competing technology advocacy sheet become 'press releases'. Or at least equated to them. I just have to ask.

DIdi you read the FCC letter? I'll confess until this post, I didn't. I responded strictly to you. However I now have read it all (I think). What conflicting language? And frankly, what context? This is a letter written to stave off regulation. Nothing more. The more I read of some of the postings here, the more I have to wonder about the level of absolute myopia re HD radio.

Ahh, Inspector.....always The Sentinel Of Objectivity here on the opinion message boards.

Now THAT'S Funny.

(Somehow I missed the references by Ford to "more radios out there (e)very day," "power increase (and more interference) coming," and "chipset quality improving"

I believe if you reread the letter to the FCC, it's right next to "Half-Baked"

Just curious, Clouseau - when you're trying to parse the meaning of a Ford press release on HD, does "objectivity" generally include inserting nonexistent statements (see above) into the language? So that's the way to provide clarity, eh?

No, I guess it isn't. I actually wish I had started my post with a phrase like..."Or if you looked at it in what some would say is a more objective light, it MIGHT mean...". Oh wait. Never mind. I did.

I was searching for the place where anything in either the article or the letter to the FCC even remotely alluded to "Half-baked". Unfortunatly, I don't seem to possess an Anti-HD mob dictionary. Darn. The letter, as I read it said... Ford thinks they do a good job providing in car entertainment already - and Satellite charges a subscription and therefore has a hard time already - and HD might stop trying to improve if they had a free ride in sat radios - and if you make us do it radios will cost more whether a car buy wants the feature or not and this isn't a problem so leave us alone.

Do you see anything else? Smoking guns? Dead Bodies? Struble suicide notes?

Clouseau

 

[landtuna]

Three situations are likely to affect the installation of standard (non-optional) HD-capable radio's in Big Three vehicles:

1. The automakers don't receive bail-out funds from the gubmint and thereby cannot upgrade any standard offerings.

2. The automakers receive bail-out funds, and needed oversight, from the gubmint and the overseers don't allow any profit-killing upgrades.

3. The automakers receive bail-out funds, but without oversight (or, more likely, with oversight by industry insiders with investment in iBiquity) and the go-ahead is given to install HD radios as a standard offering (and probably at increased cost). This is the most likely result of getting the gubmint involved in commercial venture.

Given the current reception issues in mobile HD applications however it will likely result in similar listenership to the current AM band. And automakers would be flooded with complaints and support costs.

 

[KB1OKL]

"Increasingly well established....continues to be an evolving technology."

If you read between the lines, "evolving technology" = "half-baked" in Ford's view.

Or if you looked at it in what some would say is a more objective light, it MIGHT mean HD is starting to become well established and the technology is evolving. As in "More radios out there very day" & "Power increase coming" and "chipset quality improving".

Since the hrydrogen fuel cell "continues to be an evolving technology" I guess we might as well put that in the "half-baked" column as well.

Clouseau

There is a need for the hydrogen cell (or any low pollution fuel source) but it hasn't been inflicted on the public in an unfinished or a technologically under performing form.

The exact opposite in both instances can be said of HD, hence: half baked, There is no need, and a technology which doesn't work well at all has been almost forcibly shoved down the consumers throat which hasn't bitten much to the consumer's credit.

 

[KB1OKL]

Three situations are likely to affect the installation of standard (non-optional) HD-capable radio's in Big Three vehicles:

1. The automakers don't receive bail-out funds from the gubmint and thereby cannot upgrade any standard offerings.

2. The automakers receive bail-out funds, and needed oversight, from the gubmint and the overseers don't allow any profit-killing upgrades.

3. The automakers receive bail-out funds, but without oversight (or, more likely, with oversight by industry insiders with investment in iBiquity) and the go-ahead is given to install HD radios as a standard offering (and probably at increased cost). This is the most likely result of getting the gubmint involved in commercial venture.

Given the current reception issues in mobile HD applications however it will likely result in similar listenership to the current AM band. And automakers would be flooded with complaints and support costs.

Yes, the government has pretty much proven that they don't have to a clue about the heartbreak of IBOC so far.

 

[pocket-radio]

Hello, the big three are selling satellite radios. It’s a hot commodity and probably comes with nice built in profit margins or kickbacks. The car guys don’t make money selling new cars anymore, it’s all the added on stuff.

Unless iBiquity is willing to giveaway their technology, a mandate to included HD in Satellite receivers would increase price points and or cut their profit margins too.

Stand-alone satellite radios sell, while HD doesn’t.

Its no wonder Ford is against this idea it’s just plain stupid and will cost them money.

Read between the lines.

 

[dumber than a box of hair]

Hello, the big three are selling satellite radios. It’s a hot commodity and probably comes with nice built in profit margins or kickbacks. The car guys don’t make money selling new cars anymore, it’s all the added on stuff.

Unless iBiquity is willing to giveaway their technology, a mandate to included HD in Satellite receivers would increase price points and or cut their profit margins too.

Stand-alone satellite radios sell, while HD doesn’t.

Its no wonder Ford is against this idea it’s just plain stupid and will cost them money.

Read between the lines.

I'm kinda surprised that no one has mentioned the worst-kept secret re this topic: the fact that Sirius-XM spiffs the car manufacturers to include satellite radios in the dash of virtually every make of car. The reason why iBiquity is trying to get the government to do their dirty work for them is that they want a piece of those dashboards too, but aren't willing to pay for it.

Sounds to me like the free market at work.

 

[clouseau]

Since the hrydrogen fuel cell "continues to be an evolving technology" I guess we might as well put that in the "half-baked" column as well.

Clouseau

There is a need for the hydrogen cell (or any low pollution fuel source) but it hasn't been inflicted on the public in an unfinished or a technologically under performing form.

Glad to hear you haven't heard of CAFE standards in Mass. Back to radio, no Government has inflicted anything on you, Victim KB. The Gov't has authorized what the radio industry wanted. If you don't like it, turn off the station. Or write your congressman. <sarcasm=on> Or wrap your Meduci in in tin foil. <sarcasm = off> Now your analog antenna TV? THAT'S another story. That bad boy is a doorstop without a converter box. Honestly. Have you had to toss any analog radios because of HD?

The exact opposite in both instances can be said of HD, hence: half baked,

Mr "I bought an AM only tuner" speaks. Please please please.... KB, please learn enough about the business to know tha you and I are already out of any radio targeted audience. What MAY matter to us isn't necessarilty important to the audience or visa-versa. I'll not state this as fact. Just as something to ponder... Maybe YOU, who buys an AM only tuner, is NOT who needs to listen to make radio work.

There is no need,

I won't even ask how you would claim to be able to make that statement. I sure as heck wouldn't be claim to be qualified to make it, and I'll bet I've got a tad more radio experience than you. But please... Go on.

and a technology which doesn't work well at all has been almost forcibly shoved down the consumers throat

It's funny. You post that you can't get HD at your QTH elsewhere on this and other forums and lists. But claim it's "Shoved down your throat" here. As I have said dozens of times before. Pick a complaint and go with it.

But I'm with ya KB. The fact that most people don't even know HD radio exists be damned, it's "Shoved down their throats" It's Olbyworld, folks. Half baked system? How about half baked assessment of reality?

I'm telling you HD radio should be banned. It make some normally intelligent people CRAZY!

Clouseau

 

[KB1OKL]

Since the hrydrogen fuel cell "continues to be an evolving technology" I guess we might as well put that in the "half-baked" column as well.

Clouseau

There is a need for the hydrogen cell (or any low pollution fuel source) but it hasn't been inflicted on the public in an unfinished or a technologically under performing form.

Glad to hear you haven't heard of CAFE standards in Mass. Back to radio, no Government has inflicted anything on you, Victim KB. The Gov't has authorized what the radio industry wanted. If you don't like it, turn off the station. Or write your congressman. <sarcasm=on> Or wrap your Meduci in in tin foil. <sarcasm = off> Now your analog antenna TV? THAT'S another story. That bad boy is a doorstop without a converter box. Honestly. Have you had to toss any analog radios because of HD?

The exact opposite in both instances can be said of HD, hence: half baked,

Mr "I bought an AM only tuner" speaks. Please please please.... KB, please learn enough about the business to know tha you and I are already out of any radio targeted audience. What MAY matter to us isn't necessarilty important to the audience or visa-versa. I'll not state this as fact. Just as something to ponder... Maybe YOU, who buys an AM only tuner, is NOT who needs to listen to make radio work.

There is no need,

I won't even ask how you would claim to be able to make that statement. I sure as heck wouldn't be claim to be qualified to make it, and I'll bet I've got a tad more radio experience than you. But please... Go on.

and a technology which doesn't work well at all has been almost forcibly shoved down the consumers throat

It's funny. You post that you can't get HD at your QTH elsewhere on this and other forums and lists. But claim it's "Shoved down your throat" here. As I have said dozens of times before. Pick a complaint and go with it.

But I'm with ya KB. The fact that most people don't even know HD radio exists be damned, it's "Shoved down their throats" It's Olbyworld, folks. Half baked system? How about half baked assessment of reality?

I'm telling you HD radio should be banned. It make some normally intelligent people CRAZY!

Clouseau

Cranky again, huh Inspector? You can spout off all you want, but you know as well as I do that iBlock is a year or two away from it's eventual home: the Salvation Army right next to 80's Realistic tuners and Magnavox analog TV's. HD radio will be remembered with the same reverence held for Nixie tubes and 8 track players.
Incidentally I have a Sony High Definition TV, bought it two years ago, why? Because HD TV works, channel 5 doesn't cover channel 4 with snow and with Satellite I never worry about reception. My HD TV works great, my much ballyhooed Sony HD tuner doesn't, y punto.

 

[pocket-radio]

For every HD-Satellite hybrid radio ordered, manufactures like Ford are forced to pay iBquity’s little licensing scam, plus pay for iBquity's chip. Auto manufactures will then pass that added cost’s on to consumers, plus their markup too. I.e. driving up the cost to consumers and driving down Fords profits margins, and potentially killing the goose with golden eggs. Duh..

Ford isn't stupid: Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice and you can’t fool a fool.

 

[clouseau]

Cranky again, huh Inspector? You can spout off all you want, but you know as well as I do that iBlock is a year or two away from it's eventual home: the Salvation Army right next to 80's Realistic tuners and Magnavox analog TV's. HD radio will be remembered with the same reverence held for Nixie tubes and 8 track players.

Now HERE'S a pattern we've all seen before. Someone in the Ainti-gang posts something outlandish. Line by line it it summarily refuted as Anti-Gang Hyperbole. And then the response is "You're cranky" and You know HD will fail. Maybe it will and maybe it won't. PIcking any side now doesn't make one a sage. One side will ultimately be right and one wrong. Predicting now doesn't prove wisdom, IMHO. Back when we had mechanical clocks, even a broken one was right twice a day.

Incidentally I have a Sony High Definition TV, bought it two years ago, why? Because HD TV works, channel 5 doesn't cover channel 4 with snow and with Satellite I never worry about reception.

You point is noted, but you do know channel 4 is not next to channel 5 on the radio spectrum,IIRC, right?

My HD TV works great, my much ballyhooed Sony HD tuner doesn't, y punto.

You've been advised by multiple people elsewhere on this forum and other lists that your unit appears to be defective. That's OK, though. Mrs Clouseau advises me the oven no longer works. I'm with you. We're eating the turkey raw.

Have a good one.

Clouseau

 

[KB1OKL]

For every HD-Satellite hybrid radio ordered, manufactures like Ford are forced to pay iBquity’s little licensing scam, plus pay for iBquity's chip. Auto manufactures will then pass that added cost’s on to consumers, plus their markup too. I.e. driving up the cost to consumers and driving down Fords profits margins, and potentially killing the goose with golden eggs. Duh..

Ford isn't stupid: Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice and you can’t fool a fool.

I thought it ended with: and you won't get fooled again. ;D

 

[KB1OKL]

You've been advised by multiple people elsewhere on this forum and other lists that your unit appears to be defective. That's OK, though. Mrs Clouseau advises me the oven no longer works. I'm with you. We're eating the turkey raw.

Have a good one.

Clouseau

I'm going to try to exchange it, hopefully i still have the e-mail from the seller, WBZ not coming in doesn't surprise me, WTAG 580 with Towers in Holden, MA not coming in does, it puts in a pretty big signal here, a lot bigger than WBZ which doesn't.

 

[dumber than a box of hair]

For every HD-Satellite hybrid radio ordered, manufactures like Ford are forced to pay iBquity’s little licensing scam, plus pay for iBquity's chip. Auto manufactures will then pass that added cost’s on to consumers, plus their markup too. I.e. driving up the cost to consumers and driving down Fords profits margins, and potentially killing the goose with golden eggs. Duh..

Ford isn't stupid: Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice and you can’t fool a fool.

I thought it ended with: and you won't get fooled again. ;D

It's usually rendered as: "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."