FOX Turns 25

[Mario500]

I still wish WPMI-TV would affiliate with FOX again. I'm sure they would like the extra commercial time from being a FOX affiliate, but the owners of WALA-TV probably don't want to lose that advantage in spite of its history as an NBC station.

I believe fewer hours of local programming would help WALA-TV if they were to affiliate with NBC again. They would be limited to better syndicated programs and they would not have to be too concerned about ratings or paying for syndicated programs not many folks would want to watch or hear.

 

[firepoint525]

FOX was technically already on the air by virtue of the ill-fated "Late Show Starring Joan Rivers" that debuted in 1986.

Evidently, they no longer claim that. :

Do you blame them?

Not particularly, but doing so IS revisionist history.

 

[Nate Wesley]

... (WPMI is now with NBC, thanks to WALA-TV being a part of the 'Big Switch' affiliation shuffle.)

Indeed, it was the "big switch" of 1994 with New World Communications that really put the FOX television network on the map - right around the time they successfully bid for the NFC NFL package.
http://www.nytimes.com/1994/05/24/us/fox-will-sign-up-12-new-stations-takes-8-from-cbs.html

A funny anecdote specific to WALA: When it was sold to SF Broadcasting (a new company Fox provided start-up capital to) not long after the New World deal, WALA's general manager at the time was quoted by the [Mobile] Press-Register to the effect of 'You'll never see Bart Simpson on our station'.

By January 1996, everyone in Southwest Alabama/Northwest Florida was watching Bart Simpson on their station. ;D

 

[RadioDaze]

Is there a list somewhere of the original FOX affiliates from the sign-on 25 years ago? I remember my market's (Raleigh-Durham) original affiliate was WLFL-TV 22 in Raleigh, but I don't remember exactly when they became "Fox 22".

 

[azumanga]

In the Tampa Bay area, WTOG ch.44 was the first Fox affiliate; it returned to independence when Fox moved to WFTS ch.28 in 1988. And of course, in December 1994, the networks shuffled around, in which Fox ended up on longtime CBS affiliate WTVT ch.13, with CBS moving to WTSP ch.10 and ABC, long-associated with WTSP, moving to WFTS.

Miami also had a Fox shuffle of their own much earlier than that in 1989, when Fox moved from its charter affiliate, WCIX (WFOR), to WSVN, at the time the legacy NBC affiliate, with WTVJ getting the NBC affiliation -- NBC's acquisition of WTVJ was a contributor to that, and WSVN initially had shown ill will against NBC for doing so, especially since Fox was still a newbie back then.

In other parts of Florida, Fox stuck where they were since the network launched (on former indies WFTX Fort Myers, WOFL Orlando and WAWS Jacksonville), with two stations signing on with Fox in the early-1990s (WTLH Tallahassee and WPGX Panama City). WOGX Ocala did not pick up Fox right away, until around 1991 -- until then, that station was indy, and Fox was available only on cable from WOFL, WTOG / WFTS or WAWS, if the system carried those stations at all (Cox in Ocala carried WOFL and WTOG, but not in Gainesville, where there was no Fox until WOGX picked it up).

 

[onairb]

Since day one(night one, if you count Joan Rivers' talk show), the SF Bay Area Fox affiliate has been KTVU, channel 2. This is possibly the best channel position of any Fox affiliate.

 

[KeithE4]

Since day one(night one, if you count Joan Rivers' talk show), the SF Bay Area Fox affiliate has been KTVU, channel 2. This is possibly the best channel position of any Fox affiliate.

Detroit, St. Louis, and Albuquerque also have Fox on Channel 2.

 

[TVCOOL]

FOX is on channel 5 in NYC ,Atlanta & DC ,channel 11 in LA.

 

[arnoldevns]

There's a great book about the start of the Fox Network called "Outfoxed" by Alex Ben Block. It was long ago out of print, but if you can find it, it's a great read.

What I think most people don't realize about Fox now is how difficult it was to start this network and how close it came to closing up shop at one point. Murdoch lost more than $100 million on it before turning it around.

Fox has revolutionized network and sports television in many ways. Here's a little list just off the top of my head:
- broke the big 3 prime time monopoly. Others had tried to start a 4th network in the years since DuMont went away, but none had succeeded in making a dent in the ratings. Fox had the advantage in that there were finally enough stations out there to make it possible and being on a lot of UHF stations, while not ideal, was not the severe handicap it used to be.
- The "edgy" programming they started ("Married with Children", "The Simpsons" etc) with is now fairly common fare on most broadcast networks.
- brought cartoons back to prime time
- "The Simpsons" pushed "The Cosby Show" off the top of the ratings charts
- practically invented reality TV
- "America's Most Wanted" helped capture hundreds of criminals
- "American Idol" has changed the music industry by finding several stars from total unknowns.
- greatly expanded number of local stations doing news
- invented the practice of local stations branding with the network name. (Fox 4, NBC 5, CBS 11.. etc)
- invented the full time score bug for NFL games that's now common on all sports broadcasts

I'm sure there are others, but that's just what comes to mind off the top of my head.

I'll just say: Happy Birthday Fox! Very glad they're here.

 

[landtuna]

Fox has revolutionized network and sports television in many ways. Here's a little list just off the top of my head:

We can look at network TV as "before Fox" and "after Fox" and depending upon which timeline you use you can come up with very different analysis:

- broke the big 3 prime time monopoly.

Debatable. Fox officially began in October 1986 when there were already many cable channels competing for prime time viewing with the three major networks. It would be many years before Fox was able to turn network-type numbers competing in prime time OTA.

- The "edgy" programming they started ("Married with Children", "The Simpsons" etc) with is now fairly common fare on most broadcast networks.

This hits square on my main complaint on Fox programming. You can say "edgy". I say they "lowered the bar". Fox went after the teen and 20-something viewer who liked their humor written on restroom walls. They have become experts at presenting the same type of raunchy humor which has, because of competition, bled over into the more established network's programming. I equate Fox's programming to that of Playboy which established the market for soft porn in printed media. We no longer have significant drama which used to be a staple of network TV. Instead, we are served bottom-feeding pollution that represents the basest levels of intellectual development in the history of the medium.

- brought cartoons back to prime time

"Cartoons" never existed in prime time on network affiliates so there was nothing to "bring back". Cartoons have traditionally been created as youth-oriented comedy. What passes for "cartoons" in prime time these days is adult-oriented animation. To say it is intended as comedy depends upon your sense of humor but there is no way any thinking person would compare classic cartoons to the junk portrayed on "Family Man" for instance.

- "The Simpsons" pushed "The Cosby Show" off the top of the ratings charts

Is this an accomplishment or an eventual reality? Never one of my personal favorites "Cosby" was nevertheless one of the most popular programs in TV history. But as all popular programs do it eventually changed in character and in writing and was ready for replacement when "The Simpsons" came along. This is much more natural evolution than anything Fox intended (other than their pursuit of a specific age demo which was covered before).

- practically invented reality TV

You must be young if you don't remember early TV and the plethora of what we now call "reality" shows (although most are merely non-scripted and/or games and would not have been called "reality" in the old days). Fox did have at least one true reality offering - "COPS" but it did not create the genre.

- "America's Most Wanted" helped capture hundreds of criminals

True but the show was patterned after a similar series both in Germany and in the U.K. and was not original with Fox. It's popularity grew after John Walsh was selected to host taking advantage of his experience as a parent of a murdered child in Florida several years earlier.

- "American Idol" has changed the music industry by finding several stars from total unknowns.

Again, your youth is showing. Since the very early days of TV there have been numerous talent shows showcasing performers of all genre's. "American Idol" was simply the most recent and flashiest (and slowest) and was made popular by allowing viewers to cast votes (instead of a studio audience as in older shows). Given the current very poor state of popular music it is difficult to imagine that Idol has made a major contribution to the music industry other than to save it from complete destruction. Singing is not a rare talent. Singing and having weird hair and tattoos seem to be the current menu for success in the younger demos.

- greatly expanded number of local stations doing news

I'm unsure what you are crediting Fox for doing here as 20-25 years ago most stations had news offerings of some sort. Fox does not have an OTA news show on the level of the three majors. In addition, judging from my local Phoenix Fox station, whatever airs during their morning show is essentially identical to that offered at noon, dinnertime and bedtime. I would not call that an expansion of news capability. Not that the three majors do it any better, mind you.

- invented the practice of local stations branding with the network name. (Fox 4, NBC 5, CBS 11.. etc)

While I cannot disagree with this point I also don't understand what it brings to the table. I'm not going out on a limb by suggesting that the vast majority of TV viewers know the network affiliations of their OTA stations without being reminded. After all, the majority of us select shows to watch by show name and channel and not by network.

- invented the full time score bug for NFL games that's now common on all sports broadcasts

I'm not positive but I am pretty sure the bug was first used by ESPN2. And here I am talking about the scrolling scores displayed at the bottom of the screen and not the "flashing" bug which was in use during MLB games going back to the 60's (and perhaps earlier).

I'll just say: Happy Birthday Fox! Very glad they're here.

Not surprisingly we disagree here. I can truly say I would not miss Fox one iota should they go dark tomorrow. Some things you didn't cover but I have noticed is the decrease in quality of NASCAR races - the never-ending commercials (required by the extravagant broadcast rights), the endless pre-race babbling that adds nothing to the program and the "crank it up" nightclub-like antics during the broadcast. One reason I no longer watch the NFL are the Fox broadcasts and for many of the same reasons.

In summary, I see Fox leading the charge to mediocrity in TV broadcasting instead of the other way around. And that is probably related to my age as I can clearly remember the standards and programming of a more intelligent era before the bottom-feeding Fox came along programming to the lowest common denominator.

 

[KeithE4]

- "American Idol" has changed the music industry by finding several stars from total unknowns.

You can thank a guy named Edward Bowes for doing that, beginning in 1934. After all, what is the real difference between American Idol and Major Bowes', and later Ted Mack's, Original Amateur Hour, which spent 18 years on radio and another 23 on television - on all four networks? There were others as well, most notably one hosted by Arthur Godfrey.

BTW, one of the future stars discovered by Bowes was some guy named Sinatra. If anyone "changed the music industry," it was him. Pat Boone, Gladys Knight, Irene Cara, and Ann-Margaret were other unknowns that first garnered attention on the TV version of Amateur Hour.

There's nothing whatsoever original about American Idol. It's just another talent show, and they've been broadcast nationwide for almost 80 years.

 

[Mario500]

"Cartoons" never existed in prime time on network affiliates so there was nothing to "bring back". Cartoons have traditionally been created as youth-oriented comedy. What passes for "cartoons" in prime time these days is adult-oriented animation. To say it is intended as comedy depends upon your sense of humor but there is no way any thinking person would compare classic cartoons to the junk portrayed on "Family Man" for instance.

I'm amazed someone could make a statement ignoring the history of animated cartoons broadcast in prime time on network affiliates. As for cartoons being "youth-oriented comedy" traditionally, what did you mean? Last of all, I believe the program you were referencing in the last sentence above was "Family Guy".

 

[cowboybud]

"Cartoons" never existed in prime time on network affiliates

Flintstones? Jetsons? Wait Till Your Father Gets Home? Any number of Charlie Brown and Dr. Seuss specials?

 

[landtuna]

I'm amazed someone could make a statement ignoring the history of animated cartoons broadcast in prime time on network affiliates. As for cartoons being "youth-oriented comedy" traditionally, what did you mean? Last of all, I believe the program you were referencing in the last sentence above was "Family Guy".

I neglected to say so but I was referring to regularly scheduled programs, not seasonal one-timers like "It's The Great Pumpkin Charlie Brown" or "The Grinch Who Stole Christmas". Nor did I consider network movies even though they may be animated. I should have been more specific.

As for cartoons being primarily youth comedies - that is about as succinct as I can say it. When Walt Disney created "Steamboat Willie" in 1928 he created a moving picture form of what had been mostly adult fare in printed form. Until WWII changed familiar cartoon characters into propaganda the productions of the 30's were intended primarily as children's entertainment although they were usually shown proceeding theatrical movies for all audiences. When TV became common in the 50's the familiar Saturday morning cartoon shows and weekday afternoon after-school children's shows often featured cartoons. Growing up in the 50's I cannot remember a single occasion of a cartoon being shown in what would have then been prime time.

The animated junk that replaced cartoons, ostensibly for E/I purposes, is not to be confused with the quality productions of the 40's, 50's (and even the cheap animation of HannaBarbara in the 60's although technically they are also cartoons).

And yes, I did indeed mean "Family Guy". Thanks for the correction.

 

[landtuna]

Flintstones? Jetsons? Wait Till Your Father Gets Home? Any number of Charlie Brown and Dr. Seuss specials?

I don't recall The Flintstones or The Jetsons being shown during prime time on network TV. Indie stations may have done so but we weren't talking about them.

The specials I addressed in a previous post.

 

[Mario500]

^My copy of local TV listings from 1962 has "The Flinstones" scheduled for 7:30 PM (prime time) by the local ABC affiliate (WEAR-TV in Pensacola, Florida). During the same year, CBS was presenting "The Bugs Bunny Show" in prime time on a weekly basis.

 

[Toledo Eleven]

Flintstones? Jetsons? Wait Till Your Father Gets Home? Any number of Charlie Brown and Dr. Seuss specials?

I don't recall The Flintstones or The Jetsons being shown during prime time on network TV. Indie stations may have done so but we weren't talking about them.

The specials I addressed in a previous post.

ABC also had Top Cat, Bugs Bunny, Jonny Quest, Calvin & the Colonel, all in prime time, back in the '60s and NBC had The Famous Adventures of Mr. Magoo, on Saturday nights. I think Wait Till Your Father Gets Home was syndicated.

 

[landtuna]

^My copy of local TV listings from 1962 has "The Flinstones" scheduled for 7:30 PM (prime time) by the local ABC affiliate (WEAR-TV in Pensacola, Florida). During the same year, CBS was presenting "The Bugs Bunny Show" in prime time on a weekly basis.

Do you know if these shows were national or perhaps run by the affiliate independently?

I entered the navy in the summer of '62 so didn't watch TV for the ensuing four years but I was a big fan of Bugs Bunny and would have watched that show if it had been shown on channel 7 in S.F. during that time. The Flintstones I remember only from Saturday morning shows.

 

[onairb]

^My copy of local TV listings from 1962 has "The Flinstones" scheduled for 7:30 PM (prime time) by the local ABC affiliate (WEAR-TV in Pensacola, Florida). During the same year, CBS was presenting "The Bugs Bunny Show" in prime time on a weekly basis.

Do you know if these shows were national or perhaps run by the affiliate independently?

I entered the navy in the summer of '62 so didn't watch TV for the ensuing four years but I was a big fan of Bugs Bunny and would have watched that show if it had been shown on channel 7 in S.F. during that time. The Flintstones I remember only from Saturday morning shows.

'The Flintstones'(1960-1966) was the longest running prime-time network cartoon until 'The Simpsons'.
ABC aired 'Bugs Bunny' in prime time from 1960-62; it moved to CBS Saturday mornings later that year.(I live in SF, but don't know for certain if KGO cleared Bugs; I would assume that, being an O & O, they did.)
ABC also had 'The Jetsons', 'Jonny Quest', and 'Top Cat', on the air between '61 and '63. 'McKeever and the Colonel' was a short-lived NBC show in '62-'63, and even 'Mr. Magoo' had a prime time run somewhere in that timeframe.
And not forgetting Rocky and Bullwinkle(under various titles) ran from the late 50s through early-mid-60s in prime time, before moving to Saturday mornings.

 

[TVCOOL]

they had WWE programming at one point (i.e. WWE Superstars ,WWE Wrestling Challenge and for 1 year Saturday's Night Main EVent).