FULL SERVICE MOR

[jmtillery]

I'm always confused by this discussion. I'm 58 years old, three years out of any salable demographic, soon to be eight and you're talking about programming to my parents! Where's the return on investment?

I'm 50 and in less than 4-years I will fall outside of the 25 - 54 target demo. However, my idea is to target the 35 - 64 adult with news, information, weather, traffic, sports, business news, maybe a talk show in a select daypart and non-offensive music. Tell me what part of my outline is targetted towards your parents?

 

[jh]

This is a fascinating thread. Would you consider another type of music with this full-service format?

I was looking on the Arbitron site the other day, and found some interesting demo information. It's buried in a very long pdf file: http://www.arbitron.com/downloads/RadioToday_2010.pdf

According to Arbitron's national averages, there is one format that is either #1 or #2 in every demo from 18-24 to 65+, is #3 among teens, and is the favorite music format 55+. That tells me it's the closest thing to MOR's appeal back in the 60s or 70s.

The format is country. Would a full-service country format be worth considering? Not classic country, that has almost no appeal under 55 and not all that much over 55, but mainstream country.

 

[jmtillery]

This is a fascinating thread. Would you consider another type of music with this full-service format?

I was looking on the Arbitron site the other day, and found some interesting demo information. It's buried in a very long pdf file: http://www.arbitron.com/downloads/RadioToday_2010.pdf

According to Arbitron's national averages, there is one format that is either #1 or #2 in every demo from 18-24 to 65+, is #3 among teens, and is the favorite music format 55+. That tells me it's the closest thing to MOR's appeal back in the 60s or 70s.

The format is country. Would a full-service country format be worth considering? Not classic country, that has almost no appeal under 55 and not all that much over 55, but mainstream country.

Actually, although I did not include it in my original outline, I have considered a country blend with the MOR/Contemporary selctions. It would have to be a careful balance. I'm not sure if a total country music format would work well with full service; However, I won't say it would not have an appeal to the target demo. It may very well work.

 

[KE4KLS_Radio]

Mark, WSBB in New Smyrna Beach sounds similar to what you have described. I listen to this station quite a bit on-line. Local and national news, music, sports, live morning show, etc. You can hear them at: myam1230.com

 

[jmtillery]

Mark, WSBB in New Smyrna Beach sounds similar to what you have described. I listen to this station quite a bit on-line. Local and national news, music, sports, live morning show, etc. You can hear them at: myam1230.com

Thank you for the link. I'm listening now, and I have to agree, what I am hearing, so far, is very similar to what I have described. Interestingly I was general manager for a Daytona Beach radio station two years ago and I never listened to WSBB long enough to get a feel for what it was programming then. The last time I listened to WSBB it was oldies as Beach 1230. WROD, on the other hand, was updating its music to soft adult contemporary, but with very little news and information. WROD was mostly music. At age 22 I worked for WROD "on-air" when it was Music of Your Life with studios located on Wilder Boulevard right next to the Halifax River. Once again, thank you for the link.

 

[cd637299]

I think I will give this a listen (WSBB) when I get home.

Now....would any FM station go out on a limb and give this format a try?

Mr. Tillery---upon listening, how would you evaluate WSBB vis-a-vis WVLG?

cd

 

[jmtillery]

I think I will give this a listen (WSBB) when I get home.

Now....would any FM station go out on a limb and give this format a try?

Mr. Tillery---upon listening, how would you evaluate WSBB vis-a-vis WVLG?

cd

First of all call me Mark.

As for a comparison between WVLG and WSBB, there are similarities. My understanding is the former WVLG GM acquired WSBB so both stations shared the same management at different times. In contrast WVLG tends to have a more oldies/Top 40ish/classic hits sound whereas WSBB sounds more traditional MOR with lite contemporary hits in the mix. I also heard a promo for Gator sports on WSBB. I'm not sure what national news network WSBB is airing as I didn't hear one during the time I was listening. However, I believe WVLG is ABC/I, or at least it was at one time.

As for will a format of this type work on FM? ABSOLUTELY depending on the market. Just take a look at WDUV Tampa as an example although The Dove is music intensive with little or no news content. I believe The Dove is a perfect example of a large market station that would make an excellent Full Service FM radio station.

 

[MsMusicRadio]

WDUV in Tampa with personality and news. Cox would never make those changes in a million years

 

[KE4KLS_Radio]

WSBB carries CNN at the TOH.

 

[jh]

I'm always confused by this discussion. I'm 58 years old, three years out of any salable demographic, soon to be eight and you're talking about programming to my parents! Where's the return on investment?

I'm 50 and in less than 4-years I will fall outside of the 25 - 54 target demo. However, my idea is to target the 35 - 64 adult with news, information, weather, traffic, sports, business news, maybe a talk show in a select daypart and non-offensive music. Tell me what part of my outline is targetted towards your parents?

I'm 55, and had the same reaction as semoochie to the music sample given earlier. It's the music my parents, now in their 80s, listened to 30 years ago. Ray Conniff, Ferante & Teicher, Tony Bennett seem a little too old.

Then I saw the mention of WDUV, and their playlist is more what I was thinking of. (although I think it could also work with mainstream country.)

Here's a hour of music WDUV played this morning:

Cat Stevens - Oh Very Young
Marvin Gaye - What's Going On
James Taylor - Shower The People
Neil Diamond - I Am...I Said
James Ingram - Baby, Come To Me (w/ Patti Austin)
Todd Rundgren - Hello It's Me
Olivia Newton-John - Hopelessly Devoted To You
Louis Armstrong's Orchestra & Chorus - What A Wonderful World
Wham! - Careless Whisper
The Beach Boys - God Only Knows
Carole King - It's Too Late
The Temptations - Ain't Too Proud To Beg
The Carpenters - Top Of The World
Orleans - Dance With Me

Here's the same hour from KJJY in Des Moines, which is less current-based than most country stations:
Josh Turner - Long Black Train
Randy Travis - Forever And Ever, Amen
Rascal Flatts - I Won't Let Go
Brooks & Dunn - Ain't Nothing 'Bout You
Jason Aldean - She's Country
Keith Urban - But For The Grace Of God
Shania Twain - Forever and For Always
George Strait - Here For A Good Time
Collin Raye - One Boy, One Girl
Thompson Square - I Got You
Billy Currington - I Got A Feelin'
Blake Shelton - She Wouldn't Be Gone

 

[jmtillery]

I'm always confused by this discussion. I'm 58 years old, three years out of any salable demographic, soon to be eight and you're talking about programming to my parents! Where's the return on investment?

I'm 50 and in less than 4-years I will fall outside of the 25 - 54 target demo. However, my idea is to target the 35 - 64 adult with news, information, weather, traffic, sports, business news, maybe a talk show in a select daypart and non-offensive music. Tell me what part of my outline is targetted towards your parents?

I'm 55, and had the same reaction as semoochie to the music sample given earlier. It's the music my parents, now in their 80s, listened to 30 years ago. Ray Conniff, Ferante & Teicher, Tony Bennett seem a little too old.

The target demo for the format I have in mind is Adults 35 - 64. The oldest song I gave on my sample playlist is Ferrante and Teicher "Exodus" which charted in 1960. A person who was ten in 1960 and remembers the song is 61 now. A person who was 13 in 1960 is now 64. In constrast the newset song on the sample playlist is Kenny Rogers "Morning Desire" which was released in 1985. A person who was 10 in 1985 is now 36. Therefore, the music falls within the target demo 35 - 64, and this is the reason Tony Bennet and Ray Conniff were included to attract the upper end 35 - 64, although if you will note, the majority of the music included in my sample is from the median 1970s which will attract a person from the mid 40s to mid 50s. The other elements [news, traffic, weather, sports, talk, business news and features] will attract the entire target age spectrum. This is not a "music only" format I have in mind, but rather a Full Service format that happens to play MOR/Contemporary music or possibly even country music as you suggested.

 

[radioboy]

Mark,

On the North Florida board, there was recently a discussion regarding Fred Dockins' little cluster of stations in Perry, Fla. If it weren't quite such a commute (55 miles) for me (a legally blind non-driver) I would probably jump at the chance to work at the Perry stations.

Which brings me around to this: The AM station of Dockins group is WPRY, a 1kw station on 1400, giving it fulltime capability. I have family from the small town of Mayo, located nearby in Lafayette County. We've driven past WPRY many times. I'd still like to visit it!

A full-service station on WPRY-AM would make some logical sense, given the size of the local community. I could possibly see such a station broadcasting not only both national and local news, but also ag reports, as that is a big farming community.

As far as music, I once worked at a graveyard AM station on 1450 that played a soft AC/oldies/cross country mix that worked well. The station had ABC News (Mutual overnights during Larry King), local newsbreaks in the mornings, Paul Harvey, local high school sports (primarily football, although I remember running the board for some basketball games, too) and a few churches and such on Sundays. They were pretty music intensive during the day, but ran ABC/Information news at the bottom of the hour and weather at least once an hour outside of drive times.

I was 21, and totally green in radio, but picked a good enough music mix that the station put me in charge of most of the music duties. The country mixed very well. The station had over a 4 share, and this was with only 250 watts at night! I had a music show from 9 pm to midnight, and then ran the board overnights as well from midnight to 6 a.m. Talk about long hours! I worked on programming for the weekdays while also running Larry King over Mutual. King's show was the weak link, and eventually I was moved from 6 pm to midnight.

I still have most of that music, which I was able to obtain when the station was later sold and flipped to a different format under new management. None of us survived that sale. It was a great learning experience, and I'd consider that station to have been full service at that time, its service area being Tallahassee. It was one of the best-sounding AMs I've ever experienced.

It would be nice for some of these satellite-fed, unattended AM stations, to be brought back with some sort of full service service that you've brought up in your post.

 

[jmtillery]

Alan - You must be referring to WTAL-AM 1450 as the Tallahassee "graveyard" signal you were with.

 

[radioboy]

Mark, that's correct. WTAL was my first radio gig - started there in October of 1979!

 

[charlestondxman]

Well, Full Service MOR used to be a popular format, and I feel it is something that could work today on the right station with the right signal. In Charleston that format used to be on WOKE 1340. It was on until 1994. Toward the end, it was mostly standards, but throughout its history, it was the definition of MOR.

It had good music, usually leaning toward AC and oldies, a heavy amount of personality and local news, network news (NBC, then later CBS), religious shows on Sundays and early in the morning on weekdays, and a heavy amount of sports coverage (local, regional, and national). They had streetfront studios on Sam Rittenberg Blvd. in Charleston,

For several years, it had both South Carolina and Clemson sports.

Here is what it sounded like in 1981 with a 16 year old jock, John Busbee. Good station. BTW, this was later on a Saturday night (like 8 or 8:30 pm)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rgsBukzcek

 

[jmtillery]

I like the format and overall presentation, and the music has an entertaining easy listening sound. Today, however, the music would need to be updated to fit 2011 including more of an adult contemporary sound comprising of lite classic hits, some standards and new music that fits the overall sound. The basic core elements are news, information, sports (especially local high school sports), traffic, weather, business / financial news and modern MOR to bring it all together. Thank you for the WOKE link. The kid is quite good at his craft.

 

[jmtillery]

I might add that when I was program director with WTMC-AM Ocala, Florida in the mid to late 1970s and into the very early 1980s, we were full service adult contemporary and transitioned into full service Top 40 by late 1979. For years WTMC had been strictly full service MOR with Mutual News for national content. We had a full-time news director who covered city council meetings and anything else of local interest, including Friday night play-by-play covering local high school football. We had an hourly 5-minute newscast around the clock except during drive-time when we would air a 5-minute local newscast at the top and bottom of the hour. At noon we had a full 15-minute local newscast followed by local stocks, business news, sports and weather. We later added a program called Informaton 60 which aired from Noon till 1:00 PM, consisting of a full hour of news, information and features. For years WTMC was known as THE source for news and information that also played music.

 

[semoochie]

"The target demo for the format I have in mind is Adults 35 - 64. The oldest song I gave on my sample playlist is Ferrante and Teicher "Exodus" which charted in 1960." I'm reminded of the movie, i believe was called, "Relativity". The idea was that Albert Einstein and Marilyn Monroe were on the planet at the same time so perhaps they met. In the same way, "Exodus" may have been popular when a young boy was ten years old but the chances aren't great that when the song came on the radio, he immediately turned it up, to hear the song! This particular song was intended for adults and you'd be hard-pressed to find someone, who was ten in 1960, who'd want to hear that song now! I'll give you "Theme from a Summer Place" because it definitely had some crossover appeal and still does but it also has a tempo.

 

[Chuck]

When it was current, "Exodus" was pretty sleepy, even though the movie was a huge blockbuster. On the other hand Tony Bennett defies all preconceived ideas about the shelf life of an artist. He is still very popular with all age groups, as witnessed by his latest two "Duets" releases. Over the years, he has done a remarkable job of reinventing himself.

From those examples, I think you have to conclude that it is better to evaluate each song on an individual basis, rather than just by era. If you aren’t old enough to have heard something the first time around, and the song still holds up, then it is a positive experience. A good song is a good song.

I have noted that upbeat and happy seems to win more listeners than slow and sad. It is also true that just because a song was a big hit in another era, it may not be relevant today. Some work, some don't. I'm not sure there is a valid way to measure that, since it often depends on the context the song is heard. The song before it may make an otherwise good song sound like a train wreck. That's one thing that survey groups can’t take into account. Played individually, a song may sound fine, but when interleaved with the rest of the station's programming, it may stick out like a sore thumb. The only thing I've been able to do is go with my gut feeling. When I hear it on the air, if it doesn't work for me, I have to re-evaluate my choice.

 

[jmtillery]

Out of the twelve songs I included in my sampe playlist, only three are considered adult standards or 25% of the sample hour. Of those three songs, only one has been identified as "out-of-format" or 1/3 of the 25% or 1/12 of the total sample hour playlist. Those are excellent odds. And, as with any format, music formatting is subject to periodic adjustments to A) keep the music fresh and less repetitive; B) to weed out music that no longer fits the format or attracts an out-of-target demo audience; and, C) to more evenly rotate more popular songs or power oldies while giving lower rotation to less popular songs also known as "extra Oldies".

If it is determined that Exodus does not fit the format, then, of course, it goes without saying that any programmer that knows anything useful and worthwhile about programming will pull the song out of rotation. On the other hand, if it is determined to be a good fit, there is no reason to pull the song; however, it may be necessary to place it on a less repetitve rotation depending on its popularity.