Future of KGHP/Gig Harbor in doubt

[crainbebo]

That 89.7 will put KACS Chehalis into eastern Pierce County and the Enumclaw area. But they will have to deal with interference/IBOC hash from C89.5!
Both KGRG and KASB (Bellevue) do good things for the radio broadcasting community, albeit the audience listening is very small. They put students on the air, giving them skills, albeit for how long will they keep it up? People stream Spotify and Apple Music to avoid hearing DJ chatter. And many HS/college students are listening to music on Spotify and Apple Music. Meanwhile, we see that voice-tracking is the trend of today, along with syndicating midday and afternoon hosts to dozens of stations. iHeart is known for this.

I don't know if Green River CC runs a TV program there, I doubt it, but Bellevue does a weekly television program (think of morning announcements with a few other things), so they are learning how to run cameras, soundboards, direct, etc. in addition to the radio station. With most K-12 schools approaching STEM/STEAM, it's probably more beneficial to stick with visual arts rather than radio as a long-term solution. For one thing, sports broadcasting isn't going anywhere soon, even as NFL Thursday Night games move to Prime Video. Nor are the need for technical crews, directors, etc. Would be a great place for students to get their start, and allow games to be streamed on NFHS or via YouTube. Up north in Anacortes, they have a multi-camera crew of students for sports, including football games. Students even get to direct as they work their way up. I have a friend here at CWU who was involved in that Anacortes program, but he's not going into broadcasting as a major.

Long-term: would you keep a radio program or expand a TV/sports broadcasting program in your HS or community college? I think we know the answer.

 

[Red Plume]

Just want to add that while the future of multimedia is uncertain, these stations teach students how to operate a business. Not a lot of school projects give students experience that exceeds the border of the campus.

 

[Kelly A]

That 89.7 will put KACS Chehalis into eastern Pierce County and the Enumclaw area. But they will have to deal with interference/IBOC hash from C89.5!

Good! Lead, follow, or get out of the way. KNHC is an educational facility too.

Both KGRG and KASB (Bellevue) do good things for the radio broadcasting community, albeit the audience listening is very small.

Then how are they doing good for the community if nobody listens?

Long-term: would you keep a radio program or expand a TV/sports broadcasting program in your HS or community college? I think we know the answer.

Given people can essentially broadcast to a potentially larger audience from their bedroom using more modern and sophisticated forms of tech than any HS/college radio station, the answer is probably no. As I said before; the non-comms with strong and mass-appeal programming that train students to do more than read a script or talk up an intro, will succeed. The sandboxes will eventually fade into obscurity.

 

[crainbebo]

You're right on the third quote. NWPB, KUOW, etc. will be around for many more years to come. C89.5 and KEXP probably as well. Others? Very uncertain.
Radio programs will lead students into what? Voice tracking for iHeart? If that?
While TV/sports broadcasting, operating on a crew, will lead them to countless opportunities in both television and possibly in film as well. High-quality equipment is becoming less expensive for schools to purchase. Instead of voice tracking for iHeart, they can work their way into co-directing the next Super Bowl or World Series...or even make their own documentaries. Let alone working soundboards and booms, cameras and jibs, gripping and lighting. You can't get that in radio teaching.
Many churches also run good video crews for their Sunday services which can give teens the opportunity to delve into broadcasting or film.
Kids are learning to *code* in K-2. Give them hands-on opportunities in STEAM concepts and they can take that for a lifetime.

Remember that David Bowie song...'ch-ch-ch-ch-changes'.

 

[bossbill]

What the schools need to do is cultivate "techies", not disk jockeys. The industry needs more of the former, less of the latter.

 

[Bongwater]

Then how are they doing good for the community if nobody listens?

Same could be asked of KWFJ and KYFQ. Or all these CSN translators everywhere out here. Any hard stats on their local listenership? Or who they're educating?

 

[SomeRadioGuy]

Same could be asked of KWFJ and KYFQ. Or all these CSN translators everywhere out here. Any hard stats on their local listenership? Or who they're educating?

AS for CSN, in some places.. none

When i arrived in laramie, wy in late 2018 their 100.3 translator had been broadcasting static for months and months on end... came to find out when i got up to the site for CSN, the sony radio lost its marbles during a power outage and defaulted to 520 AM instead of 90.3

CSN wouldnt pay for a UPS, saying it caused more problems than it was worth. I know someone who made two cash offers to them, as is where is... and they got ignored.

 

[notalent]

Video is the future... As much as I personally benefited from a high school radio station... The radio industry is not a good place to count on a lucrative career for the average high school student... or anyone for that matter. Again speaking from experience. As a 1980 HS graduate I only got about 15 years in as an on air talent before it became obvious I would need another way to climb the ladder, at that time it was utilizing my college education in electronics so I became an engineer... That was a good run until 2011 when I was finally right sized by iHeart. I was a better than average radio studio engineer as I had the knowledge of how all the gear was suppose to work and be used.

At that point I was hired to work at a (Seattle) college radio station as an engineer but they also had TV stuff going on and politics led another guy to the radio position so I took to the TV side.... Which opened up a lot of doors for the technically astute.

Turns out every major company now has a video production department internally to handle all the corporate zoom/teams meetings that are the rage now. All manner of executive and internal communications are being done with video. With the Covid most major fly in conferences are now online. There are several AV companies in the Seattle area that specialize in crewing the technical people needed to run these facilities. Such companies with these facilities include but are not limited to Amazon, Microsoft, Boeing, Alaska Airlines, F5, Starbucks, T-Mobile, Google SLU, ETC.

And then there is sports... Also with several companies specializing in crewing all manner of audio, video, graphics, replay, camera, director, lights, grips, etc. Almost all work (all legitimate work) is through a few unions. These are crews for Sounder, Seahawks, Storm, Kraken, UW when on TV, and Mariners. Entry level people can get lower paying non union gigs with Seawolves, Reign, the WHL Hockey teams and the various low level high school sports streams that happen.

These same skills are hired to operate the video and audio in house at the large venues... T-Mobile, Lumin Field, and CPA. In house positions are non union and pay less but they hire for all the same skills. Key Arena used to be union when the City ran it but it is not at this time under CPA.

Of course there is the film and commercial TV/News avenues which I know not much about.

A tech minded student these days would be wise to expand their horizons beyond audio and radio.

 

[bossbill]

As I get ready to move on after several decades in radio broadcasting and turn things over to those who are 30 years younger, I acknowledge that radio no longer offers the opportunities that it did 60 years ago, when we could "get our feet wet" overnights and weekends in a small town and maybe eventually work up to a morning gig on a leading Top Forty station in a major market.
Yet so many high school and community college programs still cling to an illusion that is no longer a reality. Students that want to be "disk jockeys" will be disappointed that there is no overnight shift, no weekends, no path to success doing what we all did 50-60 years ago. Radio broadcasting is no longer a career path. I was fortunate to be able to work with really great talent in a major market. Now even the major markets are using talent voice-tracking from home.

 

[PTBoardOp94]

Yet so many high school and community college programs still cling to an illusion that is no longer a reality. Students that want to be "disk jockeys" will be disappointed that there is no overnight shift, no weekends, no path to success doing what we all did 50-60 years ago.

One of my former co-workers left radio to work in education. Eventually he ended up being the instructor for the local school system's radio station. He said it was hard to keep the kids challenged.
Back in "the day", we learned physical skills that needed to be mastered - like splicing tape, and how to get your records cued up correctly. And those things took time. I never learned to splice tape well.
But these days, the equipment is so user-friendly that there isn't much to teach. A little mic technique, a little time with Adobe Audition, a little automation training, but I feel like that could be just a few days to a few weeks depending on how "green" they are.

So, IMO someone who wants to consider radio & TV could go a long way with public speaking or theater classes.

 

[bobdavcav]

That makes a lot of sense to me. It took me a little while to learn Audacity, but if a station I was learning at used both Audacity and Station Playlist, it would take probably a month or less to teach me how to use those programs. I tried out Station Playlist a few years ago and had it sounding as good as I could have made it within a couple days. The only reason it wasn't sooner is because I had other responsibilities.

 

[fordranger797]

That makes a lot of sense to me. It took me a little while to learn Audacity, but if a station I was learning at used both Audacity and Station Playlist, it would take probably a month or less to teach me how to use those programs. I tried out Station Playlist a few years ago and had it sounding as good as I could have made it within a couple days. The only reason it wasn't sooner is because I had other responsibilities.

In the big picture, the software used to run the station shouldn’t be hard to figure out. It seems like the companies who make this software can’t help but make some of the functions confusing, but a station would be in trouble if you needed a manual to figure it out.

 

[Kelly A]

That makes a lot of sense to me. It took me a little while to learn Audacity, but if a station I was learning at used both Audacity and Station Playlist, it would take probably a month or less to teach me how to use those programs. I tried out Station Playlist a few years ago and had it sounding as good as I could have made it within a couple days. The only reason it wasn't sooner is because I had other responsibilities.

Given the popular apps and software, I'd be willing to bet your average fifteen year old could figure it out in less than an hour. That's assuming they were motivated to do so.

 

[crainbebo]

Splicing tape? I can't remember the last time a high school student was ever told to do that at a radio station. You'd have to go back 20 years, probably. I doubt there are many HS stations running carts nowadays with the advancement of, yup, the computer and the Internet.
That's why I'm right (and so is notalent) about video being the future.

I've talked about it before, but one thing about the video industry is how easy it is for a teenager to learn how to use video equipment...and to take that to a career that for the most part will evolve but still require the soundboards, cameras, and directors. When the COVID shutdowns hit, just about every church had to go online. Many started with sermons from a pastor's couch. Then they had to decide...with very limited capacity and/or still keeping their doors closed, what video cameras were affordable to broadcast services online? Now they are expanding to multi-camera operations in many churches and taking on volunteers to serve in the ministry. Stepping stone to a career. I know of a church in Yakima that has at least a couple of teenagers running cameras on rotation for IMAG (big screen) and live stream, not every week, however.

The sports broadcasting program at Anacortes HS is also multi-camera (4 in all), and students run everything. The broadcasting teacher monitors to make sure they aren't goofing around (and everyone gets plenty of training). Their operation is a lot better than other HS football streams I've seen. They even have a score box on the screen that is updated by a student volunteer.

I wonder how many of those students will eventually move into the UW TV crews and/or even a major sports league or ESPN? So many possibilities.

Meanwhile, radio is becoming a dead-end job nowadays that involves that V-word...Voice tracking.

 

[PTBoardOp94]

Splicing tape? I can't remember the last time a high school student was ever told to do that at a radio station. You'd have to go back 20 years, probably.

That's why I said "back in the day" when I mentioned splicing tape.

The sports broadcasting program at Anacortes HS is also multi-camera (4 in all), and students run everything. The broadcasting teacher monitors to make sure they aren't goofing around (and everyone gets plenty of training). Their operation is a lot better than other HS football streams I've seen. They even have a score box on the screen that is updated by a student volunteer.

I wonder how many of those students will eventually move into the UW TV crews and/or even a major sports league or ESPN? So many possibilities.

Maybe your experience is different, but in my experience, these college broadcasts cannot be the backbone of a career. It's real hard for a professional to compete with the free labor that college students provide as "work experience."
My experience working with a D1 college as a baseball announcer was that none of our crew were professional broadcasters, and the primary qualification was being a current student or recent alumnus of the college. To the best of my understanding, the same was true for all their sports, unless a third party wanted to broadcast our game (such as CBSSN).

The whole dynamic may change when there is a union shop, but I live in a right-to-work state, so there's no such thing here.

 

[bobdavcav]

In the big picture, the software used to run the station shouldn’t be hard to figure out. It seems like the companies who make this software can’t help but make some of the functions confusing, but a station would be in trouble if you needed a manual to figure it out.

I wouldn't say these systems are deliberately confusing, but to the average person, some of the things they do seem unnecessary. A couple big examples are different audio types and music scheduling. I use a little free program called Zara, and a big part of the reason I like it is because it works quite similarly to how my mind works when I think about programming. You can set up rotations and playlists just about any way you want and it will play them, but it doesn't have any music scheduling, and in the free version, there's no different audio types. The big thing that prevents it from being used in more radio stations is that there's no way to create actual logs with it. I'll have to ask someone I know who has written a number of iTunes scripts if a script can be written to put what Zara would play with rotations and random tracks set up into a playlist. Running each hour as a playlist and having it automatically load the next playlist at the end of the previous one would take a bit more manual intervention, but could sound like one of the big systems out there if done correctly. I am sure there's a reason why someone who works in the industry doesn't like that setup, and I'd be happy to discuss that with said person in a private conversation, but I'd be willing to bet that to the average person, what I've just laid out won't sound any different that what they're used to and you don't have any music scheduling software or files designated with different types such as imaging, music, jingles, and commercials.

 

[crainbebo]

That's why I said "back in the day" when I mentioned splicing tape.


Maybe your experience is different, but in my experience, these college broadcasts cannot be the backbone of a career. It's real hard for a professional to compete with the free labor that college students provide as "work experience."
My experience working with a D1 college as a baseball announcer was that none of our crew were professional broadcasters, and the primary qualification was being a current student or recent alumnus of the college. To the best of my understanding, the same was true for all their sports, unless a third party wanted to broadcast our game (such as CBSSN).

The whole dynamic may change when there is a union shop, but I live in a right-to-work state, so there's no such thing here.

That wasn't my experience - that was second-hand from a friend here who graduated from Anacortes and volunteered on their TV crew for live sports. He changed his mind and is going into something else.
So then, if college students are given "free labor"...I doubt that's the case with D-1 schools for football/basketball. Pretty sure those are professional crews w/ college degrees on most of the RSN/ESPN/network broadcasts, albeit there are some schools that put actual college students into some of the behind-the-scenes roles. D-2 schools are a problem, and rarely get any 'large-scale' or even small-scale, for that matter, broadcasts or streams. In 2019, CWU football was putting their marbles into play-by-play on 88.1 KCWU. In 2021, the radio coverage went away, and SWX (KNDU/KHQ's subchannel sports network for eastern Washington) brought crews to the games. Too bad they are still in stretch-o-vision 480p.
There's more sports coverage on TV than there was 30 years ago when there were fewer RSNs and fewer cable subscribers.

 

[Kelly A]

Meanwhile, radio is becoming a dead-end job nowadays that involves that V-word...Voice tracking.

But good talent is well paid for voice tracking multiple stations or formats.

 

[notalent]

Pac 12 Network used to hold cattle calls at UW to try to recruit students into sports broadcasting... It is actually part of their mandate... They haven't done one since Covid but the last one they did do around 30 students expressed an interest and out of those all but two were only interested in "talent" positions. Of course those are not the difficult positions to fill... And they usually look to former athletes or coaches in the specific sport for those talent jobs... Not to random students. Example both Kelsey Plum and Jody Wynn have done PXP for Women's basketball on P12 Network... Not to mention Elise Woodward... etc.

 

[k1cza]

What the schools need to do is cultivate "techies", not disk jockeys. The industry needs more of the former, less of the latter.

Why not folks who are both? I agree that there needs to be more tech-savvy, but also a better focus on content programming.

Yes, yes, I know "voice tracking" is "evil", but it is today's reality of radio. Most small stations simply don't have the staff budget nor the needed number of volunteer DJs to have consistently live content. Combine this with the stratospheric rise of podcasting and very affordable at-home equipment, and it's a no-brainer to have volunteers produce shows from home on their own schedule. KAOS has been doing this heavily since the pandemic, and I'd much rather listen to a voice-tracked show curated by a decent DJ rather than random automation. (If only KAOS would improve their automation when they're not VTing shows...)