Fybush: Would we see WRKO 850?

[raccoonradio]

http://www.fybush.com/nerw.html

In the latest North East Radio Watch Scott Fybush wonders if perhaps Ent. could shift RKO to 850...
a slight improvement in signal possibly (but would it be worth the trouble?)
Also, Scott says he'll be part of a forthcoming Steve Leveille broadcast on WBZ celebrating the
90th birthday of WBZ radio (Sun into Monday 9/18-19)

>>Could WEEI's FM move provide an opening to relocate WRKO from 680 to the 850 signal? Both are 50,000-watters, but 850's Needham transmitter site (where a brand-new Harris Destiny 3DX50 transmitter is being installed this month) gives that signal the reach into MetroWest that 680 is notoriously lacking after dark.

 

[raccoonradio]

Fybush brings up some very good points (I'm getting that money ready to subscribe, Scott!):

--While they're saying WAAF is a good place for Mike fans to turn to, more than likely they'd rather
wind up going to stations owned by rivals: CBS (WZLX, WODS), Greater (WROR) etc

--The big buck$$$ that Ent. spent for Red Sox rights is a factor:
""And whatever short-term hit Entercom takes in revenue without "Mike" is bound to be less painful than the long-term effects of watching an AM-only WEEI decay"

In other words they need to make as much money as they can from their WEEI franchise including
our sadly slumping local ball team...

 

[MarcB]

I read that too, but he didn't speculate as to what would happen to AM 680 if WRKO moved to 850.

 

[raccoonradio]

Yes, he didn't speculate but I think I mentioned on boston-radio-interest that IF such a move were made,
680 could become WEEI (AM) with local and ESPN hosts etc. Or who knows what. But it was a great point he made about how the money Entercom spent on Sox, etc. needed to be recouped with an FM
simulcast of WEEI (and CBS breathing down their necks too) as opposed to running Mike jockless.
Even though Ent. will no doubt lose listeners to CBS or Greater Media music stations, they want to keep
WEEI from becoming an also-ran. Whatever, it's good to have the Sox (and ESPN baseball playoffs)
on an FM station many of us can pick up at work, in some bldgs, etc.

 

[MarcB]

Whatever, it's good to have the Sox (and ESPN baseball playoffs)
on an FM station many of us can pick up at work, in some bldgs, etc.

It's always good if you could hear your favorite team without that static. That's why I was happy that this year my New York Football Giants were picked up by the 50KW powerhouse that is WTIC 1080 - no more listening through the static to NYC's WFAN when I'm not in front of my TV to watch.

Continuing the subject of hearing ones favorite team without static hopefully the rumors in Hartford are true that Clear Channel's soon-to-be-relocated from Springfield 97.9 FM becomes a simulcast of WPOP 1410. It would be nice to hear my Yankees without putting up with static from WCBS. I can not pick up WPOP at night where I live (and it's barely audible during the day). I had to downgrade my cable and lost the Yes Network in the process. Now the only Yankees games I get on TV are the weekly games on MY TV 9 (WCTX/59). I rely on the radio to hear my Yankees.

 

[raccoonradio]

Mark S (BRW) tweeted to me that 850's night signal might not be all that good either to west (mixed in
with Montreal sta. in French etc)

And yes great to hear without static...Speaking of Giants here in Beverly MA there's a guy who frequents a local bar/restaurant all decked out in Giants gear. Before Patriots came about, or in the years before
blackouts were lifted, many New Englanders became Giants fans from exposure to the team on TV. He (and he's older) is prob. one of them. He likes Red Sox, Celts etc. but stayed a Giants fan. (More loyalty: a guy I know grew up a Bos. Braves fan and is still one despite moves to 2 other cities)

Interesting about the poss. 97.9 move. I also was once driving around Hartford area--by day--and was
surprised how weak 1410 was, at least at that time. There are some other Yankees radio affiliates in New England--even up in SE New Hampshire... What's interesting with me was at my workplace, near edge of building where there's less interference, _it was a lot easier to pick up Yankees on 880 than Red Sox on 850_, and I'm talking just north of Boston here. Not that I'll have worries now--93.7 is
5 miles from my workplace!--but imagine that a Boston station was extremely weak not far
from Boston proper and one would have better luck with a station from 220 mi away!

 

[fybush]

As has been noted elsewhere, there hasn't been a Montreal 850 for well over a decade now. When it existed, yes, CKVL wreaked havoc on WHDH/WEEI, but the channel's much cleaner since the old CKVL became CINW on 940 (and then went away completely last year.)

Raccoon, it goes without saying at this point that your workplace reception issues are highly unusual. The enormous steel building where you work functions as an enormous Faraday cage that blocks almost all outside RF from getting in, especially medium-wave ("AM"). I'm not quite sure why WCBS in particular got through...could have been something as odd as the spacing of the steel framing in your building being resonant at WCBS' wavelength.

Even FM signals are highly attenuated, which is why it takes the proximity of 93.7, just a few miles away, to get past all that signal to reach you.

I would be extremely cautious about trying to read too much into the overall quality of the various signals based on how they get into your unusual receiving situation. The same 93.7 that's the strongest thing on your dial in Peabody is a tough catch in Newton, under the "RF haze" from the FMs there.

 

[raccoonradio]

I didn't know that the 850 in Mtl. was gone.
The places where WCBS got through are the breakroom in front of building (AM and FM recep is fine)
and one spot near edge of the building, far away from interference. I would be in either place
and shake my head that WCBS came in loud and clear while WEEI had a feeble, fading signal.

Up until now, we had someone buy a $150 unit from Brookstone that would relay signals even through thick walls. (The website said you could use it to relay signals from your living room stereo out to your pool, etc.) Uses 900 MHz...not like the $20 "FM re-transmitters" you see at FYE, Target, or Walmart. So in ONE
section of work, people used the device to hear the Sox games...and even then there would be fading in and out a bit. Now, as I told my co-workers the other day, 93.7 will have Sox and anybody with a Walkman or boombox in the building would have no trouble. As I know from walking past boomboxes in there
and Mike 93.7 was blasting away. But yes, it helps that 93.7 is maybe 5-7 miles from here.

98.5 does come in on a walkman at work, though it can be shaky. I have said before "I can hear the Pats on Monday night football on 98.5 at work, but the Red Sox could be in the World Series and I couldn't pick them up on my Walkman at work...because they were on 850.

I can hear Howie on 680--their stick is just down the road in Burlington--and even then I need to set up a radio in once place and use the mini FM transmitter to beam it to my walkman. But the 850? Forget it!

But you're right Newton may not have such an easy time, esp. with all the transmitters in area...

Also as I said in another thread, RKO has CRN to run Howie to reach metrowest. Would they want to switch to 850 just so the syndie shows after Howie could come in clearer?

 

[fybush]

Also as I said in another thread, RKO has CRN to run Howie to reach metrowest. Would they want to switch to 850 just so the syndie shows after Howie could come in clearer?

If you're in Ashland or Westborough and you're listening to Howie and you have a PPM meter, your ratings points are going to WCRN, not to WRKO...and so is at least some of the ad revenue as a result.

It makes no difference to Howie - he gets paid and heard either way - but it makes a big difference to Entercom. They want those ratings points and the revenue that goes with them to go to WRKO if it's at all possible. Using WCRN is just a stopgap measure.

 

[raccoonradio]

I had mentioned something about a French lang 850 said to be interfering with 860; Mark told me he had said a French lang station but said nothing about it being 850. He meant Toronto on 860 bleeding over.
Apologies!

 

[fybush]

That makes more sense, but only to a certain degree: CJBC on 860 has long had a well-deserved reputation as one of the least-well-modulated stations on the dial. It's sometimes barely audible on 860 itself, and I can't imagine it puts much slop over to 850 or 870 as a result.

 

[inorm99]

In the early 90's, when Talk WHDH 850 was blown up for the move of WEEI to 850, a lot of WHDH's programming went to WRKO. If WRKO now moved to 850, it would be full circle.
An old mistake signal wise that they should correct.
Maybe they should toss the " Syndie" crap out with the 680 signal.

I read that too, but he didn't speculate as to what would happen to AM 680 if WRKO moved to 850.

 

[raccoonradio]

Interesting:
--CBS used to own WEEI and WEEI-FM. Now, CBS' Sports Hub competes with a station called WEEI owned by Entercom

--WHDH prog did go to RKO, at least Rush and Howie did. Moving back to 850 would indeed be full
circle. And of course when WHDH signed off an engineer added a toilet flush as the _radio_ call letters
of WHDH expired.
The syndie stuff helps RKO fill out their signal--locally they have Finneran and Feinburg, Lunch Money
(brokered), Brien, and Howie. Then they have Ingraham (who may do half decent), Savage, Doyle,
and Red Eye. Not exactly local issues and ratings are prob. not stellar.

A few people here think 850 should maybe go 24/7 ESPN...then again while a few people may enjoy
ESPN talk shows, they may not be all that great (I do enjoy ESPN's play by play though, like baseball
playoffs and world series, which will certainly be on 850/93.7) There are also a few select people here
who would think Yahoo!Sports Radio (formerly Sporting News) would be swell. OK, so a few dozen
people may enjoy that but what about the majority?

What about: WRKO 680
Morning show, Laura, middays, Howie--then ESPN
850: Simulcast with 93.7, though there would be duplication as they already run ESPN overnight
I suppose there would be the same amount of listeners to ESPN talk as there would be to
Savage, etc...that is, ...not many...

But what else? True oldies? Prog talk? Spanish? Biz news (some think you could see that...
96.9 is adding to that mix with that Wall St Journal Daily Wrapup show). What?

 

[DG02816]

I'm betting CJBC just uses enough processing to keep things from really splattering. They are diplexed with 740 in Toronto, using that tower. It's 5/9 wavelength high at 860, and the night signal here near Philly is armchair copy. I imagine it's pretty much the same thing in Boston.

 

[OFFICENERD]

Howie will still get his free food from Kowloon either way..