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- Thread starter TheBigA
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I saw this Thursday night and all I felt was my heart drop for Conan. Imagine it being a lifelong dream of yours to host the Tonight show. Then after 5 years of knowing your dream is finally going to become reality...... Conan now gets to see Jay's commercial "Get Back to Where you once belonged". This commercial has got to kill Conan's spirit whenever it comes on.
Skynet74 said:
Imagine being #1 in your daypart for 15 years, and forced to give that time spot up because of an aggressive agent. It's nice that he got to achieve his dream, but he did it in an unfair way. It wasn't like there was some national competition for the job. No one else had the opportunity to try out for it, as Leno went through when Carson retired. It was just written into his contract, with the threat that he would leave if he didn't get what he wanted. Not exactly the sympathetic image everyone has. Conan's spirit will be uplifted every time he checks his bank account.
Money doesn't buy happiness.
Sure, the money helps him, but it's not like that's all he wanted.
Conan is someone who truly loves his job, you can see it every time he walks on set. I'm sure it still hurts to know what happened to him.
Sure, the money helps him, but it's not like that's all he wanted.
Conan is someone who truly loves his job, you can see it every time he walks on set. I'm sure it still hurts to know what happened to him.
All these Conan fans are bothering me because they've only listened to Conan's story and not the other side of the story.
First of all, the Tonight Show audience dropped a whopping 49% with Conan. One can't say it the audience dropped because Letterman got better or people decided to watch Nightline all of a sudden. Conan just wasn't appealing to the 11:35 audience. While he won in the younger demos, it wasn't enough. The Tonight Show would have lost money for the first time in years as Leno said. Leno when he was on Tonight still won those younger demos.
Second, Conan was still wanted at NBC even after a 49% drop at the Tonight Show. He didn't have to give up the Tonight Show. NBC wanted to move THE JAY LENO SHOW at 11:35 and then follow it up by THE TONIGHT SHOW, this way there would be a stronger lead in to Conan, which is why Conan had viewers on Late Night back in the day.
Third, Conan ISN'T GETTING SCREWED OVER!!! Conan decided to leave the network and The Tonight Show and he left with $40 Million dollars! NBC wanted to keep him. Getting paid out $40 Million dollars is getting screwed over now?
Conan's a smart guy. He graduated from Harvard and in his statement and on his show, he made this whole fiasco look like it was Jay Leno's fault although it was part network decision and part his decision. He made the Tonight Show and NBC look bad so viewers would look at the network with disdain so when he moved onto a new network, they would follow and not stick around with Leno.
What Conan and Conan fans don't understand is that TV is all about business and ratings. Conan wasn't meeting the ratings and the revenue. People argue that Conan didn't have enough time to grow but he had 13 years to grow! This is why Letterman was topping Leno for the first few years on the Late Show because his Late Night audience followed him to CBS. People argue that Conan didn't have a good lead-in because Jay was on at 10, but Jay was only on for 4 months! Conan was on for 7! If Jay Leno really was the problem, then those 3 months that Conan was on would have been great ratings wise right? Wrong.
Conan fans need to listen up to the other side of the story, when a show sucks, it gets yanked off the air. It might have been Conan's dream to host The Tonight Show, but hey, it was Lettermans and he never got to host it. Every comedian has the dream of hosting The Tonight Show, if they don't get it, is it all Leno's fault?
First of all, the Tonight Show audience dropped a whopping 49% with Conan. One can't say it the audience dropped because Letterman got better or people decided to watch Nightline all of a sudden. Conan just wasn't appealing to the 11:35 audience. While he won in the younger demos, it wasn't enough. The Tonight Show would have lost money for the first time in years as Leno said. Leno when he was on Tonight still won those younger demos.
Second, Conan was still wanted at NBC even after a 49% drop at the Tonight Show. He didn't have to give up the Tonight Show. NBC wanted to move THE JAY LENO SHOW at 11:35 and then follow it up by THE TONIGHT SHOW, this way there would be a stronger lead in to Conan, which is why Conan had viewers on Late Night back in the day.
Third, Conan ISN'T GETTING SCREWED OVER!!! Conan decided to leave the network and The Tonight Show and he left with $40 Million dollars! NBC wanted to keep him. Getting paid out $40 Million dollars is getting screwed over now?
Conan's a smart guy. He graduated from Harvard and in his statement and on his show, he made this whole fiasco look like it was Jay Leno's fault although it was part network decision and part his decision. He made the Tonight Show and NBC look bad so viewers would look at the network with disdain so when he moved onto a new network, they would follow and not stick around with Leno.
What Conan and Conan fans don't understand is that TV is all about business and ratings. Conan wasn't meeting the ratings and the revenue. People argue that Conan didn't have enough time to grow but he had 13 years to grow! This is why Letterman was topping Leno for the first few years on the Late Show because his Late Night audience followed him to CBS. People argue that Conan didn't have a good lead-in because Jay was on at 10, but Jay was only on for 4 months! Conan was on for 7! If Jay Leno really was the problem, then those 3 months that Conan was on would have been great ratings wise right? Wrong.
Conan fans need to listen up to the other side of the story, when a show sucks, it gets yanked off the air. It might have been Conan's dream to host The Tonight Show, but hey, it was Lettermans and he never got to host it. Every comedian has the dream of hosting The Tonight Show, if they don't get it, is it all Leno's fault?
Have we forgotten that Leno's first few years on 'Tonight' were extremely rocky? It's not like he took that show to the top the day he started. After Carson's retirement, Leno tanked at the beginning. It was only after the famous Hugh Grant interview that Leno's fortune began to turn.
Also, if Leno, as he stated on Oprah, did not really want to go along with the '5 years and you retire' plan in 2004, then WHY DID HE? He lied on national television in 2004 about this being a mutual idea, and then admitted to the lie on Oprah last month. I have no respect for a man who lies on national television about an idea he agreed with. If he didn't want to do it, why did he just go along with it?
Conan was promised the show, and it takes longer than 7 months to build an audience during a host transition on a national institution. As I say, the SAME THING happened to Leno, and he was given plenty of time. Additionally, Conan's beginnings on Late Night were far from perfect, but the network gave him a chance. Why wouldn't they do it again? Conan has done so much good for NBC. Yes, he could have stayed on and done 'Tonight' at 12:05, but I wouldn't that either. Thats a huge blow to not only Conan but the franchise, and I would not have been able to turn it into the 'Tomorrow Morning Show' either.
So for all you Leno fans who claim Conan's low ratings were not tolerable, don't forget Leno had the exact same issue at the beginning of his Tonight Show in the early 90s. Just sayin'
Also, if Leno, as he stated on Oprah, did not really want to go along with the '5 years and you retire' plan in 2004, then WHY DID HE? He lied on national television in 2004 about this being a mutual idea, and then admitted to the lie on Oprah last month. I have no respect for a man who lies on national television about an idea he agreed with. If he didn't want to do it, why did he just go along with it?
Conan was promised the show, and it takes longer than 7 months to build an audience during a host transition on a national institution. As I say, the SAME THING happened to Leno, and he was given plenty of time. Additionally, Conan's beginnings on Late Night were far from perfect, but the network gave him a chance. Why wouldn't they do it again? Conan has done so much good for NBC. Yes, he could have stayed on and done 'Tonight' at 12:05, but I wouldn't that either. Thats a huge blow to not only Conan but the franchise, and I would not have been able to turn it into the 'Tomorrow Morning Show' either.
So for all you Leno fans who claim Conan's low ratings were not tolerable, don't forget Leno had the exact same issue at the beginning of his Tonight Show in the early 90s. Just sayin'
I see the matter as Conan being too impatient back in '04 and gave NBC the choice of choosing him as the next "Tonight" show host, or he would jump to another network and become a competitor. NBC in its wisdom figured they would push an aging Leno out the door in '10, and all would be happy. What was Leno going to do? If he didn't agree to the deal, he would have been out years ago. Leno didn't fail as host of the "Tonight" show. He was the good soldier. He was damned if he did and damned if he didn't. As it played out, Conan had a shot at the show, and it failed initially. NBC, and more importantly, the affiliates, in this economy, couldn't afford to keep him on any longer due to the failing ratings. All in all, it was a perfect storm against Conan, though his severance would be welcomed to any average "man on the street."
Conan should see this not as a failure, but as an opportunity. What man in the would wouldn't want $30 million and all the free time in the world. He could stay in television, or go into writing movies, etc. Maybe acting would be something he should consider. Remember Greg Kinnear? He started acting and has done very well.
Conan is very talented and I feel will do very well.
Conan should see this not as a failure, but as an opportunity. What man in the would wouldn't want $30 million and all the free time in the world. He could stay in television, or go into writing movies, etc. Maybe acting would be something he should consider. Remember Greg Kinnear? He started acting and has done very well.
Conan is very talented and I feel will do very well.
Jay wasn't Conan's lead-in. "Your late local news" was. And they complained about Jay being a bad lead-in for them!
Not everyone is on eastern or pacific time zones. That proposed time would have been 11:05 p.m. here, which is indeed still "tonight" for me. Conan would have had a better argument by saying something like "Tonight has always immediately followed the late local news."
Just a response to a few of the previous posts; I have listened to both sides of the story. I just don't have the opinion you want me to have.
I believe the situation could've been handeled better on both sides. NBC could have been more passive with Conan instead of pandering to Jay, and Conan could have been more open to a timeslot change. It didn't have to end the way it did.
I don't hate Jay or NBC, and I wish Jay all the best on Monday. I'll be watching.
I believe the situation could've been handeled better on both sides. NBC could have been more passive with Conan instead of pandering to Jay, and Conan could have been more open to a timeslot change. It didn't have to end the way it did.
I don't hate Jay or NBC, and I wish Jay all the best on Monday. I'll be watching.
Conan was promised the show when he was still getting the numbers, but by the time he got the Tonight Show he was already losing to Craig Ferguson. Conan could've done well on Tonight, but imo it was quite terrible, from the forced unfunny banter with Max to some pretty desperate-looking bits.
Let's remember this is a guy who, when he decided he was too good for 12:05am after Leno, basically had his whole staff lose their jobs. No sympathy from me.
Let's remember this is a guy who, when he decided he was too good for 12:05am after Leno, basically had his whole staff lose their jobs. No sympathy from me.
Lehos said:
But Leno never had as much exposure as Conan did for his first few years of the Tonight Show. Conan was on 7 days a week for 13 years immediately after the Tonight Show, while Jay only did almost weekly guest hosting gigs for a few years. The problem at the beginning was that although Jay had done the Tonight Show as a guest for a bit, he still wasn't completely used to the entire late night format. He had to build his own fan base and his own brand while Conan ALREADY HAD a brand and a fanbase for his show. Conan was on for 13 years! It's not like no one knew who Conan was. What I always thought about it was like Jay took his Tonight Show to 10 PM, Conan took his Late Night brand to 11:35 and that brand was already sinking at the 12:35 timeslot against Jimmy Kimmel and Craig Ferguson!
It was bound to be a failure.
And the thing that bothers me the most about Conan was that he not only thinks his brand of "comedy" is revolutionary but he tainted the Tonight Show brand by feeding his audience lies about what was really going on the network instead of just saying "I sucked at the ratings! I lost 49% of my audience!"
At least Jay admitted that he sucked at 10...
TheBigA said:
This is the same thing Leno did to Carson (Johnny...not Daly). Leno's aggressive agent planted a story about NBC wanting Johnny out. Johnny retired after being #1 for 30 years. Leno didn't "try out" - his agent had a clause in the contract that NBC had to give Jay The Tonight Show. Letterman got angry and we know the rest of the story. It's just interesting to me that there is an attempt to re-write history here. Leno didn't try out for The Tonight Show - he stiff armed Carson and Letterman (and now Conan) out of it.
F
FreddyE1977
Guest
if you listen closely though, it is not really the Beatles....just a close knock-off like they used to sell in those K-Tel record commercials in
the 70's. (Paul McCartney probably wanted more money to use his recording than Jay Leno is getting to do the show)
the 70's. (Paul McCartney probably wanted more money to use his recording than Jay Leno is getting to do the show)
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