Get Ready for AM 1520

[LDRADIO]

Looks like Andy Skotdal won the latest round in his battle to put two more towers up for AM1520
http://www.heraldnet.com/article/20090815/NEWS01/708159891#KRKO.radio.tower.foes.again.lose.in.court
It doesn't appear that even now with 34 - 50,000 watts KRKO is even showing up at all in the PPM so I'm not sure how he's going to make any money with AM1520. Anyone have any ideas?

 

[RadioRon]

KRKO is in a very tough position right now. They are essentially the #3 sports station in the market. KJR and KIRO have all of the good syndicated programming. The only thing that KRKO really has going for it is local sports. Maybe they could get some decent local talent on the air up there....but then again, that cost money.

 

[Bongwater]

KRKO is in a very tough position right now. They are essentially the #3 sports station in the market. KJR and KIRO have all of the good syndicated programming. The only thing that KRKO really has going for it is local sports. Maybe they could get some decent local talent on the air up there....but then again, that cost money.

So.....what's the format gonna be?.......

 

[DanStrassberg]

So.....what's the format gonna be?.......

Andy posted on this board a few months back that 1520--even though it will be 50 kW--at least at night, and maybe full-time--would be much more locally oriented than 1380 is. The reason is that, despite the high power, the high level of interference on 1520 at night (the primary interferer will be KGDD, I believe, but KOKC--despite being 1500+ miles away--can't be entirely discounted) will severely limit the area where the Snohomish station can deliver a listenable nighttime signal.

 

[SeattleRadioPro]

So.....what's the format gonna be?.......

What else? Automated punk country.

 

[crainbebo]

So.....what's the format gonna be?.......

Andy posted on this board a few months back that 1520--even though it will be 50 kW--at least at night, and maybe full-time--would be much more locally oriented than 1380 is. The reason is that, despite the high power, the high level of interference on 1520 at night (the primary interferer will be KGDD, I believe, but KOKC--despite being 1500+ miles away--can't be entirely discounted) will severely limit the area where the Snohomish station can deliver a listenable nighttime signal.

Oh No, I won't be able to get KGDD-OR or KVTA-CA anymore! Daytime will be useless, nights will also be useless. What about 1510 KGA and KFBK 1530. I'll get too much interference to even pick those up.

-crainbebo

 

[Bongwater]

So.....what's the format gonna be?.......

What else? Automated punk country.

I heard yesterday it was narrowed to three format options: Mongolian country. Polish reggae or Yoko Ono's Greatest Hits......

I can't wait!.......

 

[radiojjh]

You won't have to worry about picking up 1510/KGA much longer over on the westside...the morons at Mapleton that bought KGA(& the other 6 stations in the Citadel cluster here) ONLY did so so they would be able to lower the power from on KGA from 50KW to 15KW so they could raise the power of KPIG in the bay area of San Francisco. That is a sad state of affairs.

At night time 1530/KFBK should still come in, we get them loud and clear here in Spokaloo.....seriously though that's a shame that the N.W. loses a 50KW station that only had to protect 1510/WLAC in Nashville.....their signal will match their ratings here in Spokane...very very BAD....

 

[jdweaver]

Lots of good things Andy can do to make money - though most of them are probably too wierd for this board. Brokered foriegn language, tradio, oldies/news/talk, even travelers info. Of course, the audience level will be non-existent, but still profitable.

The advantage to sports on 1380 has always been it's relatively saleable...but with KJR & KIRO removing the cream, it may be more difficult. You gotta hand it to Andy...he's a real AM radio believer.

 

[Andrew Skotdal]

Gee, where's the LOVE people? I know the market is dying for Acid Polske. Sadly, we will disappoint again.

There are other programming opportunities, but we're open to taking all serious suggestions. The coverage will have limitations, but in many ways it will be better than what we had with 1380 from the old transmitter site - far better at night (1380 died toward Silver Lake at 4:30 in December). It will also cost less to run than the old 1380, even with a higher power bill.

And, sports is still a good format. There are several markets with three sports stations...San Francisco and Phoenix come to mind.

The KGA downgrade to a Class B is a travesty considering they only "improved" KPIG by a couple of kilowatts. Granted, conductivity is a lot better in California, so I'm sure it helped the coverage, but there were only about 55 Class A Clears in the US out of more than 7000 AMs. It's heartbreaking.

Yoko Ono's greatest hits may soon be appearing on KGA, but I can assure you they won't be on the air at 1520, Snohomish.

 

[boiseengineer]

KGA's signal got somewhat neutered in the 90's when it and KJRB were moved south of town to the same site. KGA now fades badly in the North Spokane suburbs. Plus, they actually have a bit of a notch in the night time pattern to protect KGDD 1520 Oregon City. The ol' FCC "ratchett" rule got 'em on that.

 

[Andrew Skotdal]

KGA's signal was slaughtered. They traded graceful 5/8 wave towers close to town for a 1/4 wave mess out on the Moran Prairie where the conductivity low. It's too bad.

 

[SeattleObserver]

Gee, where's the LOVE people? I know the market is dying for Acid Polske. Sadly, we will disappoint again.

There are other programming opportunities, but we're open to taking all serious suggestions.

Respectfully, a hosted oldies-classic hits format would be nice. I am thrown off by the KJR-FM format and can't stand the unhosted, eclectic mix of whatever comes out of 104.5 FM.

KBSG was a great station and "Fastlane" and Mark Christopher have loyal (Snohomish County) fans.

Thanks.

 

[dunno]

Focus on local. Tie in with a Snohomish County blog ala Westseattle blog.com. Look at all the advertiser they have and web hits. Be everything in Snohomish County and give advertisers a online and on air bang for the buck! Music isn't working on AM, sorry S.O.

 

[DanStrassberg]

KGA's signal was slaughtered. They traded graceful 5/8 wave towers close to town for a 1/4 wave mess out on the Moran Prairie where the conductivity low. It's too bad.

The above is substantially incorrect. All three of KGA's patterns--the current two-tower day pattern, which will still be used after KGA reduces its nighttime power; the current three tower night pattern, which will no longer be used; and the new four-tower night pattern, which will be used after KGA powers down at night, all use one 5/8-wave tower--the tallest tower at the site. The day pattern also uses one 166-degree tower. 166 is the height, which, if used by itself, would yield the minimum Class A efficiency of 362.2 mV/m/kW @ 1 km. In addition to the two towers used by day, the current 50 kW night pattern uses one half-wave tower. In addition to the three towers that form the current night pattern, the new four-tower 15-kW night pattern will use a second 166-degree tower. It should be obvious from the above that all three arrays are quite efficient. My understanding, however, is that phasing, caused by high-angle skywave, for which the tall tower is probably repsonsible, causes reception problems close to the site, which is unfortunate.


The statement that someone else made about the night pattern containing a null toward KGDD is also incorrect. In both the existing and new night patterns, radiation toward KGDD exceeds the pattern RMS. In no way does that fit the description of a null. The new night pattern will reduce radiation toward KGDD by a factor of about two, however.

 

[HowardMBurgers]

Andy is correct though in his asertion that the KGA fringe coverage was substantially degraded by comparison after they moved from the original location next to the school to the existing site. Even though the old site was held together with bailing wire and bubble-gum at times, the fact that you could still hear KGA in Seattle during the day was a testament to the combination of antenna system and ground conductivity. Other than KGO and KFBK, I don't think there was another station on the West Coast that performed as well as the old KGA did.

 

[johndavis]

Gee, where's the LOVE people? I know the market is dying for Acid Polske. Sadly, we will disappoint again.

There are other programming opportunities, but we're open to taking all serious suggestions. The coverage will have limitations, but in many ways it will be better than what we had with 1380 from the old transmitter site - far better at night (1380 died toward Silver Lake at 4:30 in December). It will also cost less to run than the old 1380, even with a higher power bill.

And, sports is still a good format. There are several markets with three sports stations...San Francisco and Phoenix come to mind.

The KGA downgrade to a Class B is a travesty considering they only "improved" KPIG by a couple of kilowatts. Granted, conductivity is a lot better in California, so I'm sure it helped the coverage, but there were only about 55 Class A Clears in the US out of more than 7000 AMs. It's heartbreaking.

Yoko Ono's greatest hits may soon be appearing on KGA, but I can assure you they won't be on the air at 1520, Snohomish.

Cool. I have a new console that you can use for the studio.

We have four sports stations in Houston. The only one worth a darn is the 1560 (50kw day, 100 night, soon to be 15kw night) - locally owned & operated, very little syndicated content (they're just now getting Sporting News Radio). Despite the competition having rights to the local teams, KGOW does better talk, and they're starting to beat both CBS & Clear Channel (the rimshot Cumulus FM running ESPN 24/7 isn't a player). Good programming always wins.

http://blogs.houstonpress.com/hairballs/2009/08/kgow_yhe_game_1560.php
http://blogs.houstonpress.com/hairballs/2009/01/kgow_kbme_kilt_ratings.php

 

[boiseengineer]

According to the 301-AM for the CP and 302-AM filed for license they've got a null towards KGDD. Maybe "null" is the wrong terminology for the way the pattern is pulled in towards KGDD. About 1,000 mV/m @1 km less than field maxima. If that reduction wasn't needed it wouldn't be a dog-leg array.

The main reason there's high-angle fading is that 5/8 tower should have been half wave. That's according to Hatfield & Dawson who unfortunately for KGA got involved only after it was designed and built.

The new owners of that array have got real challenge on their hands.

 

[jdweaver]

It warms my heart that there are still engineers who understand the intracacies of a directional AM array. To you I take off my hat and bow down. That's tough engineering and most of it learned the hard way.

Once you've actually built an AM transmitter site...poured the concrete, run the copper radials and stayed up all night wiring a patch panel you look at any installation as a work of art...always appreciating what went into building it.

My family always thinks I'm just 'too wierd Dad' driving by an array and starring at it like a '58 Buick Roadmaster convertible.

 

[Andrew Skotdal]

KGA's signal was slaughtered. They traded graceful 5/8 wave towers close to town for a 1/4 wave mess out on the Moran Prairie where the conductivity low. It's too bad.

All three of KGA's patterns--the current two-tower day pattern, which will still be used after KGA reduces its nighttime power; the current three tower night pattern, which will no longer be used; and the new four-tower night pattern, which will be used after KGA powers down at night, all use one 5/8-wave tower--the tallest tower at the site. The day pattern also uses one 166-degree tower. 166 is the height, which, if used by itself, would yield the minimum Class A efficiency of 362.2 mV/m/kW @ 1 km. In addition to the two towers used by day, the current 50 kW night pattern uses one half-wave tower. In addition to the three towers that form the current night pattern, the new four-tower 15-kW night pattern will use a second 166-degree tower.

I stand corrected. I should have looked. I was recalling the testimony of consulting engineer George Frese from our hearings in 2002 when he testified against us. He indicated that KGA moved to smaller towers and an area where the ground conductivity was horrendous. He derided the new coverage and stated the conductivity between the new site and Spokane was also horrendous. That was my only point, as Howard divined.