Great RW article on FMeXtra!

[radioskeptic]

Keep an eye on the Radio World web site (www.rwonline.com). The Nov. 8 issue isn’t available online yet, but I got my hard copy yesterday, and I want to recommend the following article: “Road-Testing The FMeXtra: Author Tries System In Minnesota, Says It Has ‘Much Potential,’” by Tom H. Jones.

For the few of you on this board who don’t know, FMeXtra uses that part of the analog bandwidth normally occupied by an analog SCA (or SCA’s) and/or RDS to provide a digital signal different from, and far better-sounding than, that of iNiquity’s I-BLOCK system (and without interfering with, or suffering interference from, first adjacents – an especially important consideration in the crowded 88-92 range reserved for NCE’s, as a recent NPR engineering report makes clear).

Here’s an important quotation from the article:

“With 20 percent injection [of the FMeXtra digital signal], on most radials, solid, dropout-free reception was experienced to each station’s 51 to 53 dBu contour.

“With 30 percent injection, dropout-free reception was received to the station’s 46 to 50 dBu contours.”

Compare this with I-BLOCK, which is trouble-prone beyond the 70 dBu contour, and practically useless beyond the 60 dBu!

I'd like to give you a direct link to the article, but it’s not posted yet. It should be on the web in a day or two. Keep checking the RW web site (link above).

And to the iNiquity apologists on this board: Read it and weep!

 

[Chuck]

My friend "El Cheapo" said a while back that he though the major justification for IBOC is the ability to add additional channels, in order to compete with the variety offered by satellite. If that is so, then FMExtra is a far more elegant way of going about that.

 

[ElCheapo]

My friend "El Cheapo" said a while back that he though the major justification for IBOC is the ability to add additional channels, in order to compete with the variety offered by satellite. If that is so, then FMExtra is a far more elegant way of going about that.

I'd have to agree with that. If it performs as advertised, it does seem like it would be a better solution for FM.

 

[700WLW]

My friend "El Cheapo" said a while back that he though the major justification for IBOC is the ability to add additional channels, in order to compete with the variety offered by satellite. If that is so, then FMExtra is a far more elegant way of going about that.

I'd have to agree with that. If it performs as advertised, it does seem like it would be a better solution for FM.

The best solution is to leave the broadcast bands alone !

 

[audiophile.]

I can't see a downside to FMeXtra...

It's a true In Band On Channel!!!!

 

[vsa]

My friend "El Cheapo" said a while back that he though the major justification for IBOC is the ability to add additional channels, in order to compete with the variety offered by satellite. If that is so, then FMExtra is a far more elegant way of going about that.

I'd have to agree with that. If it performs as advertised, it does seem like it would be a better solution for FM.

I agree and I also see no downside.

I can't believe we're seeing some agreement on something here!

 

[Chuck]

I can't see a downside to FMeXtra...

It's a true In Band On Channel!!!!

Nor can I, and my little radio station could even afford it.

 

[ElCheapo]

I guess we will just have to wait and see if anyone ends up producing radios for the format.

One thought that came to my mind is how well would FMeXtra perform alongside HD Radio on the same channel.

Now before everyone goes ballistic, listen to my reasoning...

A significant investment has been made in HD - so I do not see it simply going away any time soon - but if FMeXtra radios were to make it into production and many of the major market stations broadcast both formats and smaller markets started adding FMeXtra as well, it might just catch on.

Eventually, because of the significantly lower deployment costs I think FMeXtra might end up being the winner in a battle of formats because the cost to deploy it would be so much lower.

Even if this is possible though, I don't necessarily see it happening. I would assume HD Radio's licensing contracts probably prevent it.

It would be interesting though - imagine what public interest would be like if every Clear Channel FM started broadcasting FMeXtra by the end of the year with an ad campaign to match.

 

[tankedsecondchance]

sure sounds like a better concept..read many months ago they had a unit ready for production or a contract pending.......

 

[700WLW]

ElCheapo: "... It would be interesting though - imagine what public interest would be like if every Clear Channel FM started broadcasting FMeXtra by the end of the year with an ad campaign to match."

They would probably have the same apathetic reaction, that they have had with HD Radio.

 

[700WLW]

"Road-Testing the FMeXtra"

http://rwonline.com/pages/s.0049/t.463.html

 

[audiophile.]

Great article!

We do need to re-examine SCA injection levels. I say allow 100% maximum for analog, and 30% for digital SCA's (130% total when running DRE). This could be based of a really fast .1 ms peak flasher time (not to exceed 130% at any time).

 

[Chuck]

I guess we will just have to wait and see if anyone ends up producing radios for the format.

One thought that came to my mind is how well would FMeXtra perform alongside HD Radio on the same channel.

According to a guy named Lyle Henry, a consultant who specializes in SCA devices, FMExtra works just fine on an IBOC station. This summer, he has been traveling around the country testing this technology on real radio stations. I'm fairly sure that it was one of his demos that was written up in Radio World.

Look back a few hundred posts, and you will note that I said my vision of where we are going involves radios that will be able to decode either format. In fact, if someone comes up with a better format than either of these, then it could be decoded too with a simple software update. Both systems are software based, more than hardware based. They all use a DSP chip set, so it shouldn't be too hard to figure out. HDTV's do it right now. If I recall correctly, there are 18 ATSC digital TV standards. My HDTV works fine.

David (Old Gringo) promptly replied that the Ibiquity people would never allow that to happen. Maybe so, but if they are that short sighted, they deserve whatever they get.

There is no reason this has to be "all or nothing."

 

[audiophile.]

Better yet, make a FREE PC software solution for decoding DRE, just like DRM. It's really easy to pick off a composite signal from your FM tuner...

Every serious geek could experiment with the technology, until the production receivers kick in...

 

[Chuck]

Another interesting idea would be to make a radio that did analog AM-FM, HD, FMExtra and Wi-Fi Internet radio. At least, that would be worth paying for. The concept is not exactly new. Back in the early days of FM, it was fairly common to find tuners that did AM-FM and Short-wave. At least you knew that the radio had use beyond the (then new) FM technology. That marketing worked fairly well back then. You'll notice that Polk's attempt takes a similar approach.

 

[pqgeorge]

Now this sounds like better quality and a more cost effective way of integrating digital broadcasting to the existing FM stations. At about $9000, any station (even the non-commercial LP's and the Class D's) could join the digital age with FMeXtra, without upsetting the status-quo unlike IBOC. I would love to test it myself on some my stations (and maybe my own Class D).

Peter Q. George (K1XRB)

 

[Chuck]

Now this sounds like better quality and a more cost effective way of integrating digital broadcasting to the existing FM stations. At about $9000, any station (even the non-commercial LP's and the Class D's) could join the digital age with FMeXtra, without upsetting the status-quo unlike IBOC. I would love to test it myself on some my stations (and maybe my own Class D).

Peter Q. George (K1XRB)

It is, Peter. I'm sure it has its problems and bugs too, but at the price, a lot of smaller stations would be willing to "take a flyer" to see what they could do with it. At least, it is not destructive to anything but your checking account. It also appears to be more robust than IBOC.

My station has a small budget, but we could find the money to do it. I'm not sure what we'd put on a secondary channel, but there are lots of un-served markets out there. We could dust off our old automation computer and have at it. You never know, we might come up with something good. If you could get enough small stations doing it, you could probably get enough "buzz" going to sell some radios.

There no way we're going to spend the money Ibiquity wants for licensing and equipment, unless it means pay the piper or cease broadcasting. Even then, it could be a difficult decision.

 

[SUPERCASTER]

It's taken years to overcome all the false iBiquity propaganda, but at last some of us are looking at the same page.
The iBiquity AM or FM HD Radio system is a defective, destructive, problematic, unnecessary, expensive, proprietary system that causes far more harm then any possible good. It is not compatible with current AM and FM station assignments, and therefore should not get final FCC approval. In fact, FCC interim authority should end. The HD Radio iBiquity system does not meet any of it's claims, specs, coverage, or promises, and it insidiously invades adjacent channels with jamming buzz. It holds no promise for the future, as bandwidth will not be reduced when the analog is dropped, and therefore power can not be increased without creating vast, buzzing, multi-channel, interference zones between stations.
FM has a built in "capture ratio" that has been taken into account in the assignment of FM stations. Pure digital transmission has no such advantage. The bits just get scrambled and jam each other, in a vast buzz zone.
FMeXtra is the HD digital answer, and future of FM. www.dreinc.com

If some broadcasters bought the toxic, fraudulent, hype pumped out by the HD Radio peddlers to sell this problematic system, then they should return it for a full refund. It was totally misrepresented.
After all we now have until 2010 before the big "HD Radio rollout" begins. Tell HD Radio to "buzz off" until then.
Keep in mind the iBiquity HD Radio systrem requires a much wider RF front end in recievers then FMeXtra.

 

[700WLW]

It's taken years to overcome all the false iBiquity propaganda, but at last some of us are looking at the same page.
The iBiquity AM or FM HD Radio system is a defective, destructive, problematic, unnecessary, expensive, proprietary system that causes far more harm then any possible good. It is not compatible with current AM and FM station assignments, and therefore should not get final FCC approval. In fact, FCC interim authority should end. The HD Radio iBiquity system does not meet any of it's claims, specs, coverage, or promises, and it insidiously invades adjacent channels with jamming buzz. It holds no promise for the future, as bandwidth will not be reduced when the analog is dropped, and therefore power can not be increased without creating vast, buzzing, multi-channel, interference zones between stations.
FM has a built in "capture ratio" that has been taken into account in the assignment of FM stations. Pure digital transmission has no such advantage. The bits just get scrambled and jam each other, in a vast buzz zone.
FMeXtra is the HD digital answer, and future of FM. www.dreinc.com

If some broadcasters bought the toxic, fraudulent, hype pumped out by the HD Radio peddlers to sell this problematic system, then they should return it for a full refund. It was totally misrepresented.
After all we now have until 2010 before the big "HD Radio rollout" begins. Tell HD Radio to "buzz off" until then.
Keep in mind the iBiquity HD Radio systrem requires a much wider RF front end in recievers then FMeXtra.

SUPERCASTER,

I still don't see the point in HD Radio, or FMeXtrea - there are still too many AM/FM stations to choose from, and like everyone else, I just change stations, when I want to hear jazz versus classic rock, etc. I just don't see the point in extra channels, that are squeezed into the already crowded broadcast bands - and just like in Canada, nobody seems to care...

 

[audiophile.]

The bottom line is nobody has a problem with the FmeXtra system. If FCC is gonna stick us with a system, how about one that doesn't cause interference, and one that everyone can afford...