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dand5780
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And the biggest threat to the Buffalo News is WBEN.
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Groundhog Day
- Thread starter Element9
- Start date
And the biggest threat to the Buffalo News is WBEN.
Yeah, Beach and Bauerle and Rush are a real threat to real news. I guess that would make them a threat to WIVB, WGRZ, and WKBW too.
KB as Sports has a 0.5 and 107.7 a 1.2.
WBEN is a fossil.
If Corporate tries a little harder, a Zero share is within reach.
Many listeners liked the Lake because it offered some quality and not just
The same 200 burned out songs.
Radio has alienated many listeners. They simply "opt out"...
WBEN is a fossil.
If Corporate tries a little harder, a Zero share is within reach.
Many listeners liked the Lake because it offered some quality and not just
The same 200 burned out songs.
Radio has alienated many listeners. They simply "opt out"...
Well, now they've got a different 200 "alternative" songs.
Not true at all.
The biggest threat to the BN is the availability of news online.
If I want in-depth info on a local news story, I go to the BN, never WBEN.
WBEN doesn't have the time or the manpower to do much in-depth coverage. From what I gather, their newsroom is a veritable ghostown these days.
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There isn't one commercial radio station in Buffalo that doesn't use the Buffalo News or its website as the primary source of news or news leads. This goes for WBEN. WBFO uses stories from The News as well, but at least exercises the professional courtesy of attributing the origin of the story to The News. WBFO often elaborates on the stories by assigning reporters to follow up on the stories.
WBEN isn't the news station it was as little as five years ago and it's certainly not the news station it was twenty years ago when it had direct competition from WGR, which was a more contemporary sounding news-talk station, due in large part to Critical Mass (a Randy Michaels offshoot), which consulted WGR.
This having been noted, WBEN continues to out score WBFO by a 4 to 1 margin in the ratings 12+ and 25-54. Listeners tune to WBEN out of habit more than for any other reason. The listeners are older and old habits die hard. If Buffalo-Niagara Falls was a PPM market, WBEN's 12+ rating would be about two to three shares lower than those generated by diaries.
There's no question about the value of the Buffalo News website for detailed reporting and breaking news. It's well maintained and especially over the past year, it's more current than any of the TV stations' websites which are used as much as promotional vehicles for their news actors, er, anchors, than news itself.
WBEN isn't the news station it was as little as five years ago and it's certainly not the news station it was twenty years ago when it had direct competition from WGR, which was a more contemporary sounding news-talk station, due in large part to Critical Mass (a Randy Michaels offshoot), which consulted WGR.
This having been noted, WBEN continues to out score WBFO by a 4 to 1 margin in the ratings 12+ and 25-54. Listeners tune to WBEN out of habit more than for any other reason. The listeners are older and old habits die hard. If Buffalo-Niagara Falls was a PPM market, WBEN's 12+ rating would be about two to three shares lower than those generated by diaries.
There's no question about the value of the Buffalo News website for detailed reporting and breaking news. It's well maintained and especially over the past year, it's more current than any of the TV stations' websites which are used as much as promotional vehicles for their news actors, er, anchors, than news itself.
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The biggest reason that the Buffalo News site doesn't dominate even more is because they're now limiting access to paid subscribers. That's driving people seeking local news to local TV websites, not WBEN. As E9 noted, WBEN only gets mentioned because Entercom is the only local commercial group with a news department.
Imagine how great radio news coverage would be if the Evening News was once again allowed to own WBEN.
But no...the FCC feels it would be too much media concentration to allow such a thing.
The cross-ownership rule came up again this year, and once again they decided to leave it in place. Yet they continue to permit cable companies to buy broadcasting companies.
Doesn't anyone see the hypocrisy here?
But no...the FCC feels it would be too much media concentration to allow such a thing.
The cross-ownership rule came up again this year, and once again they decided to leave it in place. Yet they continue to permit cable companies to buy broadcasting companies.
Doesn't anyone see the hypocrisy here?
Radio stations have been using local newspapers as news sources since time immemorial — and that’s not a bad thing. While original reporting arguably is preferable, any news on the radio is a good thing, in my opinion.…
If you don’t mind my regurgitating my study and proposals from a few years ago: In 2009, I advocated for lifting the newspaper/broadcast cross-ownership ban — specifically to aid struggling newspapers and radio stations (particularly AM) … and, ideally, as a related benefit, to foster increased news on the radio (as newspapers would not only be radio’s news source but news partners) — and possibly even news startups. At the time, when primarily it was only big-media proponents arguing in favor of lifting the ban (for much different reasons than mine), it might have seemed like a kooky idea to anti-media consolidation types (like myself). That’s why I tied my proposal to national and local broadcast ownership-cap tradeoffs:
2009 policy proposals:
• Local and national radio station ownership cap reductions:
— National broadcast ownership cap of 120 stations, including any combination of AM, FM or TV stations
— Local broadcast ownership cap of four stations per market, including no more than two in the same service (AM, FM or TV) per market
• Elimination of newspaper/broadcast cross-ownership ban
• Digital-spectrum reallocation to independent, local broadcasters
• Expanded licensing of low-power FM (LPFM) stations
• Sharpened and strictly enforced studio staffing requirements
I still think cross-ownership, with tighter broadcast ownership caps, potentially could be good for both print and radio … and listeners and society, as a whole. Now, some five-plus years later, lifting the ban seems to be getting renewed attention. Regrettably, but not surprisingly (due to economic realities), however, no one is discussing new broadcast ownership caps. And, frankly, after the hole radio (read: corporate management) dug itself, even I’ve moved on from the issue.…
Sharpened studio-staffing rules was, admittedly, most likely a pipe dream … but at least there has been good progress recently on LPFM.
If you’re interested reading more about the cross-ownership debate, here’s a good discussion (with multiple viewpoints presented, including in article comments):
CJR: How to fix the media ownership debate
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To tie loosening of cross ownership to tightening of broadcast ownership rules penalizes existing radio companies, who aren't interested in buying newspapers.
If you really want to help newspapers, or smaller broadcasters, you have to tie new broadcast limits on companies that would buy newspapers, or newspapers that would buy broadcasting.
So if Clear Channel wants to buy newspapers, they have to sell a certain number of radio stations. If Fox wants to buy more newspapers, they have to sell some TV stations.
If you really want to help newspapers, or smaller broadcasters, you have to tie new broadcast limits on companies that would buy newspapers, or newspapers that would buy broadcasting.
So if Clear Channel wants to buy newspapers, they have to sell a certain number of radio stations. If Fox wants to buy more newspapers, they have to sell some TV stations.
I agree … and, essentially, that’s exactly what I was proposing. Though not explicitly stated above, existing ownership would be “grandfathered” — because that’s typically the case — and only new deals would be affected.
D
dand5780
Guest
Well that all depends if they would be reporting news, or if they would be reporting the same "snooze" they have in the birdcage liner.
That's what makes the snarky remarks about the Buff News on WBEN so ironic.
If I want the most detail on a story, I would never go to WBEN's website. Never.
I would start with the BN and then work my way through the TV stations.
WBEN's news department is minimalist...and it shows.
There's nothing unique about any of these Buffalo formats.
Every city has the same thing.
The Classic Rock format hasn't changed in 20 years.
Same burned out music and self absorbed jocks.
News Talk keeps spewing the same nonsense.
You know the product sucks when you have to bribe people with the
Illusion of winning money...
Every city has the same thing.
The Classic Rock format hasn't changed in 20 years.
Same burned out music and self absorbed jocks.
News Talk keeps spewing the same nonsense.
You know the product sucks when you have to bribe people with the
Illusion of winning money...
Where in commercial society do we NOT get bribed? Special discounts, coupons, buy one-get one free offers entice consumers at every turn. Americans are hooked on mega lotteries and gambling. It's the way commerce is conducted.
Despite 97 Rock's seemingly shallow playlist, if you asked 20 men between the ages of 45 and 64 in Erie and Niagara counties to name the Classic Rock station in Buffalo, 18 would respond 97 Rock. Of those 20 men, 15 would tell you they listened to the station within the last week.
Some listeners may have preferred the Lake, and to be fair, it reached a level of acceptance and awareness greater than the news format that followed and to this point, the alternative format. But the Lake never reached a level of awareness even half that of 97 Rock. There are many reasons for this. Don't blame the signal.
It takes time, effort and money to build a brand. Most of all, it takes inspired leadership and programming. Adults like to have fun and get jazzed about music and events... and personalities. The Lake launched and languished. It was novel at first and interesting to a degree, but it wasn't exciting. The Lake wasn't a fun station to listen to. Fun doesn't mean puerile. The Lake could have infused some Darien Lake with its History Museum mentality. As previous posters have noted, there was a reason for the lack of direction.
The new Alt 107.7 appears to be equally uninspiring and the early ratings bear this out. Again. Don't blame the signal.
Despite 97 Rock's seemingly shallow playlist, if you asked 20 men between the ages of 45 and 64 in Erie and Niagara counties to name the Classic Rock station in Buffalo, 18 would respond 97 Rock. Of those 20 men, 15 would tell you they listened to the station within the last week.
Some listeners may have preferred the Lake, and to be fair, it reached a level of acceptance and awareness greater than the news format that followed and to this point, the alternative format. But the Lake never reached a level of awareness even half that of 97 Rock. There are many reasons for this. Don't blame the signal.
It takes time, effort and money to build a brand. Most of all, it takes inspired leadership and programming. Adults like to have fun and get jazzed about music and events... and personalities. The Lake launched and languished. It was novel at first and interesting to a degree, but it wasn't exciting. The Lake wasn't a fun station to listen to. Fun doesn't mean puerile. The Lake could have infused some Darien Lake with its History Museum mentality. As previous posters have noted, there was a reason for the lack of direction.
The new Alt 107.7 appears to be equally uninspiring and the early ratings bear this out. Again. Don't blame the signal.
FUN can mean different things to different people.
Some people don't think fun is 8 minutes of commercials followed by empty
Jock banter, moronic caller requests, and "Freebird".
Many people also eat at Burger King regularly.
So what?
The Lake offered disenfranchised listeners an option.
And yes, the signal is a limitation.
However, realistic success is possible with quality content.
The Lake proved that.
Some people don't think fun is 8 minutes of commercials followed by empty
Jock banter, moronic caller requests, and "Freebird".
Many people also eat at Burger King regularly.
So what?
The Lake offered disenfranchised listeners an option.
And yes, the signal is a limitation.
However, realistic success is possible with quality content.
The Lake proved that.
The signal on 107.7 has had reasonable success in the past with quality content. It just hasn't had that kind of content in a LONG time. If The Lake had been a "resonable success", it would still be around. Sources tell me that it simply wasn't self-supporting. Blame it on paying too much for the signal if you want, but these days you can't be a money-losing FM for long unless you're flanking a station that's a major success. Even then, they'll try for break-even. If I had to guess, I'd say that "Alternative 107.7" is nicking Townsquare's Jack as the P3 choice for when the big guys are in those 8-minute stopsets. Nobody's abandoning another rock format - or another music service - to tune in 107.7 these days.
But wasn't it Entercom that created The Lake in the first place in 2004?
My suspicion is they feel that classic rock or "we play anything" is already being done in the market. And even if they could recreate the niche they had ten years ago, that audience is now ten years older and not as marketable as it was then. Now if Cumulus indeed flips one of their rock stations to country, that would change things considerably.
My suspicion is they feel that classic rock or "we play anything" is already being done in the market. And even if they could recreate the niche they had ten years ago, that audience is now ten years older and not as marketable as it was then. Now if Cumulus indeed flips one of their rock stations to country, that would change things considerably.
Entercom paid $10.5-million for 107.7 because then-Citadel bid them up on the property. Citadel was interested in taking a shot at the Kiss-Star combo and adding more women to the already-strong male numbers generated by 97-Rock/The Edge. That was also the reason for killing "Oldies 104" and changing it to "The Mix".
Entercom overpaid for 107.7 to protect its existing stations, and went with "The Lake" in an attempt give Farid some dyspepsia by knocking 97-Rock's repetitive approach to Classic Rock. Since 104.1 was abandoning oldies (and men), there was also some available audience there up for grabs.
Unfortunately, they picked a VERY stilted approach to the format. They hired some talented people, but they never let them develop a rapport with the audience. It was a classic case of micro-management by a programmer who had no experience in the market, but was "smarter than everybody in the room".
The Lake's numbers were marginal, and ebbed over time, especially after local hosts were cut to reduce expenses. Yes, the final blow was the trend toward adding FM simulcasts to AM talkers, but most revenue on 107.7 came as a throw-in on combos with other Entercom stations. The one thing that would generate even less revenue is simulcasting WBEN, which wasn't going to generate ANY new revenue without an increase in numbers.
As Entercom found out, WBEN's failure to attract younger listeners had nothing to do with the band the station occupies. It has everything to do with content. The better alternative would have been to use 107.7 to fill in the nulls that plague WGR at night, especially toward the east. When Sabres hockey - and later Bills football - are major investments, it makes a lot of sense to make that content LISTENABLE to the entire metro, especially during the winter, and especially in the car. That could increase the revenue for WGR by making spots more valuable because more people could actually hear them.
The alternative format could generate more money than the WBEN simulcast. It may approach what The Lake generated as a throw-in on deals, but additional expenses for talent and promotion aren't likely to pay the freight. It does give them the chance to add NTR through concerts and other promotions that may swing the balance closer to the the black on the ledger sheet. It still isn't likely to make a major ratings impact. I do give them credit for trying something new that may attract some disenfranchised listeners back to radio at least part-time.
Entercom overpaid for 107.7 to protect its existing stations, and went with "The Lake" in an attempt give Farid some dyspepsia by knocking 97-Rock's repetitive approach to Classic Rock. Since 104.1 was abandoning oldies (and men), there was also some available audience there up for grabs.
Unfortunately, they picked a VERY stilted approach to the format. They hired some talented people, but they never let them develop a rapport with the audience. It was a classic case of micro-management by a programmer who had no experience in the market, but was "smarter than everybody in the room".
The Lake's numbers were marginal, and ebbed over time, especially after local hosts were cut to reduce expenses. Yes, the final blow was the trend toward adding FM simulcasts to AM talkers, but most revenue on 107.7 came as a throw-in on combos with other Entercom stations. The one thing that would generate even less revenue is simulcasting WBEN, which wasn't going to generate ANY new revenue without an increase in numbers.
As Entercom found out, WBEN's failure to attract younger listeners had nothing to do with the band the station occupies. It has everything to do with content. The better alternative would have been to use 107.7 to fill in the nulls that plague WGR at night, especially toward the east. When Sabres hockey - and later Bills football - are major investments, it makes a lot of sense to make that content LISTENABLE to the entire metro, especially during the winter, and especially in the car. That could increase the revenue for WGR by making spots more valuable because more people could actually hear them.
The alternative format could generate more money than the WBEN simulcast. It may approach what The Lake generated as a throw-in on deals, but additional expenses for talent and promotion aren't likely to pay the freight. It does give them the chance to add NTR through concerts and other promotions that may swing the balance closer to the the black on the ledger sheet. It still isn't likely to make a major ratings impact. I do give them credit for trying something new that may attract some disenfranchised listeners back to radio at least part-time.
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