HD power levels increasing?

[EasyPeazy]

I spoke with someone yesterday who said the Commission is considering allowing FM HD stations to significantly increase their HD power levels.

Has anyone else heard this?

 

[SUPERCASTER]

I spoke with someone yesterday who said the Commission is considering allowing FM HD stations to significantly increase their HD power levels.

Has anyone else heard this?

Nope.
Just more BS in the long list of lies (LLL) from HD promoters and the cartel. The FCC has not yet, given HD radio final approval at the present power levels, much less higher power levels, and the multicasting (HD2, 3 etc.) only has experimental authorization. More power for HD would open an unprecedented floodgate of lawsuits, the like of which, the nation has never seen, and the legal costs and litigation would strangle broadcast radio for decades.

 

[EasyPeazy]

I spoke with someone yesterday who said the Commission is considering allowing FM HD stations to significantly increase their HD power levels.

Has anyone else heard this?

Nope.
Just more BS in the long list of lies (LLL) from HD promoters and the cartel. The FCC has not yet, given HD radio final approval at the present power levels, much less higher power levels, and the multicasting (HD2, 3 etc.) only has experimental authorization. More power for HD would open an unprecedented floodgate of lawsuits, the like of which, the nation has never seen, and the legal costs and litigation would strangle broadcast radio for decades.

I think you hit on the key point there - "the FCC has not yet given HD radio final approval at the present power levels." From what I understand, the final power level when approved will be higher.

I doubt there would be lawsuits.

Of course, I doubt all of your interference claims. With FM HD already on most stations in the densely populated areas of New York and Pennsylvania, if things were anywhere near as bad as you say they are there would already be a massive public outcry - not a miniscule public outcry from 5 or 6 people posting on this board.

 

[SUPERCASTER]

I spoke with someone yesterday who said the Commission is considering allowing FM HD stations to significantly increase their HD power levels.

Has anyone else heard this?

Nope.
Just more BS in the long list of lies (LLL) from HD promoters and the cartel. The FCC has not yet, given HD radio final approval at the present power levels, much less higher power levels, and the multicasting (HD2, 3 etc.) only has experimental authorization. More power for HD would open an unprecedented floodgate of lawsuits, the like of which, the nation has never seen, and the legal costs and litigation would strangle broadcast radio for decades.

I think you hit on the key point there - "the FCC has not yet given HD radio final approval at the present power levels." From what I understand, the final power level when approved will be higher.

I doubt there would be lawsuits.

Of course, I doubt all of your interference claims. With FM HD already on most stations in the densely populated areas of New York and Pennsylvania, if things were anywhere near as bad as you say they are there would already be a massive public outcry - not a miniscule public outcry from 5 or 6 people posting on this board.

There has been a massive public outcry against HD radio and many of the FCC's recent anti-public decisions including more media concentration, more stations and free spectrum for conglomerates.
The FCC is scheduled to hold the next public hearing in Harrisburg, PA.
http://www.radio-info.com/smf/index.php/topic,61187.0.html
http://www.radio-info.com/smf/index.php/topic,63813.0.html
You are either clueless, or just here, peddling the HD cartel's line of defective HD radios.
The only power levels that are increasing are those of HD promoters BS.

 

[EasyPeazy]

There has been a massive public outcry against HD radio and many of the FCC's recent anti-public decisions including more media concentration, more stations and free spectrum for conglomerates.
The FCC is scheduled to hold the next public hearing in Harrisburg, PA.
http://www.radio-info.com/smf/index.php/topic,61187.0.html
http://www.radio-info.com/smf/index.php/topic,63813.0.html
You are either clueless, or just here, peddling the HD cartel's line of defective HD radios.
The only power levels that are increasing are those of HD promoters BS.

Oh, I can totally see anti-corporate radio types whining about it effectively giving stations more channels. We're talking about interference though. How much of that whining has been about interference?

 

[Mike Walker]

An engineer friend of mine said that it has ALWAYS been on the table that HD power levels on FM would be increased down the road. The "rollout mode" was meant to be at a lowish level, which would be incrementally increased to just below the point where interference issues become obvious. At that level, most differences between HD and analog coverage will likely be so greatly diminished, or even eliminated (depending upon circumstances) as to be a non-issue.

Here's a Google Trends chart which backs me up http://www.theproductionroom.net/googletrends.html

 

[Mike Walker]

Sorry, couldn't resist. Just wanted to demonstrate that there isn't a chart or graph online to illustrate everything on the planet! GEEZ!

 

[SUPERCASTER]

An engineer friend of mine said that it has ALWAYS been on the table that HD power levels on FM would be increased down the road. The "rollout mode" was meant to be at a lowish level, which would be incrementally increased to just below the point where interference issues become obvious. At that level, most differences between HD and analog coverage will likely be so greatly diminished, or even eliminated (depending upon circumstances) as to be a non-issue.

Here's a Google Trends chart which backs me up http://www.theproductionroom.net/googletrends.html

Isn't that just a copy of the iBiquity/HD radio early adopters page?

 

[tomservo]

So... How much more power will they authorize before there IS interference on FM? Will it even be a problem? C'mon, I want a technical breakdown of just how much will be too much. How long before a radio scanning the dial (in seek/scan mode) will stop on an adjacent channel due to IBOC noise? AM radios already suffer from this problem. I was scanning the dial just outside of Springfield, Illinois and kept stopping on 660 and 680 due to WSCR's noise... Well over 100 miles out!

 

[Ray22]

Scanning problems already exist...
Even at low IBOC levels many car radios in scan mode already stop on both adjacent channel of every IBOC station, within 20-30 miles of transmitter. This happens on both FM and AM bands on some radios. Seem to be worse on FM band in certain markets.

 

[Mike Walker]

What you say is likely true Ray. I haven't personally experienced it, but it makes sense. However I would submit that five years ago before HD existed, lots of digital radios still stopped on adjacent channels. I have several radios that stop on adjacent channels, when there are no HD stations anywhere near. My point? This is a defect in the radio! We can't really make decisions based upon scanning capabilities of radios. Maybe I'm unusual (I am in lots of ways), but I NEVER use scan. I have never trusted the damn things not to miss something BETWEEN the stations it stops on. I use the up or down buttons and go frequency by frequency through the band. No radio will decide which stations are worthy of my attention!

A radio that can't tell the difference between a frequency modulated main channel, and a digital datastream that is one percent of the level of a "real" station is a pretty poorly designed radio (or at least the scan part of it is).

 

[w9wi]

Of course, I doubt all of your interference claims. With FM HD already on most stations in the densely populated areas of New York and Pennsylvania, if things were anywhere near as bad as you say they are there would already be a massive public outcry - not a miniscule public outcry from 5 or 6 people posting on this board.

I wonder if members of the general public would recognize adjacent-channel interference from IBOC when they heard it?

Interference from a new analog signal is recognizable: it sounds like, well, a radio station! Interference from other types of transmitters - pagers, say - listeners wouldn't know what kind of signal it is that's interfering, but they'd recognize it as a signal, as interference from another transmitter.

The sidebands sound like noise - like any station they might be interfering with is either weak or off the air entirely. I wonder how many listeners believe that's precisely what's going on - that the station they used to listen to went off the air or reduced power, or that there's something wrong with their radio?

There have been a number of stories on various engineering boards of situations where for some reason an IBOC operation has led to particularly severe interference and/or interference in a particularly heavily-populated area. It generally seems the situation has come to light as a result of listeners complaining that the station has become weaker than normal.

 

[stevenNOLA]

Scanning problems already exist...
Even at low IBOC levels many car radios in scan mode already stop on both adjacent channel of every IBOC station, within 20-30 miles of transmitter. This happens on both FM and AM bands on some radios. Seem to be worse on FM band in certain markets.

Low quality tuners have this problem. Neither my home stereo (onkyo) nor the rental car (chrysler) I had a few days ago did this. I can see the 100kw transmitters from my backyard.