HD Radio missing a marketing opportunity ---

[Tom Wells]

I said "radio" rather than communications.
Amateurs were given assignments, with specific limitations.

I suppose if I had unlimited funds to purchase "justice", I would do so.

These federal agencies were created to prevent such influence, whether by individuals, groups or corporations.

 

[TheBigA]

These federal agencies were created to prevent such influence, whether by individuals, groups or corporations.

No one has any proof that influence has taken place. It's all just assumption.

 

[Tom Wells]

The noise in the AM radio is living proof for me.

I'm not at all happy that cellphones have become distracting keyboard data devices causing many injuries and deaths,
but /sarcasm mode on/ I'm sure no influence was involved there, either../sarcasm mode off/.

 

[JH_Radio]

I'm about 15 miles away from the transmitter, near Phillly. I own and Insignia Narrator. with the antenna it came with, there are still dropouts if the antenna isn't up straight. in The Villages FL, you can forget about any HD reception. WOCL HD2 mostly doesn't come in. WMGFHD2 sounds watery (and that's with the antenna outside my window.) inside you can forget about it. however i can get much better FM analog reception. for AM in HD here in Philly, i'd like to try a terk advantage loop to see how well it might do. the internal AM antenna the radio came with sucks.
However, isn't it true that on FM at least, the signal is only 10% of the analog signal coverage? in other words the HD is only 10% of the power of analog? That could explain why the reception isn't any good unless its local stations.
with my external antenna, i can think of one example of HD sounding better than analog and tha'ts only cause it gets rid of the hiss found on my Yamaha T-85. tha'ts WZZO.
i haven't been able to tell an audio difference between analog and HD 1's. HD2's aren't bad. once you start gettin to HD3's and 4's then you can tell the difference i think.
WIPHD3 the mids sound funky. i dunno how to describe it. the version on the web has better qualety audio and that's just sad.
if the station runs HD 2 only both sound good enough for me. even the stations that runs hd3's and 4's the main signal and HD2 sound fine. corse it could be depending on the processing of the air chain too.

I've only owned this HD radio and never experienced any others unless you count the one in my mom's car, but listening to that without headphones isn't a good way for me to get what HD sounds like, especially since she doesn't drive far so the chances of the signal dropping out are slim to none.
which bbrings me to a question. does the sound qualety of an HD signal change depending on what kinda radio you have like analog? or doesn't that mattter since its digital and its either on or off.

 

[rbrucecarter5]

i'd like to try a terk advantage loop to see how well it might do. the internal AM antenna the radio came with sucks.

The Q of the Terk AM Advantage is so sharp that it doesn't help HD reception. It has gain on the analog portion of the AM station at the expense of the HD sidebands. What does help is to take the wire on that little plastic loop and wind it on a larger frame. My AM radios that use the small loops turn into DX machines when I do that. Since there is hardly any HD AM left, I can't vouch for it getting better HD reception - but it is a relatively broadband loop feeding a receiver that is broadband enough to get the HD sidebands.

 

[Ai4i]

It is clear that the original intent of the FRC and the FCC were to protect radio.
It's also clear that the job of the FDA was to protect food and drug safety.

Neither radio nor pharmaceuticals exist.
Only money exists.
Nothing more; nothing less.
Only money; that is all.

 

[Tom Wells]

It is clear that the original intent of the FRC and the FCC were to protect radio.
It's also clear that the job of the FDA was to protect food and drug safety.

Neither radio nor pharmaceuticals exist.
Only money exists.
Nothing more; nothing less.
Only money; that is all.

Gosh, thanks for the honesty.
I live in an opposite world, where I do the most I can and the difference I can make is the bottom line.
You speak as a corporation would. I am a human being, where effort, intent, and care come foremost.

 

[Ai4i]

This is not my preference, just my observation.
We are both members of the lower 98%.

 

[Tom Wells]

This is not my preference, just my observation.
We are both members of the lower 98%.

Well, then.
Isn't our duty to fly in the face of "what seems to be" ?

I reference at this point James Brown's "It's a Man's World", where after man invented everything that a man could,
he made money, to buy another man.

 

[nd2023]

The key words...in my town. If it was not in your town, you wouldn't be hearing it without dropouts. HD is dropout free only to the 80 dBu contour. It goes in and out until the 65 dBu contour, after which you have to hold the antenna in just the right way to hear an HD2. The analog is listenable to the 50 dBu contour, and people willing to put up with static listen out to the 35 dBu contour. DXers detect it at the 25-30 dBu contour.

Of course the reception depends upon location. My statement was simply that your problems with drop-out are not universal. I don't know what the contours are here but I can usually listen to analog FM (towers on Phoenix South Mountain) about 100 miles SE (mostly flat) and 60-70 miles N (into the mountains) without a problem. My HD signal is just about 15-20 miles shorter than analog. I all my travels around the metro area I have found only one small spot that causes HD signal drop-out and that is up beside the Scottsdale Air Park which may have something to do with airport ops.

I too have noticed better HD reception with the 100kw class C's out west, rather than in the crowded northeast. 15-20 miles for a class B is half its coverage area.

 

[TowerLamp]

I too have noticed better HD reception with the 100kw class C's out west, rather than in the crowded northeast. 15-20 miles for a class B is half its coverage area.
[/quote]

Of course. Take NYC and Empire State Bldg. as an eg. The ERP there for most signals is 4 or 6KW. With HD sigs at -20dBc we are talking a roaring 40 or 60 watts (to cover NYC, are you NUTS)! So of course, there's no building penetration at all. What was the FCC thinking...they weren't. They took iBiquity's lab data at face value.
Now over to the West Coast, with its 100KW signals offers HD a much better shot at real world coverage. And now with the FCC opening the door to -10 dBc, HD will give analog coverage a run for its money. I've done some mobile plots of -20, -14 and -10 HD transmission. The upgrade is well worth the cost. It's a major difference in the HD listening experience. A number of midclass automakers are now making HD a standard option. HD will help keep broadcast radio relevant in the battle for that LCD screen in the automobile console stack. Improved rbds data, "Artist Experience" graphics are all steps in the right direction. I know that may sound a bit "cheerleader" but, no I don't work for iBiquity! Just a fan of broadcast radio.

 

[Chuck]

I wonder how that "Artist Experience" idea will work out?. It seems dangerous to me. It is bad enough with people texting and otherwise fooling with their phones. Modern cars are confusing enough without adding more clutter and distractions to the dashboard.

I noticed today that Clear Channel is being sued for unauthorized use of artists pictures. I'm not sure where they were using them, but I can see this may open up a whole new can of worms. The next thing you know, the artists will want to be paid for using their album art.

Besides, radio with pictures is called Television, and there is an industry that does that way better than any radio add-on will ever do. The whole idea of radio is to entertain and amuse people while they do something else. That is not as easy to do with TV.

 

[MRFLASHPORT]

the driver distraction systems, aka touchscreen heads up displays, are the worst idea ever to see the light of day more than IBOC. Ford just announced they are brining back "the knobs" after Consumer Reports blasted their Sync UI as being one of the most convaluted, difficult and downright dangerous ideas in the new dashboards of their cars.

I agree. At least with conventional knobs, rocker switches, etc- there is a PHYSICAL layer a driver can operate by feel- I do it everyday on my 2005 Hyundai. I know where the A/C switch is, the fan control knob, and I've "learned" how to use my Kenwood HD radio (which has conventional preset buttons you can store HD subchannels to!) without LOOKING at it.

Touchscreens are a BAD IDEA. Why not just let drivers run their cars by an app on their cellphones? They're constantly fiddling and looking at them anyway. :

The Artist Experience works? Ha ha, all of the HD stations in Atlanta (both HD1 and 2's) barely have the artist name and song title scrolling correctly. My Kenwood supposedly has Itunes tagging, but I've NEVER seen the "TAG" indicator lit. Most of the broadcasters in Atlanta have given up on doing anything with HD radio long ago, except Cox. They are about the ONLY ones with unique programming on their HD2's that isn't being used as a translator feed.

 

[Ai4i]

Take NYC and Empire State Bldg. as an eg.
With HD sigs at -20dBc we are talking a roaring 40 or 60 watts

In the case of 'QXR, that would be 6w.

Now over to the West Coast,

If you are referring to LA, remember that with grandfathered signals, the maximum HD signal permitted is the greater of -20db or...
-10db of what the station would have if it were licensed under today's rules.

 

[rbrucecarter5]

If you are referring to LA, remember that with grandfathered signals, the maximum HD signal permitted is the greater of -20db or...
-10db of what the station would have if it were licensed under today's rules.

LA stations do not broadcast with 100 kW, either, due to the HAAT being more than 2000 feet. The FCC has a sliding scale of ERP depending on how high the antenna bays are. It is not a problem if you live in the Los Angeles basin itself, but go over a mountain and you are in a bad coverage area immediately. I haven't been out there with an HD radio yet, but I imagine the HD coverage closely matches the terrain. No paltry power increase of 10 dB will make up for the attenuation caused by a mountain. Some strong LA signals like KIIS become deep fringe just on the other side of a mountain. It is so bad that the FCC allows first adjacent KXLM about 60 miles away. Now tell me that a mere 10 dB of increased HD sideband power will make more than a mile or two difference on KIIS. Waste of money to upgrade. This situation is duplicated all over the LA basin on other stations. HD power increase? BAD idea!

 

[ddsparxx]

the driver distraction systems, aka touchscreen heads up displays, are the worst idea ever to see the light of day more than IBOC. Ford just announced they are brining back "the knobs" after Consumer Reports blasted their Sync UI as being one of the most convaluted, difficult and downright dangerous ideas in the new dashboards of their cars.

I agree. At least with conventional knobs, rocker switches, etc- there is a PHYSICAL layer a driver can operate by feel- I do it everyday on my 2005 Hyundai. I know where the A/C switch is, the fan control knob, and I've "learned" how to use my Kenwood HD radio (which has conventional preset buttons you can store HD subchannels to!) without LOOKING at it.

Touchscreens are a BAD IDEA. Why not just let drivers run their cars by an app on their cellphones? They're constantly fiddling and looking at them anyway. :

I have read negative reviews on things like MyFordTouch in Fords, other touchscreen junk in some of the latest Cadillacs and Jaguars...I wonder why can't automakers just use knobs and buttons instead. If these built-in computers are slow to respond, or the sunlight washes out the screen, the owner has problems...such controls and the lack of HD radio as equipment are likely why my next car will be a Honda like my current one.