Wanna see/hear just how good it USED to be?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jnl8_tdEtA8&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jnl8_tdEtA8&feature=related
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How Depressing
- Thread starter Steven21
- Start date
Thanks for sharing the youtube link.Steven21 said:
What great radio, WLS and hundreds of stations (AM and FM) used to be and yes for the most part, it is depressing to see (and hear) once great stations that are only a shell of their former selves.
Thankfully there are a few (very few) exceptions in some markets.
drt
Just want to point out that they would NEVER have been allowed to just talk as they did during Rewind. That was strictly verbotten by the powers that be.
And just a reminder that WLS was corporate radio in the 60s. By the 1980s, ABC was the biggest radio power in the country. They owned more stations, commanded more audience, and made a whole lot of money. When deregulation came, everyone expected them to go on a buying spree. Didn't happen.
One question: combo or with engineer...which is more creative?
And just a reminder that WLS was corporate radio in the 60s. By the 1980s, ABC was the biggest radio power in the country. They owned more stations, commanded more audience, and made a whole lot of money. When deregulation came, everyone expected them to go on a buying spree. Didn't happen.
One question: combo or with engineer...which is more creative?
J
JustPastBuffalo
Guest
The video takes most of us (back) to a time when jocks produced a show; a time when they performed, informed, entertained. Whether it was snappy one liners, drop-ins, great phoners, hitting the post, information and weather, even PSAs, it was a time when people who worked in radio produced a product. Isn't that what's lacking across the board these days?
Now, most of us don't have to be told... we know what the research says. The research says listeners hate it when jocks talk up the post. But I'll submit for your approval (thanks Rod and the poster who refreshed my memory of the line) that there's a big difference between "entertaining to the post" and "rambling without direction." Listeners dislike it when jocks incessantly and with no regard for the music, talk up the post and have nothing to say, just being the "DJ" getting their radio jones doing uninspired radio shtick. Listeners enjoy it and become involved when jocks entertain them, have something of value to say, localize it and sound as if they know what they're talking about and doing their act for one specific listener at a time.
When we watch and listen to the WLS aircheck, we're hearing the masters of the art. Truth be told, there were many good top forty jocks who mastered the art of producing a show with content, flair and entertainment value. We know the jocks. We know the stations. WLS, WCFL, WFIL, WIBG, WKBW, WYSL-Y103, WGR, KVIL, WBEN, WGRQ, WEBR, CHUM, CFTR, CKLW, WHAM, WBBF, WHEN, WNDR and even the AOR jocks on WPHD and QFM97-97 Rock... even WJJL and WUSJ back in the day.
Those days were great days for radio but they're not so far gone that the successful concepts of the individual formats cannot be brought back and re-worked to fit 2009 and the future. If we're reading the tea leaves correctly, subscriber "all-music-channel radio" has flopped. 12-34s didn't buy-in. It never made a cent for the shareholders, although Howard and Oprah don't seem to be hurting. Now, even Ten-In-A-Row OTA FM radio is up against it, even as consultants tell PDs and GMs to minimize the jocks and VT as many dayparts as possible. So, what's wrong with this picture?
I don't think OTA FM radio is dead. Wanna save a salary? Turn off your power consuming HD channels. Unless you're WBFO, 38 listeners may notice. (238 WBFO listeners will notice.) I know less than a dozen people who have HD receivers and seven of those people work in radio.
Last week while on business in Olean (Go Bonnies!) I heard one of my favorite "small market" stations, WPIG, 95-7 The Big Pig. The station isn't fancy and slick. It's a good combination of forward momentum and down home realism and localism. I think The Big Pig has a 30 share in Olean. Okay, you're saying, "Dude, it's freakin' OH-Le-an!" But there's a lesson to be learned and pondered. Never once did I hear excessive sloganeering on the station. Imaging? Yes. Bumpers and jingles? Sure. Sloganeering? No. Didn't hear "the most music for your workday," didn't hear "home of the no-repeat workday," didn't hear "funny and the most money in the morning." Just heard very competent local jocks (a few hours were VT'd but locally) who were very relatable.
Radio needs to concentrate on selling the local product that comes out of the speakers on Bob and Barb's radio in the house, car/truck and at work. Streaming is wonderful; everybody knows "it's the future" (alledgedly, reportedly, supposedly.) Promoting and selling what's on the main channel product first and foremost is the key to turning radio around, especially in this challenging economy. Radio is being tested, to be sure, but there are smart people who will figure out that the model that's been used for radio isn't working now and won't work in the future. Let PDs program. Look at the successful stations in Buffalo: 97 Rock, WYRK, WBEN, Star, WBFO, Kiss. Stations with known, local personalities, especially music stations, lead the pack: Norton-Rob, Clay Moden, Russo, JP, Roger Christian, Janet, Santella, Bauerle, Rob Lucas. You get the idea.
It's not simply about giving 'em ten in a row and voice tracking three dayparts out of five; nor is it about letting the jocks do two minute schtik between every song. Balance and Differentiation. If radio becomes just like Jack or Bob or Dave, then what differentiates OTA radio from an iPod or mp3 player? Radio loses that battle. Seems that if radio becomes exactly like what's killing it, radio dies.
Now, most of us don't have to be told... we know what the research says. The research says listeners hate it when jocks talk up the post. But I'll submit for your approval (thanks Rod and the poster who refreshed my memory of the line) that there's a big difference between "entertaining to the post" and "rambling without direction." Listeners dislike it when jocks incessantly and with no regard for the music, talk up the post and have nothing to say, just being the "DJ" getting their radio jones doing uninspired radio shtick. Listeners enjoy it and become involved when jocks entertain them, have something of value to say, localize it and sound as if they know what they're talking about and doing their act for one specific listener at a time.
When we watch and listen to the WLS aircheck, we're hearing the masters of the art. Truth be told, there were many good top forty jocks who mastered the art of producing a show with content, flair and entertainment value. We know the jocks. We know the stations. WLS, WCFL, WFIL, WIBG, WKBW, WYSL-Y103, WGR, KVIL, WBEN, WGRQ, WEBR, CHUM, CFTR, CKLW, WHAM, WBBF, WHEN, WNDR and even the AOR jocks on WPHD and QFM97-97 Rock... even WJJL and WUSJ back in the day.
Those days were great days for radio but they're not so far gone that the successful concepts of the individual formats cannot be brought back and re-worked to fit 2009 and the future. If we're reading the tea leaves correctly, subscriber "all-music-channel radio" has flopped. 12-34s didn't buy-in. It never made a cent for the shareholders, although Howard and Oprah don't seem to be hurting. Now, even Ten-In-A-Row OTA FM radio is up against it, even as consultants tell PDs and GMs to minimize the jocks and VT as many dayparts as possible. So, what's wrong with this picture?
I don't think OTA FM radio is dead. Wanna save a salary? Turn off your power consuming HD channels. Unless you're WBFO, 38 listeners may notice. (238 WBFO listeners will notice.) I know less than a dozen people who have HD receivers and seven of those people work in radio.
Last week while on business in Olean (Go Bonnies!) I heard one of my favorite "small market" stations, WPIG, 95-7 The Big Pig. The station isn't fancy and slick. It's a good combination of forward momentum and down home realism and localism. I think The Big Pig has a 30 share in Olean. Okay, you're saying, "Dude, it's freakin' OH-Le-an!" But there's a lesson to be learned and pondered. Never once did I hear excessive sloganeering on the station. Imaging? Yes. Bumpers and jingles? Sure. Sloganeering? No. Didn't hear "the most music for your workday," didn't hear "home of the no-repeat workday," didn't hear "funny and the most money in the morning." Just heard very competent local jocks (a few hours were VT'd but locally) who were very relatable.
Radio needs to concentrate on selling the local product that comes out of the speakers on Bob and Barb's radio in the house, car/truck and at work. Streaming is wonderful; everybody knows "it's the future" (alledgedly, reportedly, supposedly.) Promoting and selling what's on the main channel product first and foremost is the key to turning radio around, especially in this challenging economy. Radio is being tested, to be sure, but there are smart people who will figure out that the model that's been used for radio isn't working now and won't work in the future. Let PDs program. Look at the successful stations in Buffalo: 97 Rock, WYRK, WBEN, Star, WBFO, Kiss. Stations with known, local personalities, especially music stations, lead the pack: Norton-Rob, Clay Moden, Russo, JP, Roger Christian, Janet, Santella, Bauerle, Rob Lucas. You get the idea.
It's not simply about giving 'em ten in a row and voice tracking three dayparts out of five; nor is it about letting the jocks do two minute schtik between every song. Balance and Differentiation. If radio becomes just like Jack or Bob or Dave, then what differentiates OTA radio from an iPod or mp3 player? Radio loses that battle. Seems that if radio becomes exactly like what's killing it, radio dies.
JustPastBuffalo said:
It's not done as much today because it became less popular. You need to follow the time line of history. All of these personalities and stations reached a point where their act became predictable and boring. The people also became obnoxious and difficult to work with. Egos got out of control. At the same time, other approaches to radio were becoming more popular. The shouting was toned down. The jingles were done away with. Radio became more personal, less theatric. Some of the DJs of the time left the confines of Top 40 radio. Scott Muni in NY, Tom Donohue in SF, many more were tired of the yelling.
The other thing to point out is that WLS was a big city corporate radio station, hiring the best talent available. There were a lot more stations attempting to do this kind of radio, but doing it badly. I heard lots of tapes from awful people, trying to imitate the big city guys, and it was just embarrassing. Then in the 70s and 80s, there was a huge expansion of the number of radio stations, diluting the talent and audience. You can't expect local radio at 14,000 stations to have the quality achieved by a few dozen top stations in the 60s. The circumstances have changed in many ways.
It's nice to remember how things were. But don't assume we can just revive things the way they were.
To execute the precision formatics of big-market Top 40 radio and to have the production values you heard on the WLS Rewind retrospective, having a board op ("transcription operator" in CKLW parlance) was essential.
Actually, many of not most of the TO's at CKLW were Top 40 jocks in their own right - just not at The Big 8. Several had part-time shifts at CHYR/CHIR Leamington or the Sarnia station, where they honed their craft in hopes of a chance to crack the mic someday at CKLW. If you listen carefully to airchecks of The Big 8 today, you'll hear incredibly precise production - "layunders" were their specialty, where a hi-hat hit or drum roll hit at the exact moment the "W" sing on the Johnny Mann acapella jingle ended. Or recorded commercials with instrumental intros were fired early so the 20/20 newsman could talk up the vocal. Imagine: a station with production values so high the NEWS guy hit posts! It was all-in-a-day's work at CKLW.
At WIBG, we had one of the truly unique - one might say weird - technical setups I've encountered in 42 years of radio. Jocks had the cart machines and turntables on their side of the glass. Engineers had the console over in the control room. You would cue your record, on which a little label indicated the proper fader level for 0 VU on the Gatesway console, so you told the engineer what level to set over the intercom. You also had to call for your mic (union rules mandated that engineers controlled opening and closing of mics.)
You had to plan ahead. Or you'd suddenly notice your song was fading and the engineer was on the far side of the control room engaged in some urgent technical task, like replacing the pilot light on a modulation monitor. If there was dead air, you got a nasty batphone call from the PD. To this day I open my mic 30 seconds early, out of habit acquired at The Big 99.
I don't know where anyone got the idea we were "told what to say." That simply isn't/wasn't true; we adlibbed almost everything. There were fixed-position liners in sweeps at, say, :04, :23, :33 and :54, but after you said that phrase if there was intro time you could say anything which was relatable and entertaining. (You know? ENTERTAINING? Imagine THAT concept on the radio these days.)
Actually, many of not most of the TO's at CKLW were Top 40 jocks in their own right - just not at The Big 8. Several had part-time shifts at CHYR/CHIR Leamington or the Sarnia station, where they honed their craft in hopes of a chance to crack the mic someday at CKLW. If you listen carefully to airchecks of The Big 8 today, you'll hear incredibly precise production - "layunders" were their specialty, where a hi-hat hit or drum roll hit at the exact moment the "W" sing on the Johnny Mann acapella jingle ended. Or recorded commercials with instrumental intros were fired early so the 20/20 newsman could talk up the vocal. Imagine: a station with production values so high the NEWS guy hit posts! It was all-in-a-day's work at CKLW.
At WIBG, we had one of the truly unique - one might say weird - technical setups I've encountered in 42 years of radio. Jocks had the cart machines and turntables on their side of the glass. Engineers had the console over in the control room. You would cue your record, on which a little label indicated the proper fader level for 0 VU on the Gatesway console, so you told the engineer what level to set over the intercom. You also had to call for your mic (union rules mandated that engineers controlled opening and closing of mics.)
You had to plan ahead. Or you'd suddenly notice your song was fading and the engineer was on the far side of the control room engaged in some urgent technical task, like replacing the pilot light on a modulation monitor. If there was dead air, you got a nasty batphone call from the PD. To this day I open my mic 30 seconds early, out of habit acquired at The Big 99.
I don't know where anyone got the idea we were "told what to say." That simply isn't/wasn't true; we adlibbed almost everything. There were fixed-position liners in sweeps at, say, :04, :23, :33 and :54, but after you said that phrase if there was intro time you could say anything which was relatable and entertaining. (You know? ENTERTAINING? Imagine THAT concept on the radio these days.)
"Down the hall at the FM they're having a reunion of 1970's automation equipment" LOL! Priceless!
Loved this. Thanks!
Loved this. Thanks!
O
OttoM
Guest
Yeziknoradio said:
And they've probably dug out the old TM "Stereo Rock" tapes that FRED used to run on Rock 102. Now THAT was radio!
Yes, WIBG was AFTRA/NABET. Engineers had to control "all audio levels" and "opening and closing of microphones," hence the odd setup. They were mostly "older" technicians, not production people, and Paul Drew and Storer management didn't want them trying to produce the on-air product.
Yours truly was a very nervous 19-year old Ithaca College sophomore the night in July 1969 when I drove out to Lafayette Hill for my first shift. And the guy who patiently trained the green recruit from WMID was a 21 year old who drove, IIRC, a battered Renault. His Drake-style airname at WIBG was "Scott Walker." But after Buckley bought the station he reverted to his real name which he used - John Landecker.
Yours truly was a very nervous 19-year old Ithaca College sophomore the night in July 1969 when I drove out to Lafayette Hill for my first shift. And the guy who patiently trained the green recruit from WMID was a 21 year old who drove, IIRC, a battered Renault. His Drake-style airname at WIBG was "Scott Walker." But after Buckley bought the station he reverted to his real name which he used - John Landecker.
Yeziknoradio said:
That's Gil Gross, one of the most talented, multi-faceted men in broadcasting. He's still heard today weekdays 2-4 PM (PT) on San Francisco talk giant KGO/810.
I love his sense of humor!
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