How to replace my AEV EXLUSIVE FM with pc software

[kostas_par]

Hello to everyone and sorry for my english.

In 1994 i buy AEV EXLUSIVE FM now is very dificult to give 10.000 or 20.000 for a new masine to replace the old. The last day a lot of people say to me that if you want to make a good sound for you radio statio is better and chiper to take a pc with very good sound cart and one good softaware and make the sound as you like it.
I search a lot to found some programmes and the only programme that i fount but i dont test is wavelab.
If some one knows anything please help me

sorry for my english

 

[WNTIRadio]

Get a Core i9 PC with a solid state hard drive, Win XP or Windows 7, a Marian Trace Alpha sound card and this:

http://www.claessonedwards.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=47&Itemid=55

 

[Kent T]

I would get an Inovonics David III or something along that line in hardware reasonably or get an older Orban Optimod myself. Unless you're streaming.

 

[WNTIRadio]

I gotta ask, why bother with the old equipment? It's nice and nostalgic, I even own an 8100a myself. But would I put one on the air these days? With the option of Breakaway, the answer is hell no! Download the demo and listen for yourself. I have the Omnia 11 on the bench right now, and Breakaway can run with it. Can it beat it? No, but it sure hangs in there. And for the $299 ASIO version, plus about a grand for a server level PC, you've got yourself something that will run rings around the 8100 and the David III.

 

[WNTIRadio]

And if you're leery of a PC being your processor, the Omnia ONE is just a shade more expensive than the David III and will run rings around it.

 

[Chuck]

And if you're leery of a PC being your processor, the Omnia ONE is just a shade more expensive than the David III and will run rings around it.

And if that is a problem, try the BW broadcast DSPX-Mini. It costs less than the David III and sounds WAY better.

 

[Kmagrill]

If you cannot afford a real audio processor like the Omnia1 or the DSPX-mini, there is some freeware out there that actually works. Try Sound Solution by alessandro tomassini. www.soundsolution.it Although the author hasn't worked on it much in 4 or 5 years, the software's stable and it does a fairly good job of simulating an Optimod 8400. You'll still need a good stereo generator with 15kHz LPF built-in and you'll probably a composite clipper to get the most out of a setup like this.

There are a lot of reasons why using software's not a great idea. Chief among them are reliance on a Windows PC, Sonic limitations of the PC's sound card (You'll want a good one for this), lack of integration with the stereo generator, and probably a few others. If your need is not too critical and particularly if you live in a location other than the USA with relaxed technical rules, a software solution like this might work well for you.

 

[ChiefOperator]

There are a lot of reasons why using software's not a great idea. Chief among them are reliance on a Windows PC, Sonic limitations of the PC's sound card (You'll want a good one for this), lack of integration with the stereo generator, and probably a few others. If your need is not too critical and particularly if you live in a location other than the USA with relaxed technical rules, a software solution like this might work well for you.

Kmagrill-

No disrespect meant, but I have to disagree with you. My understanding is that Linear Acoustics, a top TV processor, is mostly a Windows computer. And my guess is that the new Breakaway "hardware" is basically a Windows machine as well.

The issue of hardware vs. software has been discussed here before. The consensus, even with experts such as Frank Foti weighing in, is that a Windows box can be configured to be as stable as its hardware.

I've configured many Windows machines to work as "appliances" and all are quite stable. No problems noted. I would feel very comfortable running Breakaway on a PC, provided the PC comprised grade components and the entire box were properly configured.

Just my .02

 

[j117]

As long as you don't connect to the internet it will run fine.

 

[kostas_par]

Thanks WNTIRadio i will download demo versio and i will test it

 

[Kmagrill]

The issue of hardware vs. software has been discussed here before. The consensus, even with experts such as Frank Foti weighing in, is that a Windows box can be configured to be as stable as its hardware.

Well, I'm not sure I'd be comfortable with such a solution as my only source of audio processing, though I wouldn't have mentioned it if I didn't think it was worth considering. That said, such things have been tried before. The first such attempt was about 20 years ago with the Paragon. Today, most of us use Windows based automation, though there are certainly a small, but growing, minority that have abandoned Windows for the greater stability of Linux and other operating systems. I would submit that if a critical piece of gear unexpectedly quits, even once in a year, it's possibly worth it to have a dedicated box in its place. I'm sure that there are PCs running Windows that can run indefinately without a reboot, but I've never personally seen one. All of the systems, including automation, that I've seen will go for a few months at a time, max.

Something else to consider is that most computers are not designed to last for many years. The typical lifespan is 3 years. Failures such as power supplies and cooling fans are common. In order to get a PC that is electrically and mechanically reliable, and has an excellent audio card, you're going to pay a premium price. By the time that you've done that, you would be well on your way to owning a dedicated solution that will be maintenance free for 10 or 20 years.

So, do I think a PC based audio processor is worth considering? Sure, I do, especially if you're in a less critical situation and if your money's tight. Would I use one in a competative market? Well, if the money's real tight and there's no other option, then maybe, but I'd sure make certain that the station management accepted the risks first. Given the option to own a dedicated box, I'd strongly consider that first. If I were an engineer in a serious station relying on a PC based audio processor, I'd feel like sword of Damocles was hanging over me.

 

[Sgeirk]

It's been written countless times. For the amount that you'd spend on a big name processor...build, or have built two PC's, with identical parts, and two marian trace soundcards....don't cheap out on the motherboards. Have a backup. Chances are it'll be years before you'd need it.

Windows XP is highly stable when it's locked down, left alone, and not used on the internet. It will be as stable, virtually, as the power it's fed and the motherboard and parts it's built from.

The way Breakaway runs, I have never seen it lock up a computer.

Been running it now for a year. Not a glitch. Certainly less problematic than any computer automation system I've ever ran!! lol

 

[WNTIRadio]

I have it [Breakaway] on a client's non-comm translator. Dual core PC running 2.4ghz, Windows XP SP3, solid state HD. No internet connection, all the automatic Windows bull crap turned off, like the updates etc. Has been running now for over a year. The only time it goes down is when the power goes out and the UPS runs out. Power comes back on, computer boots up and Breakaway starts right back up. This has only happened twice with the power company. They couldn't afford a hardware solution, so a spare server was re-purposed from the I.T. department. Breakaway, $199. No fancy sound card needed as this is going over an IP link to the TX which has the stereo gen in it. SSHD, $229. Digigram VX222, $209. Computer would have been about $1k if I went out and bought it, but for this place it was a total investment of $537 the translator sounds great. Much better than anything else you could possibly get at that price point.

Would I have liked to put a dedicated box in? Sure, but for that price, there aren't many options other than some beat up CRL on eBay. Can't even get a used 8100 for that low.

 

[Kmagrill]

Would I have liked to put a dedicated box in? Sure, but for that price, there aren't many options other than some beat up CRL on eBay. Can't even get a used 8100 for that low.

Very true, indeed.


One other thing that USA users should consider is about using the PC to generate the actual stereo composite. Software and a good sound card does work, but be careful. It's not enough to just generate useful stereo. The FCC technical rules on composite stereo have a lot of specifications for stuff like 38kHz cross-talk and pilot frequency. For example, if your pilot isn't within 2Hz of 19,000Hz, it's a violation. Be sure that whatever you do is capable of meeting the FCC specs under all conditions or you could end up accidently violating the rules.

 

[littlejohn]

WNTI, you're better off with two non-identical boxes. If there's a driver or software bug which bites one, it likely will not bite the other if they're not identical. It's a numbers game, play the odds.

 

[Kent T]

I'm not knocking new processors, the oldies based formats I do perform better with the old Optimod set lightly. It's a sound quality decision here. On new Processing, I have tried Orban, Omnia, and Wheatstone. Omnia One I love, performs well and is musical. Loud and Tight. And not artifact laden. And it's a good buy.

 

[Lazy J]

OK, two questions...

1. Is anybody using the M-Audio Audiophile 192 sound card with Breakaway? It seems like it would be just as good as the Marian Trace card, and cheaper.

2. Has anybody tried setting up one of these 1RU mini computers with Breakaway? I have seen versions of these computers with a Solid state drive and require no fans.
(Something like this... http://www.jncs.com/php/sys/system-index.php?id=sys-801)
(or something like this... http://www.bsicomputer.com/new/embedded/ems6910/ems6910_intro.htm)
(or this... http://www.stealth.com/littlepc_slots.htm)

 

[Tom Wells]

OK, two questions...

1. Is anybody using the M-Audio Audiophile 192 sound card with Breakaway? It seems like it would be just as good as the Marian Trace card, and cheaper.

2. Has anybody tried setting up one of these 1RU mini computers with Breakaway? I have seen versions of these computers with a Solid state drive and require no fans.
(Something like this... http://www.jncs.com/php/sys/system-index.php?id=sys-801)
(or something like this... http://www.bsicomputer.com/new/embedded/ems6910/ems6910_intro.htm)
(or this... http://www.stealth.com/littlepc_slots.htm)

They are sure good looking, and in the printing industry many operator interfaces have now been replaced by complete package PCs such as this, and they have proven fairly rugged and dependable even in non-air conditioned pressrooms.
I would expect the anticipated Breakaway hardware box to be based on something very similar, in order to satisfy those who
look for the reliability of "old fashioned" hardware-only devices.

On the other hand, if one of these cost $1000, you could buy 4 refurbished dual-core laptops with XP Pro ready to go.
No additional costs for keyboard and display..

I know what you're thinking about the on-board audio card, but until you listen to what Breakaway can sound like even with a
built-in audio card, don't dismiss this cheap solution. In a much older thread, "ultimate linearity" was indeed better with
extreme music ( Black and White by Three Dog Night as the reference music ), but very few ears would hear the difference.
Your o-scope will show it, but it will still sound great.
I haven't encountered any problems from using unbalanced audio, but then I'm a pea-shooter AM.



After maybe 2 years of running Zara and Breakaway in 2 different laptops, I haven't even once come home to hear my station off the air.
Everything is set to boot and run on power -up. The laptop battery power carries over any minor power outage.

I did have a hard drive "get slow" on data access with age, and retired it last autumn when it couldn't run 2 audio files at once.

Laptops can walk away pretty easily though, so something that looks like one of these boxes might be better, depending
on who has access. The average person might not recognize them as computers.

 

[Kent T]

My Multiplex Pilot generation is done by ye old Optimod 9100a. I like the PC solutions for streaming audio. For broadcast sound cards, I prefer AudioScience thus far or DigiGram.