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How would you fix Smooth Jazz?

S

smoothjazz

I think we can all agree there are some issues with the format right now and the fact that there are more stations across the country dropping Smooth Jazz than signing-on with it seems to verifies that. So if someone gave you the keys to a struggling Smooth Jazz outlet, realistically, what would you do to ignite the format again? People in the past have suggested focusing strictly on Contemporary Jazz, but is there a reason no one anywhere other than non-terrestrial sources has really tried that? Or if executed properly, do you think a Contemporary Jazz intensive Smooth Jazz format could work? Or do you think the format should move in another direction entirely? Let your voice be heard here. <P ID="signature">______________
Nick Langan
WNJL.com Radio
</P>
 
> I think we can all agree there are some issues with the
> format right now and the fact that there are more stations
> across the country dropping Smooth Jazz than signing-on with
> it seems to verifies that. So if someone gave you the keys
> to a struggling Smooth Jazz outlet, realistically, what
> would you do to ignite the format again? People in the past
> have suggested focusing strictly on Contemporary Jazz, but
> is there a reason no one anywhere other than non-terrestrial
> sources has really tried that? Or if executed properly, do
> you think a Contemporary Jazz intensive Smooth Jazz format
> could work? Or do you think the format should move in
> another direction entirely? Let your voice be heard here.
>
Go more Contemporary Jazz and skip the AC music. As you say Nick, non-terrestrial sources have tried it and for XM it works. “Watercolors” is the best place to hear the music and worth the subscription price alone.
I think the reason regular radio won’t try it is because Smooth Jazz with its vocals appears safe, Contemporary Jazz seems to “dangerous” because the vast majority of the audience doesn’t know the artists. Unless someone in radio grows a set as my wife would say, we’ll never know if it would work. They might be surprised.
 
Depending on where the station is located, I would go more toward a "suburban" NAC format and less toward the "Urban".

I would return to the original format. Play cuts from the Billboard Contemporary Jazz chart, mixed with Adult Alternative vocals that fit. Listening to XM, I have heard enough AA vcals that would work, to give you a reasonable variety. By the way, you have to keep Luther and other popular R&B artists, but drop the Motown oldies. Keep throwing in the "currents" from the past few years, but keep them to 1 or 2 per hour. Keep the vocals to 3 per hour. The rest would be newer material. I really believe this would work.

> I think we can all agree there are some issues with the
> format right now and the fact that there are more stations
> across the country dropping Smooth Jazz than signing-on with
> it seems to verifies that. So if someone gave you the keys
> to a struggling Smooth Jazz outlet, realistically, what
> would you do to ignite the format again? People in the past
> have suggested focusing strictly on Contemporary Jazz, but
> is there a reason no one anywhere other than non-terrestrial
> sources has really tried that? Or if executed properly, do
> you think a Contemporary Jazz intensive Smooth Jazz format
> could work? Or do you think the format should move in
> another direction entirely? Let your voice be heard here.
>
 
> I think we can all agree there are some issues with the
> format right now and the fact that there are more stations
> across the country dropping Smooth Jazz than signing-on with
> it seems to verifies that. So if someone gave you the keys
> to a struggling Smooth Jazz outlet, realistically, what
> would you do to ignite the format again? People in the past
> have suggested focusing strictly on Contemporary Jazz, but
> is there a reason no one anywhere other than non-terrestrial
> sources has really tried that? Or if executed properly, do
> you think a Contemporary Jazz intensive Smooth Jazz format
> could work? Or do you think the format should move in
> another direction entirely? Let your voice be heard here.
>

Just received my copy of the Rendezvous Lounge 2. That is the future of smooth jazz. Quit living in the past! I'm for recurrents to a degree but what is happening or soon to be happening is where it is at. Anyone been in Abacrombie, American Eagle lately? Format needs youth and I'm not youth. Who has the disposable income to support the music? Mines going to high school educations and automobiles that I do not drive :) Last time I checked, artists are happy for radio airplay but feed the family on cd sales? How you going to attract that audience with Motown oldies mixed with a few instrumentals? Doesn't even attract me.

Nock
 
> I think we can all agree there are some issues with the
> format right now and the fact that there are more stations
> across the country dropping Smooth Jazz than signing-on with
> it seems to verifies that. So if someone gave you the keys
> to a struggling Smooth Jazz outlet, realistically, what
> would you do to ignite the format again? People in the past
> have suggested focusing strictly on Contemporary Jazz, but
> is there a reason no one anywhere other than non-terrestrial
> sources has really tried that? Or if executed properly, do
> you think a Contemporary Jazz intensive Smooth Jazz format
> could work? Or do you think the format should move in
> another direction entirely? Let your voice be heard here.
>


Introduce more artist instead of playing the same stuff over and over again. There is a lot of good contemporary jazz artist out there who can't get there music played because so many of the big media company's are conservative in their selection of music.
 
Testing Must Go

Agree with all and I also think another thing that has to be phased out is auditorium testing, and specifically, testing with 10-second hooks. Basically, what determines the songs played on Smooth Jazz these days are about 50 people in some hotel audiotorium who listen to a 10-second hook from a song and then turn a knob. That's all well and good, except some songs need more than a 10-second hook for people to recognize and/or enjoy them. So if I'm a Smooth Jazz artist now, am I going to put together a really drawn out, improvisational album, or am I going to strictly stick to a formula, with the most recognizable melody possible? Of course I'm going to do the latter, to get exposed (aka played on Smooth Jazz radio). This is why you have artists like Steve Cole, who I do enjoy and think is very talented, but I don't think he's ever made a song that doesn't go from brass hook to about 10 seconds of him playing a saxophone verse back to the brass hook, LOL.

So my point is, testing is absolutely influencing the quality of Smooth Jazz being produced. So many of my favorite Smooth Jazz tracks are from the early through mid 90s. There's a reason why.
<P ID="signature">______________
Nick Langan
WNJL.com Radio
</P>
 
Re: Testing Must Go

Here's a different wrinkle...could NAC/SJ stations not be huge commercial successes because they are in fact:

*the format is not in fact a big mass appeal "25-54" type of radio format...but, a 2 to 4% share nitch format that needs to be concept sold to advertising agencies and local, direct accounts????

I'm wondering if NAC/SJ's narrowed their music focus a few years ago in order to play to mass appeal 25-54 ad agency buyers...simply because their sales staffs didn't know how to position and sell the format.

For what it's worth...in my nearly 40 year radio career is about 18 years on the air in some medium-large markets and sales in a multiple-station medium market.

I too am beyond bored with the same-old, same-old, lifeless pounding of AC crossover vocals (the SAME 40 or 50 AC vocals) and an amazingly small current playlist that keeps the same "current" songs in heavy rotation for about 6 months...sometimes longer. BORING!

But, maybe we're bored because we're mostly radio people or music fans who are not typical of the general public. I don't work in this format...so I don't hear any inside opinions from NAC/SJ execs or consultants.
 
Re: Testing Must Go

> Here's a different wrinkle...could NAC/SJ stations not be
> huge commercial successes because they are in fact:
>
> *the format is not in fact a big mass appeal "25-54" type of
> radio format...but, a 2 to 4% share nitch format that needs
> to be concept sold to advertising agencies and local, direct
> accounts????
>
> I'm wondering if NAC/SJ's narrowed their music focus a few
> years ago in order to play to mass appeal 25-54 ad agency
> buyers...simply because their sales staffs didn't know how
> to position and sell the format.
>
> For what it's worth...in my nearly 40 year radio career is
> about 18 years on the air in some medium-large markets and
> sales in a multiple-station medium market.
>
> I too am beyond bored with the same-old, same-old, lifeless
> pounding of AC crossover vocals (the SAME 40 or 50 AC
> vocals) and an amazingly small current playlist that keeps
> the same "current" songs in heavy rotation for about 6
> months...sometimes longer. BORING!
>
> But, maybe we're bored because we're mostly radio people or
> music fans who are not typical of the general public. I
> don't work in this format...so I don't hear any inside
> opinions from NAC/SJ execs or consultants.
>

I think you're exactly right. I think the major problem with this format right now besides the fact that ratings are low, is that even with the stations that do OK to well in the ratings, they aren't selling spots worth a damn right now. You've gotta have sales people who believe in the format, who understand the format, and who can convince advertisers that the format can win for them, and there aren't a lot of those sales people evidently around right now. And since nobody knows how to sell it, programmers go safe and make the format as advertiser-friendly as possible. <P ID="signature">______________
Nick Langan
WNJL.com Radio
</P>
 
Re: Testing Must Go

I've never looked...but, I'll bet most NAC/SJ stations are high average quarter-hour and somewhat lower cume: a moderate-sized audience who listens for long periods of time....which has got to be golden for a well-targeted advertiser.

Could audience psychographics and demos be what's keeping ad agency buys away? If that's the case...there's a million local-direct advertisers out there in virtually every market. But, that takes a sales staff willing and able to hit the streets and tell the story.

What I hear from business owners in the streets is they expect their ad campaigns to work "overnight"...right away. Sales people have to be honest with these business owners....radio works well...but, nothing happens in a few days or weeks. It honestly takes time. But...the good news is radio does work...and works in a spectacular fashion if you do it the right way.<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by John T. Arthur on 02/04/06 11:59 PM.</FONT></P>
 
> I think we can all agree there are some issues with the
> format right now and the fact that there are more stations
> across the country dropping Smooth Jazz than signing-on with
> it seems to verifies that. So if someone gave you the keys
> to a struggling Smooth Jazz outlet, realistically, what
> would you do to ignite the format again? People in the past
> have suggested focusing strictly on Contemporary Jazz, but
> is there a reason no one anywhere other than non-terrestrial
> sources has really tried that? Or if executed properly, do
> you think a Contemporary Jazz intensive Smooth Jazz format
> could work? Or do you think the format should move in
> another direction entirely? Let your voice be heard here.
>
Smooth jazz programmers have to give their audience more credit. They are there because they have taste and appreciate musicianship. I have always been frustrated why pd's(in general)are not about exposing new music and new artists. I honestly think a lot of it goes back to the "passion" mindset. The real reason they (the radio personality/pd)got into the business. You have to love it. But with the ways things are set up these days with the corporate mentality it's tough to let the creativity of their talent come through. That sounds very old school but I believe it's true. Look at the successful ones. They know the musicians and their lineage. Many are muscians themselves. They read the liner notes, go to the shows and know the style of the person that listens to them. Yes sj radio should play the core artists but also get into the mindset of the smooth jazz listener and realize that Anita Baker's Sweet Love is a wonderful song. But it does not to be played everyday. There are wonderful talented vocalists out there who never get the chance.

As far as igniting the format, forget focus groups, testing and charts for a couple of books. Go with your gut and heart. If you have made it to programming status, you should know the music. Many of the artists playing smooth jazz were onetime rockers. Maybe the a&r depts. (if they are around anymore) should invest a little into the artist if the "feel" is there to move into something new and fresh. If it feels good, sounds good, moves you emotionally or any other sense you have, play it. The smooth jazz audience is loyal. They will give it a chance.

Sorry. This is longer than I expected. But as a longtime musician, fan, former programmer and faithful listener, my passion is still there. I wish the industry as a whole could feel the same way and make a boatload of money at the same time. In a perfect world huh? Thanks.
 
Re: Testing Must Go

> Could audience psychographics and demos be what's keeping ad
> agency buys away? If that's the case...there's a million
> local-direct advertisers out there in virtually every
> market. But, that takes a sales staff willing and able to
> hit the streets and tell the story.

> What I hear from business owners in the streets is they
> expect their ad campaigns to work "overnight"...right away.
> Sales people have to be honest with these business
> owners....radio works well...but, nothing happens in a few
> days or weeks. It honestly takes time. But...the good news
> is radio does work...and works in a spectacular fashion if
> you do it the right way.

Yeah that's it, it's all the salespeople's fault that the format isn't doing better. We need to go out and convince all of the agencies that their 18-49 demos are all wrong and they should really be buying 35-64 (believe me, we try) and sell "millions" of local directs with the understanding that they probably won't see any results for weeks. The name of the game for most advertisers these days is ROI, return on investment, and most can't afford to have that kind of patience; besides, although local-direct-NTR business is important, it will never be the bulk of a station's revenue.
 
Re: Testing Must Go

Nick Langan said:
> Here's a different wrinkle...could NAC/SJ stations not be
> huge commercial successes because they are in fact:
>
> *the format is not in fact a big mass appeal "25-54" type of
> radio format...but, a 2 to 4% share nitch format that needs
> to be concept sold to advertising agencies and local, direct
> accounts????
>
> I'm wondering if NAC/SJ's narrowed their music focus a few
> years ago in order to play to mass appeal 25-54 ad agency
> buyers...simply because their sales staffs didn't know how
> to position and sell the format.
>
> For what it's worth...in my nearly 40 year radio career is
> about 18 years on the air in some medium-large markets and
> sales in a multiple-station medium market.
>
> I too am beyond bored with the same-old, same-old, lifeless
> pounding of AC crossover vocals (the SAME 40 or 50 AC
> vocals) and an amazingly small current playlist that keeps
> the same "current" songs in heavy rotation for about 6
> months...sometimes longer. BORING!
>
> But, maybe we're bored because we're mostly radio people or
> music fans who are not typical of the general public. I
> don't work in this format...so I don't hear any inside
> opinions from NAC/SJ execs or consultants.
>

I think you're exactly right. I think the major problem with this format right now besides the fact that ratings are low, is that even with the stations that do OK to well in the ratings, they aren't selling spots worth a damn right now. You've gotta have sales people who believe in the format, who understand the format, and who can convince advertisers that the format can win for them, and there aren't a lot of those sales people evidently around right now. And since nobody knows how to sell it, programmers go safe and make the format as advertiser-friendly as possible. <P ID="signature">______________
Nick Langan
<a href="http://www.wnjl.com">WNJL.com Radio</a>
</P>
Click to expand...

OK Dumb question time......
So how would you sell SJ successfully? Arent most of the sales weasels 20 somethings?

Personally, I dont care if the ratings are low, as long as I am able to deliver the correct audience.
 
it by expanding this lifeless niche format. Make smooth jazz only a small part of an all-jazz station.

They can be mixed, per jack... or there can be different programs for different jazz genres.

Even though it's not my favorite, I think a big band show would beat a smooth jazz show, all things being equal.

Or fusion or progressive jazz, maybe.

73s from 954, who would be listening to Serious jazz WDNA right now if I was in my car.
 
On Ask Radio-Info, someone's declared us dead...so let's start talking more about the format here. There's not a whole lot to it though, because as much as I'd love to hear Pamela Williams' "Positive Vibe" and cuts from Alex Bugnon's "Free" and "Spyro Time" from Spyro Gyra's latest and the unedited versions of "Mister Magic", "Take Five" and "Bermuda Nights" (by Gerald Albright) and so many other things like that that would make sense, we'd go nowhere on the board...other than mentioning it. If we actually thought we could make a change, we'd be more encouraged to chat about the music. But the fact is we have "currents" that have been on for 6 months. Kim Waters has only had "Steppin' Out" from his great CD but I listen to the other great songs on it and that's what takes my time away from hearing the actual radio format. I look on the Internet to see what's been released...take my chances on some stuff I've never heard and come home with gold...just like the good 'ol days when I took chances on vinyl singles. That's how I discovered Mike Phillips (sax) and Roger Smith (keys). The argument about "why don't they play this on the radio?" is too old and goes nowhere. So I'm not sure what to talk about. I'm so into the music...have so much of it...the artists the format plays...but the songs they don't play are AWESOME! Many jocks in the format are "borrowed" from other formats so there's no passion (and God, the number of mispronunciations!) because they only have to know the liners and promos and the "feel"...but not the music. Therefore a lot of Smooth Jazz stations just kinda lay there. I think the format is a Top 20-25 market format because there are enough people in those markets to swallow what's being done. And there's money. Below that it really should be a specialty format on a Soft AC or AC. Maybe even Triple-A. Like one station in Cincinnati on Saturday nights (an AC station) has an excellent program that I catch when out that way from 7P-12MID. It's everything you would expect from an SJ station full-time...it doesn't have to be restricted, because people (and advertisers) know it's a specialty show on an AC station. That show works, so Cincinnati won't need a SJ station. They satisfy everything we're talking about in one night on the radio. It's not everyday, but man just one day a week hearing unedited contemporary jazz and fresh tracks from new releases...wow! SJ started out as specialty, then sales/business got into it and that's why we are where we are now. I think it should go back to specialty. And anyone doing such a format should call it "Contemporary Jazz" or "Cool Jazz". But the Smooth Jazz moniker should go the way the "Oldies" moniker should go...away! Maybe revitalize SJ and call it "New Adult Contemporary" (NAC) again for a while. Other than that I don't know what we can talk about here, other than concerts and how they do their "Vacation-a-Day Giveaways." All that's great stuff. It all boils down to this...the format feeds off the people who really don't know the music..but "feel" the lifestyle. They're educated, will buy what's being played and be happy with it. They don't know they're hearing edited or remixed stuff...they don't care. And in big markets there are a lot of people like that...enough for the format to get away with it. They're upwardly mobile and don't have time to listen all the time, but when Arbitron knocks it will be the only thing they'll remember. Smooth Jazz. So as long as there are enough people to go for what's being done, nothing will change. Therefore it kind of negates the chat factor. Now if we here on this board didn't know as much as we do about the music, we'd be talking today about how we wish we could hear Paul Brown's "Winelight" even more. This board would be hoppin' then! The only thing that triggers a post is the format being pulled from a station or maybe a new song every few months or so. But we won't "fix" a thing. Maybe this board can survive like the SJ stations...if there are enough people who think they can change radio...there'll be a new post here a couple of times a month. But I'd love to talk about the new music...but it's a radio board. If the music is not being played on the radio...then it's irrelevant. SO! How do we FIX Smooth Jazz?
 
The way to fix smooth jazz in my opinion is to number one, mix it with more R&B and ease off the typical Anita Baker, Luther form of smooth jazz a bit. There are MANY MANY MANY more R&B/Jazz artist and songs with SJ/ soulful influences. Mood is another key component to making a successful SJ station work. The music would have to be properly dayparted for morning, midday, afternoon, and night..Yes, it will take lots of work. Yes, it does take a lot of trial and error to get it right. I agree, the testing has to go and the PD must go off of gut, heart, and feel for MOOD. The music director would be a vital position to the station. Dig up as many titles as you possibly can, especially cover songs. People love music they can sing to..kind of like karaoke. The personalities would have to be more livelier, entertaining such as ordinary radio- nothing special, it's just jazz. We see FM Gospel is making a rise in some southern states..Why? because they're ordinary announcers, the have fun, they laugh, and they compel & connect with the audience. Promotions, sales, & production/imagining would all have to really step up and provide the utmost assistance to the station's management, only in a fantasy world right? ha!

One final note with the SJ format, watch out for that phantom cume..There are a lot of "undercover jazz lovers". Do everything in your power to get them to write out your station in the diary.


I usually charge for this advice, but contact me we can talk business.

Chris Malone
WQOX 88.5 UAC/Smooth Jazz Memphis
[email protected]
 
I just got another idea on this....

The same way you would fix a cat.

(i.e.....To keep it from multiplying.)

;D

73s
 
No sooner than I praise Cincinnati's Smooth Jazz Saturday Night show I hear it may be in trouble or gone? Anyone know? I should have known a change would come with the new ownership.
 
WJJZ is DEAD - will the whole format be next?

Hi, this is my first post to this forum.
The death of WJJZ Philly, and the pending death of SJ is too important for me to remain silent.
SJ is, in my opinion, the last place on terrestrial radio where one can still find real melody & musicianship.
It'd be a real shame to lose it. But, let's face it - SJ has been broken for YEARS!
How long can you truly expect your audience to keep listening to the same tired playlist day-in, day-out, month after month, year after year?
Here's what I think: SJ doesn't need to be radically changed; rather, it needs to expand on the elements that made it quite healthy just 3 or 4 years ago.
There are fantastic artists & songs -- viable ones -- artists that could be the next "Sade" or "Chris Botti"; songs that would be the next "Smooth Operator" or "Soulful Strut'" -- they're out there, but too often, they're not makin' it to the air. You can probably name a few.
Here's how you fix SJ: We've got to put an end to the monopoly on the format. You know that one company controls SJ. Competition makes everyone try harder, and sound better. Competition will help the stations, the artists, the listeners, and the format as a whole.
But this means the industry MUST do something that until now it has been reluctant to do; it MUST take SMART risks.
Everyone's hurting financially now, but nothing will get better if the same people keep doing the same thing.
It's time to find those people who are passionate and committed to fixing the format. Maybe you know someone up to the task who isn't working in the format, or isn't even working in the field because so many doors are closed.
Maybe you're that someone.
If this resonates with anyone, please reply. I could go on for pages, but I'll stop for now.

Reach me at [email protected].

Thanks for your time,
Media Maven
 
Jim_Hicks said:
Depending on where the station is located, I would go more toward a "suburban" NAC format and less toward the "Urban".
Click to expand...

I don't know if there is a "fix" for smooth jazz; it either works or doesn't work depending on the market and who you are programming to. I just looked at the SJ chart at R&R and I think for a lot of people artist familiarity might be an issue. I like traditional jazz and late 60's-70's fusion, but to me the SJ format is like "Smooth Funk" or "Urban AC Lite". It's just not my cup of tea. I'd rather hear a more "organic approach" with real instruments and less drum machines---more musicianship and less programming. Think "Aja"-era Steely Dan with or without vocals.

I do think you are right that it's possible that a re-birth of the NAC format could work for many areas.
 
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