I FEEL WHAT 1340 SHOULD TRY A CLASSIC SOUL - BLACK OLDIES FORMAT

[towernews]

I don't know about you people, but I personally feel WHAT AM 1340 should consider going back to their original roots, and trying a classic soul - black oldies format, with motown thrown in.

Since WDAS and WRNB are playing mostly contemporary black music, why not have a station here in Philadelphia that will consider playing just black classic oldies with motown thrown in. After all when you think about it, Philadelphia does have a pretty large black audience. I'm sure there are a lot of black people and white people also, here in Philadelphia that would love to have a classic black oldies format re-established. What do think Philadelphia, is this a great idea ?

 

[LA_Guy]

The trouble is, if it took off someone would copy it on FM and there it goes.

 

[DanStrassberg]

The trouble is, if it took off someone would copy it on FM and there it goes.

Or maybe not. I've been told that the age of the classic soul demo is about the same as that of the adult standards demo. If an AM that ran AS pulled a 10 share in a top-100 market, I'd still bet against its ability to pick up enough national spot business to break even on a cash-flow basis. The teeny-bopper time buyers all _know_ that the only thing people over 55 spend any money on is their own funerals. Since the CS listeners are the same age as the AS listeners, there is no money to be made in CS. Therefore, there would be no point in an FM stealing the format even if it had been proven capable of pulling huge numbers on a major market AM. And let's face it, that AM would need at least a half-decent signal to pull huge numbers. Outside of a limited area in the northern part of Philadelphia, 1340 doesn't have such a signal.

 

[rtetro]

I've been saying for a while that the station should bring on the African-American preachers. Since their full-time primary coverage (i.e. where they can be heard all the time) is the inner city it would make sense - at least on the surface. Serve the community that can hear you, and forget about the suburbs where you can only be heard half the time.

All of those Christian teaching programs pay. It would probably be a much easier business model than just about any other format.

 

[klutch00]

I like this idea. I also like the idea of combining the following genres along with R&B Classics: "Graffiti Gold" (i.e. pre-British era rock 'n' roll oldies) and maybe 'surf-rock'. The problem is with Philadelphia being so big, and with WHAT's range being so limited, would there be a chance to draw in any kind of an audience that will go for this? Might it be time for the station to look for other sources of income? If advertisers won't take an interest, then maybe it's time to look for alternative sources to fund the station, such as donations and promotions. Another avenue the station might want to feature some underground music including avant-garde and local R&B, Soul and maybe even hip-hop that the FMs won't touch with a twenty-foot pole. In other words, become "The Black WPAZ". Now while having black preachers take to the air here, wasn't that already tried before?

I hate to have to say it but this station has maybe just a few moves left to save it from its demise. The first few I've already mentioned. Brokered might be an option, but I hope that this wouldn't be necessary. Another includes moving its COL and transmitter to an adjacent community and have it feature local programming. Either way it's a shame that the standards/oldies format didn't take hold. But I think much was working against it.

 

[EZway2go]

Wasn't such a format tried when WFLN dropped classical music and became Jammin' Oldies or something similar? Or was that more rhythmic than what you had in mind? Are you talking about a Freda Payne/Al Green/Staple Singers type of soul format, or something more along the lines of Nancy Wilson, Brook Benton, or the Four Tops?

 

[jhguthlac]

Classic soul has worked, WDIA in Memphis is an example. But WDIA is an iconic station that stayed Black. WHAT has been all over the place in the past. It is not a heritage station such as WDAS has been. Even WDAS-AM could not survive. It is time to close down 1340 in Philly.

 

[klutch00]

Classic soul has worked, WDIA in Memphis is an example. But WDIA is an iconic station that stayed Black. WHAT has been all over the place in the past. It is not a heritage station such as WDAS has been. Even WDAS-AM could not survive. It is time to close down 1340 in Philly.

You may be right. In case the future has come to that, I would hope that the frequency could be given a new lease on life. Elaborating on a remark I expressed in a previous post on this thread, I'll suggest the following:
Allow a broadcaster with vision to obtain the license to operate on that frequency in an adjacent community (e.g. Camden, Cherry Hill, Burlington, Bristol, Woodbury, Chester, etc.) and have the station feature local programming. Another option would be to get a station with a compromised service pattern in an adjacent community to change their frequency to 1340. I was thinking Chester's WVCH would be a great candidate for this.

 

[rtetro]

You may be right. In case the future has come to that, I would hope that the frequency could be given a new lease on life. Elaborating on a remark I expressed in a previous post on this thread, I'll suggest the following:
Allow a broadcaster with vision to obtain the license to operate on that frequency in an adjacent community (e.g. Camden, Cherry Hill, Burlington, Bristol, Woodbury, Chester, etc.) and have the station feature local programming. Another option would be to get a station with a compromised service pattern in an adjacent community to change their frequency to 1340. I was thinking Chester's WVCH would be a great candidate for this.

The only problem with moving 1340 is that it is INCREDIBLY blocked in on all sides - so there isn't a lot of wiggle room. I did some large studies of WHAT a couple of years back when they were attempting to increase coverage. Those studies were conclusive in showing that almost any move would require either a reduction in power or a directional antenna. Both of which would pretty much negate any benefits. As an NDA, the station cannot be moved east to NJ because of WMID. WMID has a much better than average 0.5 mV/m contour, which is easily evident by listening to 1340 along the AC Expressway. It only takes an exit or two to transition from one to the other. Likewise, move west is difficult because of Reading; again their contours touch (and actually even overlap somewhat). North is limited by WHWH 1350, and south is limited by WJSS 1330 in Havre de Grace.

So you can see moving the transmitter is problematic. There is always the possibility of changing frequency - if you can find one.

About the only real option in moving could be to change the COL to something like Bala Cynwyd or a similar municipality adjacentn\ to west Philly, and do the local thing.

 

[MikefromDelaware]

It's not a music format I'd listen to, but as someone here posted, WHAT's signal is mainly a center city Philly signal, so why not become a niche station that programs to that community. If Urban Gold isn't what would sell, then figure out what format would sell in that market and program for that.

I don't care what those teeny bopper ad people for national spots think, people 55+ still grocery shop, buy clothes, shoes, cars, RV's for traveling, stay in hotels when traveling, eat in restaurants quite a lot even when not traveling, news papers, magazines, etc, etc. Babyboomers are not afraid to spend money. It seems so shorted sighted to ignore such a large part of the actual radio listening audience. They keep targeting the young who don't listen to the radio AM at all, and FM rarely as they are online, I-Pods, Blackberry's, MP-3's, XM radio in their cars, etc. Funny, when I go to Home Depot on Saturday to get stuff for my latest home fix-it project, I see plenty of folks with gray hair there shopping for stuff for their Saturday projects. Somehow, we babyboomers didn't get the word that we're supposed to go sit on the sidelines of life and watch the parade of young people march by. We may not move as fast, and it might take us longer to get the job done, but we've certainly not given up on living life and doing things. Those ad people act like anyone 55+ has got one foot in the grave and the other foot on a banana peel. Somehow, it doesn't make sense to throw away the largest population block that still likes to listen to the radio, just because they're older and maybe you can't sell them on changing brands of soap, or deodorant, but as I listed above there's plenty of other things we buy that certainly can be sold via the radio.

However, it may already be too late for radio to take advantage of that baby boom generation as they enter the older age range. I'm listening more and more online to programming I like both spoken word and music as it's harder and harder to find what I like on the radio. I also buy CD's of music I like, I also get audio books from the public library to listen to when traveling and commuting. Some of my friends in that same age range (I'm 60) have also found other ways to get the music they want to hear without the radio since radio rarely plays our music. A number of them have bought new cars in the last 3-5 years and their car came with XM / Sirus Radio and they love the programming aimed at them and have chosen to keep the subscription going after the 1 year free service ended. When I get my next car, I'll make sure it has XM/Sirus radio too and will probably join them.

 

[klutch00]

You may be right. In case the future has come to that, I would hope that the frequency could be given a new lease on life. Elaborating on a remark I expressed in a previous post on this thread, I'll suggest the following:
Allow a broadcaster with vision to obtain the license to operate on that frequency in an adjacent community (e.g. Camden, Cherry Hill, Burlington, Bristol, Woodbury, Chester, etc.) and have the station feature local programming. Another option would be to get a station with a compromised service pattern in an adjacent community to change their frequency to 1340. I was thinking Chester's WVCH would be a great candidate for this.

The only problem with moving 1340 is that it is INCREDIBLY blocked in on all sides - so there isn't a lot of wiggle room. I did some large studies of WHAT a couple of years back when they were attempting to increase coverage. Those studies were conclusive in showing that almost any move would require either a reduction in power or a directional antenna. Both of which would pretty much negate any benefits. As an NDA, the station cannot be moved east to NJ because of WMID. WMID has a much better than average 0.5 mV/m contour, which is easily evident by listening to 1340 along the AC Expressway. It only takes an exit or two to transition from one to the other. Likewise, move west is difficult because of Reading; again their contours touch (and actually even overlap somewhat). North is limited by WHWH 1350, and south is limited by WJSS 1330 in Havre de Grace.

I can definitely see how establishing 1340 virtually any distance to the west and much to the east, particularly southeast will wreak havoc on either WMID or WRAW; but I would think that allowing WVCH that frequency wouldn't be too much of a problem (if they wanted it). The reason I say this is for several reasons. First, this would ease some burden off of the two stations in Reading and Atlantic City. Second, with Havre de Grace being 44 miles away, wouldn't any impact be negligible? If worse came to worst, maybe "the new WVCH, 1340" could broadcast with an ERP of 500-watts or at worst 250-watts unlimited. Granted, they might not get their desired daytime coverage, but their nighttime coverage might make up for it. Face it; six-watts is nothing; and when that signal is getting 'stomped on' wouldn't it be better to move it if possible?

So you can see moving the transmitter is problematic. There is always the possibility of changing frequency - if you can find one.

About the only real option in moving could be to change the COL to something like Bala Cynwyd or a similar municipality adjacent to west Philly, and do the local thing.

OK moving COL to Bala or a community in nearby Delaware County might be worth it so long as WRAW's service isn't compromised. I for one prefer the idea of local radio over religion. The only thing is will the community go for it? Recently, a radio station in Winchester, Virginia http://wxva.com/ signed on the AM, and they already seem to be showing some promise. But we're talking a rural area versus a major metropolitan suburb. Could a class C (or IV) in Bala or eastern "DelCo" make a 'go' at it? Just some thoughts.

 

[MikefromDelaware]

Does WVCH have a poor signal in Philly and North and East? Because WVCH comes in great in the car with a solid signal from Wilmington south to near Dover DE. Other than at night when they power down and the Canadian 740 comes in with a pretty good signal.

 

[DG02816]

Since I've been down here, I have to agree with Mike's observation.WVCH seems to get out better to the south and west. It's listenable here at home in Oreland, but not full quieting. Signal was decent in Bala one Sunday when I was at WNWR and had to check on Marcus Hook. Going into Jersey, it fades out about halfway down the AC Expressway, and WNYH begins to take over. In AC itself, it's all Long Island during the day, via a saltwater path, with their 25 kW. If I'm out in the car during Critical Hours on a winter afternoon, I can hear the carriers of Toronto and Long Island under VCH.

 

[qtpieislit]

Ever notice that WHAT is probably the only station in the world to have never issued a reception report?

That is unless Paoli Pa. qualifies as a reception report parameter.


WHAT can simply convert to NIST WWV for people in Wynfield to set their watches to.

 

[rackit]

Sam as a listener of WHAT who is looking for a place to find this music when it's gone, I'm shocked at your classless remarks about the radio station. Especially since you are plugging your own business when you do. I for one won't waste my time listening to your station, and will make a point of telling my friends and co-workers how disrespectful you are.

 

[qtpieislit]

Sam as a listener of WHAT who is looking for a place to find this music when it's gone, I'm shocked at your classless remarks about the radio station. Especially since you are plugging your own business when you do. I for one won't waste my time listening to your station, and will make a point of telling my friends and co-workers how disrespectful you are.

lol. What are you blaming me for. 1340 is the most deficient terrestrial signal licensed to Philadelphia. What's that got to do with me? I have a modulator that has better coverage than 1340.

 

[klutch00]

Sam as a listener of WHAT who is looking for a place to find this music when it's gone, I'm shocked at your classless remarks about the radio station. Especially since you are plugging your own business when you do. I for one won't waste my time listening to your station, and will make a point of telling my friends and co-workers how disrespectful you are.

Forgive me for sounding like a broken record, but methinks the best options for a pop-standards/jazz/big band format for the future might be to have the station partially or even entirely rely on donations for income sources. 1540 might be a good candidate. Now, with WIP to move their programming to FM soon, maybe 610 might become a viable option ! Should the latter happen, I would just hope that the WIP calls could be retained, but that's me !

 

[DG02816]

I know of two AM stations doing the listener-supported model now: WJTO-730 Bath ME, and WJIB-740 Cambridge MA. Owner Bob Bittner runs no ads, and has some church time on 740 to help pay for operating expenses. Thinking the same holds for 730. 1540 might be a good idea with the call changed back to WPGR and its former 500-watt night authorization restored.It may be possible to get more power at night with the new MoM method of array design. If 610 goes music, I'd love seeing a WNEW-style format there.

 

[rtetro]

I'd love seeing a WNEW-style format there.

I've got the entire WNEW playlist on MP3 that was used in their last two years - which is as close to the old WNEW 50s-60s music library as you will find. (I know of no one who has a copy of the music playlist from the glory days of the 50s-60s). So, if anyone ever wanted to do the format.....

At WNEW, when we found out that we were being sold to Bloomberg in 1992, I began copying music like crazy onto DAT. Over a period of two months I managed to copy the entire WNEW playlist, most from LPs, some from CDs, and a very few from cart. I then transferred them to MP3 about six years ago. The one downside, because I was limited in hard drive storage space when I made the MP3 transfer, I made the transfer at 128 kbs. If I were to do it again I would do it at either 256 or 320, or perhaps FLAC. It's a lot of work, though, and I'm not sure I'm up for it.

Anyway, here comes the shameless plug. if you want to hear the old WNEW music library, you can hear it on my internet radio station at www.breezyradio.org or on "Breezy Radio" on Itunes Radio under the Jazz category.

 

[DG02816]

Rene',
Listening to Breezy now. One word: Gorgeous!