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I Have HD Buyer's Remorse

So says Tim Schwieger, president of BSW. Since getting the HD Radio option in his BMW-X5 a year ago he has been, "conditioned to expect the HD signal to constantly pop in and out", even though the Sea-Tac area where he lives has 11 stations broadcasting HD.

HD2 is worse. Instead of going from digital to analog and back it, "just mutes, and mutes," Tim says. Oops, no analog back-up for side channels there, Tim.

He says he feels "gypped." Tim should have been reading this forum a year ago. We could have saved him a bundle of money.

But you can read his letter of frustration in the latest issue of Radio World.

C5
 
Len14043 said:
When the FCC grants the 10db power increase for FM, that will take care of the problem.

It will NOT solve the problem in the fringes in cars, where signal strengths vary by many decades of strength, not just a paltry one decade. Given the lock time of HD - I doubt the listener in a car will notice any difference at all.

And the 10 dB of increase will cause a whole host of new problems.
 
And the smart money is saying they're not going to get an across-the-board 10db increase.

NPR is re-studying the issue. If 10 db is dogmatically insisted upon, their support will disappear, because the pubcasters are very wary of increased interference in their part of the band. IBOC desperately needs NPR.

Instead there will likely be some kind of "have their cake and eat it too" middling approach where stations will have to make a threshold showing that they will produce no adjacent-channel problems with a digital increase. Most stations in major metropolitan areas won't qualify so they'll have to settle for 6db...perhaps less.

IMO it doesn't matter - 10db or 6db, contrary to your statement, neither will dramatically improve digital penetration. You need power increases on the order of several decades, not just one, to significantly improve robustness at the receivers.

Besides, there is no money for massive transmitter site rebuilds which would be necessary in most cases with a big digital power hike. At some sites, such as those atop office towers, there isn't space for the higher powered HD transmitting gear - necessitating a Tx site move costing millions. Elsewhere on this board there is a thread referencing how a not-insignificant number of stations are turning HD OFF entirely to save on utility costs....producing NO listener complaints. In this world, how many stations are going to make the capital outlay to serve a nonexistent audience??

The big power hike, or whatever variety of it which might be eventually approved, just isn't going to happen - outside of perhaps a few big Alliance HD-sponsoring stations - "show horses," so to speak, for an audience which long ago failed to materialize.
 
rbrucecarter5 said:
It will NOT solve the problem in the fringes in cars, where signal strengths vary by many decades of strength, not just a paltry one decade. Given the lock time of HD - I doubt the listener in a car will notice any difference at all.

And the 10 dB of increase will cause a whole host of new problems.

Even if the signal varies by decades, a 10-fold increase in power will nearly double the distance the signal is reliably received. If we follow your logic, then IBOC at 0.1% injection instead of the current 1% wont make much of a difference. Besides, FM IBOC in cars works fairly well now. Reception in buildings is the problem.
With respect to the "whole host of problems", it depends on who you talk to. For dxers, I'm sure it will cause problems.
 
Len14043 said:
Even if the signal varies by decades, a 10-fold increase in power will nearly double the distance the signal is reliably received. If we follow your logic, then IBOC at 0.1% injection instead of the current 1% wont make much of a difference. Besides, FM IBOC in cars works fairly well now. Reception in buildings is the problem.
With respect to the "whole host of problems", it depends on who you talk to. For dxers, I'm sure it will cause problems.

Actually, it will do nothing in the fringes when the signal strength varies by several decades as you drive in the car, for the reason I stated earlier. And the same problem applies to the approach path of any major airport. Widely fluctuating signal strengths doom HD lock. Cars and airport approach paths are HD problem areas, unless you want a 60 dB power increase, HD won't stay locked under those conditions.

I measured 6 to 8 feet more penetration into a building. About enough for a row of cubicles. Office listening is streaming or iPod. Deal with it. 10 dB won't change that.

I did measure reliable HD lock at present power levels 70 miles from Dallas Ft. Worth. The cows in the field, I am sure, appreciate HD radio. 70 miles reliable lock with a stationary receiver away from airports. Exactly - how far is far enough for you? How many more cows do you need to cover outside the metro areas?

Let's take another look at the 10 dB increase. Right now, you have a maximum of 1000W on the sidebands. That isn't enough to reflect in the upper atmosphere. There are very few reports of tropos on 1000W stations. The situation changes dramatically with 10,000W stations, which is the equivalent of the IBOC sidebands you are proposing on full class C. We are presently at historically low sunspot activity. That won't last forever, it is cyclic. Once the sunspots return and you get tropos daily during the summer, these increased sidebands are going to propagate hundreds of miles, wiping out reception of local stations all over the country - unpredictably. It is inevitable. It would be far better to keep the power levels low enough to keep them out of the upper atmosphere, or risk massive disruptions in the future, on the order of magnitude of what is happening now to AM. AM is a throwaway band right now, brokered ethnic, talk, and sports. FM is the money band - do you really want consumers tuning in to local stations - and due to the capture ratio effect - hearing very loud interference instead? They will have even more motivation to tune out of radio entirely!

That is just one massive complication - there are a lot of others like overlapping IBOC sidebands in densely packed population centers like the NE. Primarily affecting the non-comm band. Do you really want religious broadcasters throwing their sidebands all over the place wiping out NPR stations? You are giving them the tools to legally jam adjacent stations, and jam they will - to keep the "evil liberals" off the air.

Need I go on? IBOC has trashed the AM band, with sidebands audible 1000 miles in the daytime and who knows how far at night, obliterating local stations - like 610 in Houston due to KMKI sidebands almost 300 miles away at night. So with AM a disaster because of overpowered sidebands, let's re-make FM in its image - THAT is YOUR logic!
 
Len14043 said:
When the FCC grants the 10db power increase for FM, that will take care of the problem.

Dream on.

HD supporters have always been making all kinds of incredible claims for their failed high school science fair project. Even if all HD FM stations are approved for an across the board 10 db power increase, and quickly implement it, there will be minimal improvement in coverage or reliability. What there will be is exacerbated interference problems in the most populated areas of the country. Population = potential listeners.

The 10 db HD radio power increase will also create even more interference to the stereo analog signal.

Since HD radio has virtually no listeners, why not conserve capital and turn it off?

It's time to put an end to this HD radio nonsense. HD radio on AM? A bad joke.
 
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