Infinity's Handling of This Change: Brilliant!

[lance]

I know there's a large outcry over the loss of Oldies. You have every right to be upset with the loss of CBS-FM, but this is exactly what Infinity expected.

How do you make the biggest splash possible? You affect the most people possible?

There's few times that a radio station makes the front page of a newspaper or the lead story on the local newscasts. Only times I can remember recently were the backlash over Sex For Sam 3 and Stern's announcement over moving to Sirius.

You can't pay for that much promotion. Everybody in the metropolitian New York area knows what Jack-FM is now. Hell, most people in America know what Jack-FM is. And I bet a number of those will continue to listen if they like the music and variety heard.

All of those of you logging all the advertisers to boycott: Guess what? You've become a loyal listener to Jack in order to hear who to boycott. Infinity knows that when the buzz dies down, some of you will end up liking what you hear.

And where are all the disenfranchised CBS-FM listeners going to go? If nobody else flips to Oldies, some are going to go to Lite-FM, and some to Mix 102.7, while many others to AM. And guess who owns three of the big four AM's? You got it. Infinity. WINS, WCBS, and WFAN are all going to gain listeners.

In fact WNEW may be the biggest winner in all this. The rhythmic mix on Mix 102.7 no longer has to worry about overlap with CBS-FM. Instead Mix and Jack will be able to protect each other.

If somebody else flips to Oldies the likely candidates are WPLJ and WQCD. If PLJ dies, guess where it's listeners are likely to to go? Yup. Jack-FM.

If Jack was to be born on 102.7 or 92.3 it would have gotten nowhere near the attention that it has gotten on 101.1. That will all lead to more listeners, more advertisers, and more revenue for Infinity.


<P ID="signature">______________
</P>

 

[RobertGoldberg]

I agree with you. I wondered why they didn't pull the plug on K-EARTH 101 in Los Angles instead of Arrow 93 until I realized that Arrow 93 and Jack 101 would be competing for the same audience. Not so in NY where Infinity doesn't have a classic rock station.

 

[OttoM]

Totally agree with you, Lance.

Over on that "other board" - they're crying over and over again about the loss of oldies - but with each post, each advertiser listed, and each minute listened - they're helping to make JACK a success.

 

[MichaelE]

I hate to agree with you about this, only because I don't want this to be a brilliant move, but you're right. For now, though, I guess I'll be stubborn enough to not listen to Jack just on principle. Of course, if Q 104.3 ever dares to "Jack" themselves, I may just have to bring all my CD's into the cae

> How do you make the biggest splash possible? You affect the
> most people possible?
>
>
> You can't pay for that much promotion. Everybody in the
> metropolitian New York area knows what Jack-FM is now. Hell,
> most people in America know what Jack-FM is. And I bet a
> number of those will continue to listen if they like the
> music and variety heard.
>
>
> If Jack was to be born on 102.7 or 92.3 it would have gotten
> nowhere near the attention that it has gotten on 101.1. That
> will all lead to more listeners, more advertisers, and more
> revenue for Infinity.
>

 

[mlaura1224]

> I know there's a large outcry over the loss of Oldies. You
> have every right to be upset with the loss of CBS-FM, but
> this is exactly what Infinity expected.
>
> How do you make the biggest splash possible? You affect the
> most people possible?
>
> There's few times that a radio station makes the front page
> of a newspaper or the lead story on the local newscasts.
> Only times I can remember recently were the backlash over
> Sex For Sam 3 and Stern's announcement over moving to
> Sirius.
>
> You can't pay for that much promotion. Everybody in the
> metropolitian New York area knows what Jack-FM is now. Hell,
> most people in America know what Jack-FM is. And I bet a
> number of those will continue to listen if they like the
> music and variety heard.
>
> All of those of you logging all the advertisers to boycott:
> Guess what? You've become a loyal listener to Jack in order
> to hear who to boycott. Infinity knows that when the buzz
> dies down, some of you will end up liking what you hear.
>
> And where are all the disenfranchised CBS-FM listeners going
> to go? If nobody else flips to Oldies, some are going to go
> to Lite-FM, and some to Mix 102.7, while many others to AM.
> And guess who owns three of the big four AM's? You got it.
> Infinity. WINS, WCBS, and WFAN are all going to gain
> listeners.
>
> In fact WNEW may be the biggest winner in all this. The
> rhythmic mix on Mix 102.7 no longer has to worry about
> overlap with CBS-FM. Instead Mix and Jack will be able to
> protect each other.
>
> If somebody else flips to Oldies the likely candidates are
> WPLJ and WQCD. If PLJ dies, guess where it's listeners are
> likely to to go? Yup. Jack-FM.
>
> If Jack was to be born on 102.7 or 92.3 it would have gotten
> nowhere near the attention that it has gotten on 101.1. That
> will all lead to more listeners, more advertisers, and more
> revenue for Infinity.
>
As much as I hate to admit it,Lance is right! Jack got a ton of press. Bad or good, it still got people talking about the station. If I was a radio station programmer or owner, I would start to re-think how my station is programed. The listener is what makes or breaks a station. It is time for the big guns to take note! CBS FM was a great radio station, but like any other death, we need to remember the good times and move on. It is time for us to find a middle ground between the older listener and young people who need to know why radio is great. If we don't teach our youth about radio, it will die a slow death....Just my thought.

 

[hykos1045]

Brilliant except for the part of making Oldies fans listen exclusively on-line. How many WCBS listeners even own a computer? Don't be shy, raise each other's hand.

 

[JustinCase]

Initially its a big splash in the media, but I don't think its the kind of format that will win here. The music is all good (although not the same as the other Jack stations I've listened too) its also overly "white" in its musical programming for being in Americas most ethnically diverse city.

However I think its biggest flaw in the long run of JACK in NYC and what will have people flipping the dial will be its lack of news, weather, traffic, and the pulse of the city... especially at those all important drive times.

This just feels like another one of those big splash in the pan formats that tends to claim a hertiage station or two across the country makes some headlines and then dies in a year or two. Personality, news, weather, traffic and interaction are the only things radio have over IPODS and CD players... Radio can't compete with 'em head on as people load only songs and artists they like and radio has commercials. When you give up on your strengths you lose in the long run, especially here!

 

[mike704]

> Brilliant except for the part of making Oldies fans listen
> exclusively on-line. How many WCBS listeners even own a
> computer? Don't be shy, raise each other's hand.
>

Must not be very many from the lack of postings here. No one has bothered to mentioned CBS-FM on line is not living up to the letter published by management. So far I haven't heard any jocks streaming their shows or any other human input. Just oldies (with lots of repeats) and jingles.

The streaming died a few minutes ago by the way. I wonder how long it will take someone to notice?

 

[kevinsealy]

> I know there's a large outcry over the loss of Oldies. You
> have every right to be upset with the loss of CBS-FM, but
> this is exactly what Infinity expected.
>
> How do you make the biggest splash possible? You affect the
> most people possible?
>
> There's few times that a radio station makes the front page
> of a newspaper or the lead story on the local newscasts.
> Only times I can remember recently were the backlash over
> Sex For Sam 3 and Stern's announcement over moving to
> Sirius.
>
> You can't pay for that much promotion. Everybody in the
> metropolitian New York area knows what Jack-FM is now. Hell,
> most people in America know what Jack-FM is. And I bet a
> number of those will continue to listen if they like the
> music and variety heard.
>
> All of those of you logging all the advertisers to boycott:
> Guess what? You've become a loyal listener to Jack in order
> to hear who to boycott. Infinity knows that when the buzz
> dies down, some of you will end up liking what you hear.
>
> And where are all the disenfranchised CBS-FM listeners going
> to go? If nobody else flips to Oldies, some are going to go
> to Lite-FM, and some to Mix 102.7, while many others to AM.
> And guess who owns three of the big four AM's? You got it.
> Infinity. WINS, WCBS, and WFAN are all going to gain
> listeners.
>
> If somebody else flips to Oldies the likely candidates are
> WPLJ and WQCD. If PLJ dies, guess where it's listeners are
> likely to to go? Yup. Jack-FM.
>
> If Jack was to be born on 102.7 or 92.3 it would have gotten
> nowhere near the attention that it has gotten on 101.1. That
> will all lead to more listeners, more advertisers, and more
> revenue for Infinity.
>




Lance:

> In fact WNEW may be the biggest winner in all this. The
> rhythmic mix on Mix 102.7 no longer has to worry about
> overlap with CBS-FM. Instead Mix and Jack will be able to
> protect each other.


The was no overlapping between the NEW Mix 102.7 WNEW-FM.In fact the station sounded much more like WKTU than CBS-FM. When MIx was a mainstream AC station that sounded a little like CBS-FM, like how (Lite-FM) WLTW somewhat overlaps with CBS-FM.

I see Lite-FM picking up a large share of CBS-FM's audience even though they don't play a heavy rotation of 60s music.

In react to this Jack format, I see WPLJ and WAXQ-1043 broadening their playing or increasing the number of songs they rotate.

The success of Jack remains to be seen. Afterall, New York is NOT a rock town and having WAXQ-1043, WXRK-Rock and WPLJ having overlapping formats the rock audience could be stretched so thin.












Thanks,
Kevin L. Sealy<P ID="signature">______________
Kevin L. Sealy</P>

 

[dab1100]

> How do you make the biggest splash possible? You affect the
> most people possible?

Why not set off a couple of pipe bombs in Grand Central Station. That'll get you headlines, too. As I recall, O&A's little St. Patty' Cathedral prank didn't propel WNEW to a 5-share... and certain derogatory skits involving Asians and Tsunamis did not bode well for Hot 97.

>Hell,
> most people in America know what Jack-FM is.

I disagree. Us radio geeks know what "Jack" is, but to 99.9% of the listeners "Jack" is right up there in their daily vocabulary along with "stopset," "quarter-hour maintenance," and "effective radiated power."

And I bet a
> number of those will continue to listen if they like the
> music and variety heard.

Some will.... some won't... but why spin the wheel when you have an established brand.

>
> All of those of you logging all the advertisers to boycott:

I agree... it won't make one whit of difference. If the ratings (25-54) stay the same or improve, so will billing. If the ratings tank, the advertisers will either go elsewhere or stay at lower rate.

> And where are all the disenfranchised CBS-FM listeners going
> to go?

They're going to scatter... WLTW, WPLJ, WAXQ, and (to a lesser degree) WRKS and WKTU will gain the most. Hometown oldies stations (e.g., WBZO, WKHL, WMTR) will gain. In Central NJ, WOGL will pick up some listeners. The News or Talk AM's probably won't benefit that much... if someone wants talk, they want talk... when they want music... they want music. The real tragedy, though is that a lot of these listeners will spend less time listening to terrestrial radio and spend that time listening to CD's, MP3's, or Satellite Radio.


> In fact WNEW may be the biggest winner in all this. The
> rhythmic mix on Mix 102.7 no longer has to worry about
> overlap with CBS-FM. Instead Mix and Jack will be able to
> protect each other.

Again, I beg to differ... you'll prbably see much more playlist overlap now than there was before.

>
> If somebody else flips to Oldies the likely candidates are
> WPLJ and WQCD. If PLJ dies, guess where it's listeners are
> likely to to go? Yup. Jack-FM.

ABC would be the perfect company to bring back oldies. They have another great brand name from the 60's and 70's.... WABC. However, since WPLJ is out-billing CBS-FM don't look for them to make a change. If ABC owned another, less established FM signal (as they do, say, in Chicago, Detroit, or Dallas), I'd be placing big bets on the emergence of WABC-FM. WQCD seems to be doing ok. Good in-demo performance, low overhead, strong niche. A dark horse, I'd say, but not out of the realm of possibilities.


> If Jack was to be born on 102.7 or 92.3 it would have gotten
> nowhere near the attention that it has gotten on 101.1.

True... but then again if Coca Cola had replaced Tab with "New" Coke instead of replacing the original Coke, it also would have gotten nowhere near the attention. However, it was still one of the greatest marketing blunders since the Edsel.

> will all lead to more listeners, more advertisers, and more
> revenue for Infinity.
>

That remains to be seen. If "Jack" implodes to a 2-share (which is quite possible after a couple of books, look for that $31-Mil they billed last year to shrink to about half that number. K-rock is on thin ice. Is there life after Howard? And for WNEW, schools still out. This is the longest they've stayed with a format in a while.... but that ain't saying much.

One really off the wall possibility..... something's gotta' give with K-rock in the post-Howard era. They're pretty much a one-trick pony and that horse is getting out of dodge! Pull the plug on Howard now.... new call letters for "Jack" at 101.1 and 92.3 becomes WCBS-FM. You run it less expensively ("name" talents in drives only) and voice-track or use low-profile talent elsewhere). A long shot, I know but who would have predicted this whole thing a week ago?

 

[dab1100]

I'm not dead yet (it's just a flesh wound).

> Brilliant except for the part of making Oldies fans listen
> exclusively on-line. How many WCBS listeners even own a
> computer? Don't be shy, raise each other's hand.

OK.. the core of CBS's audience has aged a bit, but still in the 25-54 demo and despite conventional wisdom, one does not drop dead they day he/she turns 55. This 51 year old oldies fan owns an I-pod, and has two computers at home (plus one on my desk at work)and for the record, my 79 year old father also owns and uses a computer. I own three late-model cars, eat out regularly, and just re-financed my mortgage. In about three years when my oldes child gets out of college.... my disposable income goes up by about $25,000 a year. Undesirable demographic.... I don't think so!!

 

[BRNout]

> > In fact WNEW may be the biggest winner in all this. The
> > rhythmic mix on Mix 102.7 no longer has to worry about
> > overlap with CBS-FM. Instead Mix and Jack will be able to
> > protect each other.
>
> Again, I beg to differ... you'll prbably see much more
> playlist overlap now than there was before.
>

I've gotta take issue with this statement. WNEW is the most likely station to pick up some of the "Motown and Philly Soul" listeners of CBS-FM. And, the station may add a few more titles from the late 1960s and 1970s to this end. Plus, this Jack is a rocker at heart. Purposefully different than "Mix".

Remember, its all Infinity. I'm sure that one factor in this very questionable decision was that *maybe* they could grow Jack while pushing enough CBS-FM listeners over to 102.7 to make this a combined win. They want to have their cake and eat it too. Whether this will happen is quite questionable...


> > If somebody else flips to Oldies the likely candidates are
>
> > WPLJ and WQCD. If PLJ dies, guess where it's listeners are
>
> > likely to to go? Yup. Jack-FM.
>
> ABC would be the perfect company to bring back oldies. They
> have another great brand name from the 60's and 70's....
> WABC. However, since WPLJ is out-billing CBS-FM don't look
> for them to make a change. If ABC owned another, less
> established FM signal (as they do, say, in Chicago, Detroit,
> or Dallas), I'd be placing big bets on the emergence of
> WABC-FM. WQCD seems to be doing ok. Good in-demo
> performance, low overhead, strong niche. A dark horse, I'd
> say, but not out of the realm of possibilities.
>
Agreed. A second incarnation of WAAAABC would be awesome. I'd bet that it is being discussed right now. However, that doesn't mean that Disney will do it. I'm sure that they too are concerned over whether the demos are right.

 

[mlaura1224]

> > Brilliant except for the part of making Oldies fans listen
>
> > exclusively on-line. How many WCBS listeners even own a
> > computer? Don't be shy, raise each other's hand.
> >
>
> Must not be very many from the lack of postings here. No
> one has bothered to mentioned CBS-FM on line is not living
> up to the letter published by management. So far I haven't
> heard any jocks streaming their shows or any other human
> input. Just oldies (with lots of repeats) and jingles.
>
> The streaming died a few minutes ago by the way. I wonder
> how long it will take someone to notice?
>
Just going through the messages. Yes, I agree with this comment. some of these listeners are not into computers at all. As a friend of mine points out, most of the CBS listeners grew up listening to radio, why change now.

 

[icybluelake]

Brilliant flip? Dull format.

Brilliant handling of the flip, maybe. Brilliant new format, I think not.

I'm just waiting to be proven wrong over the long haul, but have a feeling I won't be.

 

[MikeDane]

one little flaw

> All of those of you logging all the advertisers to boycott:
> Guess what? You've become a loyal listener to Jack in order
> to hear who to boycott. Infinity knows that when the buzz
> dies down, some of you will end up liking what you hear.
>

There is one little flaw in your reasoning. It only takes
a couple of people to monitor the station and post it on
a web page.

Mike Dane

 

[Calgaryperson]

> I know there's a large outcry over the loss of Oldies. You
> have every right to be upset with the loss of CBS-FM, but
> this is exactly what Infinity expected.
>
> How do you make the biggest splash possible? You affect the
> most people possible?
>
> There's few times that a radio station makes the front page
> of a newspaper or the lead story on the local newscasts.
> Only times I can remember recently were the backlash over
> Sex For Sam 3 and Stern's announcement over moving to
> Sirius.
>
> You can't pay for that much promotion. Everybody in the
> metropolitian New York area knows what Jack-FM is now. Hell,
> most people in America know what Jack-FM is. And I bet a
> number of those will continue to listen if they like the
> music and variety heard.
>
> All of those of you logging all the advertisers to boycott:
> Guess what? You've become a loyal listener to Jack in order
> to hear who to boycott. Infinity knows that when the buzz
> dies down, some of you will end up liking what you hear.
>
> And where are all the disenfranchised CBS-FM listeners going
> to go? If nobody else flips to Oldies, some are going to go
> to Lite-FM, and some to Mix 102.7, while many others to AM.
> And guess who owns three of the big four AM's? You got it.
> Infinity. WINS, WCBS, and WFAN are all going to gain
> listeners.
>
> In fact WNEW may be the biggest winner in all this. The
> rhythmic mix on Mix 102.7 no longer has to worry about
> overlap with CBS-FM. Instead Mix and Jack will be able to
> protect each other.
>
> If somebody else flips to Oldies the likely candidates are
> WPLJ and WQCD. If PLJ dies, guess where it's listeners are
> likely to to go? Yup. Jack-FM.
>
> If Jack was to be born on 102.7 or 92.3 it would have gotten
> nowhere near the attention that it has gotten on 101.1. That
> will all lead to more listeners, more advertisers, and more
> revenue for Infinity.
>
Here's a thought that I've been thinking of for a while now. Sorry if someone else beat me to it,

Could 101.1 JACK FM being temporary?

Edmonton's JOE fm (Corus Entertainment's clone) originally lauched on 880AM, displacing the oldies format that was long established there. Months later, JOE moved to 92.5FM (bumping a CHR) and the oldies format returned to 880AM.

Could JACK FM move to WXRK-FM once Howard leaves and the oldies format return to CBS-FM?

If there are any listners from JACK, could they transfer to WXRK (even picking up a few listeners over there) and CBS-FM gaining old and new listeners when/if it returns?

Just a thought.<P ID="signature">______________

Canada TV and College Radio</P>

 

[Joseph_Gallant]

Ron Stutson wrote:

> Over on that "other board" - they're crying over and over
> again about the loss of oldies - but with each post, each
> advertiser listed, and each minute listened - they're
> helping to make JACK a success.

Given that the format change at WCBS-101.1 appeared, from all sources, to be very abrupt, it's my guess that the advertisers heard on the station up to and perhaps including today (June 7th) bought time on 101.1 assuming it would be an oldies station.