Internet RADIO May Dramatically Change NJ Radio - Playing Field

[joshzz]

LIke you I keep hearing more and more about Internet Radio being added to vehicles.

Personally, I believe it will radically change how we view radio. Arbitron ratings will become much more difficult to maintain. The small guys with great local programming like Lift FM will be on the same playing field as NJ 101.5.

How do you think it will affect local stations like Thunder FM, NJ 101.5, WIBG, WAYV, SOJO, Lift FM, WRAT, WLTW and WSUS to name a few?

josh 8)

 

[MattParker]

LIke you I keep hearing more and more about Internet Radio being added to vehicles.

Personally, I believe it will radically change how we view radio. Arbitron ratings will become much more difficult to maintain. The small guys with great local programming like Lift FM will be on the same playing field as NJ 101.5.

How do you think it will affect local stations like Thunder FM, NJ 101.5, WIBG, WAYV, SOJO, Lift FM, WRAT, WLTW and WSUS to name a few?

josh 8)

Josh, Internet radio ain't there yet. I listen in my car. Internet radio is subject to frequent interruptions (both dropped connections and long buffering). It requires a lot of attention while driving: Check to see if you've lost the stream. Re-connect. Find another stream. No push-buttons like car radios, yet. Most people won't put up with the hassle.

Not all Internet radio sites are created equal: A few streams dominate and together get most of the listeners. However, listeners who take the trouble to hunt for it, are able to find exactly the content they want. But we still have a long-tail curve and probably will for some time.

Broadcasters are losing the war to the on-demand sites like Pandora, Slacker and Last.fm, and to the online music sellers who make it possible for people to build and carry their own radio station music library. Younger people are moving away from being consumers of programming (somebody picks content for you and a lot of other people) and moving toward have-it-your-way. Newer versions of media software are becoming less supportive of online radio listening. Broadcasters aren't helping: In their desire to force hits on their websites and show ads to listeners on computer screens (like people don't minimize or cover the player while they do other stuff on their computers) they have made online listening less accessible and less user friendly.

Radio stations that thrive online will have to be website operators first, radio broadcasters second. Big or small on the playing field of over-the-air radio doesn't matter so much.

 

[amfmsw]

No doubt about it, the next 10 years will be explosive for netcasters. Those doing it right at this time will be the monsters of the next decade. But just throwing your audio stream on won't cut it. The station must be interactive on Social networking sites, it's the only way the listeners, and potential new listeners, feel invited in. Commercial Radio programmers have closed out the listener, forcing them to watch through glass windows and locked doors..."here, you'll enjoy this, my research says so. This tested well in Cleveland."

As far as reach, Wi-Max WILL be here. The new Ford products already receive Internet radio with their Sync System in major cities.

The stream interruptions are caused by crap distribution, and stations who don't care. Surfernet comes to mind...great at 3AM Eastern. If it's free, it's for me...they're bartered services for ad space. Do it right. I have NEVER, EVER lost a feed, or had interruption from www.hylitradio.com or Pandora, Nutsie Top 100 Anything or CBS Radio (I like Reunion Radio).

 

[d21ofnj]

Josh, Internet radio ain't there yet. I listen in my car. Internet radio is subject to frequent interruptions (both dropped connections and long buffering). It requires a lot of attention while driving: Check to see if you've lost the stream. Re-connect. Find another stream. No push-buttons like car radios, yet. Most people won't put up with the hassle.

Not all Internet radio sites are created equal: A few streams dominate and together get most of the listeners. However, listeners who take the trouble to hunt for it, are able to find exactly the content they want. But we still have a long-tail curve and probably will for some time.

Broadcasters aren't helping: In their desire to force hits on their websites and show ads to listeners on computer screens (like people don't minimize or cover the player while they do other stuff on their computers) they have made online listening less accessible and less user friendly.

Drops out for me if I leave a major metro area and head towards the suburbs or rural areas. As far as it not being there, at this moment, probably, but give it a few more years, and you will see the wi-fi and the 3G or 4G networks expand more. For the push button option, no need to constantly do it. Search the stream once, and lock it in the preset. This is how satellite radio started out with the loss of a broadcast and such. If any internet radio stream made it less accessible and less user friendly is Live365. I used Live for nearly 5 years, but once the upgrade kicked in and the rates climbed high about 18%, I cancelled the service and found my own basic provider for half the cost.

 

[KC2LDY]

Internet radio will eventually have a major impact on broadcasters. I currently listen to a lot of Internet radio at home on my Grace radio. But the medium's success in vehicles and other mobile/wireless applications is contingent on the availability of inexpensive, robust and reliable Wi-Fi for most Americans. There'll be no faking it... unless connection is cheap and drop-dead reliable, it won't work. But think we'll eventually get that service - beginning in major cities, then extending elsewhere in those metropolitan areas and the major traffic routes between them. After that, it'll expand to other, less-populated areas of the country. How soon? Hard to say. 5 years? 10 years?

 

[tom]

The technology for mobile Internet is pretty decent right now for data,
but it's not solid enough for audio. Those data plans are about $ 60 a
month for 5 gigabytes. No one is going to pay that much for mobile
data for streaming radio, and the 5 gigabytes would run out in a few
days I think. The 3G and 4G cell phone technology isn't bad, but I
find it breaks up on my big mile and a half ride home from work. The
cell phone providers will raise the prices and put a cap on the data
once people start listening more. The Internet radio providers are
going to have to support their services with Aural commercials, since
there aren't screens in cars to see text ads.

It's not going to be easy. People who can't find what they want on
traditional broadcast radio will probably continue to play their own
music from MP3 players, and get their traffic from their GPS, and be
happy. I would venture to guess that 50% of music listeners are
happy listening to the same songs over and over, without introducing
any new music to the mix. Younger people may be happy loading up
the player with new music on a regular basis, but older people don't care.
Talk and Sports radio will still be viable.

Technology gets better all the time, but they want to make money on
all of this stuff, not give it away. The public is cheap, they want stuff
free. It's not gonna happen. Think about how many people loved the
free XM or Sirius radio in the new car, but didn't renew it after the free
year subscription was up, and that's only like $ 12.99 a month.

 

[MattParker]

My "all you can eat" data plan is $15.00. The plan for subsidized iPhones and Droids is $30.00. But those options aren't available for newbies with carriers switching to metered plans.

Meanwhile, broadcasters keep switching to high bandwidth audio streams and dropping (or hiding) their old dial-up streams. Bad timing. Audio streams of 64bps or lower seem to work better on a 3G connection (less dropping out). And the lower the bandwidth, the less data use for those on metered plans.

Bottom line: Broadcasters, keep those lower bandwidth streams for mobile listeners.

 

[d21ofnj]

Tried that, I had too much complaints about how poor the sound quality was. So I stuck with 128K. The phone apps are just the beginning, give it time for things to upgrade to the capacity. I dont think 128K is going anywhere, since that is the "sound of stereo" for internet streams.

 

[Kevin TRC]

I think real radio stations may have a very hard time when internet hits car radios. I think they do now. As much as I like listening to radio in my car, I more often than not find myself plugging my droid into my car radio and listening to Pandora. Through apps I can also listen to other stations outside of the Atlantic County area.

As fopr price, I disagree with Tom McNally respectfully. Remember when VCR's cost $1000. How quick was it that they dropped to $100. I think ISP's will see the benefit and make radios cheap faster than we think to get them into cars. Also, in my situation I don't even need and ISP. All I need is a cable from my radio to my droid and my car charger if necessary. I have an unlimited data plan like I guess many others do.

I'm not a PD or radio manager, but I think PD's should be worried if I can be driving down the Garden State Parkway and listening to Pandora and getting my traffic from my GPS. Welcome to the technology age.

 

[TheBigA]

I expect the roof will fall in on Pandora in the next few years. The founders want to cash out. I've seen this before where they keep making deals and fattening the calf, and at some point their either do an IPO or sell out to some investment group. When that happens, Tim gets a big house in Marin, a Ferarri, and all the money he'll ever need. Then the new owners start increasing the commercials, and next thing you know, it's like MySpace. All of this internet stuff, from Facebook to Twitter to Pandora is just like Clear Channel ten years ago.

 

[tom]

Kevin -

I also have a Droid, and haven't gotten that great of results listening to
streaming while moving. I do plug it into the system in the car and
listen to Podcasts or the 1000 or so songs I have on it.

The cost of the equipment isn't the issue - it's the cost of bandwidth.
Verizon and the other carriers will limit things and raise the price when
their system is clogged up and slowed down with data users, like AT&T did
when iPhones sloed down things in the bigger cities.

Guys like us will pay for data plans, the general public won't want to pay
for a data plan for the car radio. I may be wrong, but look at the poor
acceptance of Sirius and XM. Verizon and the others aren't going to
give away bandwidth.

Speaking of the Droid ... TuneInRadio is a great free app.

Since the update to froyo (Android 2.2) with Adobe Flash, you don't
even need an app to listen to Flash streaming, just go to the station's
page.

By the way, at Millennium, we use multiple streams, 64K MP3 and 48K AAC.
It has been said that we have some of the best sounding streams around.
We are using Orban Optimod Sound Cards with simple dbx pre-processors.

 

[SilverTonicFree]

Internet radio in cars is definitely building, but until it gets an easier to access interface for cars, it won't EXPLODE like people predicted. Think of it this way:

There is legislation to stop text messaging while driving because it's distracting. Imagine scrolling through internet radio stations trying to find something good on while driving. It's distracting. Until an interface is designed that can harness the bazillion internet radio stations out there into an easy-to-use and non-distracting format, internet radio WILL have it's limitations (besides dropping out, audio quality, bandwidth etc.)

Just my two cents. 3 and one half cents if you're in Canada.

 

[Goat Rodeo Cowboy]

The station must be interactive on Social networking sites, it's the only way the listeners, and potential new listeners, feel invited in. Commercial Radio programmers have closed out the listener, forcing them to watch through glass windows and locked doors..."here, you'll enjoy this, my research says so. This tested well in Cleveland."

There are a lot of threads in this R-I discussion space about the future of radio, the problems of radio, etc. You have nailed what I think a lot of people are trying to define but can't find the words. Many of us remember radio that was "me and you sitting here having a nice cozy chat" and today it indeed has too much resemblance to something created by Rube Goldberg and "sealed behind glass".

The 21st Century audience has grown up with electronic games, computers, and maybe a more distant social expectation so radio of the 1940s and 1950s cannot be our prototype for a 2010 version of "me and you sitting here having a nice cozy chat". Come to think of it, "chat rooms" do not tend to be warm and fuzzy do they. ;D

 

[qtpieislit]

Internet radio in cars is definitely building, but until it gets an easier to access interface for cars, it won't EXPLODE like people predicted.  Think of it this way:

There is legislation to stop text messaging while driving because it's distracting.  Imagine scrolling through internet radio stations trying to find something good on while driving.  It's distracting.  Until an interface is designed that can harness the bazillion internet radio stations out there into an easy-to-use and non-distracting format, internet radio WILL have it's limitations (besides dropping out, audio quality, bandwidth etc.)

Just my two cents.  3 and one half cents if you're in Canada.

Apparently you have yet to discover those simple little things, like voice recognition navigation. That makes you just about 2 cents short. And without ever having held a portable protocol device, is consistent with your posts. No clue.

 

[MedianJ]

Internet radio in cars is definitely building, but until it gets an easier to access interface for cars, it won't EXPLODE like people predicted. Think of it this way:

There is legislation to stop text messaging while driving because it's distracting. Imagine scrolling through internet radio stations trying to find something good on while driving. It's distracting. Until an interface is designed that can harness the bazillion internet radio stations out there into an easy-to-use and non-distracting format, internet radio WILL have it's limitations (besides dropping out, audio quality, bandwidth etc.)

Just my two cents. 3 and one half cents if you're in Canada.

Apparently you have yet to discover those simple little things, like voice recognition navigation. That makes you just about 2 cents short. And without ever having held a portable protocol device, is consistent with your posts. No clue.

Sam Lit is right again and a man who clearly has expertise on emerging technology! Did this person ever see a Ford TV commercial for Sync ? Thanks Sam.

 

[qtpieislit]

Internet radio in cars is definitely building, but until it gets an easier to access interface for cars, it won't EXPLODE like people predicted. Think of it this way:

There is legislation to stop text messaging while driving because it's distracting. Imagine scrolling through internet radio stations trying to find something good on while driving. It's distracting. Until an interface is designed that can harness the bazillion internet radio stations out there into an easy-to-use and non-distracting format, internet radio WILL have it's limitations (besides dropping out, audio quality, bandwidth etc.)

Just my two cents. 3 and one half cents if you're in Canada.

Apparently you have yet to discover those simple little things, like voice recognition navigation. That makes you just about 2 cents short. And without ever having held a portable protocol device, is consistent with your posts. No clue.

Sam Lit is right again and a man who clearly has expertise on emerging technology! Did this person ever see a Ford TV commercial for Sync ? Thanks Sam.

SilverTonicFree is still in wonder of superhet Amplitude tuning on a rotary dial set that cuts off at 1605 Khz. I hope at lease it's a wide band reciever.

 

[MedianJ]

While many are still playing pong on their Atari games Sam Lit is on the forefront of bringing radio to the next level. The next generation will be asking mommy what is that ? Mommy will reply oh that's an old radio tower that hasn't been used in decades since everyone gets all their information from wireless internet. The old guard of radio has 165 million reasons and tons of debt on old equipment to downplay the coming of the new way radio is delivered to the masses via internet and Sam Lit is a proven leader and expert on the subject. All the so called problems people may have pointed out will be solved soon and pricing plans will be determined by competittion that will drive the prices way down just like long distance phone plans were.

Radio is a business, not a hobby.

 

[tom]

Apparently you have yet to discover those simple little things, like voice recognition navigation. That makes you just about 2 cents short. And without ever having held a portable protocol device, is consistent with your posts. No clue.

So tell me ... what is a "portable protocol device" ?

A google search for "portable protocol device" (with the quotes) yields
only 2 hits, and neither applies to radio or entertainment. Is this something
you invented?

 

[MedianJ]

Apparently you have yet to discover those simple little things, like voice recognition navigation. That makes you just about 2 cents short. And without ever having held a portable protocol device, is consistent with your posts. No clue.

So tell me ... what is a "portable protocol device" ?

A google search for "portable protocol device" (with the quotes) yields
only 2 hits, and neither applies to radio or entertainment. Is this something
you invented?

protocal is a SAT word Tom, Sam was using it correctly, here's a link to get you educated on the word, after reading it you'll understand how Sam used it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protocol_(computing)

 

[tom]

I know what a protocol is Walter, I was referring to the term he invented
"portable protocol device" Sam is the first to use it.