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IS 1010 WINS RUNNING IBOC NOW?

S

Savage

Interesting phenomena on the mid-AM band last night: WYSL's coverage of Rochester was suddenly crystal-clear without a hint of IBOC sideband noise. WBZ appeared to be skipping in normally. KDKA was obliterated with deafening HD hiss. This had me scratching my head, so I tuned down and found WINS coming in surprising well - and one notch lower, WMVP 1000 was blocked by loud IBOC hiss. The former WCFL has always been loud and clear in the region at night.

I can't explain the WMVP HD noise unless perhaps Crawford has started running IBOC at night on WLGZ 990 in Rochester, but it's my understanding that the night 6-tower array has bandwidth issues forcing the station to relegate HD to the daytime 4-tower array.

It almost seems like CBS had turned off WBZ's HD at night, hence the better fate for WYSL, at least last night. And if they're experimenting with running night HD on WINS, CBS might have powered WBZ down to keep from demolishing KDKA with a double-IBOC whammy from both 1010 and 1030.

Anyone else noticing this?
 
Savage said:
Interesting phenomena on the mid-AM band last night: WYSL's coverage of Rochester was suddenly crystal-clear without a hint of IBOC sideband noise. WBZ appeared to be skipping in normally. KDKA was obliterated with deafening HD hiss. This had me scratching my head, so I tuned down and found WINS coming in surprising well - and one notch lower, WMVP 1000 was blocked by loud IBOC hiss. The former WCFL has always been loud and clear in the region at night.

I can't explain the WMVP HD noise unless perhaps Crawford has started running IBOC at night on WLGZ 990 in Rochester, but it's my understanding that the night 6-tower array has bandwidth issues forcing the station to relegate HD to the daytime 4-tower array.

It almost seems like CBS had turned off WBZ's HD at night, hence the better fate for WYSL, at least last night. And if they're experimenting with running night HD on WINS, CBS might have powered WBZ down to keep from demolishing KDKA with a double-IBOC whammy from both 1010 and 1030.

Anyone else noticing this?
Click to expand...

I have not heard any iboc on 1010 nor a change in their analog bandwidth.

Unrelated, WADO 1280 seems to be 24hr iboc now, the Mexican music sounds good.

Lino
 
Bizarre. I'll make it a point to get closer in to Rochester where I can better check WLGZ's very narrow east-west night pattern on 990 (typically can't be heard south of the NY Thruway.) Maybe the 1000 WMVP interference is indeed coming from them.
 
Nope, no IBOC from WINS, WBZ is cutting it's usual swath through the band obliterating everything from 1015 to 1045 except of course for itself. WMVP 1000 is also coming in fairly well here in central MA. I do hear a suspicious whooshing noise above and below 990 here, I can almost guarantee that WGLZ is running IBOC right now at 830 ET Monday night. It's not strong enough here to obliterate the domestics on 980 and 1000 but is definitely there between those frequencies and would kill an TA's that might be there, but of course not everyone here cares them, they belong in Europe and we have no right listening to them, it's like spying or something.
 
The weirdness continues. Last night it seemed as though the reverse (compared with the previous night) was true: KDKA was crystal-clear, without a hint of HD noise; in fact it was making it into Rochester better than WBZ, which I can't recall ever happening before. WYSL was typically getting obliterated. It had to be from WBZ since neither WEPN nor CHUM run IBOC. WMVP was comiing in normally without the IBOC noise noted the previous night.

Could WBZ be tinkering with IBOC SSB? Maybe it's just weird propagation? Very strange.
 
Didn't one of the antenna pattern engineers submit a plan where they could run IBOC full bore on one sideband and substantially reduced on the opposite sideband when there was interference issues? I don't think it was Beverage - maybe it was Clark that proposed this option?
 
I was getting IBOC hash bigtime on both 1020 and 1040 last night. Right now I'm getting their hash equally on both 1020 and 1040, WINS is coming in like gangbusters and I'm getting Spanish on 1000, no hash at all from WINS. I'm about 40 West of Boston. I and other DXers have noticed that once in a while an AM broadcast station's upper and lower sidebands do not come in evenly, sometimes out of phase maybe because of both groundwave and skywave? I have alaso noticed that IBOC upper and lower hash noise is not always equal but have always chalked it up to propagation's vagaries.
 
It's been weird propogation. I'm in Green Bay this week. Last night at 7:30 WLS was in a 99% null from ground/sky cancellation.
It was steady with no fading of fluttering. WCBS was booming in with great fidelity, but no traces of iboc on the nearly silent 890.
I had to listen 25 minutes to be sure I heard WLS material, and not off the air! This at 240 miles.
Tonight, same time, normal signals from both.
 
WLS came in "full-quieting" quality CQuam AM stereo last night and sounded fantastic - so the snow is doing some weird things here in the Great Lakes
 
last night from St. Johnsbury, VT, to White River Junction, VT along I-91, a signal (almost sound like a local) 1050-WEPN (1050-ESPN New York) was booming in. no fading, no hiss. most of the NYC 50 kW were booming last night. SO was WBZ, 850-WEEI (even with a null to the NW) and 680-WRKO. weird sky conditions i guess.
 
last night from St. Johnsbury, VT, to White River Junction, VT along I-91, a signal (almost sound like a local) 1050-WEPN (1050-ESPN New York) was booming in. no fading, no hiss. most of the NYC 50 kW were booming last night. SO was WBZ, 850-WEEI (even with a null to the NW) and 680-WRKO. weird sky conditions i guess.
 
You guys are talking about things we BCB DXers love, BCB propagation is so unpredictable, this is also another reason AM iBOC will never work, you never know who you're going to jam. I'm in MA and there are nights when WLW's iBlock actually completely covers WOR, and WLW is almost a thousand miles from here and WOR is about 200. Some nights they takes turns. Some nights even good old WGN takes part in the fun, it's like musical IBUZ, chairs of course, certainly not music.
 
KB1OKL said:
I'm in MA and there are nights when WLW's iBlock actually completely covers WOR, and WLW is almost a thousand miles from here and WOR is about 200. Some nights they takes turns. Some nights even good old WGN takes part in the fun, it's like musical IBUZ, chairs of course, certainly not music.
Click to expand...

I believe WOR and WLW both accept that interference since it's outside the stations' protected contours. Not much you can do about it.
 
I realize there's nothing I can do about it, but it is a case of poetic justice if I've ever seen one, and it may be outside of their artificial protected contours but here in the real world there are plenty of areas where these stations are beating each other up and that was not taken into account when IBOC was drawn up.
 
KB1OKL said:
I realize there's nothing I can do about it, but it is a case of poetic justice if I've ever seen one, and it may be outside of their artificial protected contours but here in the real world there are plenty of areas where these stations are beating each other up and that was not taken into account when IBOC was drawn up.
Click to expand...

This issue and the stringent requirements for both TX and antenna were known, published and I had read them by the summer of 2003.

WOR and WLW conducted tests and the verdict according to WOR's Tom Ray "it's not so bad".

The reason we are at this situation is simple, AM radio is running out of time to find a solution to it's rising demos and dying listenership. It's a simple decision: accept truncated listening area in exchange for much improved fidelity and a chance at a younger audience.-

Lino
 
LinoNYC said:
It's a simple decision: accept truncated listening area in exchange for much improved fidelity and a chance at a younger audience.-

Lino
Click to expand...
There doesn't seem to be a lot of agreement among broadcasters that it's a good trade-off. It is good for some, but not for others. Therein lies the problem.

If you cover 20 square miles in NYC, then you cover a lot of people. In other markets, it is a death sentence.
 
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