Is live & local radio dead?

[davideduardo]

I've seen Seacrest on TV but he is just a vapid game show host to me. I've never heard of the others you mention.

Charlamagne is bigger than big. He is an enormous influence in the Black community and does an incredibly relevant and entertaining show for that audience. Bones is the equivalent in Country, and both of them are major influencers in their area of music.

Seacrest is a radio person. He got his break at an alternative AC station in LA and moved into morning radio and was picked up for entertainment TV as a result with Dick Clark being a major factor. The game show aspect of his career has come more recently; he "tests well" among adult users of all forms of electronic media.

 

[TheBigA]

Charlamagne is bigger than big. He is an enormous influence in the Black community and does an incredibly relevant and entertaining show for that audience. Bones is the equivalent in Country, and both of them are major influencers in their area of music.

Charlamagne, Bones, Seacrest, and Steve Harvey are all syndicated personalities from iHeart. There's also Elvis Duran and several others. They are the current incarnations of Casey Kasem and Dick Clark, who based their careers early network radio stars such as Gene Autry, Bing Crosby, and Paul Whiteman. They were the radio personalities people listened to in the golden age of radio. It wasn't live & local.

 

[MarioMania]

I miss 101.5 K-Hits

They were All Local

 

[davideduardo]

They are the current incarnations of Casey Kasem and Dick Clark, who based their careers early network radio stars such as Gene Autry, Bing Crosby, and Paul Whiteman. They were the radio personalities people listened to in the golden age of radio. It wasn't live & local.

Having worked for Tom Rounds for more than two decades, and for a while as the project manager / producer for the international equivalent of "American Top 40" called the "World Chart Show" I can say that the model (if there really was one) for AT40 was "Your Hit Parade" where vocalist Frank Sinatra and a team sang each week's hits on the NBC radio web. By 1950, it had moved to TV with artists like Snooky Lanson, still with a team of singers doing cover versions of the week's hits.

The advent of Rock 'n' Roll and the total focus on original singers killed "Your Hit Parade" and it died by the end of the 50's.

Your Hit Parade - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

A revival was tried in the mid-60's, but it failed. The idea of a hit parade show was perpetuated by many Top`40 stations that did their own countdown each week. So there was a natural opening for a national show with "official" charts and a very personable presenter... and that is what TR picked up on, calling on Ron Jacobs and Casey and Don Bustany to create the production team.

 

[MarkW]

Live & local radio isn't dead, but it is an endangered species.

 

[Deus Ex Machiato]

Charlamagne, Bones, Seacrest, and Steve Harvey are all syndicated personalities from iHeart. There's also Elvis Duran and several others. They are the current incarnations of Casey Kasem and Dick Clark, who based their careers early network radio stars such as Gene Autry, Bing Crosby, and Paul Whiteman. They were the radio personalities people listened to in the golden age of radio. It wasn't live & local.

My first "real" radio job was working weekends in a small market, making sure that the "Rick Dees" countdown show - which came on vinyl - ran correctly. Aside from me trying to stay awake, it wasn't live and local.

But the rest of the schedule? IIRC the Sunday morning public affairs show was not live, but it was still local. Syndicated shows were the exception, but more common on AM. Hell, I even worked at a small market station back then that couldn't afford an overnight board op, and my job (before I left at midnight) was to press "play" on the VCR that had recorded the station's on air feed from noon to 6pm. I can't say it was "a golden age," but we made it work.

Fast forward to about five years ago, and I was talking to a buddy who was the PD for a couple locally-owned stations...rare in a large market. I mentioned that I'd seen their station vehicle parked in front of a house every day in a neighborhood nowhere near the station. "Oh, that's so-and-so. He tracks our overnight shows, does all our production, imaging, and is also the promotions guy. He only makes 25k a year, so we let him drive it because he can't afford a car."

 

[AMRadioGuy]

But does anyone keep their radio on the same station long-term anymore?

Yes, absolutely. I have a couple of AM music stations that play 60s/70s I typically have my radio tuned to, one primarily aside from a couple of "appointment listening" type programs on the others.

My primary station is a relatively "full service" type local station.

I won't touch FM for music for the most part, aside from our top-40 CHR & country stations just to see what's new on the music scene. But that's only flipping through presets in my car whenever I'm out and about before I return to my usual station. The music is far too repetitive and the stop-sets far too long on FM for me to listen for any period of time more than a couple minutes when I'm flipping through and a song catches my ear.

When I'm home in the evening after work or on the weekends, it's not unusual for me to have my regular station on all evening on a couple of different radios throughout the house, enjoying the music and news...

 

[AMRadioGuy]

It certainly is different. I'll give you that. IIRC, there's still one lone Blockbuster video store open, so one could argue that there's "still is a business renting physical copies of movies. It's just different."

It is an imperfect analogy, to be sure. The infrastructure built up around broadcast radio is entrenched - with towers, licenses, and government agencies all still firmly in place - but the real question underlying the OP question of "is live and local radio dead" is...what are we going to do with all of that?

Are we going to continue chipping away at the business until it is a quaint reminder of what it used to be like that lone Blockbuster store, or a temporarily resurgent trend like vinyl record sales? I hope not.
Shout out to vw86's post above for encapsulating the appeal of live and local radio, and as I often do, I must strongly disagree with Mr. Eduardo's prior statement:






Because they've been trained via consolidation, voice tracking, and syndicated shows to believe that the "one way friend" no longer exists. Of course that middle school kid in Ohio or Michigan or (checks sub forum) Sacramento isn't going to consider the voice-tracked jock from a "hub" at corporate HQ that reads a liner card and does a "tease/payoff" in order to squeeze an extra quarter hour to be a "friend." Why would they?

One of my formative experiences in the business was when - as a baby DJ - I met one of my favorite jocks. I offered my hand and said 'I grew up listening to you." He looked at me disdainfully, said "yeah, you and everybody else, kid" and walked away. I carried that with me, and when I finally did find some success, I went out of my way to not be that guy. I always had time for listeners, especially young fans, and when someone came up to me and said 'I grew up listening to you" I went out of my way to thank them.

Radio has become that cold, indifferent guy I met so many years ago.

Man, this hits home big time!

I have always done my best to be approachable and be myself on-air. If the phone rings while I'm in the studio, I make it a point to pick it up and say hi. No doubt that still resonates with listeners.

I remember a couple years back driving to see my then-girlfriend a couple hours away at school (we went to different colleges). I'd listen to WSM out of Nashville fading in and out. On AM. Why? It was something to keep me company, a "friend" on those lonely nighttime drives.

I'm incredibly fortunate to work in small-market radio where that "friend," that "Pilot of the Airwaves" (as the Charlie Dore song went) can still be alive and well. Interestingly, at one point, young jocks had aspirations to work in a major market. I have no such aspirations, as what I do on the small-market station I work for just doesn't exist on those big-market stations (to be fair, in some ways it never did).

 

[AMRadioGuy]

Charlamagne is bigger than big. He is an enormous influence in the Black community and does an incredibly relevant and entertaining show for that audience. Bones is the equivalent in Country, and both of them are major influencers in their area of music.

Seacrest is a radio person. He got his break at an alternative AC station in LA and moved into morning radio and was picked up for entertainment TV as a result with Dick Clark being a major factor. The game show aspect of his career has come more recently; he "tests well" among adult users of all forms of electronic media.

I gotta be honest, David... I've only ever heard of Charlamagne and Bones on this forum and I've never even heard them mentioned outside this forum. I'm in my 20s and have quite a few friends into current country (and I follow it myself, some for my enjoyment and some for work). I voicetrack a shift on a country station and do prep in the country music world all of the time for it. Bones has never, ever come up in the reading & show-prep I've done. You & Big A mention both quite frequently here but I don't think I've seen them referenced anywhere else. Just my experience.

 

[AMRadioGuy]

Charlamagne, Bones, Seacrest, and Steve Harvey are all syndicated personalities from iHeart. There's also Elvis Duran and several others. They are the current incarnations of Casey Kasem and Dick Clark, who based their careers early network radio stars such as Gene Autry, Bing Crosby, and Paul Whiteman. They were the radio personalities people listened to in the golden age of radio. It wasn't live & local.

Current incarnations perhaps, but definitely not the pop culture icons Casey & Dick were. I'm in the 60s/70s radio world. Those names still get mentioned all of the time by listeners. As I said above, I've yet to hear Charlamagne or Bones mentioned anywhere outside this forum (and I know quite a few friends who fit that demographic).

Sure I know Seacrest & Steve Harvey. Steve Harvey, at least, is a pop culture icon.

 

[TheBigA]

I've yet to hear Charlamagne or Bones mentioned anywhere outside this forum

They aren't in pop radio. If you were black or liked modern country music, you'd know them

The difference between culture today vs the 60s is it's a lot more individual now. I can name popular TV characters, and your audience won't know them.

 

[radiofan2023]

They aren't in pop radio. If you were black or liked modern country music, you'd know them

The difference between culture today vs the 60s is it's a lot more individual now. I can name popular TV characters, and your audience won't know them.

I'm not black and not into country music and still know who both of them are. Bobby Bones got started on Fox Sports Radio.

 

[TheBigA]

I'm not black and not into country music and still know who both of them are. Bobby Bones got started on Fox Sports Radio.

What Bobby did that was similar to Kasem and Clark was diversify. He didn't restrict himself to radio. He did a range of TV projects. You mention Fox Sports, but he also appeared on American Idol, and he hosted the TV version of the Grand Ole Opry. He is part of a recording band. But obviously the power base is a syndicated radio show. Charlamagne is starting to do the same thing. He just signed a deal with Netflix.

The topic here is "Is Local Radio Dead?" The fact of the matter is the media world is way bigger than local radio. If that's what you do, there's no reason to limit yourself to just one city. If you're talented, you want everyone to hear you. Think of this from the point of view of these radio hosts.

 

[AMRadioGuy]

They aren't in pop radio. If you were black or liked modern country music, you'd know them

The difference between culture today vs the 60s is it's a lot more individual now. I can name popular TV characters, and your audience won't know them.

I'm not black, but I do follow current country music, and enjoy some of it (the stuff with actual instruments that aren't set atop drum machines, so Chase Matthew is a no-go, though we do play him on the country station I work for when he has a current). As I mentioned above, I'm in my 20s and have quite a few friends who pretty much exclusively listen to current country and we do discuss it. And I voicetrack a shift on a country station that plays plenty of currents. I visit Taste of Country and quite a few of the other big country sites at least several times a week keeping tabs on what's going on in the world of country. And I follow both the Country Airplay and Hot Country charts weekly.

So it's not like I'm out of touch with the country scene.

I have yet to see Bones mentioned outside of this forum. I can only speak to my experience... but that's been my experience.

Just because pre-1980 music is where my heart is doesn't mean I don't follow the current charts or listen to currents.

 

[TheBigA]

So it's not like I'm out of touch with the country scene.

I have yet to see Bones mentioned outside of this forum. I can only speak to my experience... but that's been my experience.

Bones is primarily an iHeart talent. If you don't listen to an iHeart country station, you likely don't know him. But that's why he also did a number of TV shows such as American Idol, Dancing With The Stars, and the Grand Ole Opry. If you don't want those shows, you haven't seen him. I don't know of any other host in country music with his level of recognition. There's a reason the country awards shows use artists and not broadcasters to host their awards shows.

As I said, culture today is very individualized. We've gone from a country that was centered around mass media to a country that lives in cultural silos.

 

[AMRadioGuy]

Bones is primarily an iHeart talent. If you don't listen to an iHeart country station, you likely don't know him. But that's why he also did a number of TV shows such as American Idol, Dancing With The Stars, and the Grand Ole Opry. If you don't want those shows, you haven't seen him.

But as I said, culture today is very individualized. We've gone from a country that was centered around mass media to a country that lives in cultural silos.

Right-o. And the current country stations in my presets aren't iHeart. I think the iHeart CHR station is the only iHeart station in my presets in my vehicle.

The point I was trying to make was simply that while those two might be big names in the iHeart industry, they aren't part of broader culture (or even the subsets they are part of) the way Casey or Dick Clark was.

You're right that a lot of culture is individualized. But I think Steve Harvey (mentioned above) is likely known by most people. But not from radio. There are absolutely still overarching cultural figures. But they're not radio personalities.

Just because someone wasn't listening to the station that Casey Kasem was on in 1978 didn't mean they didn't know who he was... they probably still did. Today, I can be plugged in and frequently following the current country scene from both a listener and business perspective and never hear of this fellow unless I'm listening to an iHeart station. That means he's an iHeart figure. Not a country culture figure.

 

[TheBigA]

He only makes 25k a year, so we let him drive it because he can't afford a car."

Times change. I know people who could once make a living bagging groceries or working as a bank teller. There are entire businesses that have disappeared such as brick & mortar record stores. Times change. It leaves old people talking about how things used to be. Radio is part of that. You either change with it, or find something else to do. You chose the latter.

 

[TheBigA]

Just because someone wasn't listening to the station that Casey Kasem was on in 1978 didn't mean they didn't know who he was...

Once again, we're talking about a smaller media world in 1978. If you were on network TV, you were well known. Today, most of the top rated network shows get about 5 million viewers nationally. That's very small. More people watch Netflix. Plus Kasen had a 50 year career. The people I listed have been around for a lot less time. It takes time to become a cultural icon.

Also remember there was no country Casey Kasem in 1978. Ralph Emery may have been close, but he was a DJ on WSM. Don Cornelius was the black Casey Kaem. How many people know him today?

That means he's an iHeart figure. Not a country culture figure.

Once again, that's why the country awards shows choose other artists to host their shows, not broadcasters. Radio is a small part of how country music is heard. Most of the music distribution isn't hosted. Name all the hosts at Spotify. But there's a big difference between someone like Bobby Bones and someone like you. How many people outside your area can name the hosts at their local radio stations?

 

[AMRadioGuy]

Once again, we're talking about a smaller media world in 1978. If you were on network TV, you were well known. Today, most of the top rated network shows get about 5 million viewers nationally. That's very small. More people watch Netflix. Plus Kasen had a 50 year career. The people I listed have been around for a lot less time. It takes time to become a cultural icon.

Also remember there was no country Casey Kasem in 1978. Ralph Emery may have been close, but he was a DJ on WSM. Don Cornelius was the black Casey Kaem. How many people know him today?



Once again, that's why the country awards shows choose other artists to host their shows, not broadcasters. Radio is a small part of how country music is heard. Most of the music distribution isn't hosted. Name all the hosts at Spotify. But there's a big difference between someone like Bobby Bones and someone like you. How many people outside your area can name the hosts at their local radio stations?

I think we're pretty much in agreement here. You're right in that the media world has changed significantly and radio has a far smaller share of the pie than it once did. And what I was trying to illustrate is that even some of the biggest names in country radio today are not known by the average country music fan. I was responding initially to David's comment, which was:

Charlamagne is bigger than big. He is an enormous influence in the Black community and does an incredibly relevant and entertaining show for that audience. Bones is the equivalent in Country, and both of them are major influencers in their area of music.

As far as Bones is concerned, he's an influence in a segment of country. The segment that listens to iHeart. But to the average country listener, I'm not so sure they are familiar with him, especially if they just head over to Spotify for their music.

So... I think we are largely in agreement.

And you're absolutely right, folks outside my station's coverage area have zero idea who I am and I'm fine with that. I aspire to serve the people in my coverage area and community well, not be the biggest "star" I can be on a national scale. Bobby can't show up at our community parades and fundraise for a local charity or food bank. He can't talk about the local theater group or a car cruise coming up this weekend hosted by a nonprofit or have an important community member on for an interview. We serve different purposes, and each of those are important purposes.

 

[davideduardo]

Current incarnations perhaps, but definitely not the pop culture icons Casey & Dick were.

Charlemagne is vastly more influential than Casey. He is important to the music world because he is the most listened to African American in the audio medium. But going way beyond that, he is a very significant sociopolitical voice in many areas, enough so that I believe his opinion can influence elections and general perceptions among Blacks.

I'm in the 60s/70s radio world. Those names still get mentioned all of the time by listeners. As I said above, I've yet to hear Charlamagne or Bones mentioned anywhere outside this forum (and I know quite a few friends who fit that demographic).

Yet they likely have many more listeners in their weekday shows than Casey had early Sunday morning or late that night.

Sure I know Seacrest & Steve Harvey. Steve Harvey, at least, is a pop culture icon.

Yet Seacrest is now a video star, and Steve is nowhere near as significant in audio as Charlemagne