• Get involved.
    We want your input!
    Apply for Membership and join the conversations about everything related to broadcasting.

    After we receive your registration, a moderator will review it. After your registration is approved, you will be permitted to post.
    If you use a disposable or false email address, your registration will be rejected.

    After your membership is approved, please take a minute to tell us a little bit about yourself.
    https://www.radiodiscussions.com/forums/introduce-yourself.1088/

    Thanks in advance and have fun!
    RadioDiscussions Administrators

Is the Dance Version of DHT really a success?

R

Renegade_X

I'll start by saying this is NOT a barb at JP & Robbins Ent. I respect, like, and purchase their products regularily.

To my understanding, the initial success of Listen to your Heart was due to the ballad getting airplay. Radio slowly warmed up to the dance version, playing it in the evenings. And yes, it works in the club.

So I'll ask all everyone in the dance community. Why toot our own horns? The song at Number 36? If Kelly Clarkson released a song tomorrow, and it took 6 weeks to get to Number 36, it would be a flop. People would be saying "She's over". If BEP released a song and it took weeks to hit the Hot 40, people would figure they were over. I've heard many comments on how lousy Destiny's Childs latest record is because Girl and Soldier "did nothing on the charts".

It's great to see a dance song hit the Top 40, and I hope it happens more, but I'm not sure I'd label this a success, least from the perspective of "Top 40"

This is not meant as a diss, and please don't call me a hater/etc. Simply asking a question.
 
> So I'll ask all everyone in the dance community. Why toot
> our own horns? The song at Number 36? If Kelly Clarkson
> released a song tomorrow, and it took 6 weeks to get to
> Number 36, it would be a flop. People would be saying
> "She's over". If BEP released a song and it took weeks to
> hit the Hot 40, people would figure they were over. I've
> heard many comments on how lousy Destiny's Childs latest
> record is because Girl and Soldier "did nothing on the
> charts".

Different standards for different artists.

A brand new act in a genre that doesn't get played much on American radio shouldn't be held to the same standard of "success" that Kelly Clarkson is.

A #36 song is great for an act that no one's ever heard of before, and has had little exposure besides being played on top 40 stations and in clubs.
 
But Kelly Clarkson was a "brand" new act and moved 300 000 copies in her first week (figures rounded due to my laziness of looking it up again).

I'm sure the purists will pull out the "renegade x voodoo dolls" on this, but dance needs a serious foot in the mainstream. Case in point, the UK. The UK has dance in the pop mainstream, and the underground is very healthy.

People need to discover a format, they used to do that through mainstream radio. A listener discovers a song they like, usually very mainstream, then digs deeper into the format. Problem is...they don't have that "song" to pull them into the format and dig deeper. Nowadays, that's SO very easy with all the choices kids have.

I hope DHT is that song, but when I read that much of what is spun is the melodic version, I realize that it's not the dance version that's a hit. It's the melodic version...which isn't the song that will bring people over to dance. Nor are remixes of Kelly Clarkson or BSB.

Course, the upside is, it's money in the pocket of Robbins which can be used to promote newer dance music. It's a definate start, but I don't know if it's a success.
>
> Different standards for different artists.
>
> A brand new act in a genre that doesn't get played much on
> American radio shouldn't be held to the same standard of
> "success" that Kelly Clarkson is.
>
> A #36 song is great for an act that no one's ever heard of
> before, and has had little exposure besides being played on
> top 40 stations and in clubs.
>
 
> It's great to see a dance song hit the Top 40, and I hope it
> happens more, but I'm not sure I'd label this a success,
> least from the perspective of "Top 40"

Even if the dance cut gets major airplay, it'll be gone in a month just like DJ Sammy, Ian Van Dahl, Gigi D'Agostino, Hampton the Hamster, and Darude. Just like every other top 40 song. It's the way the game is played.<P ID="signature">______________
</P>
 
> But Kelly Clarkson was a "brand" new act and moved 300 000
> copies in her first week (figures rounded due to my laziness
> of looking it up again).
>
> I'm sure the purists will pull out the "renegade x voodoo
> dolls" on this, but dance needs a serious foot in the
> mainstream. Case in point, the UK. The UK has dance in the
> pop mainstream, and the underground is very healthy.
>
> People need to discover a format, they used to do that
> through mainstream radio. A listener discovers a song they
> like, usually very mainstream, then digs deeper into the
> format. Problem is...they don't have that "song" to pull
> them into the format and dig deeper. Nowadays, that's SO
> very easy with all the choices kids have.
>
> I hope DHT is that song, but when I read that much of what
> is spun is the melodic version, I realize that it's not the
> dance version that's a hit. It's the melodic
> version...which isn't the song that will bring people over
> to dance. Nor are remixes of Kelly Clarkson or BSB.
>
> Course, the upside is, it's money in the pocket of Robbins
> which can be used to promote newer dance music. It's a
> definate start, but I don't know if it's a success.
> >
> > Different standards for different artists.
> >
> > A brand new act in a genre that doesn't get played much on
>
> > American radio shouldn't be held to the same standard of
> > "success" that Kelly Clarkson is.
> >
> > A #36 song is great for an act that no one's ever heard of
>
> > before, and has had little exposure besides being played
> on
> > top 40 stations and in clubs.
> >
>
by the current standards of dance music's 'situation'.D.H.T. is the 'saturday night fever' of dance;any success at the mainstream has to be considered major,cos something is always better than nothing; I've been preaching the "mainstream hits are needed to draw people into the genre' gospel on this site for years,it just seems that the 'hardcore believers' don't get it,or don't WANT to get it. They think that if they(DJS or house music fans) like a record, well then, everyone will.Think about what existing segment would be drawn to 'diva' records,the existing successful segments being pop, rock ,country, hip hop and r&b; all of these sell big amounts of records,get video channel airtime,have recognizable stars and popular songs for ALL to enjoy,.Now,who will 'divas' attract?The rock fans, the country fans, the hip hop /r&b kids; I don't think so, what elements of 'diva' would attract them? You think they'll all just hop out of bed one morning and start twirling?Think again!<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by lalumia on 06/24/05 05:42 PM.</FONT></P>
 
I'll tackle as much as I can:
------------------------------------------------------------
"I'll start by saying this is NOT a barb at JP & Robbins Ent.
I respect, like, and purchase their products regularily.
------------------------------------------------------------
jp: Thanks. :)

------------------------------------------------------------
To my understanding, the initial success of Listen to your
Heart was due to the ballad getting airplay. Radio slowly
warmed up to the dance version, playing it in the evenings.
And yes, it works in the club.
------------------------------------------------------------
jp: The initial success at CHR was driven by the ballad version but the song was already a proven dance hit.
-------------------------------------------------------------

So I'll ask all everyone in the dance community. Why toot our own horns? The song at Number 36? If Kelly Clarkson released a song tomorrow, and it took 6 weeks to get to Number 36, it would be a flop. People would be saying "She's over". If BEP released a song and it took weeks to hit the Hot 40, people would figure they were over. I've heard many comments on how lousy Destiny's Childs latest record is because Girl and Soldier "did nothing on the charts".

---------------------------------------------------------------

jp: We (followers of dance music and radio) toot our own horns on this one because it is a breakthru. It's not Top 10, yet though so it's not a total success for us. ;) But there has not been a dance record, of any sort, that has made an impact like this in 2 - 3 years. Make no mistake about it, this is as much a dance record as it is a ballad, even at CHR. While the airplay is probably at a 60 -40% ratio of ballad to dance mix, this is a major win for dance music just having a dance version on the air at these stations. The question now is, who has the next one. Because without dance records that are digestable to CHR, this window of opportunity will dry up quickly and the next anthem about Bling and things will knock us out again.

Also, I'd like to see Kelly Clarkson and or the Black Eye Peas do what we are doing with the same resources. Don't forget they have a small army of people working radio, video, tv, etc. We have one and a half, as I like to say. The half being me as I split my time between finding the hits and them getting people to notice them. But the one is Frank Murray. He's done a kick ass job and is making gold out of straw. Did you know that Robbins only has 9 people? And that includes the Receptionist and the mailroom guy (he's the one that found D.H.T.). So it just goes to show you that when the music's right, dance can compete with any of today's other hot sounds.

With that, I'm off on vacation for the next week. Talk to you all after July 4th!

jp
 
I'll agree with you.

The dance community needs to look at itself....namely how exclusive it likes to be. Certain dance fans don't want the music to be mainstream, because it's seen as watering down or selling otu to the man (which is BS in my opinion).

I also find that dance fans can be really really inward and do not accept anything "new" or innovative. Too many people are still grasping on to the EuroTrance sound of the 90's. Nothing wrong with liking that style of music, but dance has to extend beyond that border

If you look at hiphop, and compare the sounds of 1990 vs 2005, you'll see HUGE changes to the rhythmic nature. The music has more melody, it's more mainstream, and it's far more marketable. And that's exactly why Hiphop rules the roost in the clubs and dance isn't what it once was.

Basement Jaxx has been incredible innovative lately, but ignored by the dance culture. Yes, it sounds different and it incorporates hiphop sounds, but thats what needs to happen for the genre to grow. Take Rhianna, Pon de Replay, an incredible infectious songs that takes elements of dance, hiphop and reggaeton...and appeals across the board. 4 Strings (not to single them out) does not.

I had alot of hope for stuff from Stellar Project, Deepest Blue and Carolina Marquez, but American CHR completely ignored the music (as did some dance radio). Yes, Stellar Project is very mainstream, but a great record like that has cross appeal...and if enough ppl gave it a listen, they might dig deeper into dance.

Hiphop, Alternative & Country all have their feet in the mainstream, but still have active and healthy underground scenes. In the UK, dance pop hits the UK charts on a regular basis, but Jules, Tong and Fontaine still kick out the beats to MILLIONS of hardcore dance fans.

Music is about constantly finding new listeners, constantly showoing others, hey "we are here". Dance hasn't been doing that. It's been living in the past, and the past is fading away. The glory days of dance music are long over. Bring em back. To a lessor degree, Alt rock is much the same. NiN, Foo's, Weezer all had records 10 years ago, and they do today....and youth doesn't wanna dig the same music Mom and Dad likes.
> >
> by the current standards of dance music's 'situation'.D.H.T.
> is the 'saturday night fever' of dance;any success at the
> mainstream has to be considered major,cos something is
> always better than nothing; I've been preaching the
> "mainstream hits are needed to draw people into the genre'
> gospel on this site for years,it just seems that the
> 'hardcore believers' don't get it,or don't WANT to get it.
> They think that if they(DJS or house music fans) like a
> record, well then, everyone will.Think about what existing
> segment would be drawn to 'diva' records,the existing
> successful segments being pop, rock ,country, hip hop and
> r&b; all of these sell big amounts of records,get video
> channel airtime,have recognizable stars and popular songs
> for ALL to enjoy,.Now,who will 'divas' attract?The rock
> fans, the country fans, the hip hop /r&b kids; I don't think
> so, what elements of 'diva' would attract them? You think
> they'll all just hop out of bed one morning and start
> twirling?Think again!
>
 
Hey JP,

I know you're limited with resources...but the question/statements I made were for the dance community in general. I truly believe far too many of us sit around, basking in tiny bits of glory instead of rolling up the sleeves and getting out there and kicking some a**. Even something as simple as calling/requesting a dance song on your local CHR. Phones are stil important to some radio...

I hope you give your mailroom dood a raise, or at least a free lunch, in Manhattan :?)

And enjoy your holidays :).


I'll tackle as much as I can:
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "I'll start by saying this is NOT a barb at JP & Robbins
> Ent.
> I respect, like, and purchase their products regularily.
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
> jp: Thanks. :)
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
> To my understanding, the initial success of Listen to your
> Heart was due to the ballad getting airplay. Radio slowly
> warmed up to the dance version, playing it in the evenings.
>
> And yes, it works in the club.
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
> jp: The initial success at CHR was driven by the ballad
> version but the song was already a proven dance hit.
-> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> So I'll ask all everyone in the dance community. Why toot
> our own horns? The song at Number 36? If Kelly Clarkson
> released a song tomorrow, and it took 6 weeks to get to
> Number 36, it would be a flop. People would be saying
> "She's over". If BEP released a song and it took weeks to
> hit the Hot 40, people would figure they were over. I've
> heard many comments on how lousy Destiny's Childs latest
> record is because Girl and Soldier "did nothing on the
> charts".
>
---> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> jp: We (followers of dance music and radio) toot our own
> horns on this one because it is a breakthru. It's not Top
> 10, yet though so it's not a total success for us. ;) But
> there has not been a dance record, of any sort, that has
> made an impact like this in 2 - 3 years. Make no mistake
> about it, this is as much a dance record as it is a ballad,
> even at CHR. While the airplay is probably at a 60 -40%
> ratio of ballad to dance mix, this is a major win for dance
> music just having a dance version on the air at these
> stations. The question now is, who has the next one.
> Because without dance records that are digestable to CHR,
> this window of opportunity will dry up quickly and the next
> anthem about Bling and things will knock us out again.
>
> Also, I'd like to see Kelly Clarkson and or the Black Eye
> Peas do what we are doing with the same resources. Don't
> forget they have a small army of people working radio,
> video, tv, etc. We have one and a half, as I like to say.
> The half being me as I split my time between finding the
> hits and them getting people to notice them. But the one is
> Frank Murray. He's done a kick ass job and is making gold
> out of straw. Did you know that Robbins only has 9 people?
> And that includes the Receptionist and the mailroom guy
> (he's the one that found D.H.T.). So it just goes to show
> you that when the music's right, dance can compete with any
> of today's other hot sounds.
>
> With that, I'm off on vacation for the next week. Talk to
> you all after July 4th!
>
> jp
>
 
Status
This thread has been closed due to inactivity. You can create a new thread to discuss this topic.


Back
Top Bottom