Is the economy killing your ad sales?

[radiovictim]

Our cluster has suffered a fairly significant loss of ad sales with the economic downturn. After listening to the competitors, it seems the trend is universal with a majority of the ads now running being for the big box stores and debt relief companies. From the programming perspective, I like not having such long stopsets. Unfortunately, with less revenue I know this puts everyone's jobs in jeopardy. At least it won't be difficult to run commercial-free holiday specials and weekends for awhile, which should make the listeners happy. How's it going in your neck of the radio woods?

 

[newsperson]

Newsperson responds:

If there are a lot of big box or chain stores runnning on your stations that is always a good sign. Also it could be that the managment has cut back so much on sales people that they don't have sales people calling on those accounts.

So if it's debt relief companies that mean that mortage lenders have already sucked the last dollar out of out pockets.

I was always opposed to commercial free runs as they are programing to the listener that commercials are evil and there are what keeps us in business.

On the other hand shorter spots sets are a welcome relief, so please no six-min. breaks if that's all you are selling per hour.

Newsperson

 

[djj]

The disturbing trend, imho, is the growth of PI (Per Inquiry) spots
I seem to hear, especially on midday time slots...

"Call this toll-free number in the next 30 minutes..."

In some - not all - cases, the return of "Snake-Oil Salesmen"...
Not much money to be made on those spots, either...

But Newsperson is right:
"If there are a lot of big box or chain stores runnning on your stations that is always a good sign."
--jay

 

[BurnedOutOnTheBoards]

I've noticed the increase in PSAs and imaging on many stations, and a few still-working-in-radio types have told me some accounts are getting freebies and pretty incredible discounts at some clusters just to keep anything coming in.

Several months ago, I posted somewhere on these boards my hypothesis that commercial radio would come out ahead should America sadly find itself in a worldwide depression - and, to all of our regrets, this seems more than just a possibility.

As things worsen, I see the distinct possibility of cable/satellite TV taking some pretty huge hits....I know a few families who, after layoffs, firings, and cutbacks, have dropped Sirius and are on the brink of cancelling Comcast Cable due to the high monthly payments....unless the major cable distributors head off the defections with imaginative pricing, expect some major losses.

If it's a choice between food in the fridge or 150 channels, food's gonna win, especially with rather dire predictions coming from Congress, economists, and business leaders about any quick economic recovery.

And does anyone really wanna buy HD Radios now???

Just as history showed us during the last Great Depression, commercial radio could be set for a rebirth....after all, I have yet to pay for a download of a radio station. I don't have to pay my receiver $70+ to get dozens of channels like I do Comcast. And if you think radio has had cutbacks in both ad revenue and staff size, check out The Bee....and their worst days are ahead.....

But I do not know anyone who, somewhere around the house, does not own an AM/FM radio...ready for use at little cost.

Now.....if we could just get some product worth listening to........

 

[MT1]

I've noticed the increase in PSAs and imaging on many stations, and a few still-working-in-radio types have told me some accounts are getting freebies and pretty incredible discounts at some clusters just to keep anything coming in.

Several months ago, I posted somewhere on these boards my hypothesis that commercial radio would come out ahead should America sadly find itself in a worldwide depression - and, to all of our regrets, this seems more than just a possibility.

As things worsen, I see the distinct possibility of cable/satellite TV taking some pretty huge hits....I know a few families who, after layoffs, firings, and cutbacks, have dropped Sirius and are on the brink of cancelling Comcast Cable due to the high monthly payments....unless the major cable distributors head off the defections with imaginative pricing, expect some major losses.

If it's a choice between food in the fridge or 150 channels, food's gonna win, especially with rather dire predictions coming from Congress, economists, and business leaders about any quick economic recovery.

And does anyone really wanna buy HD Radios now???

Just as history showed us during the last Great Depression, commercial radio could be set for a rebirth....after all, I have yet to pay for a download of a radio station. I don't have to pay my receiver $70+ to get dozens of channels like I do Comcast. And if you think radio has had cutbacks in both ad revenue and staff size, check out The Bee....and their worst days are ahead.....

But I do not know anyone who, somewhere around the house, does not own an AM/FM radio...ready for use at little cost.

Now.....if we could just get some product worth listening to........

Give it up. I've been in the business 30 years and no longer even own a functioning radio at home ... rare if ever use the one in the car. When I buy a new car even that radio will be gone because the new cars do not have radios as standard equipment any more... you plug your Pod into the dash and connect wirelessly to your home system or the Internet (just like the new Jukeboxes).

In fact, it has been years since I have defauted to radio in a local "emergency" and I cannot remember the last time I used any of the 3 traditional media when I needed accurate information quickly --- being on the radio all these years has allowed me to watch the product go away and the ownership destroy one chance after another to remain viable.

Who do you know - under a hundred years old - that actually uses radio?

The radio that you and I have been part of is not coming back any more than Amos & Andy, Fibber McGee, newspapers or over-the-air TV.

Oh, correction... radio did not come back after the Depression. The technology remained and even expanded but the content went bye-bye. Same thing now. 1530's facilites will make for one dynamic WiFi footprint! No humans necessary, no content provided... just a signal for us to all use an customize.

 

[BurnedOutOnTheBoards]

MT1: I respectfully disagree......terrestrial radio is far cheaper for the vast majority of consumers when this recession deepens.....

I use radio daily, either through my home receiver, car radio or streamed {like I am right now}....but I will be seriously looking at broadband as a luxury if it's a choice between that or food, rent, insurance, etc. I don't own an iPod or mp3 player because I don't like the compressed mp3 sound {and, frankly, today's music bores the hell out of me}.

No....I'm not looking to a return to "The Golden Age Of Radio"....but it could very well become a primary news source during a real depression. Hell, McClatchy could go belly up after they completely screwed up and bought a huge failing newspaper chain and took on massive debt {added to huge ad revenue losses}.

Perhaps I haven't made my previous points about the future of the American Economy clear: if things continue as they seem to be headed - The U.S. Government printing trillions of unbacked, unstable dollars, increasing the debt ceiling to over $12 TRILLION,, virtually every sector committed to or forecasting double-digit job cuts, and indicators right & left showing worsening conditions for at least 12-18 months - we face a real depression. That's not an "inconvenience", folks....we are talking social unrest,
disrupted food and housing supplies, unemployment possibly greater than the 1930's, in a country with nearly 400% greater population - legal & illegal - than in 1935.

Plugging in an iPod into a car you can't afford to operate to play songs you cannot afford to download on your computer you won't be able to connect to the Internet, if you can afford any electricity to your home....
I don't think so.

I do agree about the collapse of radio quality....in my 25+ years in the Sacramento market, I've never encountered so many completely unlistenable station contents.

However, regarding your correction....the quality content of network & local radio continued to evolve into radio's most glorious period throughout and after The Great Depression. After the 1929 market crash and as The Depression deepened, America turned to the radio in ever increasing numbers while the newspaper, motion picture and, particularly, the recording industries all suffered dramatic setbacks until the late 30's. The great stars of radio: Jack Benny, Fred Allen, Orson Welles, so many others, as well as the magnificent creators like Norman Corwin and Arch Oboler , all date from the early 30’s on {well, O.K…. Welles & The Mercury Theater from around 1937}, but reached their peaks in the 1940’s.

The greatest radio dramas, comedies, musical presentations, and news & commentary all date from the late Depression Years, World War II, and post-war years...as far as I can see, the real decline in radio quality started in the late 70's, but really snowballed in the mid-90's to the present.....Gee, along with the rise of "Radio Consultants"???

 

[MT1]

You'll get no disagreement from me about consultants... I was a major market PD who found himself with the vile Randy K in his face all of a sudden. I never saw a guy who knew less about radio work harder to destroy it.... well, at least until the San Antonio boys came around and made him look like a total amatur. He only wrecks stations one at a time, they perfected bulk.

On the other hand... old technologies and formats do not come back to replace that which replaced them. Silent B&W movies are cheaper to make, screen and go to than color talkies... horses ain't comin' round to replace cars either. The old time radio stuff was awesome, but I personally do not have blocks of 15 minutes to an hour to sit around and look at my radio while being spoon fed entertainment. My TiVo, iPod, Nano and Smart Phone are waiting for me.

As for my iPod, dude, it's the Internet. If you're paying for your music then you're not paying attention. We've gone through Web 1.0, Web 2.0 and are now in the "Cloud" environment. All you need to access anything at all; from your social network, to your mom, to your personalized news and everything else you must access is a simple hand-held device. I also really doubt that electricity will become expensive or scarce enough that my long-retired but working RCA 1924 battery operated farm radio will become a viable option again. If it does then techonolgy will arrive that incorporates power supply right into the Cloud, the same way old fashioned telephone lines powered themselves without tapping into the grid.

As a saviour for civilization radio is a horrible option( right along with TV). Both are already under the thumb of government and their corporate masters and already engage in wholesale censorship of points of view and news. Neither maintains anything close to a critical mass of people who understand or have any talent in either venue... at any level. Plus, the new and emerging technologies are cheap cheap cheap cheap cheap as in no people no people no people. (Drudge was one guy with a good Rolodex, and that was over a decade ago! Today even he's fat and slow).

 

[BurnedOutOnTheBoards]

MT1..... You make some good points....but I still say the upcoming economics will not sustain as many gadgets and toys.

It won't be that electricity will become that expensive....it will be, with no job and entire states bankrupt, that there is no income and few benefits to cover rents, mortgages, food and utilities.

And let us not look into our crystal balls and miss the next large looming financial crisis: credit cards.

My Mom's 88 years old this month....she lived through the last Great Depression. No minimum wages then, but they wouldn't have mattered, 'cause there were no wages for 25-50% of the people. Miles & miles of unused farmland in every direction, most of it foreclosed. Fistfights in the street when state trucks dropped off stale bread and beans to feed neighborhoods. Railcars passing through towns at high speeds to reduce the number of citizens from freight-hopping and stealing produce. Mini-riots at relief stations.......

If you think it can't happen here....well, it did. And it could again.

As for not paying for copyrighted material, I'm rather proud I have refused to download anything illegally. I believe artists and copyright holders are entitled to fair compensation for their works....which is why I could never understand how the hell Tower Records went bust when I was dropping entire paychecks in there....

....then again, some of those were entire Clear Channel board op paychecks, which covered the cost of about 2 discounted CDs......

You are correct that older technologies don't tend to "come back"....but radio is still here, or is this board and most of its posters just working in a distant memory? Sure, TiVo, iPods, Nanos, Smart Phones...all cute, fine devices. I guess it must be interesting to be "spoon fed entertainment" with the instruments of your own choosing....and when you're out of work, you'll have plenty of time to load these bad boys up, God Forbid.

Only an idiot would contemplate TV or the current radio products as "saviors" of anything {least of all their present business models}....and, yes, the technologies are cheap.....but when you already have a working technology installed in most cars and have multiple AM/FM units in most people's homes, why invest in more gadgetry?

Revamp current products, forget about losers like HD, and package yourself like the NAB is already doing....there are some things you just shouldn't have to pay for.....

 

[Stage5Clinger]

Amos & Andy, Fibber McGee

Don'tcha need to be a hundred to know the eff those people are?

Btw, poor folks will always be listening to the radio. Ipods and stuff are still luxury items for a lot of people, especially in this sucko economy.

 

[BurnedOutOnTheBoards]

S5C......

I'm going on 52 years old, and have known those names for about 46 of those years....but, then again, I don't think too many 6 years olds listened to Duke Ellington music from 1928 like I did, either.....

Does it matter anyways? According to Arbitron, anyone over 44 is labeled "deceased"....

 

[djj]

S5C......

I'm going on 52 years old, and have known those names for about 46 of those years....but, then again, I don't think too many 6 years olds listened to Duke Ellington music from 1928 like I did, either.....

Proving we are rarities to the masses in our age bracket - at least to Arbitron -
as I'm 47 and have known those names a good while, also...

Does it matter anyways? According to Arbitron, anyone over 44 is labeled "deceased"....

LOL!
Yup, that's why 1950s/60s-based music formats are dying in major markets,
because they allegedly cater to a 50-to-death demographic, thus "unattractive"
to advertisers...

Yet, when I did my oldies show in Napa for over 12 years (ending in May 2006),
a great deal of request-callers were kids, and my music was essentially from
the time period 1954-1972...go figure...
--jay

 

[BurnedOutOnTheBoards]

djj.......

When I produced & hosted a local Sunday Night jazz show on public radio {1979-2003}, at least a third of my requests came from younger, pre-30's listeners, many who gathered in homes to dance to 1920's-1940's tracks, mostly Big Band stuff.......

I've still believe, if quality content is actually used as a true guideline to the programming, that it could work as a format.....wouldn't print money on its own like some formats did for so long, but a few people could make a buck or two.

If something has real quality, people will find it or seek it out and enjoy it.....

 

[SoCal Tom]

If something has real quality, people will find it or seek it out and enjoy it.....

And that's the rub. In today's corporate world, there's no such thing as quality. Today, it's "you listen to the crap we want you to hear, or you go away." Today's radio has been surveyed, consulted, and politically inclined to death. What's needed is someone that'll say, "screw you" to the corporate world, then build something of quality.

This is why iPods, MP3 players, smart phones, etc., are selling like there's no tomorrow. The people that want quality are making it for themselves. Just a look at the numbers should prove this point. Listenership is down. Then look at Apple's numbers for their iTunes sales. It isn't surprising that they're up.

Then, there's the "free" stuff on Usenet, or pirated stuff that's floating through the Internet. It's not hard to find. Rhapsody offers free auditioning of full length tracks, not the 30 second snippets of stuff that iTunes offers. So, who says that you can't record what you're listening to with an application like Audacity? It's easy if you know how.

But, that's beside the point. Radio will survive somehow. It always has, and it always will be. If a station isn't manned by a human, it'll be entirely automated, and run by the minimum wage blonde bimbo that can't even answer the phone properly. Hey, the station's on the air now. All we have to do is let it run for the minimum hours a week that the FCC dictates. Even if there's dead silence, with the silence being broken by the once hourly station ID, it's keeping the transmitter warm.

Even the once proud engineering staff will amount to one person. Since a lot of stations are clusters, one engineer will handle the whole cluster, then drive across town and engineer the competitor's cluster. If it ain't already happening now, it will be in a year or less.

Do I listen to radio? Once in a while, and usually to get a traffic report; then it's back to the MP3 player.

 

[oldrover]

I'm in radio sales, news/talk and country, in a small (#165) market in the northeast.

I can emphatically say that my sales are the best they've ever been.

Your station's sales can be great, IF:

1. You're focused on your client's needs.
2. You write compelling copy.
3. You sell predominantly annual contracts.
4. You're not afraid to prospect new categories.

JMHO

 

[MT1]

Do I listen to radio? Once in a while, and usually to get a traffic report; then it's back to the MP3 player.

While you are sitting traffic, waiting for a Clear Channel out-sourcer to fill their moment, telling you on the air what they just saw on TV from Live Chopper 3 or the CHP web site, I am cruising through traffic with real time, first hand traffic conditions thanks to my crummy little, couple hundred buck GPS (my car is an '03, that GPS stuff is now pretty much standard even on starter cars for first time buyers.)