Isn't modern rock and alternative rock the same thing?

[hotpatrick2004]

I know what active is puddle of mud and seether and korn and mudvayne and buckcherry and alterbridge etc... but i would think modern rock and alternative would be the same thing just depends how you want to brand the station. Coldplay and radiohead and the hives and the vines and the thrills and r.e.m. and dave matthews(yes they belong on the alt and modern charts in my humble opinion) and the bravery and nightmare of you and she wants revenge they all belong on modern rock/alternative not on the hybrid active alt stations which by the way are horrific to listen to. I for one do not want to here buckcherry and radiohead back to back!!!

Opinions

 

[p_herring]

I know what active is puddle of mud and seether and korn and mudvayne and buckcherry and alterbridge etc... but i would think modern rock and alternative would be the same thing just depends how you want to brand the station. Coldplay and radiohead and the hives and the vines and the thrills and r.e.m. and dave matthews(yes they belong on the alt and modern charts in my humble opinion) and the bravery and nightmare of you and she wants revenge they all belong on modern rock/alternative not on the hybrid active alt stations which by the way are horrific to listen to. I for one do not want to here buckcherry and radiohead back to back!!!

Opinions

Here's my first piece of advice: No one will take your posts seriously if it's one long run-on sentence in all lower-case.

Listen, we get it. You think Active Rock artists have no place on Alternative radio. It's an argument that's been going on for nearly the past 10 years (whenever Creed, Days Of The New, Tantric, etc. started appearing on the Alt charts). There is no clear cut answer. If you want to have an alterna-snob playlist and it works in your market, great! Remember, this is a MASS medium (for dummies: you have to be able to reach a lot of people). In some markets, it can work (I think) to have your playlist center on more traditional alternative artists with an indie-leaning (Nirvana, Arcade Fire, Smashing Pumpkins, Interpol, etc.) Other markets rely on more Active-heavy playlists to get the 18-34 males in there, because those males have spending power. This is why you'll see Puddle Of Mudd, Seether and Velvet Revolver on those playlists.

The real reason Alternative stations don't sound like "True" alternative stations is because those listeners have tuned out long ago. I'm a 24 year old male living in NYC. Do you think I listen to FM radio? Nope. I get my music recommendations from blogs, friends and websites and then load those puppies onto my ipod, no questions asked and certainly no advertisements heard. The same can't be said for Joe Schmoe works at the Hardware store in NJ. So, before you complain about the playlists, ask yourself if those listeners who would appreciate your playlist are LISTENING in the first place. Also, try to use some grammar every once in a while, ok?

 

[hotpatrick2004]

Yes master p_herring hot p will work on grammar ;D

But to answer my question i just got carried away on my own tangent is there a difference between alternative rock and modern rock???

There are some stations one can listen to in this country to keep up on alt acts like indie 1031 in los angeles or cd 101 in columbus ohio or fm 949 in sandiego and 91x in sandiego. My hometown of louisville ky would much rather hear the latest offering from seether then arcade fire. The alt station here is really an active station that plays a few alt tunes and burned out grundge music from the 90s and reports as alternative.We do have triple a but it is not the same.

 

[BlueWanderer]

My opinion is they're not the same thing.

The real reason Alternative stations don't sound like "True" alternative stations is because those listeners have tuned out long ago. I'm a 24 year old male living in NYC. Do you think I listen to FM radio? Nope. I get my music recommendations from blogs, friends and websites and then load those puppies onto my ipod, no questions asked and certainly no advertisements heard. The same can't be said for Joe Schmoe works at the Hardware store in NJ. So, before you complain about the playlists, ask yourself if those listeners who would appreciate your playlist are LISTENING in the first place. Also, try to use some grammar every once in a while, ok?

Well said, and I don't think my playlist would work well in my market. Even though I would love to have an alternative or even a modern rock station around, active rock is here to stay in my market whether I like it or not.

 

[hotpatrick2004]

p_herring how is that new station? The old smooth jazz station that is no more i am talking about?

 

[SoulCrusher]

p_herring how is that new station? The old smooth jazz station that is no more i am talking about?

It's basically kitchen sink rock. An example of what you can hear in one hour: Bruce Springsteen, Stone Roses, AC/DC and Nickelback. They've been described as "AAA" and "Adult Rock" - to me it sounds like "throw it at the wall and see if it sticks". Safe money says that the station will evolve over the next few months to fit the tastes of the majority of listeners. The station will be just fine with me as long as they keep my precious, astonishing, brilliant Nickelback in the rotation. I am just so happy that you can hear them on every station in NYC - it makes me so happy that true geniuses for the modern age are being recognized for their fantastic work .

With K-Rock and Q 104.3 both as Classic Rock with a few new tracks thrown in, WRXP will hopefully lean toward an Alternative sound over time - one that leans more toward R.E.M., Beck and The Strokes rather than Pearl Jam, Stone Temple Pilots and Seether.

 

[hotpatrick2004]

Yes but it is new york after all la has indie 1031 so it is just fare that new york has a cool left of center rock station.

Kitchen sink rock but rock mullett rock its all the same.

 

[CHRles]

The station will be just fine with me as long as they keep my precious, astonishing, brilliant Nickelback in the rotation. I am just so happy that you can hear them on every station in NYC - it makes me so happy that true geniuses for the modern age are being recognized for their fantastic work .

LMAO!

 

[p_herring]

Re: Wow

p_herring how is that new station? The old smooth jazz station that is no more i am talking about?

It's basically kitchen sink rock.

Can you say something positive for once? You're like the Truthsayer who usually trashes my station.

What exactly is "kitchen sink rock" anyways?

(I'm not a Nickelback fan either, but you have to program to the listeners and not to yourself or the industry)

Taking Nickelback out isn't programming the station to personal taste, it's fitting the station's image. It's been proven time and time again that if you throw everything out there and see what sticks, it won't work. My advice for the NYC market. Have K-Rock go 100% Active Rock. They can still play listen rock while focusing on the harder age which will still allow them to play STP, Pearl Jam and Chili Peppers every hour should they choose. Then, let's have RXP be the more "daring" alternative. Not quite Indie 103 in LA but more like FNX in Boston. There IS an audience for that in NYC but it has to sound smart and not try to sound hip. You can play Modest Mouse, Interpol, Kasabian while keeping more mainstream acts like My Chemical Romance, Foo Fighters and (maybe ocassionally) Linkin Park. Post-grunge crap like Seether, Nickelback, Puddle Of Mudd, Velvet Revolver should stay out. Leave that to K-Rock. Finally, allow Q to act as the classic rock station since it's already established an audience. The idea here is to have 3 formats playing DIFFERENT music and not just a random shuffle of all the tired hits.

-Phil

 

[hotpatrick2004]

Excellent advice.

That is the only thing missing is good rock radio from the best city in the world NYC baby!!! In HOTPATRICK'S opinion ;D

 

[mjb1124]

I'd also have to agree with p_herring's analysis. Another good station for RXP to model itself after would be G-Rock in NJ, though there is some overlap in their listening range, and they do play some of the active-leaning stuff. Also, I really have not found a station that can effectively mix classic and modern rock. I say leave the classic stuff to Q104.3.

 

[SoulCrusher]

Re: Wow

p_herring how is that new station? The old smooth jazz station that is no more i am talking about?

It's basically kitchen sink rock.

Can you say something positive for once? You're like the Truthsayer who usually trashes my station.

What exactly is "kitchen sink rock" anyways?

(I'm not a Nickelback fan either, but you have to program to the listeners and not to yourself or the industry)

"Kitchen sink rock" is not a putdown. It just means that WRXP has a very eclectic definition of Rock, as evidenced by the variety of music they play. The problem, however, is that they're too eclectic. Basically, they're playing Bad Company, AC/DC and Daughtry alongside Alternative titles by Rogue Wave, Deaf Pedestrians and Cold War Kids - therefore, while people are highly likely to tune in for a song or two, there's a good chance they'll find something off-putting depending on their tastes that will lead them to tune out. I'd like to see them become a bit more focused, and based on what the NYC market has to offer, the Alternative direction would be the more attractive option for them.

As for Nickelback: A lot of Rock radio stations are done with them. They're pretty much finished on Alternative, which has moved in a different direction. They're too soft and downright hokey for many Active Rock stations. The only "rock" stations that still play them are awful ones that are pretty much semi-Hot AC like WRAT in New Jersey - they would rather play Buckcherry's terrible new ballad "Sorry" than Five Finger Death Punch. And they wonder why their ratings stink.

 

[hotpatrick2004]

Soulcrusher in my hometown of louisville ky we have this pathetic piece of crap called wlrs that reprots as alt but is active wiith some alt sprinkled in along with alot of burnt out 90s grundge and they love the nickelback. Anytime i get a chance to tell people how bad they are i do until they go away!!!

I think grock has come a long way.

 

[BlueWanderer]

As for Nickelback: A lot of Rock radio stations are done with them. They're pretty much finished on Alternative, which has moved in a different direction. They're too soft and downright hokey for many Active Rock stations. The only "rock" stations that still play them are awful ones that are pretty much semi-Hot AC like WRAT in New Jersey - they would rather play Buckcherry's terrible new ballad "Sorry" than Five Finger Death Punch. And they wonder why their ratings stink.

Apparently, WRTT 95.1 The Rocket isn't done with them yet. You look at their playlist over on yes.com and they still play at least one different Nickelback song almost every hour. That and among other reasons is why I can't accept them as a replacement for a defunct station (WRAX-107.7 The X) that I used to listen to.

 

[tgillison]

WLRS (Is it still "The Walrus") was REALLY good at one time, and they went away. They eventually came back on another frequency, and they weren't any good anymore.

To me, there is a true difference between modern rock and alternative, but the problem is all in the semantics. When I was starting in radio, emo was just becoming a "style" (as well as "screamo"). Emo in today's terms would be considered alternative (Death Cab For Cutie, My Chemical Romance, etc.), but when I was younger, it was much different. Most people don't even know what it stands for ("emotional hardcore") which to me automatically implies modern rock. Jimmy Eat World was one of the quintessential emo bands back in the day.

This is a classic example of the difference, because today's emo bands I would classify as truly alternative, and they would have no business on a modern rock station (which would include your formulaic rock bands like Staind and Nickelback). I find that the line between active rock and modern rock is a lot more gray, and the alternative format has broken away.

For anyone unfamiliar, go to radioandrecords.com and compare the Active Rock charts with the Alternative. You'll see a few instances of similarities, but for the most part, they are worlds apart in my opinion.

 

[Jacko]

The problem is, "modern rock" stations report as "alternative." Stations like WBCN/Boston, WWDC/Washington or WRXL/Richmond I would consider "modern rock" as opposed to alternative, but they're reporting as alternative instead of active rock. And it throws off the alternative chart, especially with acts like Hinder, Puddle of Mudd, Seether, and... wait for it... Motley Crue (?!?!) being played on alternative-reporting stations. I was glad when Mediabase moved several alternative reporting stations to active rock a few months ago, and I think it's time to move a few more over. And when WXRK/New York becomes a reporter (I'm surprised they haven't yet), they should report as rock or active rock, as they preliminarily are reporting as alternative according to Mediabase.

Sorry, I'll stop ranting now...

Jacko

 

[hotpatrick2004]

Hey tgillison wlrs is still around but as a classic/active rocker and it really is ashame mainline did not rebrand them for those calls wlrs are the kiss of death. They flipped like 2 or 3 months ago.

 

[drpickle]

I was in an Oklahoma City bar in December. OKC is the home of the Flaming Lips. Some woman throwing darts put in Nickelback on the jukebox. Under a good buzz I remarked that "this is the home of Wayne Coyne and the Flaming Lips, and people still play garbage like Nickelback". Well, the bimbo told me off. She said, "we don't like those weirdos around here." We listen to real rock." I responded by saying if this was Judas Priest or something I'd concede but to say Nickelback is real rock is ludicrous." My response was'nt accepted. The bartender said I could stay because she thought I was cute and funny. She was an advanced Cougar so while I appreciated the compliment I was'nt going to pursue anything. I finished my drink and left a nice tip. As I left the bimbo and her crew playing darts seethed at me as I walked out.

 

[upstate29651]

..and I always thought "Modern Rock" was alt rock with a female-friendly lean to it (think Lillith Fair-type artists).

G

 

[scottsvb5]

It figures "upstate" would be in this Alternative thread. Alternative is modern rock. Active rock is hard rock. True alternative is just that..true alternative....like some have mentioned.. deathcabforcutie,weezer,coldplay,mychemicalromance, etc, etc.. modern rock is linkin park,foofighters,offspring,scars on broadway,rehab, etc..etc. Active rock (since there is no metal chart) are bands like Disturbed,fivefingerdeathpunch,Slipnot,Dragonforce,MotleyCrue,Metallica, etc etc etc..

Now where put bands like Staind,Theory of a Deadman,Nickleback,Jetblackstare,3 door down,hinder, etc etc???? Probably into the Active rock scene mainly cause they lean more towards active rock sounding. If your a alternative guy,, do you you consider them alternative/modern rock? Most wont. With Active rock beating alternative rock formats nationwide and overseas its mostly metal/hardrock.. bands listed above have leaned more active rock.