Ithaca's OTHER Hit Music Station. Wait... what?

[Beejus]

I'm hearing this literally third hand, so I really can't confirm anything... but a friend sent me a link:

http://hits1033.com/

APPARENTLY Saga reacted to the sign-on of Z95.5 by taking on of their translators (103.3) and flipping it to commercial-free CHR.

A couple of questions if this is true:

1- I never really tuned into the signal for 103.3, is it even good enough to make anyone notice it's there?

2- Is this legal per FCC? I'm not going to be a whistleblower, but can you take a translator station and program seperate programming on it?

Either way. Things may have just got... well... interesting in Ithaca.

 

[ThePickleReport]

It is 250 watts I guess. There is another case of a station in Harrisburg doing it. The FCC I guess is informally allowing it....for now. Same thing with using an FM translator to re-broadcast an FM.

 

[Beejus]

It is 250 watts I guess. There is another case of a station in Harrisburg doing it. The FCC I guess is informally allowing it....for now. Same thing with using an FM translator to re-broadcast an FM.

Well... the Harrisburg station was first translating an AM.. then they are now translating an HD-2 channel of I think WNNK.

::shrug:: I'm not sure on the FCC regulations on it. I just found it REALLY odd.

 

[rygert]

Saga also started a new format on a translator in Asheville, NC this week. In that case, it's translating one of the HD channels from a local FM (WOXL), similar to what's going on in Harrisburg. The FCC seems to be allowing it for now, at least. So my best bet is that Hits 103.3 has been installed on the HD channel for either WYXL or WQNY and they are translating that at 103.3.

The 103.3 translator had been on 103.1 for years, as a relay of WQNY. I haven't been in Ithaca since the move to 103.3, but the 103.1 signal was pretty bad even compared to the other translators in town. Last I heard, 103.3 had been relaying the talk format of WNYY 1470.

 

[InsertNameHere]

According to the FCC's site, W276AO on 103.1 FM is still the licensed station, while 103.3 FM is the CP.
I'm sure the FCC site just needs updating, as 103.3 would clearly be on the air, judging from the website

Here's 103.1's contour:
http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=FX511525.html

And 103.3's
http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=FX1228417.html

So 103.3 clearly does have a bigger signal than 103.1, it appears to cover the entire city. But not much else.

 

[Beejus]

When I was in Ithaca (01-05)... 103.1 was pumping out maybe 2 watts?

The CP to move to 103.3 and bump it to 250 watts probably helped their decision.

I'm still wary with a signal like that though. In the car they're probably audible.. but how much building penetration will you get with it?

Oh.. and according to CNYRadio.com "Hits 103.3" is the HD-2 channel of I100 (WIII).

 

[amfmxm]

This is the front edge of a tidal wave--and it ain't gonna be pretty. It's gonna be stupid.

It all started a year or so ago when the FCC responded to a proposal from licensees of AM daytimers to add night service by using an FM translator. Sounds logical and sane and innocent enough, so far, right?

Well, that got interpreted by other broadcasters to mean that translators could be used to compensate for signal deficiencies of FULLTIME AM stations--that's how the Harrisburg mess started--to supposedly shore up the same lousy signal that 1,000 watts has produced on 1400 kHz for the past 60 years. But Cumulus also put 1400's urban format on an HD channel attached to 104.1/WNNK and instead used the translator to repeat the HD channel--and then changed the AM format to something else.

The end result is that Cumulus created a new urban-formatted FM for the Harrisburg market without having to go through the normal (lengthy and expensive) process.

The FCC hasn't told Cumulus that they could do this. But they haven't told them that they can't, either. So it is now officially a free-for-all. The commission has effectively said "Do whatever you want. We don't care."

So now Saga is using a translator in Asheville to slap a new Triple A on the air (to scoop up some of non-commercial WNCW's audience?) and is using a translator in Ithaca to slap a commercial-free CHR on the air to presumably blunt the impact of their newest commercial FM competitor.

If you think radio has turned itself into a clusterf**k over the past dozen years, just wait til every FM translator in America has been snapped up and turned into a format weapon.

The radio industry just can't stop shooting itself in the foot. We've been overrun by morons.

 

[theradiokid]

This is getting very interesting… I mean all of it. Ithaca goes from a CHRLess market, to a full on CHR war game between Saga and Radio Group in less than 2 weeks. Huh. Who’d’ve figured it?

So now that we’ve talked about the legality of the translator thing, and we’ve established what the translator and HD2 stations are, the next thing to do is to speculate on who’s gonna win the war game.

Okay, it’s pretty much established that “Z95.5’s” got the best signal. Plus, their an actual station. They’re not owned by the dominating company. The Finger Lakes Radio Group’s been puttin’ a lot of money into getting this CHR on the air for Ithaca, and they did a good job of keeping it a secret. The signal they have goes lots further than the Saga translator. So, “Z” could claim that when “Ya can’t get hits (cuzz of the signal), turn to us.”

However,, as a commercial station, “Z95.5” must run commercials. And in fact, The Radio Group wanted an Ithaca station to go after those Ithaca advertisers, and hurt Saga. On the other hand, Saga’s new “Hits 103.3” is an HD2 subchannel of WIII. HD2 channels do not, and cannot run commercials. So when “Z” starts to play a commercial, all a CHR listener has to do is press a button, turn on “Hits,” and can leave it there, and know they won’t hear a commercial. And, as a result, Saga can say “Unlike Z, we don’t play commercials, so you can hear music all day.”

So, in terms of this analysis of this CHR war, we’re tied now, 1 for 1. There’s one factor in this war game that will determine the winner… Talent, talent, talent! Now, we know that “Z95.5” is hiring a full roster of talent. The question is: Will Saga do the same? If not, then, in the Radio Group VS Saga CHR war in Ithaca, Radio Group will surely win. If Saga does hire talent, then, expect a very nasty and ugly CHR brawl to happen, with each daypart up for grabs, depending on which station has the better talent.

So, I ask you, fellow radio-info Binghamton posters, are you ready to see a war? If so, take your seats, and grab your refreshments.

In this corner, weighing in at 1,500 watts, the locally owned WFIZ, “Z95.5, Ithaca’s Hit Music Channel!!”

In this other corner, weighing in at 250 watts, the Saga owned translator W276AO, and it’s HD2 carier, “Hits 103.3, Ithaca’s New Hit Music Station!!”

Okay, CHR stations, let the war begin!!!!

--The Radio Kid
(AKA Oswego Jeremy, as nicknamed by George of the Radio Racket.)
My email: [email protected].

 

[ThePickleReport]

On the other hand, Saga’s new “Hits 103.3” is an HD2 subchannel of WIII. HD2 channels do not, and cannot run commercials.

Not true. The constraints are off the HD channels now with respect to formats and commercials. They're fair game now.

And I seriously doubt Saga will "hire" talent for Hits 103.3.

 

[kfitz]

I noticed that 97.3 in Ithaca recently filed to begin their HD radio broadcasts. Don't be surprised if yet a second translator begins broadcasting a new format via the rebroadcast of an HD-2. Doesn't Finger Lakes Radio group also have Ithaca translators? They could easily put country on the WFIZ HD2 and go country to compete with Saga's 103.7.

 

[Kent]

This is the front edge of a tidal wave--and it ain't gonna be pretty. It's gonna be stupid.

It all started a year or so ago when the FCC responded to a proposal from licensees of AM daytimers to add night service by using an FM translator. Sounds logical and sane and innocent enough, so far, right?

Well, that got interpreted by other broadcasters to mean that translators could be used to compensate for signal deficiencies of FULLTIME AM stations--that's how the Harrisburg mess started--to supposedly shore up the same lousy signal that 1,000 watts has produced on 1400 kHz for the past 60 years. But Cumulus also put 1400's urban format on an HD channel attached to 104.1/WNNK and instead used the translator to repeat the HD channel--and then changed the AM format to something else.

I can understand the logic of letting weaker signaled AM's use FM translators. I worked for KFRU 1400 in Columbia, MO a few years ago, and there was talk of finding a way to get KFRU on FM because 1400's signal couldn't keep up with the growth of Columbia. This has been a problem for local channels everywhere. The old WTCY in Harrisburg was licensed when Harrisburg was much smaller than it is now (as was WKBO 1230), and Harrisburg has outgrown the coverage area of the station. Maybe you could argue adding an FM translator is too little too late, though. After all, AM is already all-but-dead, and the real reason wasn't the superior sound quality of FM. It was that cities were growing by leaps and bounds, and most of the AM's just couldn't adequately cover the entire metro area. I grew up in Texas and Oklahoma, and I remember Dallas/Ft. Worth as being one of the first markets where FM overtook AM. It happened because Dallas and Ft. Worth were combined into one market in the mid-70's, and Dallas stations like KLIF 1190 and KBOX 1480 barely covered Ft. Worth at night while Ft. Worth stations like KFJZ 1270 and KXOL 1360 barely covered Dallas. In order to get the ratings, you had to cover both cities, and only the FM's and about three AM's did that.

The FCC hasn't told Cumulus that they could do this. But they haven't told them that they can't, either. So it is now officially a free-for-all. The commission has effectively said "Do whatever you want. We don't care."

So now Saga is using a translator in Asheville to slap a new Triple A on the air (to scoop up some of non-commercial WNCW's audience?) and is using a translator in Ithaca to slap a commercial-free CHR on the air to presumably blunt the impact of their newest commercial FM competitor.

If you think radio has turned itself into a clusterf**k over the past dozen years, just wait til every FM translator in America has been snapped up and turned into a format weapon.

The radio industry just can't stop shooting itself in the foot. We've been overrun by morons.

The biggest problem with translators rebroadcasting an HD-2 is that the translator rules were created before anyone ever thought an FM station could have multiple channels. Yes, there were SCA's, but no one was going to use a translator to rebroadcast an SCA. An SCA was never considered to be another option for the listening public. As for every translator getting snapped up and turned into a format weapon, I don't have much concern about that happening. After all, it seems better to me that they be locally programmed and used to target the local audience than just rebroadcast a different market's religious broadcaster. Also, if HD radio ever does catch on, there will no longer be a need to rebroadcast a subchannel unless it's really to fill in a coverage gap in the primary signal contour.

 

[Kent]

HD2 channels do not, and cannot run commercials.

Not true. There isn't, and never has been, a prohibition against commercials on HD subchannels. The HD Radio Alliance, which was only 10 broadcasters, agreed they would coordinate formats and not air commercials on subchannels in order to promote HD Radio. However, those who weren't members of the HD Radio Alliance could and did air commercials. Saga is not and never has been a member of the HD Radio Alliance.

As has also been mentioned, the HD Radio Alliance no longer requires its members to run commercial free subchannels.

 

[Play Freebird]

Has the simulcast of WIII-HD2 actually begun at 103.3?

I just searched CDBS but can't find any evidence of an STA application under W276AO or facility ID 24216. Officially, it appears to remain a conventional FM translator for WYXL. So the question is: who authorized this?

 

[amfmxm]

As for every translator getting snapped up and turned into a format weapon, I don't have much concern about that happening.

Tell you what. Assuming the FCC continues to ignore this, I'll bet you ten bucks that by this time next year (10/6/09) there will be hundreds (let's say, 300) of these babies glutting the airwaves as "format weapons"--and mostly in small-to-mid size markets. As far as I can tell, the only limiting factor right now is the availability of existing translators (i.e. translators to buy) on commercial channels--and the relatively modest technical cost of launching an HD-2 channel and retooling the translator. Not too many translators currently on-air in major markets, but there are thousands on-air already in smaller markets.

Every broadcaster is looking for an edge--either to improve their own lot, or--as evidenced with Saga in Ithaca--to attack a competitor. And some of them won't stop until everyone has a one share.

 

[SirRoxalot]

Lost In Translation

"Flankers" come to small-market radio. In large markets, companies buy rimshot stations to either steal a couple of shares from the competition's biggest guns, or to prevent other companies from trying to steal a couple of shares from their biggest guns.

Now, in small markets, it seems that translators are being used to extend the reach of "flankers" that were set up on HD2 and HD3 channels. Welcome to the big time, folks.

For my money, I think that the FCC should require that translators MUST repeat main channel audio - with HD streams as HD service, not primary service off the translator.

 

[amfmxm]

FWIW, I stumbled onto an item this morning from the Midwest. Saga is buying FM translators in Spencer, Iowa and Mitchell, South Dakota--both for a grand total of $5,800. Sounds like Mitchell & Spencer have new formats coming, momentarily.

 

[Kent]

Tell you what. Assuming the FCC continues to ignore this, I'll bet you ten bucks that by this time next year (10/6/09) there will be hundreds (let's say, 300) of these babies glutting the airwaves as "format weapons"--and mostly in small-to-mid size markets. As far as I can tell, the only limiting factor right now is the availability of existing translators (i.e. translators to buy) on commercial channels--and the relatively modest technical cost of launching an HD-2 channel and retooling the translator. Not too many translators currently on-air in major markets, but there are thousands on-air already in smaller markets.

I think the big difference is that you see this as a problem, and I don't necessarily. As I mentioned before, would you rather see a local station broadcasting on a translator or a repeater of a religious broadcaster that no one would listen to? If you're curious, those translators Saga is buying in Spencer, Mitchell and Tuscola, IL were originally going to repeat religious broadcasters. Spencer was going to repeat KBDC 88.5 from Mason City, IA, the AFR affiliate. Mitchell was going to repeat religious KNWC while Tuscola was going to repeat religious WBGL. So, I ask again, would you rather have a local station programmed toward your city's listening tastes, or would you rather have another religious broadcaster? Those translators were going to go on-air and were going to do something regardless of who owned them. If the only issue is too many translators, that problem should be dealt with in its entirety instead of just whether or not a digital subchannel can be repeated.

Every broadcaster is looking for an edge--either to improve their own lot, or--as evidenced with Saga in Ithaca--to attack a competitor. And some of them won't stop until everyone has a one share.

If digital multicasting catches on, this could easily happen anyway.

 

[amfmxm]

Tell you what. Assuming the FCC continues to ignore this, I'll bet you ten bucks that by this time next year (10/6/09) there will be hundreds (let's say, 300) of these babies glutting the airwaves as "format weapons"--and mostly in small-to-mid size markets. As far as I can tell, the only limiting factor right now is the availability of existing translators (i.e. translators to buy) on commercial channels--and the relatively modest technical cost of launching an HD-2 channel and retooling the translator. Not too many translators currently on-air in major markets, but there are thousands on-air already in smaller markets.

I think the big difference is that you see this as a problem, and I don't necessarily. As I mentioned before, would you rather see a local station broadcasting on a translator or a repeater of a religious broadcaster that no one would listen to? If you're curious, those translators Saga is buying in Spencer, Mitchell and Tuscola, IL were originally going to repeat religious broadcasters. Spencer was going to repeat KBDC 88.5 from Mason City, IA, the AFR affiliate. Mitchell was going to repeat religious KNWC while Tuscola was going to repeat religious WBGL. So, I ask again, would you rather have a local station programmed toward your city's listening tastes, or would you rather have another religious broadcaster? Those translators were going to go on-air and were going to do something regardless of who owned them. If the only issue is too many translators, that problem should be dealt with in its entirety instead of just whether or not a digital subchannel can be repeated.

Every broadcaster is looking for an edge--either to improve their own lot, or--as evidenced with Saga in Ithaca--to attack a competitor. And some of them won't stop until everyone has a one share.

If digital multicasting catches on, this could easily happen anyway.

At the risk of sounding like an old fogey longing for the "Good Ole Days" pre-deregulation, I'll admit that I see this newest twist with FM translators as the latest in a long line of regulatory abuse over the past 30 years or so.

There is a traceable thread extending from the FCC's hairpin turn following the allocation of the 80-90 channels 25+ years ago--channels intended (mostly) to serve small communities--allowing broadcasters to quickly abandon those towns and move those sticks to the nearest larger town. In more recent times, we've watched even more small towns lose their long-established radio stations via move-ins to already-saturated large markets (Cincinnati & Atlanta come to mind).

In this instance, the original intent of the commission's approval of FM translators was to extend radio service to small isolated communities (mostly out west) that would otherwise not have local service. To this day, the commission still prohibits commercial broadcasters from originating local programming directly via translator--recognizing, at least officially, that it amounts to owning an additional FM signal. So by inserting HD-2 channels into the audio chain, Saga & Cumulus (with many more coming) have skirted the rules.

I completely agree that the (mostly) large nationally-based religious organizations have abused both non-commercial rules and translator rules to glut the airwaves with their proselytizing with "chains" of both full-power FMs and FM translators rivaling the size of the largest commercial group operators.

So is Saga any worse than EMF? Probably not. Have they both taken advantage of a lazy regulatory agency with little or no interest in radio to rake in big bucks? Yup.

But I'll flip it back on you.

There are 7 more translators on-air already in Ithaca. Since these translators presumably don't count against the local caps, how many should Saga be allowed to buy? All of them? And when the next window opens for new translator applications, should Saga be allowed to put one on every FM channel?

Would that be good for the listener? Would that be in the public interest? Would that be good for the radio industry?

 

[Kent]

So is Saga any worse than EMF? Probably not. Have they both taken advantage of a lazy regulatory agency with little or no interest in radio to rake in big bucks? Yup.

You won't get much of an argument from me on that point!

But I'll flip it back on you.

There are 7 more translators on-air already in Ithaca. Since these translators presumably don't count against the local caps, how many should Saga be allowed to buy? All of them? And when the next window opens for new translator applications, should Saga be allowed to put one on every FM channel?

Should Saga be allowed to put a translator on every FM channel? Of course not. Interference concerns from full power stations would prevent that! As for how many translators Saga, or any other operator, should be able to buy, I would have less of a problem with them owning or leasing all 7 of them than you probably would so long as they had something to put on them. Of course, the FCC doesn't seem to make that distinction.

Would that be good for the listener? Would that be in the public interest? Would that be good for the radio industry?

From a listener's and public standpoint, more choices is usually a good thing. As for whether or not it's good for the radio industry, I don't know. I have little doubt, however, that regardless of whether FM translators are used, we'll have the same issue if digital multicasting gets a foothold in the market. After all, I've been told Clear Channel engineers think you could run 8 distinct multicast channels on a single FM frequency if the analog signal were turned off. Ithaca could easily have more than 50 stations if that happens!

 

[theradiokid]

Here’s an update that may throw people into confusion: This morning, CNYRadio.com reports that “Hits 103.3” is actually on the HD2 of WYXL (97.3), and not the HD2 of WIII, as reported elsewhere. I cannot find any other source verifying this, with everyone else saying that it is the HD2 of WIII. Ah well, no matter what station it is, we’re still talkin’ about a translator relaying an HD2 here.

--The Radio Kid
(AKA Oswego Jeremy, as nicknamed by George of the Radio Racket.)
My email: [email protected].