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JMHO about part 15 radio

C

carlvanorden

Guest
No matter you be AM or FM, if you interfere with a commercial station, you broadcast nasty music or comments, or piss off your neighbor due to your antenna or somehow overshadow his tv set, part 15 radio continues to be a science, best left for those who are expereinced in it.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Taking a 100mW FM station down to an acceptable level is not something everyone can do, but it can be done....and it is done daily...........Taking a part 15am which for some reason may be more powerful than it should be down to an acceptable level is something that can also be done................................>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I like to put posts on here that generate lots of discussion: such is the reason for the discussion board. But in no way do I want people to fall into harms way by doing something wrong.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I am sorry if I led people to believe that I am running pirate radio stations: I have no personal reasons to do so. I know radio and don't interfere, nor do I put on illegal stations; what I looked for was imput on specific transmitters, and I got great results!!......>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Specifically, what I do is to test transmitters, both am and fm, and advise on the best I have found. I build am antennas for sstran and feel I've done an excellent job building them for my customers. It doesn't mean I tell you to put on an illegal tx....or for that matter ONE WATT (read that repeatedly throughout the last several threads!)....................................Take a well built FM transmitter with 100 mW and use a simple piece of wire; and what you get is.....well, a nice solid signal but not a lot of distance.......If you can reign it in or not interfere, you have no problem.If you take this same transmitter and interfere with a Class C; you have a problem.............So lets get real here; I never advocated on this board that part 15'ers need to go pirate; what I said was that you can improve your signal, stay legal, and have what amounts to a radio station you can call your own...perhaps a business....perhaps a service...whatever you like.......but to retain the ability to put part 15 stations on the air, we need to obey the rules..............Putting on any one watt station, AM or FM...if enough of you do this, our privaledge will be taken away immediately. So, please don't do that, and keep legal and DO serve your community!!! Put on your AM...put on your FM...I encourage it!!But don't get in trouble, do it right and email me if you want details on how to do it right............The benefits of community radio are immense: the ability to broadcast local church services or thier information, to talk about what your town is doing, to broadcast music that can't be heard in your town...all are great reasons to be part 15 broadcasters.Do your homework and do it [email protected]<P ID="signature">______________
[email protected], [email protected],[email protected]</P>
 
> No matter you be AM or FM, if you interfere with a
> commercial station, you broadcast nasty music or comments,
> or piss off your neighbor due to your antenna or somehow
> overshadow his tv set, part 15 radio continues to be a
> science, best left for those who are expereinced in
> it.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Taking a 100mW FM
> station down to an acceptable level is not something
> everyone can do, but it can be done....and it is done
> daily...........Taking a part 15am which for some reason may
> be more powerful than it should be down to an acceptable
> level is something that can also be
done..........> ......................>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I
> like to put posts on here that generate lots of discussion:
> such is the reason for the discussion board. But in no way
> do I want people to fall into harms way by doing something
> wrong.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I am sorry if I led people
> to believe that I am running pirate radio stations: I have
> no personal reasons to do so. I know radio and don't
> interfere, nor do I put on illegal stations; what I looked
> for was imput on specific transmitters, and I got great
> results!!......>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Specifically,
> what I do is to test transmitters, both am and fm, and
> advise on the best I have found. I build am antennas for
> sstran and feel I've done an excellent job building them for
> my customers. It doesn't mean I tell you to put on an
> illegal tx....or for that matter ONE WATT (read that
> repeatedly throughout the last several
> threads!)....................................Take a well
> built FM transmitter with 100 mW and use a simple piece of
> wire; and what you get is.....well, a nice solid signal but
> not a lot of distance.......If you can reign it in or not
> interfere, you have no problem.If you take this same
> transmitter and interfere with a Class C; you have a
> problem.............So lets get real here; I never
> advocated on this board that part 15'ers need to go pirate;
> what I said was that you can improve your signal, stay
> legal, and have what amounts to a radio station you can call
> your own...perhaps a business....perhaps a
> service...whatever you like.......but to retain the ability
> to put part 15 stations on the air, we need to obey the
> rules..............Putting on any one watt station, AM or
> FM...if enough of you do this, our privaledge will be taken
> away immediately. So, please don't do that, and keep legal
> and DO serve your community!!! Put on your AM...put on your
> FM...I encourage it!!But don't get in trouble, do it right
> and email me if you want details on how to do it
> right............The benefits of community radio are
> immense: the ability to broadcast local church services or
> thier information, to talk about what your town is doing, to
> broadcast music that can't be heard in your town...all are
> great reasons to be part 15 broadcasters.Do your homework
> and do it [email protected]
>

Carl... I'm like the guy looking for all info relating to a subject before he buys a car, house, etc.

Now no where do I say I want to get a 1 watt transmitter or anything close to it, what I want to know is if I want to put the EDM 50mw tranmitter at say 100' up... will the signal at the bottom of the antenna be 250 uv/m to meet the rule or does the transmitter need to be 100mw, 500mw, 1 watt, etc. to meet the rule? Sure 10mw is good outside of the homes, but will the signal be strong enough to penetrate homes say 1/4 mile away or will only those in cars hear the signal? I was only seeking info, before I buy any transmitter or put one up to the test.

There is alot of good info from you Carl, Radiobrandy, Rev. Chrysafis, and a host of other honest good folks here and I surely did not intend to offend anyone here... rather just wanting to here it from the FCC guys, and there's no blowing any cover as these are regular working folks, engineers, techs, etc. and perhaps have their own Part15 setups...

Radiopilot
 
>... what I want to know is if I want to
> put the EDM 50mw tranmitter at say 100' up... will the
> signal at the bottom of the antenna be 250 uv/m to meet the
> rule. . .

You guys are overthinking a very simple and elegant rule. It is elegant because it absolutely limits the distance that an effective signal can travel from its origin, that being its antenna.

If you put the antenna up 100 feet off of the ground then you are wasting a great deal of your available signal just trying to reach a receiver at ground level.
 
> >... what I want to know is if I want to
> > put the EDM 50mw tranmitter at say 100' up... will the
> > signal at the bottom of the antenna be 250 uv/m to meet
> the
> > rule. . .
>
> You guys are overthinking a very simple and elegant rule.
> It is elegant because it absolutely limits the distance that
> an effective signal can travel from its origin, that being
> its antenna.
>
> If you put the antenna up 100 feet off of the ground then
> you are wasting a great deal of your available signal just
> trying to reach a receiver at ground level.
>

You couldn't have said it better... the 10-50mw signal will be lost by the time it reaches the ground... so do you actually measure 250 uV/3m if the antenna is 100' high? So naturally the output would need to be better than 10-100mw's or higher!

I posted a reply below indicating a possible visit to the Atlanta field office and will get whatever finding I can muster from these agents/engineering gurus there. They will sure know the answer plus beings engineers themselves will lend to giving information to fellow engineers!

The answer is there and I'll find it!

Radiopilot
 
Radiopilot; I wasn't singling YOU out!!.....

> > No matter you be AM or FM, if you interfere with a> > commercial station, you broadcast nasty music or comments,> > > or piss off your neighbor due to your antenna or somehow> > overshadow his tv set, part 15 radio continues to be a> > science, best left for those who are expereinced in> > it.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Taking a 100mW FM> > station down to an acceptable level is not something> > everyone can do, but it can be done....and it is done> > daily...........Taking a part 15am which for some reason> may> > be more powerful than it should be down to an acceptable> > level is something that can also be> done..........>> ......................>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I> > > like to put posts on here that generate lots of> discussion: > > such is the reason for the discussion board. But in no> way> > do I want people to fall into harms way by doing something> > > wrong.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I am sorry if I led> people> > to believe that I am running pirate radio stations: I> have> > no personal reasons to do so. I know radio and don't> > interfere, nor do I put on illegal stations; what I> looked> > for was imput on specific transmitters, and I got great> >> results!!......>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Specifically,> > > what I do is to test transmitters, both am and fm, and> > advise on the best I have found. I build am antennas for> > sstran and feel I've done an excellent job building them> for> > my customers. It doesn't mean I tell you to put on an> > illegal tx....or for that matter ONE WATT (read that> > repeatedly throughout the last several> > threads!)....................................Take a well> > built FM transmitter with 100 mW and use a simple piece of> > > wire; and what you get is.....well, a nice solid signal> but> > not a lot of distance.......If you can reign it in or not> > interfere, you have no problem.If you take this same> > transmitter and interfere with a Class C; you have a> > problem.............So lets get real here; I never> > advocated on this board that part 15'ers need to go> pirate; > > what I said was that you can improve your signal, stay> > legal, and have what amounts to a radio station you can> call> > your own...perhaps a business....perhaps a> > service...whatever you like.......but to retain the> ability> > to put part 15 stations on the air, we need to obey the> > rules..............Putting on any one watt station, AM or> > FM...if enough of you do this, our privaledge will be> taken> > away immediately. So, please don't do that, and keep> legal> > and DO serve your community!!! Put on your AM...put on> your> > FM...I encourage it!!But don't get in trouble, do it right> > > and email me if you want details on how to do it> > right............The benefits of community radio are> > immense: the ability to broadcast local church services> or> > thier information, to talk about what your town is doing,> to> > broadcast music that can't be heard in your town...all are> > > great reasons to be part 15 broadcasters.Do your homework> > and do it [email protected]> > > > Carl... I'm like the guy looking for all info relating to a> subject before he buys a car, house, etc.> > Now no where do I say I want to get a 1 watt transmitter or> anything close to it, what I want to know is if I want to> put the EDM 50mw tranmitter at say 100' up... will the> signal at the bottom of the antenna be 250 uv/m to meet the> rule or does the transmitter need to be 100mw, 500mw, 1> watt, etc. to meet the rule? Sure 10mw is good outside of> the homes, but will the signal be strong enough to penetrate> homes say 1/4 mile away or will only those in cars hear the> signal? I was only seeking info, before I buy any> transmitter or put one up to the test. > > There is alot of good info from you Carl, Radiobrandy, Rev.> Chrysafis, and a host of other honest good folks here and I> surely did not intend to offend anyone here... rather just> wanting to here it from the FCC guys, and there's no blowing> any cover as these are regular working folks, engineers,> techs, etc. and perhaps have their own Part15 setups...> > Radiopilot> The thread I started began to look like I not only advocated pirate radio(due to posters who turned it all around), but promoted it. And that is not the case.............Best thing to do, shoot me an email at [email protected] and I will fill you in on my installation. I just began with FM so I'm experimenting with it........But as far as I can advise just now, putting up a 10mW unit with antenna low to the ground and not interferring with anyone will more than likely not get you into any trouble. You put the EDM 100 up 100 feet and you have a class A station (on a very very clear frequency)....and then, that can change with antenna, how it is hooked up, loss in dB inside coax, etc.So, not blaming anyone; I love the discussions and I think they should take place, but I don't need the responsibility for anyone getting in trouble due to a post I made and the resulting posts to it.Carl<P ID="signature">______________
[email protected], [email protected],[email protected]</P>
 
Re: Radiopilot; I wasn't singling YOU out!!.....

Carl... I'm like the guy
> looking for all info relating to a> subject before he buys a
> car, house, etc.> > Now no where do I say I want to get a 1
> watt transmitter or> anything close to it, what I want to
> know is if I want to> put the EDM 50mw tranmitter at say
> 100' up... will the> signal at the bottom of the antenna be
> 250 uv/m to meet the> rule or does the transmitter need to
> be 100mw, 500mw, 1> watt, etc. to meet the rule? Sure 10mw
> is good outside of> the homes, but will the signal be strong
> enough to penetrate> homes say 1/4 mile away or will only
> those in cars hear the> signal? I was only seeking info,
> before I buy any> transmitter or put one up to the test. > >
> There is alot of good info from you Carl, Radiobrandy, Rev.>
> Chrysafis, and a host of other honest good folks here and I>
> surely did not intend to offend anyone here... rather just>
> wanting to here it from the FCC guys, and there's no
> blowing> any cover as these are regular working folks,
> engineers,> techs, etc. and perhaps have their own Part15
> setups...> > Radiopilot> The thread I started began to look
> like I not only advocated pirate radio(due to posters who
> turned it all around), but promoted it. And that is not the
> case.............Best thing to do, shoot me an email at
> [email protected] and I will fill you in on my
> installation. I just began with FM so I'm experimenting
> with it........But as far as I can advise just now, putting
> up a 10mW unit with antenna low to the ground and not
> interferring with anyone will more than likely not get you
> into any trouble. You put the EDM 100 up 100 feet and you
> have a class A station (on a very very clear
> frequency)....and then, that can change with antenna, how it
> is hooked up, loss in dB inside coax, etc.So, not blaming
> anyone; I love the discussions and I think they should take
> place, but I don't need the responsibility for anyone
> getting in trouble due to a post I made and the resulting
> posts to it.Carl


Carl... My discussions here on this board or any other board is not meant to single anyone out or accuse anyone or blast anyone. Rather I treat it more of a round table discussion where we all bring ideas to the table and discuss it, toss it around, experiment and bring data to the table that everyone can use....

I know you don't want anyone to break any rules or laws here, neither do I, but just asking the questions that bring out the true meaning of the intent of the Part15 rules.. Remember at one time people thought that Part15 kits were illegal... well we dispelled that myth quickly... even though there are still diehards that believe it's still illegal!

What I want is the FCC to tell me in plain words... a 10mw, 100mw, or 1 watt, or for that matter 1000 watt transmitter is not what we measure but 250uv/m at 3 meters is what we measure... that is pretty simple... What the thread stated is that if the transmitter is 100' high what is the uv/m at the ground level if the FCC agent were to measure it!

This was all I ask... and if I had the test equipment to measure it I'd do it and finally get my answer... till then we really don't know the answer because no installation of an FM transmitter is going to be setup with a simple telescoping antenna sitting on someone's desk, transmitting 10mw's and call it a community radio station.. try as they might it'll be a 50'-100' range and that just won't do but for backyard/patio listening....

Radiopilot
 
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