Just checking the trends...

[smedge2006]

No sign of 1160 WCFO or 1690 WMLB the "Voice of the Arts"...

That business radio format is sure raking in the listeners...

 

[RandomGuy6]

"Business Radio" formats are all about that: BUSINESS. Revenue over ratings is the mantra. As long as there are emough listeners who patronize the customers who buy the time, and management couldn't care less about ratings.

 

[Bubba2112]

"Business Radio" formats are all about that: BUSINESS. Revenue over ratings is the mantra. As long as there are emough listeners who patronize the customers who buy the time, and management couldn't care less about ratings.

Too tough a concept for the folks that think some 18 year old kid is going to be able to actually BUY the 1.4 million dollar house I build. Come on dude, what are you thinking? It's ALL about the 18-34 year old "demographic". If they don't understand it, it doesn't exist.

Of course if we all bought into THAT "philosophy" we would be eating dog poo poo every meal because 10 bajillion flies COULDN'T be wrong could they?

 

[RandomGuy6]

Uh, "dude", why don't you stick to the topics that you know something about?

Stations that actually go after listeners and ratings, go after the money demographic of Adults 25-54. Those are the folks advertisers think hold all the green (although researchers would argue that the folks 50-65 have the kind of cash to make customers salivate).

Stations that broker their time don't give a rat's hairy behind about how many people are listening, so long as their clients a) stay on the air and b) keep paying their bills. That happens when enough of the people listening patronize that business/buy that product. The best example are those stations that play the 15 minute and half hour religious programs. "preachin' and teachin'" they call it. Stations can make mad cash with that kind of stuff. As long as the listeners donate to the church/pastor, they stay on the air, and keep paying for the time.

Stations that sell spots (commercials to you) need listeners, because ad rates are directly related to ratings. Those that sell PROGRAMS are all about the clients and how much money they're making.

 

[evnlee]

No sign of 1160 WCFO or 1690 WMLB the "Voice of the Arts"...

That business radio format is sure raking in the listeners...

Of course, Smedge uses a 'trend' not a full book. Wanna know why? Err Amerika failed to make the Arby's and so has WMLB. Basically they have remained flat. However, WMLB bills a ton more then WWAA used to. That's a fact.

http://www.radioandrecords.com/radiomonitor/ratings/index.jsp

 

[amlover]

WCFO bills a ton! Says who? They have a handful of advertisers that are on because they are friends of the management. One advertiser is even a trade out, hardly enough to pay the power bill on the transmitter for 1160. The cost of keeping WCFO on the air is enormous and to say they are breaking even is a long shot. Even though most of the programing is satellite fed with exceptions on the weekends they do not have brokered time,only a few and the ones they have really suck and boring as hell. The only ones listening are the ones paying for the shows. WMLB-1690...Same thing! A joke! Just an expensive ipod for the owner.

 

[evnlee]

WCFO bills a ton! Says who? The only ones listening are the ones paying for the shows. WMLB-1690...Same thing! A joke! Just an expensive ipod for the owner.

I said they bill a ton more then WWAA, Air America. That is a fact. WWAA didn't even have a sales staff, and they were still looking when they were bought. WMLB may be an 'expensive Ipod', but they definitely bill more then WWAA did.

Perhaps if the few Err Amerika fans that did listen would pony up some $$$, they might still be on the air like in Phoenix and Madison. At least the few listening to WMLB did! ;D

 

[amlover]

AM-1690 was put on the air to be sold in the first place and was country when it came on the air and becoming Air America later. Making a lot of money was not really a big concern for the owners except the sale of the station. It cost about 6 million to put on the air and sold it for 12 million cash. Pretty good profit for a station not billing as you point out. Also when WWAA-1690 was Air America it did show up in the ratings something it will NEVER do with it's current ownership and silly programing. When AM-1160 then WMLB was MOYL it showed in the ratings also, a 0.4 not screaming numbers by any means but if it had been given the chance would have held it's own and been a better draw to advertisers. The current format of business talk will never amount to anything and will never have any ratings PERIOD. I just wonder how long Joe will continue to throw his money away.

 

[taylorengineer]

I find it interesting that most ads on 1690 are for retirement homes! Is there no market for "esoterica" anymore? I would think the demos skew educated 34-54.
I thought WCFO was all brokered time for the snakeoil salesmen who peddle "swami stock future" software.(I know one of the guys, Phil "are you nuts" Grandy used to pay WGUN to run his show a few years back.)
There is a ready and willing market for brokered time....my guess is Jeff Davis, GM of WCFO/WMLB, is milking it for all it's worth....and makin' plenty!

 

[wooder]

First, whoever pointed out that 25-54 is a much more desirable demo than 18-34 is dead on. Anybody who thinks otherwise simply doesn't know jack about the business. Most advertisers would rather have their message heard by 50 38-year old P1's than 100 22-year old P1's...unless you're a night club.
Second, I find it funny that there are morons on this board who think they have a better business sense than a guy like Joe Weber, who has made MILLIONS making good business decisions. I guarantee you his stations turn a profit. Even though he does it for a hobby, guys like him don't do things to lose money.

 

[amlover]

Joe inherited his money making business that was already established and ran it and then sold it for a nice profit. Good business there, but running a radio station well that's a different story. They are there for his ego. The stations are not taking bags of money to the bank either. If they were they would not tell employees they were not. Trust me, they are spending a lot more than they are taking in and even a moron knows that. I'd be willing to bet also that WGUN takes in more money than 1160 and 1690 combined and has more listeners. Anyway enough said about those horrible radio stations.

 

[evnlee]

First, whoever pointed out that 25-54 is a much more desirable demo than 18-34 is dead on. Anybody who thinks otherwise simply doesn't know jack about the business. Most advertisers would rather have their message heard by 50 38-year old P1's than 100 22-year old P1's...unless you're a night club.
Second, I find it funny that there are morons on this board who think they have a better business sense than a guy like Joe Weber, who has made MILLIONS making good business decisions. I guarantee you his stations turn a profit. Even though he does it for a hobby, guys like him don't do things to lose money.

significantly, news/talk formats skew older then most other radio formats, that is true. That's why you hear so many 'viagra' and 'invest in gold' commercials on the N/T stations.


Am lover states : Trust me, they are spending a lot more than they are taking in and even a moron knows that."

Really? please provide some proof of that statement. Weber may have inheirited his $$$, but he didn't screw the pooch, and lose it all like so many others have. He sold his business for a tidy profit, and anyone who says this guy is 'stupid' ought to look in the mirror.

While MOYL did do better in the ratings, Air America did not. They did not 'outperform' WMLB. They did about the same.I cant find WWAA busting in on RnR, and I don't have access to the Arby's.

The big question here is : for all you disenfranchised Air America moonbats, why didn't you try to save AAR? You could have done it, you know. The model is out there, you only have to look for it.A little organization and $$$, and it might still be on the air.

Try not to hate too much this holiday. Weber may not be your cup of tea, but he's not uriniating in the punchbowl

 

[Jay F]

I see a few threads on this ATL board claiming that 18-34 is the big demo in radio. That is just plain wrong. 25-54 (and various subsets of 25-54, females 25-49 for example) is the money demo.

Every market has these type of time brokered AMs. These stations don't care about ratings at all, they don't even subscribe to Arbitron. They are not trying to be one of the top billers in the market, they are simply trying to make a profit. It should be taken for granted that they will barely show up (or pull a no-show) in the ratings.

A discussion about ratings is much more interesting when the stations being discussed are actually trying to get ratings.

When I look at the ATL trends here are some of the stories I see...The RIVER is trending down, will they ever again have the numbers they signed on with or was that just "curiosity cume"?

A station people on this board tend to dislike, the BEAT, is at their highest level ever. Any theories why? STAR is at one of their lowest levels ever, any theories why?

 

[radioriot7]

I was reading this ridiculous thread, and FINALLY someone actually mentioned the trends and a few observations - not arguing about AM stations no one listens to.

Rodney or someone, can you post an overview of the last trend please? Is the River slipping, is Star fading, how did the Buzz do on their last trend at 105.3?

Ohh, and can someone please explain why you'd put a "listen at work" type format on a frequency (96.7) that can't penatrate a building or a house or anything really?

 

[smedge2006]

Try not to hate too much this holiday. Weber may not be your cup of tea, but he's not uriniating in the punchbowl

Considering his programming, I think anyone who drinks from Weber's punchbowl risks a DUI arrest. ;D

 

[rodneyho]

I don't tend to take trends seriously because they are unweighted but yes, stations such as Viva, Star, 96rock and the River are down while Jazz, the Beat and V-103 are way up. We can make a more intelligent analysis when the fall book comes out next month.

 

[artiemad]

It's true the numbers will shit a bit after each month is weighted, but it'll sure be interesting to see how it all turns out with all the changes made during the Fall book. We'll have to wait till Winter is released in April to see the effect of the Bull, Project, Lite etc.
Stations trending up with two phases of the Fall released are 750, B98, Kiss, Kicks, Lite, Star, Dave in the 25-54 demo, those trending down include the River, V, 96, Jazz. The Beat is up big 18-34, V down, 99X down to flat, 96 way down, Star up, Buzz up, Q up. The full fall story coming soon.

 

[evnlee]

Try not to hate too much this holiday. Weber may not be your cup of tea, but he's not uriniating in the punchbowl

Considering his programming, I think anyone who drinks from Weber's punchbowl risks a DUI arrest. ;D

You may be right, but at least he had a punchbowl. Poor WWAA only had a 'toiletbowl'

When will Franken get flushed? Will you mourn, Smedge?

 

[Bubba2112]

Uh, "dude", why don't you stick to the topics that you know something about?

Stations that actually go after listeners and ratings, go after the money demographic of Adults 25-54. Those are the folks advertisers think hold all the green (although researchers would argue that the folks 50-65 have the kind of cash to make customers salivate).

Stations that broker their time don't give a rat's hairy behind about how many people are listening, so long as their clients a) stay on the air and b) keep paying their bills. That happens when enough of the people listening patronize that business/buy that product. The best example are those stations that play the 15 minute and half hour religious programs. "preachin' and teachin'" they call it. Stations can make mad cash with that kind of stuff. As long as the listeners donate to the church/pastor, they stay on the air, and keep paying for the time.

Stations that sell spots (commercials to you) need listeners, because ad rates are directly related to ratings. Those that sell PROGRAMS are all about the clients and how much money they're making.

Ummmmmmm Dude? I was agreeing with you. Did I use a word or two that was too big? LOL Don't sweat me, we are talking the same thing. Guess you missed my sarcasm. I don't know how since sarcasm is about the lowest form of humor...........