When and why did WKBW change its calls to WWKB? They are calling themselves WKBW and use WWKB only during the offical ID on the hour. I live in NYC and get it loud and clear with some fading on most nights.
-
Get involved.
We want your input!
Apply for Membership and join the conversations about everything related to broadcasting.
After we receive your registration, a moderator will review it. After your registration is approved, you will be permitted to post.
If you use a disposable or false email address, your registration will be rejected.
After your membership is approved, please take a minute to tell us a little bit about yourself.
https://www.radiodiscussions.com/forums/introduce-yourself.1088/
Thanks in advance and have fun!
RadioDiscussions Administrators
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
KB-1520 question
- Thread starter BruceS8852
- Start date
> When and why did WKBW change its calls to WWKB? They are
> calling themselves WKBW and use WWKB only during the offical
> ID on the hour. I live in NYC and get it loud and clear
> with some fading on most nights.
>
The calls changed in 1986 when Capitol Cities sold WKBW radio and TV to separate owners and for some reason TV got to keep the calls. I've heard that radio tried to keep the call letters since channel 7 only used them in the top of the hour legal ID's but TV refused (or wanted more than radio was willing to give them). The indignities for a once great radio station weren't over because then came Price Communications and a certain GM (no names mentioned) that couldn't see the forest for the trees and insisted that Business Talk was the format to go with. He actually even wanted to change the calls to WBZT but was talked out of it by some folks with some foresight. To make a long sad story short, KB has been a sleeping giant since 1988.
> calling themselves WKBW and use WWKB only during the offical
> ID on the hour. I live in NYC and get it loud and clear
> with some fading on most nights.
>
The calls changed in 1986 when Capitol Cities sold WKBW radio and TV to separate owners and for some reason TV got to keep the calls. I've heard that radio tried to keep the call letters since channel 7 only used them in the top of the hour legal ID's but TV refused (or wanted more than radio was willing to give them). The indignities for a once great radio station weren't over because then came Price Communications and a certain GM (no names mentioned) that couldn't see the forest for the trees and insisted that Business Talk was the format to go with. He actually even wanted to change the calls to WBZT but was talked out of it by some folks with some foresight. To make a long sad story short, KB has been a sleeping giant since 1988.
> The calls changed in 1986 when Capitol Cities sold WKBW
> radio and TV to separate owners and for some reason TV got
> to keep the calls. I've heard that radio tried to keep the
> call letters since channel 7 only used them in the top of
> the hour legal ID's but TV refused (or wanted more than
> radio was willing to give them). The indignities for a once
> great radio station weren't over because then came Price
> Communications and a certain GM (no names mentioned) that
> couldn't see the forest for the trees and insisted that
> Business Talk was the format to go with. He actually even
> wanted to change the calls to WBZT but was talked out of it
> by some folks with some foresight. To make a long sad story
> short, KB has been a sleeping giant since 1988.
>
There may even be some history here: www.rockradioscrapbook.com/
<P ID="signature">______________
"If you never say NO, How much is your YES worth?"
</P>
> radio and TV to separate owners and for some reason TV got
> to keep the calls. I've heard that radio tried to keep the
> call letters since channel 7 only used them in the top of
> the hour legal ID's but TV refused (or wanted more than
> radio was willing to give them). The indignities for a once
> great radio station weren't over because then came Price
> Communications and a certain GM (no names mentioned) that
> couldn't see the forest for the trees and insisted that
> Business Talk was the format to go with. He actually even
> wanted to change the calls to WBZT but was talked out of it
> by some folks with some foresight. To make a long sad story
> short, KB has been a sleeping giant since 1988.
>
There may even be some history here: www.rockradioscrapbook.com/
<P ID="signature">______________
"If you never say NO, How much is your YES worth?"
</P>
This was also part of Bob Price's strategy to acquire those stations cheap. I don't remember what the sale price of 1520 without the WKBW call letters was, but considering, it was a steal. Price did the same thing with KOB in Albuquerque...relinquishing the call sign to the TV, and making the 50 clear AM KKOB.
When Sandy Beach left, I became Program Direcor of the new WWKB for six agonizingly long months in which:
1) KB alienated its core audience shooting Tom Shannon and Oldies in midday, in favor of a talk show hosted by a refugee from Public Radio. They gave this person and his producer carte blanche, and the PD had no line authority to them or any say in how the program sounded.
2) The station affiliated with The NY Yankees.
3) The station's manager, who had previously worked at a 50 clear in San Francisco and out of radio for the preceding 10 years, had no plan or strategy for the station.
4) The Exec. VP of the company, who'd hired the GM, sent in a consultant who took the station's on air library and trimmed it down to 141 songs.
5) When Price finally got wind of what was going on, the GM was fired...along with everyone he hired and everything he did.
This was Price's entry into the market.
When Sandy Beach left, I became Program Direcor of the new WWKB for six agonizingly long months in which:
1) KB alienated its core audience shooting Tom Shannon and Oldies in midday, in favor of a talk show hosted by a refugee from Public Radio. They gave this person and his producer carte blanche, and the PD had no line authority to them or any say in how the program sounded.
2) The station affiliated with The NY Yankees.
3) The station's manager, who had previously worked at a 50 clear in San Francisco and out of radio for the preceding 10 years, had no plan or strategy for the station.
4) The Exec. VP of the company, who'd hired the GM, sent in a consultant who took the station's on air library and trimmed it down to 141 songs.
5) When Price finally got wind of what was going on, the GM was fired...along with everyone he hired and everything he did.
This was Price's entry into the market.
As for today, the station would have to get permission from KB TV to change the calls to WKBW; it is my understanding that TV is either still reluctant to do that or just wants too much money, which is probably the case (did you know they almost lost the film "Bruce Almighty" to channel 2 because they were simply trying to hold up the movie company for too much? Apparently they didn't care or understand how much publicity they could generate by setting the film at their television studios. Had Jim Carrey not insisted on the movie being set at channel 7...because that's the station where he watched Eyewitness News growing up in Ontario, the movie would have ended up taking place at channel 2).
Anyway...the regulations (or lack of them) allow radio stations to call themselves anything they want during the hour, but they have to use their actual call letters at the top of each hour for a legal ID. Hence KB's use of the old WKBW jingles.
Although you should have noticed that the new IDs and live references are only for "KB Radio 1520".
Anyway...the regulations (or lack of them) allow radio stations to call themselves anything they want during the hour, but they have to use their actual call letters at the top of each hour for a legal ID. Hence KB's use of the old WKBW jingles.
Although you should have noticed that the new IDs and live references are only for "KB Radio 1520".
>
> This was Price's entry into the market.
>
A dreadful period in the station's history, no malice toward your role in it. The whole scenario is textbook MBA 'what NOT to do' while managing a radio station.
That talk show was dreadful. Almost funny, if it wasn't so sad. To be truthful, Shannon's act in middays wasn't setting the world on fire, but it was vastly superior to the amateurish drivel of that talk show.
The Yankees on radio was the nail in the coffin. Just bad. I often wonder if radio managers realize there are as many Yankees HATERS in Western New York as there are Yankees fans.
Your only consolation might be that this story gets repeated a few times every year at radio stations throughout America. Small consolation.
> This was Price's entry into the market.
>
A dreadful period in the station's history, no malice toward your role in it. The whole scenario is textbook MBA 'what NOT to do' while managing a radio station.
That talk show was dreadful. Almost funny, if it wasn't so sad. To be truthful, Shannon's act in middays wasn't setting the world on fire, but it was vastly superior to the amateurish drivel of that talk show.
The Yankees on radio was the nail in the coffin. Just bad. I often wonder if radio managers realize there are as many Yankees HATERS in Western New York as there are Yankees fans.
Your only consolation might be that this story gets repeated a few times every year at radio stations throughout America. Small consolation.
M
mike704
Guest
Thanks for relaying that painful memory. Even if the station had done everything right it would be an uphill battle against the FM stations. Buffalo's major AM's WGR, WBEN, WKBW put up a good fight long after many AM's were dead or dying. Add to this the Buffalo market itself was shrinking.
Was Dan Kelly there at the time? I worked with him at WSOC-AM in Charlotte. I know he left for KB. Lokks like Dan had the bad fortune to work at dying AM stations.
The change from WKBW to WWKB was probably the best they could do They should have changed the TV stations calls but that's not the first time the TV station got the heritage calls. WIS Columbia,SC comes to mind. The radio station was one of the last to get a 3 letter call. The radio changed to WVOC, not even close.
Radio management and programming....science,art, or show biz?
MikeM
> This was also part of Bob Price's strategy to acquire those
> stations cheap. I don't remember what the sale price of 1520
> without the WKBW call letters was, but considering, it was a
> steal. Price did the same thing with KOB in
> Albuquerque...relinquishing the call sign to the TV, and
> making the 50 clear AM KKOB.
>
> When Sandy Beach left, I became Program Direcor of the new
> WWKB for six agonizingly long months in which:
>
> 1) KB alienated its core audience shooting Tom Shannon and
> Oldies in midday, in favor of a talk show hosted by a
> refugee from Public Radio. They gave this person and his
> producer carte blanche, and the PD had no line authority to
> them or any say in how the program sounded.
> 2) The station affiliated with The NY Yankees.
> 3) The station's manager, who had previously worked at a 50
> clear in San Francisco and out of radio for the preceding 10
> years, had no plan or strategy for the station.
> 4) The Exec. VP of the company, who'd hired the GM, sent in
> a consultant who took the station's on air library and
> trimmed it down to 141 songs.
> 5) When Price finally got wind of what was going on, the GM
> was fired...along with everyone he hired and everything he
> did.
>
> This was Price's entry into the market.
>
Was Dan Kelly there at the time? I worked with him at WSOC-AM in Charlotte. I know he left for KB. Lokks like Dan had the bad fortune to work at dying AM stations.
The change from WKBW to WWKB was probably the best they could do They should have changed the TV stations calls but that's not the first time the TV station got the heritage calls. WIS Columbia,SC comes to mind. The radio station was one of the last to get a 3 letter call. The radio changed to WVOC, not even close.
Radio management and programming....science,art, or show biz?
MikeM
> This was also part of Bob Price's strategy to acquire those
> stations cheap. I don't remember what the sale price of 1520
> without the WKBW call letters was, but considering, it was a
> steal. Price did the same thing with KOB in
> Albuquerque...relinquishing the call sign to the TV, and
> making the 50 clear AM KKOB.
>
> When Sandy Beach left, I became Program Direcor of the new
> WWKB for six agonizingly long months in which:
>
> 1) KB alienated its core audience shooting Tom Shannon and
> Oldies in midday, in favor of a talk show hosted by a
> refugee from Public Radio. They gave this person and his
> producer carte blanche, and the PD had no line authority to
> them or any say in how the program sounded.
> 2) The station affiliated with The NY Yankees.
> 3) The station's manager, who had previously worked at a 50
> clear in San Francisco and out of radio for the preceding 10
> years, had no plan or strategy for the station.
> 4) The Exec. VP of the company, who'd hired the GM, sent in
> a consultant who took the station's on air library and
> trimmed it down to 141 songs.
> 5) When Price finally got wind of what was going on, the GM
> was fired...along with everyone he hired and everything he
> did.
>
> This was Price's entry into the market.
>
Can the owners of a TV station really prevent the owners of a
radio station from using the same call letters? Is there
actually a rule about this. Seems a radio station and TV station
with different owners could still use the same calls, afterall,
it's two completely different broadcast mediums. Perhaps there
was some agreement made between the parties, but it seems unlikely
there's an FCC rule on this. Does anyone know?
> > When and why did WKBW change its calls to WWKB? They are
> > calling themselves WKBW and use WWKB only during the
> offical
> > ID on the hour. I live in NYC and get it loud and clear
> > with some fading on most nights.
> >
>
> The calls changed in 1986 when Capitol Cities sold WKBW
> radio and TV to separate owners and for some reason TV got
> to keep the calls. I've heard that radio tried to keep the
> call letters since channel 7 only used them in the top of
> the hour legal ID's but TV refused (or wanted more than
> radio was willing to give them). The indignities for a once
> great radio station weren't over because then came Price
> Communications and a certain GM (no names mentioned) that
> couldn't see the forest for the trees and insisted that
> Business Talk was the format to go with. He actually even
> wanted to change the calls to WBZT but was talked out of it
> by some folks with some foresight. To make a long sad story
> short, KB has been a sleeping giant since 1988.
>
radio station from using the same call letters? Is there
actually a rule about this. Seems a radio station and TV station
with different owners could still use the same calls, afterall,
it's two completely different broadcast mediums. Perhaps there
was some agreement made between the parties, but it seems unlikely
there's an FCC rule on this. Does anyone know?
> > When and why did WKBW change its calls to WWKB? They are
> > calling themselves WKBW and use WWKB only during the
> offical
> > ID on the hour. I live in NYC and get it loud and clear
> > with some fading on most nights.
> >
>
> The calls changed in 1986 when Capitol Cities sold WKBW
> radio and TV to separate owners and for some reason TV got
> to keep the calls. I've heard that radio tried to keep the
> call letters since channel 7 only used them in the top of
> the hour legal ID's but TV refused (or wanted more than
> radio was willing to give them). The indignities for a once
> great radio station weren't over because then came Price
> Communications and a certain GM (no names mentioned) that
> couldn't see the forest for the trees and insisted that
> Business Talk was the format to go with. He actually even
> wanted to change the calls to WBZT but was talked out of it
> by some folks with some foresight. To make a long sad story
> short, KB has been a sleeping giant since 1988.
>
- Status
- This thread has been closed due to inactivity. You can create a new thread to discuss this topic.