KFOG hasn't been AAA for a long time. The real KFOG died a long time ago. The last few years have been plagued by ineptitude and mismanagement. Cumulus destroyed this station. KFOG had a passionate listener base that actually cared about Radio. Yes, we know the demos were getting older. The end of KFOG is another example of Radios Death Spiral. When no one cares about your product anymore, The jig is up...
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KFOG Flips To KNBR Simulcast
- Thread starter TheBigA
- Start date
KFOG hasn't been AAA for a long time. The real KFOG died a long time ago. The last few years have been plagued by ineptitude and mismanagement. Cumulus destroyed this station. KFOG had a passionate listener base that actually cared about Radio. Yes, we know the demos were getting older. The end of KFOG is another example of Radios Death Spiral. When no one cares about your product anymore, The jig is up...
I look at stations like KBCO and WXRT as examples of AAA stations that can and have successfully evolved with their changing audience. The few time I heard KFOG on visits to San Francisco, it sounded like a station that was stuck in a time warp.
In a way, but it's similar to what happened at KGO. The station never evolved or attracted new listeners, it just stayed with the same base, until that base aged out of the demo. You can't wait that long to make changes. You have to work them in along the way. They didn't do that out of fear of alienating the base, and then it was too late. The only thing left is blow it up and start over, because you can never recreate what was there before. It's like thinking a facelift or Botox can postpone death. It can't.
In the Case of KGO under Citadel and Cumulus leadership they had to deal with NPR affiliate KQED-FM getting the news talk audience away from them though and it was around the time PPM came out though a decade ago.
Sadly this is not the 1980's and 1990's anymore where you can argue FM is for music and AM for news talk and sports. In this decade it's apps on your phone or dashboard for music and FM for News Talk and sports at this point.
But that is proven true in San Francisco and Washington DC where the NPR News/talk affiliate competes against All news for the top spot.
In Los Angeles Ihearts top Music station is CHR KIIS-FM.
This has been a long time coming and came as a result of tons of bad decisions. The confusion on whether it was AAA or Alt. itself wasn't the problem, the problem was a ton of bad decisions from management over the past decade.
First, they got rid of Dave Benson and pretty much just left the station on auto pilot for a few years. They added new songs like once every two months, and became extremely boring and repetitive (i.e. they hung onto The Fray - "You Found Me" for like two years as a current.)
I thought KFOG might have had another chance when they brought on Dennis Constantine. He made the playlist sound fresh, got the station a newer demo, and got the ratings back to upper 2's/low 3's. Firing him was an incredibly stupid and inept decision.
Then, after hiring a revolving door of PDs whose names I don't remember (because they played nothing but mind-numbingly bland and boring ****) and basically giving listeners no reason to listen, they somehow thought that firing the DJs (which was the main reason the listeners stayed around) would be the key to success rather than making the music interesting.
In a seemingly last ditch effort to be relevant, they hired Mat Bates who actually did make it sound good one last time. I'm not sure if that was by Cumulus's design or if Bates just went rogue and decided to make the station sound good, but for a few months it sounded like a very listenable Pandora playlist. But by that point it was just too little too late, ratings-wise. Nothing could save their ratings anymore.
Then in an incredibly stupid final move that I really think was intended to be the final nail in the coffin, they decided to clone Live 105. And here we are.
First, they got rid of Dave Benson and pretty much just left the station on auto pilot for a few years. They added new songs like once every two months, and became extremely boring and repetitive (i.e. they hung onto The Fray - "You Found Me" for like two years as a current.)
I thought KFOG might have had another chance when they brought on Dennis Constantine. He made the playlist sound fresh, got the station a newer demo, and got the ratings back to upper 2's/low 3's. Firing him was an incredibly stupid and inept decision.
Then, after hiring a revolving door of PDs whose names I don't remember (because they played nothing but mind-numbingly bland and boring ****) and basically giving listeners no reason to listen, they somehow thought that firing the DJs (which was the main reason the listeners stayed around) would be the key to success rather than making the music interesting.
In a seemingly last ditch effort to be relevant, they hired Mat Bates who actually did make it sound good one last time. I'm not sure if that was by Cumulus's design or if Bates just went rogue and decided to make the station sound good, but for a few months it sounded like a very listenable Pandora playlist. But by that point it was just too little too late, ratings-wise. Nothing could save their ratings anymore.
Then in an incredibly stupid final move that I really think was intended to be the final nail in the coffin, they decided to clone Live 105. And here we are.
Management is typically reactive. They see the demos are going up, they see costs are going up, and they react, usually without all of the facts. How can we make a quick fix that doesn't completely blow everything up. The problem was there really were underlying problems with the changing audience dynamic that wasn't as noticeable from the demographics. What I mean is in the way the audience perceived radio, and used it. The older folks, the ones who had been there in the 80s, were more likely to see radio as part of a community, because that's what it was, from the days of KMPX and early KSAN, to then KFOG. But as we got into the 2000s, the audience perception of radio changed. Music was changing too, and the way people used music changed once downloading replaced purchase. Call it the Music-Media complex. At one time, they were intertwined. MTV was part of it too. Those who came in during the 60s, 70s, and 80s understood this. Those who came in later didn't. So this was sociological, and it was most apparent in the AAA/alternative format. When you look at AAA or Americana radio stations today, their audience is mainly from that earlier era. But that audience is too old for commercial radio, so that had to change. The new younger demos didn't have the same passion for radio, they just wanted to hear their favorite songs or bands. It's the Napster mentality. So as others have said, this change was a long time coming. Management couldn't see that you can't fix or change human nature. People will do what they want to do. If you don't give them what they want, they'll just go someplace else. We're seeing the same thing with MTV. The audience that once was there has gone, and the new audience wants something else, and they're very transactional. So it's likely at some point we'll see the same realization hit MTV.
The hip younger demos didn't care about the new KFOG or Radio. That's the paradox. The listeners that cared about KFOG and its legacy were no longer relevant (to ad agencies). The sports simulcast will generate no new revenue, passion or ratings. It just cuts costs. That gets you nowhere.
KFOG could have tried a "listener supported" approach for boomers, but Cumulus isn't known for forward thinking...
KFOG could have tried a "listener supported" approach for boomers, but Cumulus isn't known for forward thinking...
It will replace the declining audience for KNBR, since fewer sports fans are willing to listen to AM, so that will help revenues for that station. Clearly KNBR is the top revenue producer of all Cumulus stations in San Francisco. Nothing else comes close. So this will make the cluster itself more profitable.
I hate to break it to you but boomers are cheap. For all their talk about having lots of disposable income, they're very stingy. Most non-commercial stations find that 7% of the listeners donate. The majority of the revenue comes from corporate sponsorships. That means selling ads. And boomers hate ads. In its current state, I doubt KFOG could get many of its listeners to donate. So it's not really a profitable idea. I can't think of any examples of profit-making radio companies choosing a listener supported approach.
Interesting article:
http://www.insideradio.com/free/cum...cle_302ae332-c83b-11e9-bb81-a32721fb449a.html
Other companies might be willing to continue to format online or as an HD, but really, what's the point? There is no audience for what they're doing now. There might be a small audience for old tapes from the archives. I'm sure someone will do a fan tribute site at some point. Will they retain the call letters? Who cares?
The bad news is they have the radio rights to the 49ers, and while the audience is very dedicated, I don't anticipate them having a winning season.
One more thing: Some have talked about Cumulus looking to sell its major markets. This move today makes the SF cluster a lot more sellable.
Last year KFOG billed about 1/10th what KNBR bills. A little uptick in KNBR ratings and a commensurate increase in rates will more than make up for the loss of the KFOG format and revenue.
It is reported that KFOG was about 25th in revenue last year, just below Asian targeted AM KEST.
Who will buy Cumulus cluster in San Francisco? Since they owned 2 FM's and 4 AM stations in the market. (FM: KFOG 104.5, KSAN 107.7; AM: KSFO 560, KNBR 680, KGO 810, and KTCT 1050)
I could speculate if cumulus were to be sold I think Bonneville will probably take 104.5 KFOG 107.7 KSAN, 680 KNBR, 810 KGO, and 1050 KTCT. Bonneville could sell 98.5 signal since it will be over the 5 limit fm cap and Iheart media or Entercom could take KSFO 560 signal. (Just a hunch)
They were down to about 22nd in cume in the market, with stations like KVVF tying them. That is not a very big listener base... and as BigA says, Boomers are not strong supporters of things like this.
Actually, the end of KFOG simply signals the end of AAA as a viable format. It is also on the decline in Portland, mostly due to aging. Same in Chicago with WXRT. It is very much alive in Denver, but that station has a very strong community heritage going back to the late 70's when Bob Greenlee opperated it and had Dennis Constantine as PD.
But elsewhere, AAA is pretty much an aged out non-viable format.
MOR aged out. Beautiful Music aged out. Smooth Jazz aged out. Standards aged out. Oldies aged out. The formats ceased to be commercially viable. While each format may have had passionate listeners towards the end, advertisers had no interest in reaching them.
Adjusting to reality is part of radio's century worth of resilience. Dropping a format that was no longer viable and replacing it with one that is alive is just part of the cycle of change.
Dropping a no longer viable format is not a death spiral; it is a demonstration of agility in a changing media environment.
And adjusting to the reality of sharing listeners with new media... or even better, making new media offerings... is part of that same resilience.
The only thing worse than buying one AM today is buying two. The only thing worse than buying two AMs is...
Here's Sean Ross' take on today's announcement:
https://radioinsight.com/ross/180052/final-listen-kfog-san-francisco/
I might be misreading him, but he says that in the 90s and 00s, listeners from outside the area streamed the station. Not sure if that was at all possible in the 90s.
https://radioinsight.com/ross/180052/final-listen-kfog-san-francisco/
I might be misreading him, but he says that in the 90s and 00s, listeners from outside the area streamed the station. Not sure if that was at all possible in the 90s.
WOW.
That is nothing short of stunning!
Oddly enough - Cumulus just launched a new AAA station earlier this year. Granted, it's in a non-PPM market.
http://www.thisisqmusic.com/
[The station is largely modeled after its successful 107One in Ann Arbor. John Dickey tried hard to ruin that station years ago by firing its popular morning host. The President of the Bank of Ann Arbor - who also served as U-M's Athletic Director for several years - soon after called John Dickey's office, said he would cancel all advertising (and encourage his fellow businessmen to do the same) if Martin Bandyke wasn't re-hired immediately, and guess what happened? Mr. Bandyke was rehired!! He remains the morning man at WQKL to this very day.]
Listeners in the Bay Area who like the mid tempo contemporary pop music that passes for "Alternative" these days can at least take some solace in the fact 104.5's demise will almost assuredly make 105.3 a more resilient station.
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Strange you say this as there seems to be an article every year talking about the vibrancy and importance of the AAA format, whether as a tastemaker for new music or as a way to bring generations from Boomers to Millennials together. Is it wishful thinking or is this like the alternative format in the 80's, having ups and downs before a breakout moment?
WXRT was in a extremely KFOG-ish position a couple of years ago as they were the last defiant holdout when it came to alternative rock on AAA. They preferred to use the 60's/70's soft rock/AOR recurrents from their past as that's what their drying pool of listeners wanted. The new PD that took over after the Entercom merger saw an opening with The Loop gone and WKQX largely turning into a glorified pop station and took it. There is no rock station playing anything after 1990 with WKQX shifting to indie pop and the Loop gone so WXRT was going to play those songs and hope the audience was there. They had nothing left to lose.
WXRT has peaked as high as 1st in Chicago after incorporating artists like The Killers, The White Stripes, Garbage, STP, The Cure, Nirvana, Alice in Chains, Franz Ferdinand, etc. Into their playlist. They also discontinued some specialty programs that had been getting a miniscule but loyal audience for years. WXRT did sacrifice some of their loyal listeners by incorporating 90's/00's alt rock but not all of them, and they're solidly in the top 10 every month.
It helped that they didn't ditch all of their soft/AOR rock that the diehards cling to, and the playlist flows well enough that there's never a jarring transition.
WXRT has also been smart with song selection from the artists they added. You're not going to hear "Rooster" or "Again" by AIC, but "No Excuses", "Down in a Hole", and "Don't Follow", as an example. They did an appropriate amount of listening and research to figure out what songs would mesh well with their heritage.
Also, KFOG had switched from AAA to pure alternative, so if anything this reveals that San Francisco doesn't have room for more than one alternative-formatted station. In a city where two news stations are far and away the most popular stations the music stations are competing for scraps and you can't have two alternative stations cannibalizing each other.
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