Kjoi-lp 104.3

[mofocat]

I'm not sure that Christmas Tree Lane operation has been on the past few years. As far as those seemingly 'open' freeqs go - the FCC spacing requirements are SO STRICT- I think they (the spacing regs.) are BS but the existing licensees, aka the NAB, wants to keep it that way. It is easy to show that low power at low elevation (<100 watts @ <100ft.) is not any kind of interference threat when done right. Granted there has to be some guidelines to make sure it was done 'right', but the LPFM parameters are very restrictive: overkill.
There should be a license free "hobby" class less restrictive than the Part 15 limits. (Which is good for about 200ft.) Say, 10 watts at 10 meters HAAT. WITH the right to sell "dollar a holler" ads. A 1 mile radius neighborhood signal is not going to hurt the big boys. BUT there WILL be abusers and enforcement would be a burden.

Gary Cocola does run a LP FM on 100.7 during the holiday season in the area of Christmas Tree Lane, don't know what kind of license it has if any, But how about putting it on the tower at Radio Park on Clinton and repeat the programming of KJOI during the rest of the year.

Another idea is to have very low power repeaters say from 1-5 watts, in Clovis and South-East Fresno and at Radio Park, just a thought, if there are any open Frequencies, maybe 104.5, 92.5, 92.7, 94.7 and 95.1, since 104.3 is allowed to be adjacent to an Esom Point station, what about the rest up there.

 

[kenrayc]

I'm not sure that Christmas Tree Lane operation has been on the past few years. As far as those seemingly 'open' freeqs go - the FCC spacing requirements are SO STRICT- I think they (the spacing regs.) are BS but the existing licensees, aka the NAB, wants to keep it that way. It is easy to show that low power at low elevation (<100 watts @ <100ft.) is not any kind of interference threat when done right. Granted there has to be some guidelines to make sure it was done 'right', but the LPFM parameters are very restrictive: overkill.
There should be a license free "hobby" class less restrictive than the Part 15 limits. (Which is good for about 200ft.) Say, 10 watts at 10 meters HAAT. WITH the right to sell "dollar a holler" ads. A 1 mile radius neighborhood signal is not going to hurt the big boys. BUT there WILL be abusers and enforcement would be a burden.

Yes makes sense, the 30 mile (approx depending on class) 4 channel rule, It's interesting about the 94.3 Co-Channel repeater at the old KEAP stick on Valentine near Freeway 180, its at 265 watts and 200 ft. and only 3 channels from 93.7, but 93.7 is grandpa with it's 68,000 watts, so that must have been the exception.

 

[mofocat]

kenrayc said: "It's interesting about the 94.3 Co-Channel repeater at the old KEAP stick on Valentine near Freeway 180, its at 265 watts and 200 ft. and only 3 channels from 93.7, "
But that on-channel repeater is not allowed to 'extend' the signal of it's primary station beyond the contour of that primary station. Can only be a 'fill-in' booster. So it is not 'short spaced' to 2nd adjacent 93.7. The booster's coverage is completely contained WITHIN it's primary station's allowed coverage,
But that's a completely different subject from allowing a 'very-low-power', *non-interfering*, independent new signal on a channel not suitable for a higher power signal (100w LPFM or Class A).

 

[kenrayc]

kenrayc said: "It's interesting about the 94.3 Co-Channel repeater at the old KEAP stick on Valentine near Freeway 180, its at 265 watts and 200 ft. and only 3 channels from 93.7, "
But that on-channel repeater is not allowed to 'extend' the signal of it's primary station beyond the contour of that primary station. Can only be a 'fill-in' booster. So it is not 'short spaced' to 2nd adjacent 93.7. The booster's coverage is completely contained WITHIN it's primary station's allowed coverage,
But that's a completely different subject from allowing a 'very-low-power', *non-interfering*, independent new signal on a channel not suitable for a higher power signal (100w LPFM or Class A).

Okay I got it, so it fills in the shadow areas caused by buildings, and other objects on the edge of their coverage, in the Metro Fresno area, so what about other stations that have the same problem such as 103.7 north of Herndon, 105.5, 106.3 Kingsburg, and 95.3 Kerman? Can they do the same?

 

[MrZoom]

OK -- Thats use the correct terms. A "Repeater" or "Mobile-relay" are two-way radio terms. Not broadcast terms.

The correct term for an "ON Channel" FM station would be a "Booster" station, which is limited to an ERP of 20 % of the class of station that it "re-broadcasts". "Boosters are limited to the same co-channel as the main station.
A "translator" uses a different channel than that of the main station. Both a Booster or a translator may not extend the stations coverage area beyond the 60 dBu.
LPFM stations are NOT able to use a translator or a booster station because LPFM stations are limited to such a small coverage area.

 

[mofocat]

OK -- Thats use the correct terms. A "Repeater" or "Mobile-relay" are two-way radio terms. Not broadcast terms.

The correct term for an "ON Channel" FM station would be a "Booster"…. ... Both a Booster or a translator may not extend the stations coverage area beyond the 60 dBu.
LPFM stations are NOT able to use a translator or a booster station because LPFM stations are limited to such a small coverage area.

True statement as far as the 'originating' station is concerned; regarding the ownership of translators. HOWEVER, translators owned by someone else can carry a station, LPFM or 'full-power', far from the station's coverage area, or adjacent to it, to extend the originating station's coverage. Just look at the K/Love network of translators- some so far from the 'mother ship' that they are fed by satellite feeds.
More and more LPFMs are getting extended coverage by being carried on translators. KDRP-LP in Dripping Springs TX is heard in Austin via an Austin translator. Also, rules are different for NON-COMS vs. commercial stations.
Aside from all the rules and regs- I just think - and I am not an RF engineer - that there really isn't the need that would justify fill-in boosters in Fresno given the flat terrain.

 

[b-turner]

Several LPFM operators now own full power stations, choosing a fairly unique format and building some support before swooping in to buy a commercial FM or AM. In one instance, they were able to grab an NCE channel.

Right, you can't sell ads. They sell underwriting. Certainly some here haven't a clue about how non-profit, non-commercial stations operate. A local NCE here does 4.5 million on one of their stations. By comparison the top biller in the market is just north of 24 million.

Most LPFMs are run by folks with little if any radio experience and many times that experience is limited to on air and/or programming. Most are scared to death off doing sales and in time they tire (or their spouse) tires of funding the station.

For the record, a non-profit can be one person. Many applicants file in Delaware, for example. You don't have to be an IRS recognized non=profit, state approved works.

You can run only 1 LPFM but can have up to two translators and you can lease as many as you want. A success story is KDRP LP in Dripping Springs, Texas. They're showing up in the Austin ratings.

 

[mofocat]

Attn: b-turner re: "Several LPFM operators now own full power stations,..."; shouldn't you have said "several FORMER LPFM operators"? Can't have both. Divest the LPFM, then acquire a full power station. KDRP-LP was mentioned in the post just prior to yours.

 

[b-turner]

You are correct that a LPFM group cannot own anything beyond up to two translators but one LPFM operator simply created an additional entity to buy a non-comm full power FM they not only operate but simulcast programming on. Now they lease several translators, own two and then created a new organization from their LPFM non-profit to buy a NCE full power they operate.

 

[K.M. Richards]

You are correct that a LPFM group cannot own anything beyond up to two translators but one LPFM operator simply created an additional entity to buy a non-comm full power FM they not only operate but simulcast programming on. Now they lease several translators, own two and then created a new organization from their LPFM non-profit to buy a NCE full power they operate.

Then the second LPFM application should have been denied. The rules say that the governing boards of the non-profit organizations who are LPFM licensees cannot have shared members with other such non-profit LPFM license holders.

 

[b-turner]

They share no members. They started a second non-profit to acquire the NCE full power.

 

[MrZoom]

For the record -- a single person can NOT quilify under FCC rules as a Non-commercial. FCC and State Corp. rules are different. There is FCC case law rejecting several applications by a single person applicant as a non-commercial group.

New LPFM applicants must show their Incorporation as a valid Non-profit corporation or association.

 

[b-turner]

There are many licensed LPFMs run by 1 person non-profits. The case law deals with individuals not state recognized non-profit organizations comprised of one person. The FCC respects any State's certification for a non-profit. It would have to be a very odd case to be rejected (ie: no educational purpose). Yes, you have to show your state certification. In Delaware, Florida and several other states you can have that state certification as a one person non-profit...not in my state, but one of the LPFMs in this city is Delaware certified. I don't know of any FCC Rule that prohibits one person state certified non-profit organizations and I'd love to read that if there is such.