KPLZ is #1!!!

[semoochie]

With all the discussion of Star falling on hard times awhile back, I thought it was interesting that they should top the market, albeit in 6+. Nevertheless, a win is a win and a #1 ranked Hot AC might just be news!

 

[AQH]

With all the discussion of Star falling on hard times awhile back, I thought it was interesting that they should top the market, albeit in 6+. Nevertheless, a win is a win and a #1 ranked Hot AC might just be news!

Let's see, how many times has this board said that Kent & Alan are washed up, leave the building at 10:02 a.m., are too old and are boring?

Can't forget the times that many here insisted that they changed format, play too much Country or have gone CHR.

I'm sure there are other things mentioned about them that I am missing.

 

[SRP]

No kidding. Guess "old and boring" is the new moneymaker.

Congrats to Kent and the Star gang for a well-deserved win!

 

[345palm]

they have many things going for them: a quality LOCAL product, they deliver what you expect, and they have a LOCAL management structure that lets them do their jobs without a bunch of corporate tinkering and pressure from Back East. I wonder if the big shots at Clear Channel, CBS, Entercom, and Bonneville are paying attention to this formula?

 

[radioguy123]

KZOK number one 25-54 adults, KPLZ number two.
25-54 adults Mornings KPLZ number one, KZOK number two

25-54 men KZOK number one overall and mornings
25-54 women KPLZ number one overall and mornings

Speaks volumes about local radio and local personalities. KZOK and KPLZ may be the best examples of how to do radio well. Even if you don't like the formats, they do them well and with local morning, mid-day and afternoon shows and long-time local programmers who make the stations their own.

Congratulations to KPLZ for 6+ win
Congratulations to KPLZ and KZOK for the great wins 25-54.

 

[RadioEatsItsYoung]

No, speaks volumes about how much PPM has ruined radio. non-offensive, boring, background radio will win for years to come. say goodbye to anything with an edge and anything out of the box.

Doesn't matter if people are actively listening. It just matters that the station is on at a medium volume in their office, or doctors office, dentist office, etc.

 

[RadioRon]

Or maybe it's as simple as good radio trumps bad....don't go blaming it on PPM. Not saying that it's perfect, but do you really think that antiquated diary methodology is the way to go?

 

[RadioEatsItsYoung]

with all its faults, I absolutely think that diary was better. Here is my reasoning:

1) If the station isn't forefront enough for someone to write the name of the station down on a diary, obviously the station isn't cutting through. If the station isn't cutting through, the advertising isn't cutting through. Why would someone spend $ with a station that can't even brand their name/frequency with a listener when they repeat it 12x an hour?! How is my advertising message going to be received in such an atmosphere? Answer - Not Very Well.

2) The sample size was refreshed continually. None of this 2-year panelist crap. It was a true representation of the audience. The panel was fresh and new all the time. Look at the percentage of the original (April 2009) panelists that are still in Seattle's panel. It's over 30% original panelists after 16 books. Absolutely ridiculous. If you have one panelist who hates your station, depending on the demo, you could be screwed for up to 24 months.

PPM encourages stations to play the at-work, non-offensive, PPM game. If you don't believe it, look at the top stations right now. KRWM, KPLZ, KJAQ, KMPS, KKWF, etc. PPM is just one more challenge that radio will need to overcome to stay viable.

 

[AQH]

1) If the station isn't forefront enough for someone to write the name of the station down on a diary, obviously the station isn't cutting through. If the station isn't cutting through, the advertising isn't cutting through. Why would someone spend $ with a station that can't even brand their name/frequency with a listener when they repeat it 12x an hour?! How is my advertising message going to be received in such an atmosphere? Answer - Not Very Well.

Mainstream AC stations can cut through. But I think what you're suggesting is essentially having Mitch Craig be the voice on Warm, or Casey Keating go full throttle at Star. Ain't going to happen.

2) The sample size was refreshed continually. None of this 2-year panelist crap. It was a true representation of the audience. The panel was fresh and new all the time. Look at the percentage of the original (April 2009) panelists that are still in Seattle's panel. It's over 30% original panelists after 16 books. Absolutely ridiculous. If you have one panelist who hates your station, depending on the demo, you could be screwed for up to 24 months.

Your complaints about the two year panelists and proper representation of the market are two separate arguments.

Sample is indeed a problem, but not in the way you describe.

PPM encourages stations to play the at-work, non-offensive, PPM game. If you don't believe it, look at the top stations right now. KRWM, KPLZ, KJAQ, KMPS, KKWF, etc. PPM is just one more challenge that radio will need to overcome to stay viable.

Have you given any thought that maybe those stations might actually be delivering on what listeners want?

 

[Jay Peninger]

PPM encourages stations to play the at-work, non-offensive, PPM game. If you don't believe it, look at the top stations right now. KRWM, KPLZ, KJAQ, KMPS, KKWF, etc. PPM is just one more challenge that radio will need to overcome to stay viable.

Have you given any thought that maybe those stations might actually be delivering on what listeners want?

I would append that with they may be delivering what a larger segment of listeners want, which certainly excludes me in that audience. I prefer a more edgy in your face brand of radio which it would appear is on it's way out as stations search to find more share. KISW began playing music during their morning show today for the first time in well over five years no doubt an attempt to get more share.

 

[jupiter2]

I agree with parts of both sides of this argument. The diary was old, the PPM is at least measuring something real. You can't go back. The PPM must be improved before it destroys the very business that it lives off of.

The sample size is way too small, and with long term panels providing the illusion of instant answers and consistency. Those who have studied focus groups know both the tremendous opportunities with real time feedback and the dangers of letting too few people influence you. It is a double edged sword.

Now passionate listeners who will respond to a station or show are valued equally to people who are not even actually listening. They just happen to be exposed, or may have it on in the background.

Music intensive stations should have gotten more credit for all this exposure, so I have no problem with that.

Savvy ad agencies, advertisers and programmers know that foreground listening delivers strikingly better response. That's why there rare so many personality endorsement spots on your live and local shows.

In the future, music stations will be eroded by commercial free music services. For now, let them enjoy the good times while we also realize that strong personalities still provide the backbone to our industry.

 

[Steenman]

Diary's were 'voting' and PPM is actual listening and therefore far more accurate. In addition PPM provides a continual trend which is less subject to promotion, stunting and contesting. In my view, the sample size is adequate, although I do see validity in the argument that the population should be refreshed more often and I suspect that will be better worked out over time.

As far as KPLZ goes, Kent Phillips is one of the best out there and I congratulate him. The guys at KZOK are pretty smart too. Note that both of these shows-stations-formats have been around seemingly forever and that speaks volumes for managers that are willing to support them internally and take whatever short term heat is dished out when they do take dips.

Oh, and while advertisers consider things like ratings, the bottom line for us is results for our products and clients. Ratings can get an advertiser to TRY a station, but results is what keeps them there.

 

[peetah]

"PPM is actual listening..."
Uhhhh, well it is registering/reporting that a radio near the PPM has a particular station on, yes.
There is no way of knowing if someone is actually paying attention to what is being said or being sold at that moment. So I have big problems with this 'passive' listening. I do agree with the idea put forth that results for the advertiser are the true test for a radio station. Unfortunately the PPM has flaws all its own. It's certainly not a perfect 'currency' either. Guess we'll have to wait to the day when we have microchips implanted to gauge our 'true' listening habits. Or not.
LOL

 

[Steenman]

@peetah. If I understand your point correctly, you are seeming to make the argument that writing down what you listen to implies that you are engaging in active foreground listening, whereas wearing a PPM device implies that you are only ever passively listening. If this is in fact your argument, can you offer any research or actual information to support this or is this just a IMHO statement?

As far back as I can remember, certain formats (ie: talk, news) claim more value (read higher ad rate) because they have more 'active listening'. Of course Christian, Country and lots of other stations can also claim this (exclusive cume, loyalty, more P1's). I've seen little real recall research to support any of this and in any case this argument is based on format type, not based on who's carrying a diary or a PPM.

Enlighten us, please.

 

[peetah]

No, I wasn't making any argument about writing down what one listens to, in any way at all.
I was pointing out some of the problems with PPM.
Both the diary and the PPM are flawed systems.
PPM really isn't reporting actual listening, just that a radio nearby is tuned to a local station that is encoded.
If stations and/or advertisers want to believe these numbers represent "actual" listening I think they are fooling themselves.
Some of the reported numbers are active listeners, certainly.

But the PPM is now the system of choice, offered by the Big Dog, Arbitron.
We're stuck with it, but hopefully improvements/fine tuning/updates/greater sample size/whatever will continue.

 

[SRP]

But the PPM is now the system of choice, offered by the Big Dog, Arbitron.
We're stuck with it, but hopefully improvements/fine tuning/updates/greater sample size/whatever will continue.

No, the PPM is what's available in the ratings service marketplace today. Got a better system? What is it? How can it differentiate between passive and active listening? Put your $$$ where your mouth is - develop it, market it and challenge Arbitron.

 

[semoochie]

The PPM seems to be similar to the Neilsen TV ratings, in that it registers what is on. The latter doesn't figure someone going into the kitchen or bathroom for an extended period of time. At least, the former has that much in its favor. Perhaps, the next step is for it to only register if the volume level is high enough for the person wearing the apparatus to notice.

 

[radioguy123]

Actually that is how the meter works. The encode is only picked up if the station is audible. Background music is not picked up, unless it is loud enough to be heard. The bigger issue is missed listening because of headphones or levels too low. I LOL at comments that background stations benefit. Tell that to THE TICKET in Detroit, WTOP in DC, KCBS in SF, KISS in LA, KISS in Dallas, KPLZ in Seattle and many more atop this months ratings that are heavy on personality and not really Smooth Jazz or Soft AC, or background talk style formats. IF background listening were picked up Smooth Jazz would have not declined overall in PPM, Soft AC would own every PPM market and news stations would disappear. That is not the case. The actual big winners in PPM are all-news, CHR, HOT-AC, Personality Classic Hits or Oldies and Alternative according to Arbitron data. SOFT AC was slightly up while, Talk, Smooth Jazz and other background music or chatter formats declined. It ain't what it seems.

 

[RadioEatsItsYoung]

I LOL at comments that background stations benefit. Tell that to THE TICKET in Detroit, WTOP in DC, KCBS in SF, KISS in LA, KISS in Dallas, KPLZ in Seattle and many more atop this months ratings that are heavy on personality and not really Smooth Jazz or Soft AC, or background talk style formats. IF background listening were picked up Smooth Jazz would have not declined overall in PPM, Soft AC would own every PPM market and news stations would disappear. That is not the case. The actual big winners in PPM are all-news, CHR, HOT-AC, Personality Classic Hits or Oldies and Alternative according to Arbitron data. SOFT AC was slightly up while, Talk, Smooth Jazz and other background music or chatter formats declined. It ain't what it seems.

Thanks for the 'LOL' Miley Cyrus, but I doubt that many are arguing that background stations benefit in PPM. What people (myself included) are saying is that the majority of the winners in PPM are non-offensive stations. You need to be non-offensive and mass appeal to an extent to be at-work friendly. And you need to be at-work friendly to succeed in PPM.

The problem with formats like Smooth Jazz, AAA, etc, is that they are passion stations. Passion stations benefited from (what really was) "voting" in diary. Now that PPM is "real" exposure, those stations aren't doing as well.

 

[semoochie]

Smooth Jazz has been trending too old for quite awhile. PPM just sealed its fate. Having said that, I realize this is a Seattle board and the format is still active but nationally, it's well on its way to being over.