Actually I liked Jhani's approach. Upon his arrival, he ditched some of the titles that had been burned to a crispy crisp by the previous regime, brought in some late 70s and 80's that the station sorely lacked, increased the number of rock tracks, brought back some themed weekends which was an opportunity to spin some songs not on the regular playlist, and generally brought a brighter presentation to the station. He was much more flexible than he ever was with KOST 103, where playlists were so tight and jocks were micro-managed down to the last syllable (literally). The station will never have the 10,000 song on-air library I want them to have, but he at least more intelligently managed the 700 song playlist better than the previous regime. He made the station listenable again and probably saved the station's format.
-
Get involved.
We want your input!
Apply for Membership and join the conversations about everything related to broadcasting.
After we receive your registration, a moderator will review it. After your registration is approved, you will be permitted to post.
If you use a disposable or false email address, your registration will be rejected.
After your membership is approved, please take a minute to tell us a little bit about yourself.
https://www.radiodiscussions.com/forums/introduce-yourself.1088/
Thanks in advance and have fun!
RadioDiscussions Administrators
KRTH playing 2004 music!
- Thread starter oldies76
- Start date
Actually I liked Jhani's approach. Upon his arrival, he ditched some of the titles that had been burned to a crispy crisp by the previous regime, brought in some late 70s and 80's that the station sorely lacked, increased the number of rock tracks, brought back some themed weekends which was an opportunity to spin some songs not on the regular playlist, and generally brought a brighter presentation to the station. He was much more flexible than he ever was with KOST 103, where playlists were so tight and jocks were micro-managed down to the last syllable (literally). The station will never have the 10,000 song on-air library I want them to have, but he at least more intelligently managed the 700 song playlist better than the previous regime. He made the station listenable again and probably saved the station's format.
K
K.M. Richards
Guest
It wasn't you I was thinking of when I said apologies were owed. You have been consistent in saying everything you recapped above.
Your conclusion is undoubtedly correct, which is why CBS brought him in.
I think everyone here knows that he and I are friends, and have been for about three decades now. Now that he has retired, I don't think he'll mind my sharing something, because it's true and came out of his own mouth ...
Many of you will recall that he had announced his retirement from Clear Channel, and expressed surprise when he instead went over to CBS. A few opined at the time that the "retirement" was a smoke screen. Here's the reality: At the time he announced his retirement, CBS was pretty much on the verge of deciding whether or not to blow up KRTH. Instead, they took advantage of the situation, enticed him with a great salary (all of which went right into his investment accounts) to delay his retirement and come fix KRTH instead. And the reason he agreed? "How could I say 'no' to inheriting the last part of Bill Drake's legacy?"
The reason KRTH sounded so much better under Jhani Kaye is that he tried as hard as he could to do things the way Drake would have.
I would like that more if it were in random order.
Couldn't have said it better!
T
Thomps2525
Guest
During KODJ's first day---okay, half-day, if you want to be technical---they played several songs which were not being played on KRTH. Among them were Maybe I Know by Lesley Gore and Let's Lock The Door by Jay & the Americans. In 1989, I thought that when listeners became aware that KODJ had a larger playlist than KRTH did, KRTH would lose listeners to KODJ. I now realize that for every person such as myself who wanted to hear a higher number of songs and less repetition, there were many more people who wanted to hear only the biggest hits over and over and over and over and over. Twenty-six years later, that still holds true and, unfortunately, probably always will.
T
Thomps2525
Guest
In the 1990s, 104.7 KDES in Palm Springs was a typical mid-'50s-to-mid-'70s oldies station. KDES, now at 98.5, today has a format that more closely resembles that of Jack-FM. Here is a sample:
Baby What A Big Surprise - Chicago
Big In Japan - Alphaville
Bittersweet - Hoodoo Gurus
Boys Don't Cry - Cure
Celebration - Kool & the Gang
Centerfold - J Geils Band
Church Of The Poison Mind - Culture Club
Da Ya Think I'm Sexy - Rod Stewart
Destination Unknown - Missing Persons
Dude Looks Like A Lady - Aerosmith
Emotional Rescue - Rolling Stones
Girlfriend In A Coma - Smiths
Heat Of The Moment - Asia
Hot Stuff - Donna Summer
Hotel California (Live) - Eagles
I Send A Message - INXS
Keep It Comin' Love - KC & the Sunshine Band
Killer Queen - Queen
Let Me Go - Heaven 17
Love Train - O'Jays
Never Can Say Goodbye - Gloria Gaynor
Reap The Wild Wind - Ultravox
Red Red Wine - UB40
Rock 'N' Roll High School - Ramones
Roxanne - Police
Silly Love Songs - Paul McCartney & Wings
Strangelove - Depeche Mode
The Long Run - Eagles
Waiting For A Girl Like You - Foreigner
Wild Wild West - Escape Club
KDES focuses on mid-'70s to early '90s. Sunnylands Broadcasting recently launched a 1960s-70s pop oldies station, "The Valley's Greatest Hits" 105.1 KVGH in Palm Springs. Eventually KRTH, too, will be focusing on mid-'70s to early '90s. Does anyone foresee any Los Angeles station adopting a 1960s-70s pop oldies format or are those songs pretty much gone for good in this area?
Baby What A Big Surprise - Chicago
Big In Japan - Alphaville
Bittersweet - Hoodoo Gurus
Boys Don't Cry - Cure
Celebration - Kool & the Gang
Centerfold - J Geils Band
Church Of The Poison Mind - Culture Club
Da Ya Think I'm Sexy - Rod Stewart
Destination Unknown - Missing Persons
Dude Looks Like A Lady - Aerosmith
Emotional Rescue - Rolling Stones
Girlfriend In A Coma - Smiths
Heat Of The Moment - Asia
Hot Stuff - Donna Summer
Hotel California (Live) - Eagles
I Send A Message - INXS
Keep It Comin' Love - KC & the Sunshine Band
Killer Queen - Queen
Let Me Go - Heaven 17
Love Train - O'Jays
Never Can Say Goodbye - Gloria Gaynor
Reap The Wild Wind - Ultravox
Red Red Wine - UB40
Rock 'N' Roll High School - Ramones
Roxanne - Police
Silly Love Songs - Paul McCartney & Wings
Strangelove - Depeche Mode
The Long Run - Eagles
Waiting For A Girl Like You - Foreigner
Wild Wild West - Escape Club
KDES focuses on mid-'70s to early '90s. Sunnylands Broadcasting recently launched a 1960s-70s pop oldies station, "The Valley's Greatest Hits" 105.1 KVGH in Palm Springs. Eventually KRTH, too, will be focusing on mid-'70s to early '90s. Does anyone foresee any Los Angeles station adopting a 1960s-70s pop oldies format or are those songs pretty much gone for good in this area?
Human nature, Steve. Always has been. It's why KFWB fell to the tighter KRLA, why a mere 30 records on KHJ blew them both away, and why, in markets where it existed, Buzz Bennett's 22-song Q format put Drake on the trailer (also why WABC remained dominant for as far into the 70s as it did).
By the way...the June numbers are out. KRTH is now #1. Not tied for #1. #1 all by itself.
T
Thomps2525
Guest
KRTH is actually a little more listenable than it was just three months ago because quite a few songs have been added to the playlist. Michael, do you remember in 1982 when KLAC cut their "Big 57" survey down to a measly 25 songs? After a few weeks, the list expanded to 35 songs. When KLAC switched to a country format in 1970, Burbank country station KBBQ had a "Sizzlin' 60" survey. I have some old KFOX weekly playlists from the mid-'70s which listed 90 currents.
Those June Nielsen Audio ratings for Los Angeles are at http://ratings.****************/cgi-bin/rol.exe/arb003
Those June Nielsen Audio ratings for Los Angeles are at http://ratings.****************/cgi-bin/rol.exe/arb003
K
K.M. Richards
Guest
KVGH will do okay for the same reason KWXY is still playing Beautiful Music. Palm Springs has a lot of over-55 population, they listen to the radio, and the local businesses buy spots to reach them.
In L.A., pretty much all the ad business is agency, they won't buy over-55, and ... can you answer your own question, or must I rehash old facts you should have already known before you asked? (There is a word for bringing up a topic again that has been discussed to death with controversy, and you know what it is. Don't make me call you one.)
This reminds me of another anecdotal experience.
Some years ago, I began consulting a Top 20 market station that was current based. They had 87 currents, and over 15 "new" songs that were less than 2 weeks old. They had over 1200 gold and recurrent selections.
They were the lowest rated FM in the market. Even the Class A stations were higher.
I cut the currents, including new songs, to 27. The gold and recurrent library was reduced to under 600.
First book, #1.
As time went by, we decreased the currents to about 17 and had about 40 songs in two recurrent categories, while the gold was reduced to around 400 songs after doing music tests.
I ceased to consult them 20 years later, and they were still #1, generally with twice the audience of the second-rated station.
You can dream about long lists and forgotten oldies. But I have never seen a station do better with a much bigger list.* I have seen, over and over and over and over how stations improve by cutting out the marginal songs and the stiffs and shortening the list.
* Possible exception: I have seen a few current based stations launch with a very tight and fast rotation of only the biggest songs, and then move to a list with recurrents and even some throwbacks after creating a buzz in the market. Usually, such a launch period is measured in months, and is not permanent.
Last edited:
According to you guys...the 12+ numbers are meaningless. I've been told that many times, defending WOGL when they were #1. So, I will go with the original answer.
T
Thomps2525
Guest
Yeah, I, too, wonder about that. Certain "radio professionals" keep telling us that the 12+ numbers are meaningless and don't matter and yet every time Nielsen Audio releases ratings of radio stations, the stations are ranked from first to last based on those 12+ numbers.
David, can you tell us which FM station you were consulting? And do you know how many "goldens" KHJ was playing in 1965? Michael has noted how quickly KHJ surpassed KFWB an KRLA in the ratings. Of course the smaller playlist was only part of the reason. There were the jingles, the DJs, the contests, the "more music" policy and something that came to be known as "the Drake sound."
David, can you tell us which FM station you were consulting? And do you know how many "goldens" KHJ was playing in 1965? Michael has noted how quickly KHJ surpassed KFWB an KRLA in the ratings. Of course the smaller playlist was only part of the reason. There were the jingles, the DJs, the contests, the "more music" policy and something that came to be known as "the Drake sound."
Meaningless from a standpoint of sales and the ultimate success of the radio station. But you've also been told many times (monthly, if I'm not mistaken), how KRTH's demographics (which are what drives sales and the ultimate success of the radio station) have been improving along with the 12+ numbers. And I expect David will have the demo rankings for us shortly.
Steve, I hope to God you know the answer to that first question, given all the time you spend on radio. It is simply that Nielsen Audio only releases demographic information to paying subscribers. The 12+ numbers are the only ones they're willing to make public, so that's what radio-related websites have to work with. As I said to Oldies, David has monthly kept us up to date on how KRTH is doing in the demos and I expect this month will be no different.
As to your second point, it was the total package that put KHJ in the lead so quickly. A "more music" policy with the wrong music would not have been an asset. Drake actually tried to get his PDs to dump the Boss 30 Countdown on several occasions. His logic? You're spending the first two hours playing the 20 least popular songs on your playlist back to back. And that was from a tight list.
And I see David has addressed the demos in a separate ratings thread.
Mr. Hagerty, did KHJ actually air the Boss 30 every week from July 1965 through 1980, when weekly copies of that survey were issued or was it just for a time due to Drake? Also those weekly KRTH surveys that began in 1977 and ran through 1985, were those publically available, because I am having a very hard time finding anyone who has them or is willing to share them.
Good point...as we've noted, and the AT40 re-runs demonstrate, there were lots of duds in the first half of the show.
What some people did (and I don't know who was the first) was mix in re-currents in those first two hours to break up the duds.
K
K.M. Richards
Guest
Yes, because those are the only numbers they release publicly. The rest of the numbers are only released to paying customers (radio stations and ad agencies).
Your logic is therefore flawed: Nielsen cannot publicly rank stations based on numbers they do not release to non-subscribers because that would give away information which is their bread-and-butter product.
With great fear and trepidation, based upon what Steve tends to do in terms of twisting such things, here is an analogy. When you go into the supermarket, and you come across someone giving out free samples of a product, they don't give you the whole package, they give you one small bite. When Nielsen issues their public rankings, it's a free sample. Okay?
The countdown continued until Michael Spears' arrival in 1977. He killed it, as he had at KFRC in 1973. Despite his clout, Drake let his local PDs have latitude, and they wanted the countdowns.
I have no idea about the KRTH playlists.
- Status