KTWV's Christmas Format Has Almost No Jazz

[EJ204]

Last year, when The Wave switched to Holiday music, to compete against KOST, it still had a Jazz flavor to it. Major Smooth Jazz artists with holiday CDs were included in the format, along with the Bing Crosby and Mariah Carey Christmas music.

This year, it sounds more like a straight AC Christmas station. There's very little holiday music from Dave Koz, Kenny G. or other Smooth Jazz artists.

It makes me nervous about The Wave's long-term future.

 

[hotpatrick2004]

I know it was nice to have 2 christmas stations playing different formats of christmas music. For instance last christmas(pardon the pun lol) the wave played god rest ye by jethro tull.

Very cool cover but this yr nada nuttin but the same old stuff kost and thousands of other ac stations are playing. Very very very sad

 

[Thomps2525]

In the past hour KTWV has played:

All I Want For Christmas - Mariah Carey
O Come O Come Emmanuel - Pentatonix (an a cappella quintet)
The Christmas Song - Michael Bublé
Rudolph The Red Nosed Reindeer - Gene Autry
Holly Jolly Christmas - Burl Ives
Jingle Bell Rock - Bobby Helms
The First Noel - Nat "King" Cole
I'll Be Home For Christmas - Carpenters
The Most Wonderful Time Of The Year - Johnny Mathis
It's Beginning To Look A Lot Like Christmas - Bing Crosby
Last Christmas - Wham!
Frosty The Snowman - Ronettes
Deck The Halls - Dave Koz
The Christmas Song - Nat "King" Cole
There's No Place Like Home For The Holidays - Barry Manilow

Final tally: only one smooth-jazz song and only one non-secular song. And I wouldn't be too far afield if I predicted that every hour from now through Christmas will be similar.

 

[Thomps2525]

In the past few minutes KTWV has played John Lennon's Happy Xmas (of course), Paul McCartney's Wonderful Christmastime (of course), Kenny G's What Child Is This (the requisite one-an-hour smooth-jazz song) and Frosty The Snowman by Jimmy Durante. Oh yeah, what is Christmas without a Jimmy Durante song?!?

I wonder if after Christmas we'll start hearing "94.7 KTWV, CBS Sports Radio for Los Angeles"? If the station changes formats, they're almost certainly going to be changing call letters as well. Officially, KTWV's format is no longer "smooth jazz" but "smooth adult contemporary." Jazz Times columnist David Adler posed the question "Is smooth jazz dead?" in a September 2012 column, which, through the magic of the Internet, you can read at http://jazztimes.com/articles/54758-crossing-over-is-smooth-jazz-dead

 

[ercjncpr]

Well, if the format is dead, then why is everyone expecting "smooth jazz" Christmas music on KTWV?

 

[EJ204]

Because, even if a mostly instrumental Smooth Jazz station isn't practical today, have things gone so downhill that the LA audience won't even accept three Jazz instrumentals per hour? That's what KTWV was doing in an effort to keep its previous audience and expand into the Soft AC audience, until the switch to Christmas music last week. It was mostly an AC format, but leaning a bit more rhythmic and a bit older and softer than KOST, with three Smooth Jazz instrumentals per hour.

That format managed to keep KTWV mostly in the Top Ten. Unfortunately the 25-54 numbers aren't great.

I guess I don't understand how Los Angeles radio listeners can go from making KTWV one of the most profitable stations owned by CBS in the 90s to putting The Wave in danger of a format change now. Is there no place on the dial for any sort of instrumental music these days? No commercial Classical stations, no Easy Listening stations, no Smooth Jazz stations. On the radio today, you either have to talk or sing. If you just play an instrument, we don't want to know you.

 

[Thomps2525]

"On the radio today, you either have to talk or sing or speak Spanish or Korean."

There, I fixed it for you.

 

[michael hagerty]

I guess I don't understand how Los Angeles radio listeners can go from making KTWV one of the most profitable stations owned by CBS in the 90s to putting The Wave in danger of a format change now. Is there no place on the dial for any sort of instrumental music these days? No commercial Classical stations, no Easy Listening stations, no Smooth Jazz stations.

In the same way their parents made KBIG and KJOI dominant ratings and revenue forces as beautiful music stations in the 70s, but by the 90s, it was over. And about the same time, Classical KFAC became KKBT. That was 20 years ago.

KTWV was aimed at thirty-somethings when it launched 25 years ago. The format never grabbed succeeding generations in any significant numbers, so the audience is 55 and up. And that's where the ad dollars aren't.

As the stunt that ended KMET and launched KTWV on February 14, 1987 said: "Time's up."

 

[Thomps2525]

Golly gee, I had forgotten about that: the several-days-long countdown that told us every few minutes how much time KMET had left ("Five hours, 14 minutes"..."Five hours, seven minutes"..."Four hours, 58 minutes"...). When KFAC ended the classical music format, there were several days of a heartbeat interrupted occasionally by a few seconds of a pop song that would be part of the new format of KKBT, "The Beat."

About the only instrumental music on radio nowadays is classical. I discovered a lot of really good artists in on KTWV in the late 1980s and '90s and I bought a lot of CDs by Yanni, Earl Klugh, Patrick O'Hearn, Vangelis, Eric Tingstad & Nancy Rumbel, Special EFX and others. Then somewhere along the way, "smooth jazz" changed direction and most of the instrumentals played featured a saxophone. That's where the format lost me...and probably others too. A friend of mine called it "snake charmer" music.

 

[michael hagerty]

Golly gee, I had forgotten about that: the several-days-long countdown that told us every few minutes how much time KMET had left ("Five hours, 14 minutes"..."Five hours, seven minutes"..."Four hours, 58 minutes"...). When KFAC ended the classical music format, there were several days of a heartbeat interrupted occasionally by a few seconds of a pop song that would be part of the new format of KKBT, "The Beat."

About the only instrumental music on radio nowadays is classical. I discovered a lot of really good artists in on KTWV in the late 1980s and '90s and I bought a lot of CDs by Yanni, Earl Klugh, Patrick O'Hearn, Vangelis, Eric Tingstad & Nancy Rumbel, Special EFX and others. Then somewhere along the way, "smooth jazz" changed direction and most of the instrumentals played featured a saxophone. That's where the format lost me...and probably others too. A friend of mine called it "snake charmer" music.

As the article linked above indicates, Kenny G was the format superstar...the guy who made millions. That promoted the erroneous concept that alto sax was key.

 

[ChannelFlipper]

You could remove the word "Christmas" from the title of this thread and it would still be true.

 

[Shoot From Hip]

You can't be a hybrid AC/smooth station and survive in a niche world. That's why playing 3 instrumentals per hour doesn't really work. SiriusXM has three formats that might be of interest...smooth jazz, classic jazz and New Age.

 

[michael hagerty]

If you think about it, 25 years is a heck of a run...and I'm not saying The Wave is a dead duck...just maybe on the verge of some re-invention.

Go back and look at the legendary stations of Los Angeles...KFWB was huge for the first 5 years as a top 40 station, but only lasted for 10. KHJ lasted 15, but there was a major drop-off in the numbers, accompanied by some major changes in approach, after the first 5 or 6. Even KMPC really only got 20 years out of the original personality MOR approach before they became an AC and started struggling for numbers for the next 10. KIIS and KROQ have been around for 30+, but both have had several changes in music and personnel to make it that long.

Any station that is tied to one type of music lives or dies by that genre's popularity. If KIIS had tied itself to Wham! or KROQ to A Flock Of Seagulls, they wouldn't be here today.

 

[Thomps2525]

Mister hagerty, I would add that KLAC kept a country format from 1970---Ray Price's For The Good Times was their first number one---until December 1993, when they fired all the DJs and news staff and switched to Westwood One's syndicated adult standards format. But in the case of KLAC, the format change was not because of the genre's popularity. Country music was very popular then (Garth, Clint, George, Alan, Reba, Vince, Travis, Brooks & Dunn, Alabama, et al). The problems were that KLAC is on AM and most music formats other than adult standards had by then moved to FM, and KLAC was owned by Shamrock Broadcasting, led by Walt Disney's nephew Roy, who hated country music. There ya go!

 

[michael hagerty]

Mister hagerty, I would add that KLAC kept a country format from 1970---Ray Price's For The Good Times was their first number one---until December 1993, when they fired all the DJs and news staff and switched to Westwood One's syndicated adult standards format. But in the case of KLAC, the format change was not because of the genre's popularity. Country music was very popular then (Garth, Clint, George, Alan, Reba, Vince, Travis, Brooks & Dunn, Alabama, et al). The problems were that KLAC is on AM and most music formats other than adult standards had by then moved to FM, and KLAC was owned by Shamrock Broadcasting, led by Walt Disney's nephew Roy, who hated country music. There ya go!

That's 23 years, which is two fewer than KTWV. And it wasn't all roses. KLAC was in the top 10 only for a handful of those years (1971-1974 and 1978-1981). After 1982, they were always trailing KZLA, and the case could have been made for a format change anytime in their final 11 years in the Country format.

 

[Thomps2525]

I met Stoney Richards shortly after KLAC went to a country oldies format. I lamented the non-airplay of classic 1950s artists such as Hank Williams, Hank Thompson, Webb Pierce, Kitty Wells, Carl Smith and Lefty Frizzell. Stoney said, "For every listener who wants to hear those artists, there will be one who doesn't. And besides, recording-wise, the '50s songs aren't as technologically advanced as songs of the '70s and '80s." My reply: "Listeners aren't going to care if a 32-track Garth Brooks song is followed by a mono Red Foley track. Listeners just want to hear all the songs that were hits, regardless of year or recording style." Obviously KLAC didn't hire me as a consultant.

Getting back to KTWV and what was once known as "new age music," did the first few years of the smooth-jazz format create any "radio hits"? KTWV plays a lot of pop/r&b oldies---Stevie Wonder, Gladys Knight, Phil Collins, Eric Clapton, Anita Baker, Steely Dan, Earth Wind & Fire, et al---but where are the "smooth-jazz" oldies? Are there any?

 

[michael hagerty]

Getting back to KTWV and what was once known as "new age music," did the first few years of the smooth-jazz format create any "radio hits"? KTWV plays a lot of pop/r&b oldies---Stevie Wonder, Gladys Knight, Phil Collins, Eric Clapton, Anita Baker, Steely Dan, Earth Wind & Fire, et al---but where are the "smooth-jazz" oldies? Are there any?

A few. I'd say Kenny G's "Songbird" would be the biggest. I don't know about the rest of the country, but KTWV probably made Pat Metheny's "Last Train Home" a hit in L.A.

The fact is, the format wasn't right for hit making. Frank Cody himself was quoted in the Times early on as saying "it's not a radio station, it's a mood service". And that's most likely the reason that, when hits became necessary, they were largely hits from other formats.

I've listened to a couple of Wave airchecks from the first six months recently, and what I was reminded of was how many LP cuts from rock artists with jazz sensibilities got play...Sting, Donald Fagen/Steely Dan, Van Morrison, Rickie Lee Jones, Joni Mitchell, Joe Jackson...

 

[ChannelFlipper]

Getting back to KTWV and what was once known as "new age music," did the first few years of the smooth-jazz format create any "radio hits"? KTWV plays a lot of pop/r&b oldies---Stevie Wonder, Gladys Knight, Phil Collins, Eric Clapton, Anita Baker, Steely Dan, Earth Wind & Fire, et al---but where are the "smooth-jazz" oldies? Are there any?

A few. I'd say Kenny G's "Songbird" would be the biggest. I don't know about the rest of the country, but KTWV probably made Pat Metheny's "Last Train Home" a hit in L.A.

The fact is, the format wasn't right for hit making. Frank Cody himself was quoted in the Times early on as saying "it's not a radio station, it's a mood service". And that's most likely the reason that, when hits became necessary, they were largely hits from other formats.

I've listened to a couple of Wave airchecks from the first six months recently, and what I was reminded of was how many LP cuts from rock artists with jazz sensibilities got play...Sting, Donald Fagen/Steely Dan, Van Morrison, Rickie Lee Jones, Joni Mitchell, Joe Jackson...

Yes to that. The Steely Dan Aja and Gaucho albums got plenty of airplay for the first several years. Lots of Sting Dream of the Blue Turtles as well.

 

[EJ204]

Well, I think we can say that George Benson's "Breezin'" album was a giant hit well before there was a format called "Smooth Jazz." I don't know about other markets but NYC Rock stations WPLJ and WNEW-FM played lots of music from Breezin', even though it wasn't Rock. It was #1 for several weeks and in the top 10 for months. It may still be the biggest Jazz album of all time.

The Wave still plays Smooth Jazz music from that era: Spyro Gyra's "Morning Dance," Bob James' "Theme from Taxi," Larry Carlton, Ramsey Lewis. They all pre-date the Smooth Jazz format but still air on KTWV. And vocal jazz-flavored acts that only had minor success on the AC or Top 40 charts still get heard: Enya, Basia, Everything But The Girl.

LARadioRewind mentions listening to recordings of The Wave when it first premiered. I still have a few. It was quite a revolutionairy station in those days. No DJs. Artists would be asked to identify their music themselves and that I.D. would be played at the end of some songs.

At the top of each hour, a comedy troup would do a brief skit, mentioning somewhere in the bit the time ("It's 8 o'clock. Where did I leave my car keys?" "It's 11 o'clock. I wish my neighbor's dog would stop barking.") which would get played in place of a DJ telling us the time. They even had Cheryl Dentine of Manhattan Transfer do a bit called "Lady Sings The News." They'd compose recent news stories into brief songs she'd sing, rather than have a real newscast.

And yes, when it first went on the air, The Wave mixed three musical styles: what today we'd call "Smooth Jazz," plus New Age (Andreas Vollenweider, George Winston) and Soft Rock. It wasn't uncommon to hear Fleetwood Mac and Dire Straits, as well as jazz-influenced Rock artists such as Sting and Steely Dan. It really was a pioneer in its time.

It's really sad that there are only four musical formats in English that are viable on today's radio: Urban (Urban AC, Hip Hop), Rock (Alternative, Active, Classic), Contemporary (Top 40, Hot AC, AC) and Country. Don't stray outside those four formats. It won't work.

 

[Thomps2525]

EJ, call me Steve. After you get to know me better, you can call me Steve. I have most of the Air Waves magazines that KTWV put out in their early years. Each issue included "The WAVE Music List---the newest, hottest Smooth Jazz." The Summer 1997 list includes After 7, Herb Alpert, Gato Barbieri, Babyface, Walter Beasley, Rick Braun, Toni Braxton, Braxton Brothers, Zachary Breaux (who had died earlier in the year), Jim Brickman, Norman Brown, Dancing Fantasy, Tommy Emmanuel, Exodus Quartet, Fantasy Band, Kenny G---oh, you just know he'd be in there!---Gota, Warren Hill, Incognito, Boney James, Denny Jiosa, Chuck Loeb, Jeff Lorber, Bobby Lyte, Eric Marienthal, Keiko Matsui, Chiell Minucci, Paolo, David Sanborn, Andy Snitzer, Soundscape, Special EFX, Paul Taylor, TDF, John Tesh, 3rd Force, Urban Knights, Grover Washington Jr. and Peter White---around 50% instrumentals.

And I remember those idiotic vignettes that included the time. What was KTWV trying to do, create a "new age" version of KRLA's late 1960s Credibility Gap troupe? It didn't work.