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KYOT - New Format A Bummer!

This isn't Washington DC. You could put 100 Phonecians in a room and ask them who is Jill Scott and 95 of them might think she is a reporter on channel 3.

If there's anything I learned working for the AAA version of the Zone, and the first few years of KYOT, people don't listen to the radio to be led on a musical adventure. If you don't play what people know, they will turn it off because they think you're playing "weird" music. The more you step away from what the audience knows, they'll turn it off, not up. Even if it's good for them, they're all grown up and you can't make them eat their vegetables.

Meanwhile, according to yes.com, a recent set on KYOT had Warren Hill into Prince's I Would Die 4 U into Michael McDonald's I Keep Forgettin'... just because you know the songs, does it make them the right songs?


John,
How did people get familiar with those songs?? Back in the day they were played on KUKQ in the 80's that's how...How do most people get familiar with these songs? ...They get played on the radio. I am a black AZ native, & during the 80's KUKQ played a urban AZ todays current hits & old school with about a 2% black population. Today there is a 4% black population, but my point is that alot of different people listened back then and that is how they got familiar with those songs. Next, the 1990's decade was the big decade for R&B & Mega is still focused on the 70's & 80's ...I think it's time to for a station like Mega & KYOT to realize that people in the 25-49 age group now consider the 80's-90's to be their primary old school period if they wanna hold to the old school format. Anyway's, I really like Hamps idea.

The way you talk about Jill Scott/D.C. who sells many records reminds me of the ideas they had back in the 50's & 60's when they thought they had to use Elvis to make the songs written by black artist hits...LOL Have you considered that maybe they may like a Jill Scott as well as the format?... just like they liked prince back in the day.
 
XMportable said:
How did people get familiar with those songs?? Back in the day they were played on KUKQ in the 80's that's how

Take those same 100 random Phonecians packed into the room.

Ask them what is KUKQ.

They won't know.

The ones who moved here in the 90's may remember it as an AM Alternative station, but Phoenix is a city where everyone's from somewhere else and most don't stay too long. KQ quit being the Rhythm of the City at least 25 years ago.
 
I agree they don't stay long because Pheonix has no "SOUL" ...LOL & those song played on the KOYT are 25-40 years. OLD Shools for 60+....LOLOLOLOL
 
JohnDavis, I think you missed the mark with my comment. I REALIZE Phoenix isn't DC, that was my whole point of dayparting KYOT!!!! I know there isn't a huge African-American population in Phoenix, but there is somewhat of a market I feel in Phoenix (black, white, etc.) that would like the format. It would have to fit a Phoenician's listening taste.
Keep it simple during the day (6A to 6P), but between 6P and 6A add some Urban AC favorites. I am not saying add a lot at once, do it little by little to garner audience response. Of course you don't want to scare away listeners!!! If it is done in this manner, some of the audience who don't know Kem or Jill Scott, will know them now.
Oh, and one more thing. Don't assume a lot of people in Phoenix don't know Jill Scott, there are probably more of them than you think. They just aren't being properly served in the market.
 
XMportable said:
I agree they don't stay long because Pheonix has no "SOUL" ...LOL & those song played on the KOYT are 25-40 years. OLD Shools for 60+....LOLOLOLOL

Which is precisely my point about Warren Hill/Prince/Michael McDonald.

Before the tweak, nobody would blink an eye at Warren Hill into Michael McDonald. Is inserting a pretty decent (and mostly forgotten) I Would Die 4 U in the middle there to make you say Wow or WTF? "I Wanna Be Your Lover" would make for a better segue, especially if you play the entire album cut and don't fade out the funk at the end.

Here's the last 10 songs as I write this, according to KYOT.com:

Indigo Girls - Fill It Up Again
Seal - Crazy
Diana Ross - Missing You
Urban Knights - Got To Give It Up
Babyface - When Can I See You
Ramsey Lewis Trio - The In Crowd
Richard Elliot - In The Groove
Selena - I Could Fall In Love
Beyonce - Irreplaceable
Sting - If I Ever I Lose My Faith In You

I suppose this answers the question of where do all the lite AC listeners go if they don't like Nickelback and ABBA on KEZ.
 
Hamp said:
JohnDavis, I think you missed the mark with my comment. I REALIZE Phoenix isn't DC, that was my whole point of dayparting KYOT!!!!

I don't believe in dayparting in AC formats. If a record isn't strong enough to play at 9 AM, then it's not strong enough to play at 9 PM, either.

Dayparting in CHR makes sense because adults are listening when the kids are in school. You don't have that problem in AC.
 
Jill Scott, Kem, Maxwell artist probably sell more albums than those you mention. If you ever listen, their music has a "jazzy" instrumental with Nice R&B vocals. Isn't that what KYOT wants to capture? I think Hamp has a great idea. Some of these songs may bring in crossover younger listeners also. ;)
 
XMportable said:
Jill Scott, Kem, Maxwell artist probably sell more albums than those you mention. If you ever listen, their music has a "jazzy" instrumental with Nice R&B vocals. Isn't that what KYOT wants to capture? I think Hamp has a great idea. Some of these songs may bring in crossover younger listeners also. ;)
Finally, someone who gets it!!!
 
johndavis said:
Hamp said:
JohnDavis, I think you missed the mark with my comment. I REALIZE Phoenix isn't DC, that was my whole point of dayparting KYOT!!!!

I don't believe in dayparting in AC formats. If a record isn't strong enough to play at 9 AM, then it's not strong enough to play at 9 PM, either.

Dayparting in CHR makes sense because adults are listening when the kids are in school. You don't have that problem in AC.
John, it isn't about what you "believe", it is about trying to serve an audience that is being underserved, even if it isn't a large one. What is so wrong with trying this formula. KYOT's ratings could possibly go up as a result. If they don't, they try something else. Simple as that. Sometimes you have to take a risk in order for something to be successful. It is called being innovative. The valley's demos are constantly changing, shouldn't radio change with it? Believe it or not, there are also some whites that DO enjoy Urban AC "new school" artists. I am not saying Phoenix is going to have Steve Harvey or Tom Joyner in the morning almost overnight, but radio companies really need to look at this format hole in the valley. I realize it cannot be a full-fleged Urban AC in phoenix because of the numbers, but smooth and urban AC can make beautiful music together. It wasn't too long ago when Barry Mayo started up V-103 in Chicago and the "experts" thought he was crazy for starting a format like that. Now it is one of the most successful format in the country. Maybe Clear Channel needs to do some better music research when it comes to programming KYOT.
 
Hamp said:
...radio companies really need to look at this format hole in the valley.

Is there really a format hole, or do you just wish there was one?

Because it seems to me that what you're arguing for is not a station that the Valley needs, but rather a station that you feel the Valley should need.
 
Ford, there is more than one hole....Right now there is probably 4 or 5 REDUNDANT formats in the Phoenix market. Why do they waste the airways with 4 or 5 stations that play the SAME format. Does it make sense? There should be a limit of 2 of the same. WHen you are a 3rd or 4th station on a CHR format, your ratings will probably be lLOWER than a brand new format ON A GOOD SIGNAL....LOL ::)
 
XMportable said:
Why do they waste the airways with 4 or 5 stations that play the SAME format. Does it make sense?

Two things...one, just because there are 4 or 5 redundant stations in the market, it does not automatically mean there are a similar number of format holes waiting to be filled.

WHen you are a 3rd or 4th station on a CHR format, your ratings will probably be lLOWER than a brand new format ON A GOOD SIGNAL....LOL ::)

Tell it to KZON. That station is a great example of why it is sometimes better to be a redundant format instead of trying to fill an imaginary hole. If you'll recall, when Howard Stern left for satellite, the rocket scientists at CBS thought they could replace him with a little thing called FREE-FM. Morning shows...not just in the morning, but all day long! ::)

They figured there was a format hole for that sort of thing, and not only that, but there was a same-sized hole in every single market. They got lots of big talents, debuted it in every market, promoted and marketed the hell out of the thing, and it bombed. Not just here, but everywhere. So the experiment was shut down, and the local stations were free (pun intended) to flip to a format that worked.

Locally, KZON flipped to CHR. "But wait...there's already two of those! That's against the rules!" Well 101.5 Jamz' ratings now are better than anything FREE-FM ever had, so there goes your theory out the window. A station that tried to fill a hole failed, then found success in a format shared by other stations.
 
XMportable said:
Ford, there is more than one hole....Right now there is probably 4 or 5 REDUNDANT formats in the Phoenix market. Why do they waste the airways with 4 or 5 stations that play the SAME format. Does it make sense? There should be a limit of 2 of the same. WHen you are a 3rd or 4th station on a CHR format, your ratings will probably be lLOWER than a brand new format ON A GOOD SIGNAL....LOL ::)

The current ratings system favors cume, not time spent listening. There is little benefit to being the favorite station of a small group of people. You want a million people listening 10 times a day, not ten thousand people listening for 10 hours straight.

There's more money to be had in being the third favorite station playing "Raise Your Glass" than playing something obscure because more people will stop when their seek button hits Pink. Even if they punch out after the song is over, they'll come back the next time you're playing something good.

CHR in particular does well in PPM because the lists are so tight and thus you're more likely to be playing a better song.

If there's anything that Clear Channel is doing here is they've built a wall of adult females like Sandusky has done with males with their rock formats. Between KZZP, KMXP, KESZ, KNIX, and KYOT they're going to get a crack at capturing a woman between the age of 18 - 54 several times a day.

I'm still wrapping my head around "Smooth AC" but we're in some weird musical times - songs that used to take nearly a year to cross over from CHR to AC are moving almost immediately (Katy Perry, Nickelback). The line between Hot AC & CHR is blurry (whereas Hot AC used to be Alternative Lite). The line between Mainstream AC and Hot AC is blurry. It's almost like they're finding a place for all the records that Mainstream AC (KEZ) would play before they discovered Katy Perry & Daughtry over on what used to be Smooth Jazz.
 
Ford said:
Locally, KZON flipped to CHR. "But wait...there's already two of those! That's against the rules!" Well 101.5 Jamz' ratings now are better than anything FREE-FM ever had, so there goes your theory out the window. A station that tried to fill a hole failed, then found success in a format shared by other stations.

Not to mention they're getting better ratings than KZON ever got as a freeform rock station. Again, just because nobody was doing it in the market it doesn't mean the market could support it.

And don't get me started on Jorgy's "Rhythm & Rock" creation on 95.5. Y-95's last book was a 1.9 and we rode that sucker down to 0.9 playing Nutbush City Limits.
 
Again, for every KZON thats might be making it. There is a Hot/Moving/whats next 97.5 & KKFR that's not..LOL

Anyways I have stressed this enough. Urban AC IS a format that sells records, it is selling many records in Phoenix regardless of the in box thinking that goes on in radio (Phoenix or any where else). I will just rely on internet & satellite radio for my due to the lack of interest here in the Phoenix market. It would be nice
 
XMportable said:
It would be nice if Phoenix radio was not stuck in a box.
Seems like most terrestrial radio is in that same box - no matter what the format.
 
Ford said:
Hamp said:
...radio companies really need to look at this format hole in the valley.

Is there really a format hole, or do you just wish there was one?

Because it seems to me that what you're arguing for is not a station that the Valley needs, but rather a station that you feel the Valley should need.
That is wrong on so many levels. Just because YOU don't like the format doesn't mean it isn't needed. Go to phxsoul.com and you will see how many people have a gripe about not having an Urban AC station in the valley. Oh, and just to let you know, I found out there is an internet Urban AC based and programmed in the valley. It is magic108.com. So if there isn't a demand for an Urban AC music station in the valley, then why does this station (even though it is on the internet) exist. Also there is FINALLY an all gospel music station in the valley (AM 860). So I disagree, the valley doesn't need FOUR freaking CHR's (only two, one of them leaning meanstream Urban). These companies need to realize there is more than just an African-American audience that enjoys this music. KYOT should continue to morph into Urban AC.
 
Hamp said:
So if there isn't a demand for an Urban AC music station in the valley, then why does this station (even though it is on the internet) exist.

There is a internet station for every format you can imagine. It doesn't equal a demand...more like a hobby. People do it out of their bedrooms with winamp (hell even I have one). Where it is hosted is irrelevant, as they can be streamed worldwide.
 
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